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Relations between the Empyrean age Trailer and new graphs update.

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Captain Falcord The Python Cartel	Posted - 2008.06.19 22:11:00 - [1] Does the new empyrean age trailer have anything to do with the upcoming graphics update? I mean, are those explosions and planets what we should expect? Even the corpses look better. Can I have a blue bar on this? thanks. ---<---@
Tamia Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.06.19 22:17:00 - [2] God, I hope so, that planet was awesome. Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.06.19 22:18:00 - [3] Edited by: MotherMoon on 19/06/2008 22:19:18 There was a dev quote saying yes :) saying that it what they want eve to look like in 2 years. No reason it couldn't other than the explosions. I mean it's pretty basic, space games are easier to render in a way so you can really push some effects. also it's using the new DX10 models
FluterEx	Posted - 2008.06.19 23:02:00 - [4] Originally by: MotherMoon Edited by: MotherMoon on 19/06/2008 22:19:18 also it's using the new DX10 models Holy **** when will we get ship models like that ? --------------------------------------- Only the dead have seen the end of war.
Jacob Mei	Posted - 2008.06.19 23:06:00 - [5] Hopefully in two years either a new windows OS will be out or Vista will finally be made practical because I am sure as hell not putting vista as it is now for the dx10 graphics. -------------------------------- To borrow a phrase: Players who post are like stars, there are bright ones and those who are dim.
Oedus Caro Cross Roads Ouroboros Cross Combine	Posted - 2008.06.19 23:32:00 - [6] Originally by: FluterEx Originally by: MotherMoon Edited by: MotherMoon on 19/06/2008 22:19:18 also it's using the new DX10 models Holy **** when will we get ship models like that ? Unless I'm in the wrong decade, we won't - not in EVE, at any rate. I think that model was created for the generation of bump maps for the assets the game actually uses (or that, at least, is what was said of really high-res models paraded in developer blogs long before the release of Trinity).
jongalt	Posted - 2008.06.19 23:48:00 - [7] rumor has it nVidia is working on new drivers for the voodoo 5 card in order to take advantage of the DX10 / Vista synergy....
Khandara Seraphim StarHunt Fallout Project	Posted - 2008.06.20 00:31:00 - [8] All I want are explosions. the way that titan goes down at the end is the exact thing i've had my fingers crossed hoping for for ages now. Better planets are also high on the list, but oh man those explosions rule
Viqtoria Groping Hand Social Club	Posted - 2008.06.20 00:33:00 - [9] awesome graphics already exist, awesome explosions, effects, etc. All I want is for shields to be solid things, to show damage bouncing off them, to change colour, etc. Basic stuff even games 10 years old have.
niroku KIA Corp	Posted - 2008.06.20 00:44:00 - [10] Originally by: MotherMoon Edited by: MotherMoon on 19/06/2008 22:19:18 There was a dev quote saying yes :) saying that it what they want eve to look like in 2 years. No reason it couldn't other than the explosions. I mean it's pretty basic, space games are easier to render in a way so you can really push some effects. also it's using the new DX10 models Actually, the models used in the end segment of the trailer were all taken from the DX9 (nine) game client assets . This includes the associated texture files . I'd like to ask who your source is for your claim that these were DX10 models . You do have a source when you say things like 'I can confirm', right ?
schurem Anarchy Inc.	Posted - 2008.06.20 01:36:00 - [11] Actually, though it is only my subjective opinion, EvE looks quite a bit better on vista than it does on XP. I reckon some of the dx10 niceties are already being used to make the models have more depth and detail to em. However, I still think EvE needs more and better tactical warning sounds. <<<< No Boundaries, No Fences, Fly Free* Or Die Trying* >>>>
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.06.20 01:46:00 - [12] Originally by: Oedus Caro Originally by: FluterEx Originally by: MotherMoon Edited by: MotherMoon on 19/06/2008 22:19:18 also it's using the new DX10 models Holy **** when will we get ship models like that ? Unless I'm in the wrong decade, we won't - not in EVE, at any rate. I think that model was created for the generation of bump maps for the assets the game actually uses (or that, at least, is what was said of really high-res models paraded in developer blogs long before the release of Trinity). what do you mean? they are fully modeled AND used for the normal maps on the current. THe DX10 models are ready to go it's just a question of when it will be supported.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.06.20 01:47:00 - [13] Originally by: niroku Originally by: MotherMoon Edited by: MotherMoon on 19/06/2008 22:19:18 There was a dev quote saying yes :) saying that it what they want eve to look like in 2 years. No reason it couldn't other than the explosions. I mean it's pretty basic, space games are easier to render in a way so you can really push some effects. also it's using the new DX10 models Actually, the models used in the end segment of the trailer were all taken from the DX9 (nine) game client assets . This includes the associated texture files . I'd like to ask who your source is for your claim that these were DX10 models . You do have a source when you say things like 'I can confirm', right ? the Art of EvE book. fun stuff lots of DX10 models.
Kyra Felann Noctis Fleet Technologies	Posted - 2008.06.20 02:22:00 - [14] Originally by: Jacob Mei Hopefully in two years either a new windows OS will be out or Vista will finally be made practical because I am sure as hell not putting vista as it is now for the dx10 graphics. Funny, I've been using Vista on my only windows machine for over a year and I've never seen any impracticalities that you imply exist. I rarely get crashes, I can run games fine, my computer hasn't exploded...what are these problems that you are imagining? I think you're falling prey to all the FUD about Vista out there. It's a perfectly good OS (as far as Windows goes) and is better than XP in every way I can think of (I didn't like XP, though). I hope you're not getting your info from the new Mac ads. I'm far from a Microsoft fanboy, but I get annoyed at all the undeserved FUD about Vista from people who've probably never used it.
Kyra Felann Noctis Fleet Technologies	Posted - 2008.06.20 02:24:00 - [15] Originally by: schurem Actually, though it is only my subjective opinion, EvE looks quite a bit better on vista than it does on XP. I reckon some of the dx10 niceties are already being used to make the models have more depth and detail to em. You're imagining things, just like the people who imagine who thought Age of Conan looked better in DX10 mode, even though devs said that DX10 wasn't actually implemented and wouldn't be for months after release. But people changed the little option for DX10 that doesn't actually do anything and thought things magically looked better.
Batwigg B and D	Posted - 2008.06.20 02:25:00 - [16] Originally by: MotherMoon Originally by: niroku Originally by: MotherMoon Edited by: MotherMoon on 19/06/2008 22:19:18 There was a dev quote saying yes :) saying that it what they want eve to look like in 2 years. No reason it couldn't other than the explosions. I mean it's pretty basic, space games are easier to render in a way so you can really push some effects. also it's using the new DX10 models Actually, the models used in the end segment of the trailer were all taken from the DX9 (nine) game client assets . This includes the associated texture files . I'd like to ask who your source is for your claim that these were DX10 models . You do have a source when you say things like 'I can confirm', right ? the Art of EvE book. fun stuff lots of DX10 models. The models in the Art of EVE book are the DX9 models.
Anell Evil Avatar Ltd.	Posted - 2008.06.20 03:00:00 - [17] Edited by: Anell on 20/06/2008 03:01:42 Edited by: Anell on 20/06/2008 03:00:43 Originally by: Kyra Felann Funny, I've been using Vista on my only windows machine for over a year and I've never seen any impracticalities that you imply exist. I rarely get crashes, I can run games fine, my computer hasn't exploded...what are these problems that you are imagining? I think you're falling prey to all the FUD about Vista out there. It's a perfectly good OS (as far as Windows goes) and is better than XP in every way I can think of (I didn't like XP, though). I hope you're not getting your info from the new Mac ads. I'm far from a Microsoft fanboy, but I get annoyed at all the undeserved FUD about Vista from people who've probably never used it. Vista is a great OS for productivity. It is more stable then XP. However, when it comes to gaming it is inferior to XP in most of the ways that count. Just lookup some benchmarks comparing XP to Vista in a resource intensive video game. There are very real and quite significant FPS differences with the XP machine coming out on top every time. Vista also takes up a lot more RAM which ends up meaning games get a lot less to work with. If you have 4+ gigs of RAM then its not a big deal. If you have 2 gigs or less you will feel the crunch on more resource intensive games. In the realm not related to gaming Vista has some fundemental flaws in its design. They can appear in minor ways but it is annoying. Try copying 40+ files reaching at least 60+ megs from one folder to another on the same HD in Vista sometime then do the same operation in XP. Vista will literally grind away at this for 20+ seconds whereas XP will do it instantly. The other day I tried using the Vista zip utility to decompress 70 megs of data. The timer in Vista kept going up for how long this operation would take. I stopped it when the timer read 1 hour and some odd minutes. I downloaded 7-zip and the operation took a couple of seconds. So yea, making an argument that Vista is great for games is really just not valid.
Drexxler Freedom Incorporated	Posted - 2008.06.20 03:07:00 - [18] What does the DirectX version have to do with model details? I don't see why there would be "DX10 Models" in the first place....
Vellen Thoss	Posted - 2008.06.20 03:11:00 - [19] Edited by: Vellen Thoss on 20/06/2008 03:14:50 Edited by: Vellen Thoss on 20/06/2008 03:11:58 Originally by: Anell Edited by: Anell on 20/06/2008 03:01:42 Edited by: Anell on 20/06/2008 03:00:43 Originally by: Kyra Felann Funny, I've been using Vista on my only windows machine for over a year and I've never seen any impracticalities that you imply exist. I rarely get crashes, I can run games fine, my computer hasn't exploded...what are these problems that you are imagining? I think you're falling prey to all the FUD about Vista out there. It's a perfectly good OS (as far as Windows goes) and is better than XP in every way I can think of (I didn't like XP, though). I hope you're not getting your info from the new Mac ads. I'm far from a Microsoft fanboy, but I get annoyed at all the undeserved FUD about Vista from people who've probably never used it. Vista is a great OS for productivity. It is more stable then XP. However, when it comes to gaming it is inferior to XP in most of the ways that count. Just lookup some benchmarks comparing XP to Vista in a resource intensive video game. There are very real and quite significant FPS differences with the XP machine coming out on top every time. Vista also takes up a lot more RAM which ends up meaning games get a lot less to work with. If you have 4+ gigs of RAM then its not a big deal. If you have 2 gigs or less you will feel the crunch on more resource intensive games. In the realm not related to gaming Vista has some fundemental flaws in its design. They can appear in minor ways but it is annoying. Try copying 40+ files reaching at least 60+ megs from one folder to another on the same HD in Vista sometime then do the same operation in XP. Vista will literally grind away at this for 20+ seconds whereas XP will do it instantly. The other day I tried using the Vista zip utility to decompress 70 megs of data. The timer in Vista kept going up for how long this operation would take. I stopped it when the timer read 1 hour and some odd minutes. I downloaded 7-zip and the operation took a couple of seconds. So yea, making an argument that Vista is great for games is really just not valid. I really have no idea what youre talking about. You dont need more than 2 gigs of ram unless youre running XP/Vista 64, I have Vista Ultimate 32 and 2 gigs and I have not experienced any of these slowdowns you talk about. I run Crysis and Age Of Conan on high settings and get 50+ FPS average for both games. (Mind you Ive got an EVGA 9800GTX, but still.) Ive also unzipped 500+ megabyte files and Im pretty sure the longest any of them took was around 10-12 minutes due to a large amount of directories. From what Ive seen and experienced, all the things youre talking about were sporadic pre SP-1 issues that the minorities griped out on web forums. Ive never had a single issue with it, before and after Service Pack 1.
Batwigg B and D	Posted - 2008.06.20 03:21:00 - [20] Originally by: Drexxler What does the DirectX version have to do with model details? I don't see why there would be "DX10 Models" in the first place.... Mothermoon is just talking out of his ass. The models in the back of the Art of EVE book are the models in game right now - There's no such thing as a Direct X 10 model. Direct X 10 does not affect model polygon count in any way. The models just look a bit more crisp in the art book because they are printed in extremely high resolution, and they have no textures on.
Anell Evil Avatar Ltd.	Posted - 2008.06.20 04:11:00 - [21] Originally by: Vellen Thoss I really have no idea what youre talking about. You dont need more than 2 gigs of ram unless youre running XP/Vista 64, I have Vista Ultimate 32 and 2 gigs and I have not experienced any of these slowdowns you talk about. I run Crysis and Age Of Conan on high settings and get 50+ FPS average for both games. (Mind you Ive got an EVGA 9800GTX, but still.) Ive also unzipped 500+ megabyte files and Im pretty sure the longest any of them took was around 10-12 minutes due to a large amount of directories. From what Ive seen and experienced, all the things youre talking about were sporadic pre SP-1 issues that the minorities griped out on web forums. Ive never had a single issue with it, before and after Service Pack 1. I'm running Vista with SP1 on my laptop so that is where I'm getting my information from as far times it takes to unzip things. The particular example I used happened last week (and yes I've had SP1 since it was released). When I couldn't unzip this file (it was a bluetooth stack btw) I thought it maybe was just because the computer was busy or some such. So I shut everything down and restarted, gave it a few minutes to completely start up and then tried again. Exact same results. The counter quickly stretched over an hour. I don't know what it is but something in Vista is boinked. As for slowdowns. I'm not saying that Vista is incapable of running games. What I am saying is that Vista does not run games as well as XP. So while you are getting 50 FPS in Conan in Vista you would probably be doing a bit better if you were to wipe your machine and re-install XP. Thus as far as running games is concerned theres just no reason to do it in Vista. Thats why you don't see a lot of gamers upgrading. And Microsoft's insistence on keeping DX10 Vista only means that games are not adopting it as quickly as they adopted previous directx upgrades.
Viqtoria Groping Hand Social Club	Posted - 2008.06.20 04:19:00 - [22] Originally by: Anell Edited by: Anell on 20/06/2008 03:01:42 Edited by: Anell on 20/06/2008 03:00:43 Originally by: Kyra Felann Funny, I've been using Vista on my only windows machine for over a year and I've never seen any impracticalities that you imply exist. I rarely get crashes, I can run games fine, my computer hasn't exploded...what are these problems that you are imagining? I think you're falling prey to all the FUD about Vista out there. It's a perfectly good OS (as far as Windows goes) and is better than XP in every way I can think of (I didn't like XP, though). I hope you're not getting your info from the new Mac ads. I'm far from a Microsoft fanboy, but I get annoyed at all the undeserved FUD about Vista from people who've probably never used it. Vista is a great OS for productivity. It is more stable then XP. However, when it comes to gaming it is inferior to XP in most of the ways that count. Just lookup some benchmarks comparing XP to Vista in a resource intensive video game. There are very real and quite significant FPS differences with the XP machine coming out on top every time. Vista also takes up a lot more RAM which ends up meaning games get a lot less to work with. If you have 4+ gigs of RAM then its not a big deal. If you have 2 gigs or less you will feel the crunch on more resource intensive games. In the realm not related to gaming Vista has some fundemental flaws in its design. They can appear in minor ways but it is annoying. Try copying 40+ files reaching at least 60+ megs from one folder to another on the same HD in Vista sometime then do the same operation in XP. Vista will literally grind away at this for 20+ seconds whereas XP will do it instantly. The other day I tried using the Vista zip utility to decompress 70 megs of data. The timer in Vista kept going up for how long this operation would take. I stopped it when the timer read 1 hour and some odd minutes. I downloaded 7-zip and the operation took a couple of seconds. So yea, making an argument that Vista is great for games is really just not valid. wtf is with that folder copying thing? I use vista as it is absolutely rock stable, and I need that, but some of it's behavior, like the file copying thing (I run raid0 for gods sake...speed!!) confuses me.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.06.20 04:44:00 - [23] Originally by: Batwigg Originally by: Drexxler What does the DirectX version have to do with model details? I don't see why there would be "DX10 Models" in the first place.... Mothermoon is just talking out of his ass. The models in the back of the Art of EVE book are the models in game right now - There's no such thing as a Direct X 10 model. Direct X 10 does not affect model polygon count in any way. The models just look a bit more crisp in the art book because they are printed in extremely high resolution, and they have no textures on. like hell they are, there is a difference between polys and normal maps pal. they aren't DX10 then they are full poly models. Eve IS NOT USING THE MODELS IN THE ART BOOK IN THE GAME. You might wish they are but sorry mate, they aren't. p.s.(not having textures doesn't decease polys lol.)
Mica Swanhaven	Posted - 2008.06.20 05:36:00 - [24] cool stuff moon.
Batwigg B and D	Posted - 2008.06.20 05:59:00 - [25] Edited by: Batwigg on 20/06/2008 06:00:41 Originally by: MotherMoon Edited by: MotherMoon on 20/06/2008 05:22:22 Edited by: MotherMoon on 20/06/2008 05:19:15 Edited by: MotherMoon on 20/06/2008 05:08:12 Edited by: MotherMoon on 20/06/2008 05:07:58 Originally by: Batwigg Originally by: Drexxler What does the DirectX version have to do with model details? I don't see why there would be "DX10 Models" in the first place.... Mothermoon is just talking out of his ass. The models in the back of the Art of EVE book are the models in game right now - There's no such thing as a Direct X 10 model. Direct X 10 does not affect model polygon count in any way. The models just look a bit more crisp in the art book because they are printed in extremely high resolution, and they have no textures on. Forget I've decided to bring down my full wrath on you. also your right why am I saying DX10 models? EDIT: adding pics http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/0806/highrez.JPG "My full wrath" The top picture is a really bad screenshot - If you look at that part in game, you can clearly see all the detail that is on the model in the art book. The second picture... there's no goddamn difference between the model in the art book and the screenshot you posted. None whatsoever, other than texture and stuff like that. The models may look lower detailed in game, but that is because of visual noise like reflective surfaces on the model, textures, etcetera. There really is no difference, at all, between those models and what you see in the game at full settings. Stop being a dumbass. There is no such thing as a Direct X 10 model - There's no new feature in Direct X 10 that allows it to handle higher polygon counts on the same hardware over Direct X 9. The models in the art book look more defined and higher quality because there's no clutter whatsoever on them, and you see them in a very sharp light - In game, you're floating around in space, with all kinds of textures, reflective surfaces, shadows, and other doodads on the model, in significantly worse lightning conditions. The reason that the trailer looks better is, I imagine, simply because of intensive post processing. Most game companies do this when creating game trailers. Edit; I have the art of EVE book, so I know what you're talking about. All the models I've compared in-game with their Art of EVE counterparts look exactly the same - The only one I haven't had a chance to see in game yet is the Polaris frigate, simply because there ain't exactly a lot of those things floating around.
Brachis Eve Liberation Force Liberty.	Posted - 2008.06.20 06:11:00 - [26] No ships in EVE will have models with as many polys as they have parts for many years to come. Currently, EVE uses really good bump maps and light maps to make the ship geometries appear more complex than they actually are, and in a game engine designed to be played in large-scale battles on computers that don't represent the bleeding edge of technology, replacing all of those features with actual geometry would be a joke. The graphics will get better, over time, but we're more likely to see higher resolution textures and improved bump map quality than we are to see actual added geometry. "I do this with but one small ship and I am called a terrorist... you do it with an entire fleet and are called an Emperor."
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.06.20 06:12:00 - [27] Edited by: MotherMoon on 20/06/2008 06:18:19 I already said I was wrong about the DX10 model thing. However I am not wrong the ingame models are lower rez, they don't have as many polys, they don't have as high normal maps (bump maps are not normal maps! argh) It's how production works, and someday they will release the better stuff to us. but for now they use it in the trailers. please I don't ammar ships get my a really close up ic then please. Also I'll dig out the dev comments about how the models are 10 times lower rez than the finished models.
MotherMoon Huang Yinglong	Posted - 2008.06.20 06:17:00 - [28] Edited by: MotherMoon on 20/06/2008 06:23:02 Edited by: MotherMoon on 20/06/2008 06:22:11 stop trying to compete, here why don't you take it from the devs mouth instead. I'm sure they are FULL of BS. http://myeve.eve-online.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=543 more info for the non-ignorant Quote: The reason the videos look a bit crisper in the video is probably because they're using the full size uncompressed TGA textures. They were captured from graphics engine, but not from in-game, because at the time they were being done, the game integration of the art assets wasn't finished. The possibility is open for the future for some textures to be increased in resolution, but doing so has an obvious cost in texture memory, installer size and installed disk footprint etc. you want more? note that the models in the art book at at the bolded text stage.

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