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Notarri
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Posted - 2008.06.28 15:28:00 -
[1]
I have a three step idea that may trim the macro miner hoards down to a handful. Simple really, first step: Allow mining lasers to damage ships to an infintesimal degree.
This would mean that macro hunters could place their ship near suspected macro miners and wait to be auto targetted (I have been targeted by macros before). Once they start "mining" the targeted ship, it triggers an aggression timer and CONCROD swoops in and kills them. People may accidentally target a player ship in a crowded belt, but only a macro would then activate a mining laser on a targeted ship. Works for high sec, but hold the thought I address low sec later.
Step two: Not sure how easy this part would be, but somehow send CCP an alert on accounts that "attack" ships with mining lasers so CCP could further investigate the accounts themselves for possible banning. If I am not mistaken, these ships that are destroyed in high sec as the aggressor have their security status effected, so eventualy, high sec becomes off limits for those macro accounts.
Step three: Have a new police force similar to CONCORD but maybe MPs (Mining Police). These ships would be available in every system, high and low sec. Have one in each belt randomly moving to asteroids and ice chunks and hover long enough to randomly be targeted and "attacked" by mining lasers. Then once this occurs they act as CONCORD would to defend their buddy. The kills they generate could easily be tracted by CCP. These ship would not be CONCORD in that they would have no effect on PvP.
Thoughts?
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Demetrius True
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Posted - 2008.06.28 15:41:00 -
[2]
Nice idea! I like the thought of sitting in front of the macro miner and watching CONCORD give me a salvage opportunity... At lease this would begin to address the issue...
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Tbear
Cave Bear Mining
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Posted - 2008.06.28 15:52:00 -
[3]
It's surprising that CCP has allowed the macro miner issue to persist for so long. I would have not expected them to let this phenomenon damage EVE so much. As the CEO of a small mining corp, I spend too much of my time trying to find mining locations in Empire because of this issue. When we do find a few belts, if we don't run the mining op that night, it's almost guaranteed that the belts will be cleaned out by the next day by macro miners.
This needs to be fixed... |
Banana Torres
Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.06.28 15:56:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Notarri
I have a three step idea that may trim the macro miner hoards down to a handful. Simple really, first step: Allow mining lasers to damage ships to an infintesimal degree.
This would mean that macro hunters could place their ship near suspected macro miners and wait to be auto targetted (I have been targeted by macros before).
Step 1a: Watch as the macro miners adapt their programs so that they do not target ships. |
Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.06.28 15:57:00 -
[5]
Silly.
Macros aren't stupid enough to "target" a ship, otherwise their drones would assault every can flipper in existence and there wouldn't be any macros. You are trying to put in things to give you an opportunity that won't happen. Instead it will be used as a method of baiting n00b miners who don't know better.
Try the "legal" methods of dealing with Macros:
1) Petition them. You know, the thing that CCP keeps begging us to do?
2) Suicide them.
3) Bump/harass them, knock them away from their cans/asteroids
4) Steal their Ore, profit.
Find me a method of dealing with macros in game that doesn't screw normal players and n00bs and I'll support it. Everything I've seen so far in all these suggestions just makes Eve even more of "Griefers Online".
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
Not it isn't, people should be encouraged to get out in low sec space, but never forced to do so.
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Notarri
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Posted - 2008.06.28 16:14:00 -
[6]
Not silly, macros do target ships. But perhaps they can program macros to not target shps? Or create a certain ship that is recognized as an asteroid by mining barges and only allow these ship types to macro hunt? You could have a volunteer force overseen by CCP with these fleets?
Oh, and I do pettition macros, with no result.
Hey, I am just trying to come up with some fresh ideas on the subject.
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ToxicFire
Phoenix Knights
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Posted - 2008.06.28 16:14:00 -
[7]
Edited by: ToxicFire on 28/06/2008 16:17:13
Edited by: ToxicFire on 28/06/2008 16:16:07
one big flaw, your assuming macroers are so dumb that they wouldn't adapt to the situation in less than a week, where as it would take probably a month or more for CCP to put in all your suggested ideas and they'd be rendered useless by a minor change in a macroers behavior.
Also stop starting new macro threads there is a dedicated thread for macro discussion keep it there.
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=273924&page=37
------------------------------------------
Sig removed as it lacks EVE-related content. Mail [email protected] if you have questions. -Hango
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Furb Killer
Gallente
USC Militia
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Posted - 2008.06.28 16:15:00 -
[8]
Oh noes, now the macros have to put auto target option to zero (and you still got warning message you are about to do something stupid, the macro wont press button to go ahead with it).
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Faife
Minmatar
Kinda'Shujaa
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Posted - 2008.06.28 16:32:00 -
[9]
this would be a great idea of people were NPCs. |
Sack Dragon
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Posted - 2008.06.28 17:07:00 -
[10]
Macroer's Solution: set up your overview to make sure only asteroids show up.
You don't have to modify your macro program, you don't have to risk getting blown up.
Any macro miner who actually targets a ship is a complete idiot. Any macro miner who activates a mining laser on a targeted ship is the kind of idiot that idiots make fun of.
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7Boy Curry
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Posted - 2008.06.28 17:29:00 -
[11]
Why do people who do not even understand the game mechanics think they can come up with an idea that millions before haven't?
When I mine, I filter my overview to show roids only, while you may think macro miners are stupid, I seriously doubt that are stupid enough not to do the exact same thing.
it would be idiotic to do anything else IMHO. |
Wasp
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Posted - 2008.06.28 17:41:00 -
[12]
Make miners have to scan systems to find asteroid belts. These belts spawn at downtime each day in a different places. Would require two ships, skills and a short scanning process to do before mining can begin. This would make it harder and less profitable for the macro miners. Keep one regular belt in each system for noobs to work.
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Haks'he Lirky
Dominion Imperium
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Posted - 2008.06.28 17:42:00 -
[13]
hehe cool idea :) not sure I would call it simple, the design implications are horrendous.
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Lochmar Fiendhiem
Caldari
Wyverns of Dionysus
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.06.28 17:48:00 -
[14]
after 30 days you get booted from a starter corp and you have no corp until you join a player corp. If you leave said player corp you get dropped right back into no corp status.
you can wardec the corp as farmers and such would want the benefits of protection (although terrible) from being in a corp together for agression reasons.
But if they are in no corp status, you still can't wardec them or do anything to them, so it really solves nothing, as everyone would be listed as "no corp"
Originally by: Halkin
bob is dead, goons are great, cheese is cheesy, there we go no need for any more threads
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Terianna Eri
Amarr
Scrutari
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Posted - 2008.06.28 18:30:00 -
[15]
Couldn't they just set "Auto Target Back" to "0 ships" ?
Doesn't even have to modify the program, just press escape ingame, and it's one of the options there. |
Notarri
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Posted - 2008.06.28 22:05:00 -
[16]
Ok, so can someone respond to why having a ship designed to filter as an asteroid that is made specifically for macro hunting wouldn't work? It could be designed to filter as any asteroid type so it would show up on all overview filters. It would not target as a ship because it is designed to signature as an asteroid.
Macro miners still have to work within the bounds of the game design. And there is nothing wrong with discussing ideas for those that think there is no way to beat macro miners. They have limitations, otherwise they would simply hack the game.
Oh, and if you think there should be one thread for macro mining, then it should be *stickied* so it shows up on page one and not get burried 7 pages back  |
RigelKentaurus
Flying Tartiflette
Caldari Deep Space Industral
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Posted - 2008.06.28 22:26:00 -
[17]
Edited by: RigelKentaurus on 28/06/2008 22:26:09
Originally by: Notarri
Ok, so can someone respond to why having a ship designed to filter as an asteroid that is made specifically for macro hunting wouldn't work? It could be designed to filter as any asteroid type so it would show up on all overview filters.
So, what happens if some high sec pirate/griefer/whatever flies it next to a miner who uses his overview only and starts trying to mine it?
_________
Someday, EVE may look like this. |
WarlockX
Amarr
Free Trade Corp
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Posted - 2008.06.28 23:30:00 -
[18]
Edited by: WarlockX on 28/06/2008 23:30:32
Originally by: Notarri
I have a three step idea that may trim the macro miner hoards down to a handful. Simple really, first step: Allow mining lasers to damage ships to an infintesimal degree.
This would mean that macro hunters could place their ship near suspected macro miners and wait to be auto targetted (I have been targeted by macros before). Once they start "mining" the targeted ship, it triggers an aggression timer and CONCROD swoops in and kills them. People may accidentally target a player ship in a crowded belt, but only a macro would then activate a mining laser on a targeted ship. Works for high sec, but hold the thought I address low sec later.
Step two: Not sure how easy this part would be, but somehow send CCP an alert on accounts that "attack" ships with mining lasers so CCP could further investigate the accounts themselves for possible banning. If I am not mistaken, these ships that are destroyed in high sec as the aggressor have their security status effected, so eventualy, high sec becomes off limits for those macro accounts.
Step three: Have a new police force similar to CONCORD but maybe MPs (Mining Police). These ships would be available in every system, high and low sec. Have one in each belt randomly moving to asteroids and ice chunks and hover long enough to randomly be targeted and "attacked" by mining lasers. Then once this occurs they act as CONCORD would to defend their buddy. The kills they generate could easily be tracted by CCP. These ship would not be CONCORD in that they would have no effect on PvP.
Thoughts?
alot of ppl seem to be really ignorant about what a macro can do, so lets for the record state that for the most part
a macro can make any decision or choice that a player can make.
Examples: don't target ships, only target blue asteroids, reply with no i am not a macro if asked. find a moving button that moves around the screen to activate your mining lasers.. Ect.
There is no such thing as a change that can get rid of macros because they can be programed to do anything the only limit is the programmers patience.
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Mika Meroko
Minmatar
Crayon Posting Inc
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Posted - 2008.06.29 04:59:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Mika Meroko on 29/06/2008 05:00:23
you do know that:
-you can disable auto targeting in the menu... so that you dont automatically lock back what locked you. (yes, this is in eve menu...)
-that you can remove npc drones/all ship types and just about everything possible on the overview...(again, built in game..)
As for the kicking people out comment...
try again.. macros in 0.0 ARE already in player corps =P.. they will just make dozens of 1 man corp and switch when needed (is not illegal... you can leave corp...as long as you dont fight back.)
and yeah, best way to fight macros are:
a) petition suspected ones and let CCP handle it (they DO ban them for the record...)
b) DONT BUY ISK!!! they are in it for the next meal.. they will move on if they dont get bussiness.
shame people who buy isks!
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Sir Substance
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Posted - 2008.06.29 05:40:00 -
[20]
ive done some research on macros, although ive never actually used one.
firstly, most of them disable the autotarget back thing, but secondly, most of them require exacting window locations and colours. i allways wondered why CCP didnt just occasionally automatically collect info on peoples local settings, and look for settings that match macro-miner requirements. |
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Freya Runestone
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.06.29 07:41:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Sir Substance
ive done some research on macros, although ive never actually used one.
firstly, most of them disable the autotarget back thing, but secondly, most of them require exacting window locations and colours. i allways wondered why CCP didnt just occasionally automatically collect info on peoples local settings, and look for settings that match macro-miner requirements.
because they can change it easily, or make 10 versions of the program for different settings (or they could just make a macro for the default settings)
The idea won't work. They'll change their macro's on day 1, if not sooner (patchnotes) |
Lord WarATron
Amarr
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.06.29 08:01:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Notarri
I have a three step idea that may trim the macro miner hoards down to a handful. Simple really, first step: Allow mining lasers to damage ships to an infintesimal degree.
This would mean that macro hunters could place their ship near suspected macro miners and wait to be auto targetted (I have been targeted by macros before). Once they start "mining" the targeted ship, it triggers an aggression timer and CONCROD swoops in and kills them. People may accidentally target a player ship in a crowded belt, but only a macro would then activate a mining laser on a targeted ship. Works for high sec, but hold the thought I address low sec later.
Step two: Not sure how easy this part would be, but somehow send CCP an alert on accounts that "attack" ships with mining lasers so CCP could further investigate the accounts themselves for possible banning. If I am not mistaken, these ships that are destroyed in high sec as the aggressor have their security status effected, so eventualy, high sec becomes off limits for those macro accounts.
Step three: Have a new police force similar to CONCORD but maybe MPs (Mining Police). These ships would be available in every system, high and low sec. Have one in each belt randomly moving to asteroids and ice chunks and hover long enough to randomly be targeted and "attacked" by mining lasers. Then once this occurs they act as CONCORD would to defend their buddy. The kills they generate could easily be tracted by CCP. These ship would not be CONCORD in that they would have no effect on PvP.
Thoughts?
1. How does this stop 1 guy running 8 accounts in sweatshop?
2. How would this stop someone designing a new macro to get around this? It seems to me all the macro needs to do is when docking up, to repair the ship before undocking.
--
Billion Isk Mission |
Mangtoos
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.06.29 08:39:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Lord WarATron
1. How does this stop 1 guy running 8 accounts in sweatshop?
2. How would this stop someone designing a new macro to get around this? It seems to me all the macro needs to do is when docking up, to repair the ship before undocking.
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=808216 |
Rhanna Khurin
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.06.29 08:58:00 -
[24]
Pointless as the programs target asteroids from the survey scanner menu, not the overview. |
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