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slothe
Caldari
Murky Inc.
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:23:00 -
[1]
Please note that this is not a whine, just some (i think) well argued points that slightly bug me in this fine game.
Lets start with the basic premises of eve which i see as follows-
1. Risk v reward.
This in eve is that everything that can make isk (except trading etc) bears risks. for example 0.0 is seen as profitable, but you obviously need to survive getting there. NPCing is profitable but you risk dying etc etc...
2. Everything has a counter.
For everthing in eve there is a counter. e.g. ecm can be countered with eccm, warp disrupters can be countered with wcs etc etc. There is generally a counter for everthing.
3. Nothing should be overpowered relative to equivalent items.
This can apply to ships and modules. Over time since eve has been conceived you can see how certain items have become overpowered. This is illustrated when people cross-train to fly certain ships / setups. It was seen years agowhen amarr was boosted and everyone flew gankageddons, then gallente was boosted and everyone flew megathrons, then recently (before nano nerf) everyone was flying crazy bs speed seups (nano domi ftw ).
Items that need tweaking slightly..
1. Interdictors / heavy interdictors.
I personally like the concept of these, but why stop at warp disruption bubbles / infinipoints. Lets introduce a web bubble (would web anyone landing in it) and infiniweb (makes ship stop dead if activated). These would potentially help against ships that would easily escape warp bubbles due to crazy speeds.
2. Cloaks on non covert ships.
These do have penalties already, but imho the penalty should be increased to avoid the massive usage on an array of ships. You now see cloaks on pvp interceptors right up through to pve ravens. They dont have a counter and imho this cries against the basic rules of eve as outlined above. Im not going to suggest a definitive answer as people have different views. However ccp should consider what to do including potentially ---being able to probe cloaked ships with specialised ship types---cloaks using cap or fuel-----cloaks having a deactivation range based on ship size(the bigger the ship the further away it uncloaks)---cloak activation preventing warp / movement. Whatever the answer please do something.
3. Polycarbs.
Not an anti nano whine. I dont mind nanos and fly them a lot myself. However polycarbs are undeniably overpowered. They are the only rig that is better than its module counterpart. Put this in line with other rigs please.
There are other items that bug me, but these bug me more as (especially the cloaks) these have been problems for a while. Anyway please dont give me too much grief, im only posting as bored as on holiday and cant play the game :/ |
Furb Killer
Gallente
USC Militia
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:30:00 -
[2]
Your web idea just plain sucks.
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balrog
The Collective
Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:33:00 -
[3]
Maybe you got few solutions yourself instead of saying his idea`s sucks.
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Furb Killer
Gallente
USC Militia
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:34:00 -
[4]
Okay.
Solution: no web bubbles.
Solution given, now happy?
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Firkragg
Blue Labs
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:35:00 -
[5]
polycarb nerf idea gets a meh from me since personally i dont see much of an issue with nanosetups.
web bubble idea is dumb. Why not just make a "everyone stays still so i can shoot it to death on my terms" button.
Cloaks need to have downsides closer to warp core stabs (if not worse than warp core stabs) when fitted on none cloaking ships.
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Sokratesz
Rionnag Alba
The Requiem
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:36:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Sokratesz on 01/07/2008 11:36:55
Fix MS
Fix POS'es
Fix tanking rigs (they are way overpowered)
Nerf HP on all ships by 25 - 30%
Boost large AC & Arty
Fix tempest
This all in addition to your list ;) |
Dheorl
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:37:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: slothe
1. Interdictors / heavy interdictors.
I personally like the concept of these, but why stop at warp disruption bubbles / infinipoints. Lets introduce a web bubble (would web anyone landing in it) and infiniweb (makes ship stop dead if activated). These would potentially help against ships that would easily escape warp bubbles due to crazy speeds.
I hate the idea of not being able to get in and out of 0.0 even in an interceptor. Web bubbles would mean the only way to possibly get through a camp would be to bring a bigger gang. |
ILikeTastyPie
Digital assassins
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:39:00 -
[8]
Web idea would be totally overpowered, anybody camping a gate would be infinately able to stop anything at all coming through. Polycarbons are stupidly expensive, 2 of them making the rigs more expensive than most of the ships you fit them on, so I think that justifies how good they are. The cloaking idea...well cloaks would be pointless if people could find you with them. Although there is a bit of a problem with cloaking ships I don't think anything without making the utterly useless could be done. |
Laura Loquacious
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:39:00 -
[9]
Web bubble?? get a rapier/huginn
Polycarbs are expensive as hell, it's fair that they are nice as well.
Increased decloaking range for cloaks used on BS's and the like i dont mind however.
Make warpstabs only usable on haulers! |
Furb Killer
Gallente
USC Militia
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:42:00 -
[10]
Why would they be utterly useless when you can still be scanned down? You just cant stay afk in system anymore. |
Firkragg
Blue Labs
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:45:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Sokratesz
Edited by: Sokratesz on 01/07/2008 11:36:55
Fix MS
Fix POS'es
Fix tanking rigs (they are way overpowered)
Nerf HP on all ships by 25 - 30%
Boost large AC & Arty
Fix tempest
This all in addition to your list ;)
TBH nerfing the hp would be a big fix to projectiles anyways as the higher alpha would now have an advantage |
Dheorl
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:45:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Furb Killer
Why would they be utterly useless when you can still be scanned down? You just cant stay afk in system anymore.
How would sitting cloaked at an SS be any different from just sitting at an SS?
I think increasing the range at which they are uncloked as the ship gets bigger may be a good idea though. |
Furb Killer
Gallente
USC Militia
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Posted - 2008.07.01 11:58:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Dheorl
Originally by: Furb Killer
Why would they be utterly useless when you can still be scanned down? You just cant stay afk in system anymore.
How would sitting cloaked at an SS be any different from just sitting at an SS?
I think increasing the range at which they are uncloked as the ship gets bigger may be a good idea though.
Well depending how it would be done, you would still be harder to scan down.
But imo a cloak shouldnt be used to stay forever in one safespot.
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Elhina Novae
Amarr
Destruction Reborn
CORPVS DELICTI
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Posted - 2008.07.01 12:13:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Sokratesz
Edited by: Sokratesz on 01/07/2008 11:36:55
Fix MS
Fix POS'es
Fix tanking rigs (they are way overpowered)
Nerf HP on all ships by 25 - 30%
Boost large AC & Arty
Fix tempest
This all in addition to your list ;)
When we're talking about the wonderful POS, fix the corporation interface and handing out roles, too complicated and too much job. |
Liang Nuren
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.07.01 16:17:00 -
[15]
Slothe, of all the things in the game that are dramatically broken, these are not them. And then to suggest solutions like insta-dead-stop-web... I really thought you had more game design sense than that.
-Liang
--
It was an honor to participate in the Insurgency campaign in Branch. o7 to all involved. |
Flanneh
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Posted - 2008.07.02 09:34:00 -
[16]
I definitely agree with your opinion on cloaking. I don't much like the idea of a web bubble though...
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Amy Wang
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Posted - 2008.07.02 09:59:00 -
[17]
Originally by: slothe
3. Polycarbs.
(...) They are the only rig that is better than its module counterpart.
that is not true
regenerative plating: 8% armor bonus vs trimark rig: 15% armor bonus
nanofiber II: 12,5% mass reduction vs. Poly: 15% mass reduction
not only is the trimark rig better then its module counterpart but it is also nearly double as effective whereas the poly rig is just 20% more effective compared to a nanofiber, that is just from the top of my head, there are other examples for sure
also there are several rigs that increase stats that there are no modules for like graviton capacitor rigs or auxiliary nano pumps to just name a few so one could argue those are indefinitely more effective then their module counterparts
long story short: not all rigs are created equal and behave equally towards their module counterparts nor do they need to
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the thorn
Tres Viri
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Posted - 2008.07.02 11:28:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Amy Wang
Originally by: slothe
3. Polycarbs.
(...) They are the only rig that is better than its module counterpart.
that is not true
regenerative plating: 8% armor bonus vs trimark rig: 15% armor bonus
nanofiber II: 12,5% mass reduction vs. Poly: 15% mass reduction
...
energized regenative membrane II gives 15%
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Baudolino
Gallente
Sky Net Industries
Pure.
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Posted - 2008.07.02 11:34:00 -
[19]
About probing cloaked ships
CCP stated about a year ago or something that they were considering implementing it.
Probing would depend on factors such as ship size and intended role (if i remember correctly)
Thus a cloaked raven would not be too difficult to probe while a covert ops would still be near impossible.
I believe some detractors of the idea a forgetting one aspect.
Cloaked ships that are moving will have left the spot they were probed to- so even if hostiles warp to zero, most ships will have left the spot and the hostiles will be forced to execute search patterns.
So cloaking will still work fine, but will be slightly more dangerous and require attention from the cloaked pilot rather then going afk and playing a different account in the neighbouring system..
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deadmeet
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Posted - 2008.07.02 11:48:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Firkragg
Originally by: Sokratesz
Edited by: Sokratesz on 01/07/2008 11:36:55
Fix MS
Fix POS'es
Fix tanking rigs (they are way overpowered)
Nerf HP on all ships by 25 - 30%
Boost large AC & Arty
Fix tempest
This all in addition to your list ;)
TBH nerfing the hp would be a big fix to projectiles anyways as the higher alpha would now have an advantage
Completely wrong, nerfing HP would buff nothing for AC and Arties... I would add that it would nerf them, because as these weapons don't use caps, more the fighht will be long, more you can take an advantage about that...
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Diomidis
Amarr
Mythos Corp
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.07.02 11:54:00 -
[21]
Originally by: deadmeet
Completely wrong, nerfing HP would buff nothing for AC and Arties... I would add that it would nerf them, because as these weapons don't use caps, more the fighht will be long, more you can take an advantage about that...
Yeap, hear that man...
@ Webbing Bubbles -
For someone that believes that almost anything has a counter, how could u counter a webbing bubble + warp preventing bubble? FFS this idea is ridiculous, and the whines around it after the first fleet would run into a gate camp with both bubble types and a few torp-raven/blasterthrons/pulse-apocs-geddons-abbas around them would be something to remember!
Join the Biggest Greek Corp!
www.Mythos-eve.com - Join Mythos Channel in game! |
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