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Mud Pandemonium
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:30:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Mud Pandemonium on 05/08/2008 13:32:34 There's a cancer killing PVP in EVE, a deep rooted cancer that has nearly eliminated the element of surprise.
Trial scouts.
There is nothing more pathetic then warping your fleet around only to have it seen and reported by some idiot in an ibis who is an alt-trial account of someone in the enemy fleet.
Or using them to scout 0.5->0.4 gates for pirates, using them in FW, etc.
So what can CCP do? They can completely ban trial accounts from activating gates that would let them into 0.5 and below systems.
Restricting trial accounts to 0.6+ is the only thing that makes sense.. It's not as if other restrictions haven't been imposed on trial accounts to stop abuse.
Please CCP, give this some hard thought.
I think before my days are done, I want to be a fisherman. |
Kecheor
Free Space Pilots aka Banderlogs Red Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:32:00 -
[2]
I support this product/service.
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Steve Hawkings
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:33:00 -
[3]
lol is this some sort of joke ? they already stopped trials duel logging a normal account, thats about as much as your gonna get.
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Haradgrim
Tyrell Corp INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:34:00 -
[4]
because making a noob corp alt on your second account is hard.... but if you want to buff that, feel free --
Originally by: CCP Oveur ...every forum whine feels like a baby pony is getting killed
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Mud Pandemonium
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:37:00 -
[5]
Boo at the people using logic to tell me why this is a bad idea.
But yeah, FW is going down the crapper right now thanks to these idiots (Yes, who cares about FW right?)
They sit on gates and follow our fleets and we can do nothing to them unless we want to get ****d by sentries and take a sec hit.
If you have a better solution to this abuse of trial accounts let me hear it.
I think before my days are done, I want to be a fisherman. |
Quelque Chose
New Eden Roller Disco Supply
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:39:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Mud Pandemonium
There's a cancer killing PVP in EVE
OH LAWDY!
It wasn't a dark and stormy night too, was it? ___________________________________________
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Mud Pandemonium
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:39:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Haradgrim because making a noob corp alt on your second account is hard.... but if you want to buff that, feel free
We threw this around the other day and figured that we could amass a fund and continually contribute to it for the sole purpose of wardeccing corps found acting as scouts, allowing use to kill them and not take a sec hit.
And if they folded the corp to evade the wardec, I'm pretty sure CCP has said that's a no no.
I think before my days are done, I want to be a fisherman. |
Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:39:00 -
[8]
We÷÷ there's no real difference in that, and someone in a cloaked cov-ops seeing you or me in an ibis seeing you
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Viqtoria
Caldari Groping Hand Social Club
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:41:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Quelque Chose
Originally by: Mud Pandemonium
There's a cancer killing PVP in EVE
OH LAWDY!
It wasn't a dark and stormy night too, was it?
the rain came down in .torrents
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Mud Pandemonium
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:42:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Sheriff Jones We÷÷ there's no real difference in that, and someone in a cloaked cov-ops seeing you or me in an ibis seeing you
Big difference for us FW folk, we can try to uncloak and kill the cov-ops.. keyword being try.
The Ibis can just zip around the gate and laugh as we're unable to kill it without becoming target practice for a sentry gun and once again.. taking a sec hit.
And atleast the cov-ops would require some time invested in the account.. and if CCP gets money out of it all the better then
I think before my days are done, I want to be a fisherman. |
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Mud Pandemonium
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:43:00 -
[11]
It's very CAOD in here.
I think before my days are done, I want to be a fisherman. |
Quelque Chose
New Eden Roller Disco Supply
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:44:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Mud Pandemonium
We threw this around the other day and figured that we could amass a fund and continually contribute to it for the sole purpose of wardeccing corps found acting as scouts, allowing use to kill them and not take a sec hit.
Like Center for Advanced Studies?
Quote: And if they folded the corp to evade the wardec, I'm pretty sure CCP has said that's a no no.
I'm pretty sure you're completely mistaken about that. ___________________________________________
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Monkey Saturday
Knights of Chaos Chaos Incarnate.
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:44:00 -
[13]
Who uses a trial account to scout? Who PVP's with just 1 account nowadays?
Meh.
Thanks for the Maulus BPO nerf! :D |
Lolarina
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:44:00 -
[14]
You cannot run a normal account and trial account as the same time.
No one is going to ask hin none eve playing friend to get a trial and scout for him
Anyone who is scouting is likely using a full account with a character made for scouting.
People can use a ship for whatever function they wish. Their account, their 3 characters.
Camping is weaksauce anyhow noob.
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Vee Raa
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.05 13:55:00 -
[15]
noobcorp char hanging at low-sec gate more than 2 minutes, sentries open fire, including pod ofc
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Astria Tiphareth
Caldari 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.08.05 14:51:00 -
[16]
In the story-telling spirit of the OP, many moons ago low-sec was for pirates, men were real men, women were mostly exotic dancers in the hold, and new players stayed in high-sec.
In this ancient tribal time of blood and war and gatecamps, funnily enough nobody cared about blasting a trial-alt ibis to tiny bits, sending the scout alt back to the clone bay, and posting a long and interesting diatribe on the forums about how Corp A really needs to man up and scout like men.
In other words, this is hardly a new problem. Neutrals, trial or otherwise, can and have been used as scouts and haulers since time immemorial. The 0.0 alliances in most cases have a trivially simple approach to this. Kill them.
Pirates with any need for preventing scouting equally have the same issue and no doubt do not shrink from applying harsh penalties for attempting to discover their fedo-ridden asteroid port of villainy.
The only bit people seem to complain about is that shooting neutrals invokes that deadly virus where your ship inexplicably flashes red, causing a large proportion of nearby idiots to shoot you on the basis that 'well, you're flashing red, you must be hostile'... oh and the sentry guns take an instant dislike to you too... ___ My views may not represent those of my corporation or alliance, which is why I never get invited to those diplomatic parties... |
Kel Nissa
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Posted - 2008.08.05 21:25:00 -
[17]
To the OP: Useless ideas, because most neutral-noob-scouts arent trial accounts. When you got 2 Accounts with 4 real characters there are still 2 spared slots for neutral-scouting.
Solution Idea for FW: Engaging neutrals should be without security penalty inside FW regions. Sentry guns will not fire on you, when a militia guy attacks the noob ship or his pod.
Rational: The FW region is explicitly marked as warzone. When someone wants to be protected from this mechanism: join the militia!
Result: No change at all. The neutral-scout will be militia-scout afterwards.
Conclusion: Its hard or nearly impossible to find a technical solution to prevent such kind of account abusage.
New constraint: Its not allowed to fly 2 accounts from enemy militias at the same time on one pc, which will enforce the player to fly as dedicated spy. Result: The spy will use 2 PCs.
Maybe someone is able to find a algorithm/ruleset preventing the issue.
So now that we realized, that it is not possible to find a technical solution. New licence/rule: this kind of abuse is an exploit. Whenever its proven that someone uses his account for this purpose, the GM gets the permission to lock down the characterslot wich means, that his account will be only able to handle 2 instead of 3 characters afterwards.
Just some ideas ..
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Inara Subaka
Caldari the united
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Posted - 2008.08.05 21:34:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Mud Pandemonium The Ibis can just zip around the gate and laugh as we're unable to kill it without becoming target practice for a sentry gun and once again.. taking a sec hit.
Originally by: Mud Pandemonium We threw this around the other day and figured that we could amass a fund and continually contribute to it for the sole purpose of wardeccing corps found acting as scouts, allowing use to kill them and not take a sec hit.
Originally by: Mud Pandemonium The Ibis can just zip around the gate and laugh as we're unable to kill it without becoming target practice for a sentry gun and once again.. taking a sec hit.
Your sec status isn't that precious, shoot the neutral and tank the sentries (they really aren't that bad to deal with). You mentioned sec status 3 times that I counted (and I could have missed one), I promise you that having a low sec status won't ruin your Eve life... trust me *points to -10 placed there by CONCORD*.
And I'm curious what your thoughts are on neutral full accounts that fly cov ops ships to spy on you? Are you going to whine about them too?
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Hieronimus Rex
Minmatar Infinitus Sapientia New Eden Research
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Posted - 2008.08.05 23:54:00 -
[19]
New plan: get your own damn trial account alt and gank the trial account alt scout.
Seriously, this feature would bring marginal benefit to the game as people can easily substitute 2nd account alts.
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Hawkster222
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Posted - 2008.08.05 23:59:00 -
[20]
wtf... what do pirates kill in 0.0 when little 10 day old people in there cruisr comes flying over to join some corp or explore with all there assets in the thing
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Marcus Gideon
Gallente Excessive Force
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Posted - 2008.08.06 00:04:00 -
[21]
I agree with this idea completely!
Alts and Rookies shouldn't be abused and slaughtered en mass, just for the sake of avoiding costly loss of lives of important people.
THAT'S why I think there should be a type of Probe that can be sent through a Stargate, that reports back the situation on the other side.
Then you don't have to bother getting someone else to jump through and scream "They came... from behind..." before he gets Popped.
Instead, you just get a reading of the exact number and composition of the Gate Camp... so you know whether to bother going through at all.
Good idea?
--- Don't take my ranting personally. I may just be arguing the topic, unless you're saying something stupid, and then I mean every word. "Players don't want Variety. They want THE BEST" |
UnDeRBaLaNcE
dearg doom
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Posted - 2008.08.06 01:25:00 -
[22]
Hey that sounds like a great idea! However ill still be following you in my ibis! Unfortunately I think you fail at thinking. Most people have second accounts, I actually do and that's where my alt spies are and are not even remotely close to a trial being that they were made in 03 and 04. So your solution is not going to resolve the issue. Its not pathetic, its being dynamic. Why not do something called stop camping gates and put your fleet where it cannot be seen. Use everything you can to get edge and Intel. Deal with it and stop complaining.
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Lilith Velkor
Minmatar Oyster Colors
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Posted - 2008.08.06 02:22:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Lilith Velkor on 06/08/2008 02:23:06
Originally by: Lolarina You cannot run a normal account and trial account as the same time.
Are you sure? I recall it worked back when I got a 2nd account, not sure about on the same PC, but with another PC no problem (scouting on the same PC as your main would be dumb anyway).
On a side note, banning trial accounts from lowsec/nullsec wont solve anything, the cheapskates will just register their accounts and go on.
If anything would help, it would be banning trials from lowsec/nullsec AND only allow one character per account to be created. At the least people will have to pay for their scouts.
On the other hand, this doesnt work so well for people that need hauler alts for shopping.
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Kiki Arnolds
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 03:21:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Marcus Gideon
THAT'S why I think there should be a type of Probe that can be sent through a Stargate, that reports back the situation on the other side.
Then you don't have to bother getting someone else to jump through and scream "They came... from behind..." before he gets Popped.
Instead, you just get a reading of the exact number and composition of the Gate Camp... so you know whether to bother going through at all.
Good idea?
Wait... your saying my alliance didn't need to keep sending my interceptor through the gates blind...
On that note, have you ever tried to catch interceptor pilots scouting? It can be a challange even with bubbles, good luck catching them in FW... ç¦ |
Inara Subaka
Caldari the united
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Posted - 2008.08.06 03:25:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Marcus Gideon I agree with this idea completely!
Alts and Rookies shouldn't be abused and slaughtered en mass, just for the sake of avoiding costly loss of lives of important people.
THAT'S why I think there should be a type of Probe that can be sent through a Stargate, that reports back the situation on the other side.
Then you don't have to bother getting someone else to jump through and scream "They came... from behind..." before he gets Popped.
Instead, you just get a reading of the exact number and composition of the Gate Camp... so you know whether to bother going through at all.
Good idea?
CCP already hate pirates... don't give them any more ideas to screw us with.
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Catherine Bennet
Caldari Alloyed Tritanium Bar And Grill
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:00:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Lolarina You cannot run a normal account and trial account as the same time.
If you have more than one computer, you can.
But what I really suspect is going on is that some script kiddie wrote a little program that circumvents this rules (it's easy), and the current explosion in trial account noobscouts is due to the program being passed around between players.
CCP should start checking whether trial noobscouts are being run on computers simultaneously running a paid account (or another trial account). They have the capacity to do this, and maybe it's time to start handing down some bancandy to people breaking the EULA.
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Kiki Arnolds
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:04:00 -
[27]
INAL, but in some countries I think there are legal problems with CCP setting the eve client to start scanning your computer for secretly running programs. From the server side, I don't think there is a way to tell if your dealing with two clients on one computer, or two computers behind a NAT firewall...
Also, NO ONE HAS SHOWN A SHRED OF EVIDENCE THAT THERE ARE ANY MORE TRIAL SCOUTS THEN IN THE PAST... that newb in the ibis could just as easily be a scout on a secondary PAID acount... ç¦ |
Plekto
CCITT
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:01:00 -
[28]
Heh. I actually love it. No changes as far as I'm concerned. That smart players have managed to find a way to work the sandbox to get intel in high sec is great. I applaud their evil and devious minds.
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UnDeRBaLaNcE
dearg doom
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Posted - 2008.08.06 22:14:00 -
[29]
Agian I use my second account that I pay for whos a hauler alt, but also have 2 year old scouts. Now whats seriously wrong with an ibis, no deferenet than using spies in the actual corp/alliance/faction. No deferent than finding a snitch. People really need to learn to play around stuff they dont like.
Its called put your fleet not in visual range. This is not going to change, you will always have spies. If you ban 2nd toons on 1 account or even restrict trials, simply put I would use my actualy hauler character to collect intel.
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Marcus Gideon
Gallente Excessive Force
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Posted - 2008.08.06 22:22:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Marcus Gideon I agree with this idea completely!
Alts and Rookies shouldn't be abused and slaughtered en mass, just for the sake of avoiding costly loss of lives of important people.
THAT'S why I think there should be a type of Probe that can be sent through a Stargate, that reports back the situation on the other side.
Then you don't have to bother getting someone else to jump through and scream "They came... from behind..." before he gets Popped.
Instead, you just get a reading of the exact number and composition of the Gate Camp... so you know whether to bother going through at all.
Good idea?
--- Don't take my ranting personally. I may just be arguing the topic, unless you're saying something stupid, and then I mean every word. "Players don't want Variety. They want THE BEST" |
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