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CSM - CCP Meeting 001 - Priority List

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
ian666 Rave Technologies Inc. C0VEN	Posted - 2008.07.10 22:34:00 - [31] Edited by: ian666 on 10/07/2008 22:36:12 What about adding new time intensive skills for those who already have high amounts of SP's. For example skills like +1% to CPU/PG with x5 multiplier and pre requirements like several x1, x2, x3 skills up to lvl5? You talking about specializing in industry, think about specializing in engineering or electronics. High pre requirements of new skills will make them far from overpowered and in second hand give interesting alternative to learn for those who paying ccp from really long time.
Waxau Unus - Vir Exercitus	Posted - 2008.07.11 01:15:00 - [32] To be frank - Whilst the proposed issues/changes to black ops are useful, they still leave the ship roleless and underhanded in combat. The jump range and fuel bay isnt the base concern, its more so the ships have no true role in pvp. A suggested fix has been that of creating them as 'bs force recons'. Has been discussed at great lengths in many topics, so wont spam anymore. But yes - Whilst its good to see them being looked into, scan res, whole 'unable to warp cloaked' and so on gives them a whole variety of issues (let alone holding no advantage in most scenarios vs their t1 variants.)
Pivalak Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.07.11 07:12:00 - [33] Why is it that the Linux client issue(s) are missing from the list? CSM - CCP Meeting 001 - 0034 Linux Client After a delay of 7 months, all we know is that a beta on a better version of the client is going to occur "at some point in the future". Now I'm not sure anymore what having "official support" from CCP on Linux and Mac does mean... :(
ZephyrLexx	Posted - 2008.07.11 15:29:00 - [34] it's frustrating to see that UI fixes and improvements are not the number 1 prioritory, whatever else gets changed, the UI is always there and it's how we play the game, and everyone has to deal with it. sigh.
Mell Prime	Posted - 2008.07.11 18:56:00 - [35] thanks for posting this. now i know what is going on. i never really kept up-to-date with the CSM.
Windjammer Gallente	Posted - 2008.07.11 21:18:00 - [36] How did Jump Bridges and Cyno Jammers make it to high priority? I thought escalation of that was voted down in a CSM meeting. Windjammer
Matalino Gallente Ki Tech Industries	Posted - 2008.07.11 21:58:00 - [37] Here is the original list repeated with links to official thread as best as I could find them. If I find official threads for the remaining issues, I will edit my post to include them as well. Originally by: CCP Wrangler High Priority: 0004 Black Ops Improvements X Jump Bridges and Cynojammers 0029 Eve-Mail Issues 0019 Contract Improvements 0018 0.0 Sovereignty Issues 0013 Skill Page Tweaks 0007 Double Click function on avatars Medium-High Priority 0026 Suicide Ganking 0012 Minimum Size of HUD elements 0009 Alliances and Factional Warfare 0017 Empire War Decs 0030 PVP Wreck Ownership 0003 Problems with Aggression Timer 0001 Skill Queue Medium Priority 0016 Switching all Ammo at the same time 0015 Pilot Avatar Listing 0002 Bombs need a Boost 0039 Roleplay Storylines 0028 Forum Issues and Fixing 0021 Assembly Array Issues 0022 Shares and Dividends Issues 0024 Experimental Industry Issues 0027 Drone Implants 0036 Small Freighter X Corp -> Alliance sync Low Priority 0006 Pillageable Outposts X More Corp Standing Slots 0011 Electronic Warfare Icons 0033 Color Deficiency 0014 Personal Assets and HUD 0038 Buff Large Autocannons Rejected/Unfeasable/Completed 0025 Game Time Codes 0020 Public POS Arrays 0023 Sell order availability 0008 Cargo Hold Size
Odewad Gallente Geddonites	Posted - 2008.07.12 01:23:00 - [38] Originally by: Jade Constantine Kinda convinces me that we hit EXACTLY the right balance. When extremists on both sides are screaming its a fair bet the committee did its job quite nicely. You didn't do shit .... except win a free trip. As many ahead of me have pointed out, you were so busy patting yourselves on the back you forgot to mention the concerns of the same people who won you the trip. ------ http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/5962/brightlc7.png This ^^ sucks
Masu'di Es and Whizz Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2008.07.12 01:31:00 - [39] i'm really excited about evemail improvements, does anyone have a link to a post with any further details?
Jinx Barker GFB Scientific	Posted - 2008.07.12 01:59:00 - [40] Edited by: Jinx Barker on 12/07/2008 02:01:11 Originally by: Odewad Originally by: Jade Constantine Kinda convinces me that we hit EXACTLY the right balance. When extremists on both sides are screaming its a fair bet the committee did its job quite nicely. You didn't do shit .... except win a free trip. As many ahead of me have pointed out, you were so busy patting yourselves on the back you forgot to mention the concerns of the same people who won you the trip. Pretty much correct - CSM had a chance to do something special, instead they focused on some "safe" nickel and dime bull shit and failed all those who voted for them Goonswarm maybe able to push their candidates through sheer force of numbers, but rest of you "regular" elected CSM better be ready when the next election comes. Where is the fix for POS? Something that had overwhelming support? I am not talking about a controversy here, like Black Ops, or War Decs, or idiotic suicide ganking, all those things worked, and worked OK, even half broken. Very much unlike the current POS system which has been broken for years and takes bloody hours and days and years to maintain when it has to be improved, and is affecting pretty much everyone.

Lynn Suriyawong	Posted - 2008.07.12 03:54:00 - [41] I'm disappointed as well, as it seems that the interests of a minority of players (0.0 players in large alliances) are being over represented in this priority list. First and foremost should be attention paid to the core parts of the game, in particular the UI. Anyone who plays eve for any significant amount of time can sit down and write out a list of things that could be tweaked to make using the UI less tedious and annoying. Here's a few off the top of my head: Mining laser countdown timers More tabs for the overview, 5 just isn't enough. Perhaps a drop down list for the list of tabs you want displayed. I'd love to be able to set up a group for general PvP, a group for complex/scanning/exploration, a group for missioning, a group for gathering loot/salvaging, etc. The vast majority of the time, I could use 2-3 tabs for the type of gameplay I'm currently engaged in... but since I like to do lots of stuff, there are far more than 5 total. Applying ALL color tags to the local list (I'd love to see low security standing players, for example) Making similar context menus have the same options... for example, I can't align to a stellar object in some context menus, while I can in others. (Why would you have different implementations of context menus in different places anyhow?) Letting us "view market details" on any UI element that has an item contained inside... for example, the info window sometimes has it as an option, sometimes it has no options at all... why the difference? Let us cancel warp in mid-flight... if we can bookmark a location while warping, why can't we just stop? It's not likely that you could have the accuracy needed to land anywhere specific on purpose. Ever warped to the wrong gate while flying a freighter, and realized it just as you entered warp.. and the gate is 120 AU away? SUCKS! Fix the various ways that numbers are handled in text fields. When I click on a price, there should be a cursor inserted there, that's it. I don't want to do anything odd, and I don't need the numeric display to change to something like 41883.1299. Where'd the 99 come from anyhow? (I think the auto justification is part of the problem here.) For god's sake, let us sort by meta level in our hangers! I can't remember which modules are the valuable ones, but meta level can certainly help! Let us export and import overview settings to other characters/accounts. This data is obviously being stored somewhere on our hard drives in some format... why not make it portable? Let us highlight our own orders in the market window! And shoving the whole alliance thing in there as the top FW issue... come on! The reason why alliances aren't in FW has been stated, and it's a reasonable restriction given the likely outcome if the restriction were lifted. Let corps in alliances in FW? Do you really want Goonfleet or Evolution signing up in FW? Factional warfare is fun, but based on the last month's worth of player experience, it could use some tweaking... better rewards, mission tweaks, something to discourage giant blobs, etc. Yet, none of that is on the list. Instead, we have the issue of alliances participating in FW. How about we get FW polished up and make it more fun first, before worrying about that? And despite what Jade said above, the speed issue SHOULD be a priority on the community representative's list, as it is obviously a priority in the community! How can you possibly justify saying that this is representative of the entire Eve community without that issue listed? It's one of the most talked about issues in the community! It doesn't matter what YOU think of the issue, or what CCP thinks of the issue... it's what WE think about it. You're there to represent us, please don't forget that. It's unfortunate that "special interests" seem to have a disproportionate influence in this priority list... just like real world politics.
Lynn Suriyawong	Posted - 2008.07.12 04:04:00 - [42] Additionally, why black ops over assault frigates? Far more players have the ability to fly assault frigates than black ops, yet black ops has the highest priority, and assault ships are absent. Why? What about the 3rd high slot on the Helios? The missing turret on the Vulture? The fact that only a few of the recons are really used? All of these ships are more available to the general population of Eve than black ops ships... yet we see nothing. It'd be easier to swallow if black ops was further down the list, but you guys have it as the absolute highest priority! I'm sorry, but it's just not that important to the majority of us! Sure, it should be looked at, but not before you give the assault frigate class a better role and/or tweak them so they're an attractive option to cruisers.
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2008.07.12 10:12:00 - [43] Originally by: Inanna Zuni left, imho, a lot to be desired in that rather than taking an average of all the CSM's views it was based on a simple majority (so effectively ignoring those not in that majority). The same flaw the elections for CSM had in the first place if you voted for someone that got a low number of votes, your vote was wasted, when if done on a preferential system you could have either re-cast or indicated a second preference etc to affect a change in which 'other' candidate you would prefer to be elected out of the remaining. A much fairer system, instead of the current one where effectively 0.02% of people decide each CSM candidate (and the views of a third of the voters are simply discarded).
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2008.07.12 10:18:00 - [44] Originally by: Lynn Suriyawong What about the 3rd high slot on the Helios? I fly the Helios, the reason it doesn't have third high slot is because unlike the other cov-ops, it has a drone bay. So while the fitout for the others is probe launcher / cloak / gun, the fitout for a helios is just probe launcher / cloak (drone). I rather like this as it means you don't have to waste fitting on your weapon. And the drone is handy for popping pods you scan down etc. Granted this may not be an effective use of the ship if you're using it in one of the newer PvE roles, but I guess that's something to consider. I don't think adding a high slot to them would necessarily make them overpowered since they are so tight on fittings anyway, and not exactly useful in doing damage against anything that can shoot back. I think the reason for Black Ops being on the list is that they're not really a ship worth having, and cost quite abit. Though being at the top of the list IMO is a long way from where they should be. Because they're not all that useful, as you point out, not a heap of people fly them, so the problem doesn't affect that many people (not flying something because it's not useful isn't the highest order of problem IMO), things that you use constantly (possibly because you have to) but that have issues are pretty high on my personal list of things I'd like to see fixed.
Mesuno Azure Horizon	Posted - 2008.07.12 22:15:00 - [45] Out of curiousity, exactly how did the CSM decide the order of these items. You mentioned fist-fights etc but I can't believe that any individual would have looked at that list and put 'black ops improvements' top. Sounds like you needed a formal system of reviewing these items, such as a pivot table system. I'll give a little demo on a random list of letters.... sotganhdumexyw Pick one item from the list and decide whether each of the remaining items should be above or below it. Effectively that one becomes the pivot dividing the list in two. Pick 's' - divide alphabetically oganhdme s tuxyw On each of the new sublists pick a pivot and continue.. ganhdme o s tuw x y ade g hmn o s t u w x y a d e g h m n o s t u w x y And evenually you get a nice ordered list. It may seem like a complex way of doing it but it has advantages: a) It is transparent - you can justify why the CSM as a whole placed any item where it is b) It should reduce the problems with obvious misplacements. You are asking 'Is issue X more or less important than issue Y?' As opposed to 'what should go top of the list?' which risks everyone jumping on their own hobby horses. c) it makes the process systematic so people are less likely to get worked up. /me removes his maths teachers hat and puts the Decision Maths textbook back on the shelf to collect more dust. Hmmm... doesn't come out as pretty as I would like - for some reason the forum is stripping out the extra spaces I'd put in to make it all line up. I hope it still makes sense! Originally by: t20 If it's not fixed by the christmas holidays, I'll most likely get fired. - on the forum "!" problem
JVol Amarr The IMorral MAjority Imorral Dragons	Posted - 2008.07.13 04:22:00 - [46] Just before the CSM's went to Iceland I remember Jade saying that he was going to bring up duel ownership of wrecks and cargo from pvp.. I didnt see it in the minutes.. What happend jade?
Matalino Gallente Ki Tech Industries	Posted - 2008.07.13 05:11:00 - [47] Originally by: JVol Just before the CSM's went to Iceland I remember Jade saying that he was going to bring up duel ownership of wrecks and cargo from pvp.. I didnt see it in the minutes.. What happend jade? I am guessing that is the medium-high priority item "0030 PVP Wreck Ownership". The question is, where is Wranglers post-meeting thread to follow up discussion on this feature.
Antiquus Altercor Minmatar Phoenix Propulsion Labs Lost Sheep Domain	Posted - 2008.07.13 13:06:00 - [48] I spend all my time in lo-sec and in the past in no-sec and do almost nothing in empire but a little shopping. I read the minutes of the CSM meeting in it's entirety. What was discussed was impressive, and the CSM is to be congratulated. However, it sure looks to me like the care bears got screwed on the priority list. I'd like a little more light shown on who voted and how in the CSM. Every politician in anything close to resembling a democracy has to defend their voting record, and the CSM should be no exception.
Zathi Shaitan Minmatar Illiteracy Combatants	Posted - 2008.07.13 23:41:00 - [49] Originally by: Gojyu So it cost us players how much for this? Basically 12 round trips to iceland to deliver a synopsis of the general forum. In all seriousness, what has this accomplished that couldn't be done over mirc? Like... does it have to be Mirc? Couldn't it be X-chat? </sarcasm> When will noobs realize IRC is a protocol and Mirc is just a client? Lord... ---- " Several unconventional alliances where made at that point " - Hey CCP, "where" != "were".. you too, Brutus? http://loseloose.com/
McTard	Posted - 2008.07.14 00:06:00 - [50] Edited by: McTard on 14/07/2008 00:10:15 Originally by: Herschel Yamamoto Originally by: McTard Fair enough. You're being surprisingly reasonable for a character named McTard. What's the catch? I dunno, off day maybe? Quote: The question is, where is Wranglers post-meeting thread to follow up discussion on this feature. Ok, back on track now: Yeah, and if I see the usual "we are looking into that/this/the other, kktxbye!" usual bs I'll puke.

AltBier Minmatar Freelance Unincorporated	Posted - 2008.07.14 09:17:00 - [51] Edited by: AltBier on 14/07/2008 09:17:55 Originally by: Lynn Suriyawong Mining laser countdown timers More tabs for the overview, 5 just isn't enough. Perhaps a drop down list for the list of tabs you want displayed. I'd love to be able to set up a group for general PvP, a group for complex/scanning/exploration, a group for missioning, a group for gathering loot/salvaging, etc. The vast majority of the time, I could use 2-3 tabs for the type of gameplay I'm currently engaged in... but since I like to do lots of stuff, there are far more than 5 total. Applying ALL color tags to the local list (I'd love to see low security standing players, for example) Making similar context menus have the same options... for example, I can't align to a stellar object in some context menus, while I can in others. (Why would you have different implementations of context menus in different places anyhow?) Letting us "view market details" on any UI element that has an item contained inside... for example, the info window sometimes has it as an option, sometimes it has no options at all... why the difference? Let us cancel warp in mid-flight... if we can bookmark a location while warping, why can't we just stop? It's not likely that you could have the accuracy needed to land anywhere specific on purpose. Ever warped to the wrong gate while flying a freighter, and realized it just as you entered warp.. and the gate is 120 AU away? SUCKS! Fix the various ways that numbers are handled in text fields. When I click on a price, there should be a cursor inserted there, that's it. I don't want to do anything odd, and I don't need the numeric display to change to something like 41883.1299. Where'd the 99 come from anyhow? (I think the auto justification is part of the problem here.) For god's sake, let us sort by meta level in our hangers! I can't remember which modules are the valuable ones, but meta level can certainly help! Let us export and import overview settings to other characters/accounts. This data is obviously being stored somewhere on our hard drives in some format... why not make it portable? Let us highlight our own orders in the market window! Very nice list there ... where are the suggestion threads so people can vote for these issues to be brought up at the next CSM meeting?
Sinulan Kahn Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2008.07.15 22:21:00 - [52] Its funny, i liked where the discussion was heading in about 90% of the CSM minutes... until i got to this priority list. I propose that this function of the CSM be changed. It should be where CCP reveals its own internal priority list. Then CCP and the CSM could modify it together, based on the issues that where raised in the meeting. Priority should be based on time required to implement the feature, balanced with playerbase interest. Something with a high enough interest from the playerbase could be put at the top even if it will take a long time to implement. But, the top of the list shouldn't only be things that will take 2 years to create. This is where the balance should come in with CCP being truthful(in relating time to implement) and firm(rejecting unrealistic priority lists) in their discussions with the CSM. *** This current priority list doesnt have much to do with playerbase support or time required for completion. And thats where it fails.... hard.
Heinkel facility Caldari	Posted - 2008.07.16 22:22:00 - [53] Why no Jump clone reduction timer with the inclusion of a skill reducing it by 5% or 10%? Why CCP? WHY? 24hrs is just bollox and make jump clones totally worthless for what they were meant in the first place (jumping in as reinforcement to a mothership, titan or roqual). They will just still be used only for implant storage.
Nexus Wolfguard	Posted - 2008.07.17 06:34:00 - [54] Several of these topics excite me. Good job CSM!
eliminator2 Gallente Black Water.	Posted - 2008.07.17 10:35:00 - [55] Edited by: eliminator2 on 17/07/2008 10:45:41 this priority list is kinda shockingly shit i mean com on skill page tweaks is higher than say problems with aggression timer and and switching all ammo at the same time half the high priority we do not friggin need like asap but some from the rest we do. In my eyes CCP don't no nothing about what is happenin in-game and wat is causing the major problems. and the fact that GTC'S r gunna stay reall really high priced and all we r gunna have is 60 day well i can say for one wen my account goes inactive i say bb to EVE and im sure alot of people will do same well done marketing side of CCP for detroying there so called "premium" game or did all the people with CCP destroy it like CSM CCP CCP'S market side and others like that cause this game is way way WAY away from been a premium with how things are going i mean u will get people signing up fro 14 day trail and than either thinking ok cool game so fare how much would it cost OMFG im not paying that much ill go play WOW or something else or they will think bah this game is pathetic. i mean i dont no anyything about other countries but iv seen adverts on TV of WOW for years i think i sore one of EVE back wen it started and that took me 2-3 years after seeing that to actually try it. so to sum it all up in a few years EVE will be dead due to prices or dead due to lack of custumer support/listening to customers and may i add CSM u fail at pushing these points we have made to u FAIL BADLY now if u all please GTFO
Buhhdust Princess Black Water.	Posted - 2008.07.17 12:21:00 - [56] I have come to this cornershop to purchase a lag upgrade: wtb lag upgrade!! Lag upgrade? less lag = more players = more money eve. NOT MORE EXPENSIVE GTC's <3 -Buhh ________________________________________
Deldrac Bat Country Aegis Militia	Posted - 2008.07.20 15:51:00 - [57] imo, you have these... 0012 Minimum Size of HUD elements 0009 Alliances and Factional Warfare 0001 Skill Queue 0016 Switching all Ammo at the same time ...way too low.
Thirzarr	Posted - 2008.07.21 10:44:00 - [58] I feel special now! All of the high-priority items just get a "meh, who cares?" from me. Yey, I'm different. Also - I miss Linux Client. I'm so WAY different.


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