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CodeFreeze
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Posted - 2004.06.01 19:41:00 -
[1]
Strangely these forums don't have a mining forum so I can't research what to get to be as good as mining as is possible.
Apart from Mining 5 and Efficiency are there any other skills to train?
TIA 
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Lachenlaud
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Posted - 2004.06.01 20:59:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: CodeFreeze
Strangely these forums don't have a mining forum so I can't research what to get to be as good as mining as is possible.
Apart from Mining 5 and Efficiency are there any other skills to train?
TIA
Astrogeology for one. 
You can read all the skill descriptions and what they do in my spreadsheet (link below my signature).
[email protected]
http://www.goi-eve.com/forums/
Check out the Eve Master Datasheet here!! |
CodeFreeze
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Posted - 2004.06.01 21:20:00 -
[3]
OK thanks
That spreadsheet must have taken ages to compile!
I didn't know almost every ore has its own skill.
Thanks again.
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Drusilla
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Posted - 2004.06.01 21:57:00 -
[4]
To be a perfect miner, presently, you need to train 7 skills:
Mining - 5% bonus yield per minute
Astrogeology - another 5% bonus yield per minute
Drones - control up to 5 drones
Drone Interfacing - control up to 5 additional drones
Mining Drone Operation - 5% bonus yield from mining drones
Option 1: Add -
Gallente Frigate - precursor to Gallente Cruiser
Gallente Cruiser - allows use of 5 minter 2s and 10 drones. Stop here if you want to limit your mining to cruisers.
Option 2: Add -
Amarr Frigate - precursor to Amarr Cruiser
Amarr cruiser - precuror to Amarr Battleship
Amarr Battleship - presently best mining ship in the game, can run 8 miner 2s and 10 mining drones.
If you go the Amarr route it will take longer but you'll pull in more ore. You will also probably want to increase ability in two other areas: Hauling, and Refining.
Hauling - there are really two ways to go:
1. Amarr Industrial - good hauler, quickly trains to a decent level.
2. Gallente Industial - best hauler in the game at level 5.
Refining:
You will need:
Refining 5
Refinery Efficiency 5
Science
Metallurgy 4
Ore Refining Skill at refining whichever ores you plan to mine most
A standing of as close to 10 as you can get at the stations where you will refine.
Hauling is easier to train up. I'd suggest that since refining has so many skills to it now that it is a career path unto itself that you might want to consider focusing on just mining and hauling, and sell the raw ore to a builder corporation that already employs professional refiners.
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Sable Moran
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Posted - 2004.06.02 13:14:00 -
[5]
A very good post Drusilla, but two minor points...
Originally by: Drusilla
Hauling - there are really two ways to go:
1. Amarr Industrial - good hauler, quickly trains to a decent level.
2. Gallente Industial - best hauler in the game at level 5.
There is a third option between Bestower and Iteron mk5 and it is the Mammoth (Minmatar level 4 industrial) . Mammoth takes a _lot_ less time to train than Itty5 but has clearly better stats (except armor) than Bessie.
Originally by: Drusilla
A standing of as close to 10 as you can get at the stations where you will refine.
A standing of 6,67 is sufficient. With that you can get the 'we take' (i.e. the station takes) part of the refining equation down to zero. And the standing is towards the corp owning the station where you refine.
-----
Sable's Ammo Shop at Alentene 5, Moon 4, Duvolle Laboratories Factory. Ammo at affordable prices. |
Vigilant
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Posted - 2004.06.02 13:37:00 -
[6]
What about all the mineral specializations? Wouldn't those help????
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Drusilla
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Posted - 2004.06.02 16:42:00 -
[7]
Yes, they will.
When calculating the amount of minerals you get from ore, a fwe things will screw you.
1. Waste. to reduce waste to as low as it can get you need refining 5, refinery efficiency 5, and high skill in refining the particular ore you are sticking in the recycler.
2. Station greed. The corp that owns the station you're refining at takes a portion of the minerals from your refining. To reduce it you must increase your standing wtih that corporation.
Regarding the mammtoh - good call.
Regarding standing 6.67 - I'll take your word, have not checked recently. :)
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Lentia
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Posted - 2004.06.02 18:13:00 -
[8]
As far as drones go...
10 Harvestor drones will pull in 20 bist/min. that is like having FOUR more miner 2's!!
ELite are even better but cost prohibitive
Lentia
Military Officer
http://www.staf.online-guild.com/ |
Drusilla
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Posted - 2004.06.02 20:44:00 -
[9]
Elite are, if memory serves, no faster than harvesters, they just take up less space in the drone bay.
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Penfriel Ursim
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Posted - 2004.06.02 22:21:00 -
[10]
some good posts here!
i have a question about astrogeology. from memory the info says something about better use of survey scanners. do you really need to use one to receive the 5% bonus??
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Kinnison
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Posted - 2004.06.03 08:20:00 -
[11]
Just one point about refining. Be careful where you refine! My home system has 2 stations with refineries, the efficiency of both of which is 30%. Even at 5/5/4, I would lose about 22% or so in refining waste at those stations.
Two systems next door have 50% stations; refining waste essentially zero.
Personally, I think it's worth going 1 jump (for which you can set up instajumps anyway) for 15% more minerals.
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Chepe Nolon
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Posted - 2004.06.03 12:33:00 -
[12]
If you tend to stay in empire space, and has access to good refining stations (50%), you don't need to train the ref. skills too much.
I have 0% waste with ref V, ref Eff III, metallurgy II (to get the ore skills) and veld to jaspet at level II.
Of course, if you are mining and refining in 0.0 + recycling modules, then you have to train things a bit further.
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Drusilla
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Posted - 2004.06.03 14:05:00 -
[13]
Penfuriel -
Astrogeology only gives a +5% yield to your mining take, it does nothing to your scanners.
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Galen Dvorak
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Posted - 2004.06.03 16:05:00 -
[14]
Essentials for mining efficiently:
Mining 4
Science 4 (for astrogeology)
Astrogeology 3
Energy Systems Operation 4
Electronics 4-5
Drones 5 (so you also get Heavy Drones and Drone Interfacing)
Drone Interfacing 3-5
Mining Drone Operation 2
Scout Drone Operation 3-4
Refining:
Refining 5
Refine Efficiency 4
Science 4 (for ore specifics)
Metallurgy 2(for ore specifics)
Kernite Processing 2 (level 2 for each ore type)
Navigation:
MWD is nice to have when mining in low secure space. So:
Navigation 4
Afterburner 4
Highspeed Manouvering 1 (or more)
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Chrome Born
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Posted - 2004.06.03 16:09:00 -
[15]
One thing thats been missed here, and is well worth investing some time in.
Agent running for the corp that owns the station you refined in will lower your refining cost to 0.
Chrome Born.
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White Fang
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Posted - 2004.06.04 00:30:00 -
[16]
Great thread. I would only add that navigation skills should NOT be underestimated for mining. Being an ultimate miner means travelling around a lot, for instance into deep space and then back to a refinery. Once you are at the point when you can ninja mine in 0.0, navigation becomes important.
Also, search the forum for ninja mining tips. And there's a miner's forum at http://www.eve-i.com, has loads of useful info.
So there you go. Have fun :)
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Larno
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Posted - 2004.06.04 09:26:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Chepe Nolon
I have 0% waste with ref V, ref Eff III, metallurgy II (to get the ore skills) and veld to jaspet at level II.
A better setup for perfect refining is this:
Refining V
Refinery Effieciency IV
*Whatever* Processing I
Metallurgy III
Not only do you save time only training the specific skills to level 2, you also have Refinery Efficiency IV which will allow you to train more skills for the higher ores. With the above skills you can train all the way up to and including Dark Ochre and Spodumain. You need Refinery Efficiency V for the higher ores (Crok, Bist and Ark) though, but you won't even be ninja mining them as they are about 30 jumps deep into 0.0 space.
As a side note, the amount a station takes from you is:
Percent Station Takes = 5 - ((Corp Standing/4)*3)
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Lentia
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Posted - 2004.06.04 17:39:00 -
[18]
Um, huh?
0.0 is where ninja mining is done. Thats where the small amount of ark/bist/crok give u the big ISK rewards that make ninja mining worth it. Yes it is in 0.0 but there are stations in every 0.0 sector to refine at. And yes you WILL need refi.eff. 5, metal 4, and ark/crok/bist process to at least 2.
I have spent my entire eve-"career" in deep space and believe me everyone in this neck of the woods ninja mines from time to time (usually to support thier PvP habit hehe)
Lentia
Military Officer
http://www.staf.online-guild.com/ |
X'Alor
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Posted - 2004.06.04 18:12:00 -
[19]
Edited by: X'Alor on 04/06/2004 18:14:06
Mining is one aspect, refining is another.
to mine fast with just lasers or to mine fast using lasers AND drones.
to mine fast
mining 5 and astrogeology 5
to mine fast with drones(above skills plus)
drones 5
mining drones 5
drone interfacing (doesn't do you any good to have this to 5 if your ship can't hold 10 mining drones, only need this as high as the number drones your going to fly)
I made a thread in gen disc title " Mining Drones"
it has some info on drones.
mining drone ranks are:
Basic
Harvester
Improved
Elites
improved and elite travel at 300m/sec and are 50 drone cargo
improved only haul 20 cargo units. elites and harvies haul 30 units. so now your saying doesn't that make harvies better than improve........the answer yes & no. harvies take up 100 drone cargo where improved only 50 so you can run two improved for every one harvestor your ship can hold. if you can do simple math 2 improved move 40 units where harvies only haul 30. And they are faster
*** So where space is a factor(cruiser mining) improved are way better than harvies........if space is not an issue (BS mining) then harvies are better but only when space is not an issue***
Refining is a whole nother area or specialization and there are many ways to max refine but ultimately the ores only yeild soooooo much mineras. As much as we would all like it to be........we can not refine minerals from thin space air.
If your specializing in refinging, as opposed to going to refine eff 5, you can get the same result from stoping at refine eff 4 and specializing in the ore processing skills to make up what refine eff 5 gets you.
The only reason to possibly train refine eff 5 is that it's a required skill for scrap metal reprocessing but then again that skill is not implemented ......yet, hopefully soon(tm)
Currently it will not do you any good to do refine eff 5 and then work your mineral process skills to 5 as well, at that poing you are wasting invaluable training time being the ores can't produce that much mineral.
Currently by the current skills, you can in essence......over refine but it does not yeild more minerals.......all it does is waste your training time for a skill that does not produce anything for you at that point
If you take refining to 5, refine eff to 4, and any of the specialized mineral processing to 3, you'll be about as close to everything you can be without wasting time.
Just make sure to recycle with the corporation that you run missions with the most.....minimize the "we take" portion
Basically what happens on the refine side in simple numbers.
1000 units of whatever can only yield lets say 10000 units of trit max. pending on your refine skills you can actually get your numbers to state that you should be yeilding over 100% of that ore. so that refine of 1000 units of whatever can only produce 10000 max, just because you have the skills does not mean you'll get 13000 for your refine if it's not there to produce. All refines have a max amount of minerals they can give and currently you can train them skills to say your going to get more than is possible.
I love seeing nothing but zero's in the last column of refine totals for myself.
when you get to that point, your getting everything back and that is it. you can't get more out of it if it's not there to get.
If your looking for elite mining drones, 7 outrageously price elites on escrow.
That guy must be nuts but they are there, oh wait, that's me.
will be dropping them to a nice price of 20 mill each when this escrow runs out.
Oman miners......you need 6, on top of 4 miner 2's.....not bad at all
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Larno
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Posted - 2004.06.04 21:09:00 -
[20]
You need refinery efficiency 5 for Crokite, Bistot and Arkonor processing, the only ores that are worth ninja mining. However, at ref eff 4 you will still get 97.85% of the minerals which is very good.
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Bohr
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Posted - 2004.06.05 14:18:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Larno
Originally by: Chepe Nolon
I have 0% waste with ref V, ref Eff III, metallurgy II (to get the ore skills) and veld to jaspet at level II.
A better setup for perfect refining is this:
Refining V
Refinery Effieciency IV
*Whatever* Processing I
Metallurgy III
Not only do you save time only training the specific skills to level 2, you also have Refinery Efficiency IV which will allow you to train more skills for the higher ores. With the above skills you can train all the way up to and including Dark Ochre and Spodumain. You need Refinery Efficiency V for the higher ores (Crok, Bist and Ark) though, but you won't even be ninja mining them as they are about 30 jumps deep into 0.0 space.
As a side note, the amount a station takes from you is:
Percent Station Takes = 5 - ((Corp Standing/4)*3)
Metallurgy? That's a science skill. Speeding up ML/ME research :)
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Bohr
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Posted - 2004.06.05 14:32:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Bohr on 05/06/2004 14:36:25
Originally by: X'Alor
Edited by: X'Alor on 04/06/2004 18:14:06
improved only haul 20 cargo units. elites and harvies haul 30 units. so now your saying doesn't that make harvies better than improve........the answer yes & no. harvies take up 100 drone cargo where improved only 50 so you can run two improved for every one harvestor your ship can hold. if you can do simple math 2 improved move 40 units where harvies only haul 30. And they are faster
True. But if you want to earn back their value (about 2 mil atm) in a reasonable time you need to mine ark or crok. Elites carry only one unit of crok or ark, while harvies carry 2. Harvies wins when doing 0.0 mining, i would however never bring them there, as npcs tend to spawn close to you, meaning bye bye harvies :(
If improved/elites are better, is only a matter of dronebay. Any miner should know that some of the most versatile mining ships are gallente. Amarr ships, with their many turret hardpoints, are low on defense, if they use harvies too, defense are as good as gone. Meaning, Amarr bss do best in empire with low risk, and a megathron, or even better if using mining drones, a dom, is the way to go for low sec mining.
Quote:
will be dropping them to a nice price of 20 mill each when this escrow runs out.
LOL - Mind you all. Never pay more than 500k for a harvie. A mil if you're desperate, and laugh (*cough*) at the rest.
/emote goes off to start a virtual campaign against the "old Ev'ers Pension Fond" also known as harvies by the thousands, collecting dust :)
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Steel Optik
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Posted - 2004.06.05 14:32:00 -
[23]
On the subject of Iterion vs the Mammoth considering the days you will spend training to get Mimitar Frigate and also allow the fact you have already trained gallante frigate ( to use the thorax) and the ability to carry a max of 8 Giant cans in the Iterion vs 5 in the mammoth I would train Gallante Indusrial 5
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Bubba1977
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Posted - 2004.06.05 17:34:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Bohr
Originally by: Larno
Originally by: Chepe Nolon
I have 0% waste with ref V, ref Eff III, metallurgy II (to get the ore skills) and veld to jaspet at level II.
A better setup for perfect refining is this:
Refining V
Refinery Effieciency IV
*Whatever* Processing I
Metallurgy III
Not only do you save time only training the specific skills to level 2, you also have Refinery Efficiency IV which will allow you to train more skills for the higher ores. With the above skills you can train all the way up to and including Dark Ochre and Spodumain. You need Refinery Efficiency V for the higher ores (Crok, Bist and Ark) though, but you won't even be ninja mining them as they are about 30 jumps deep into 0.0 space.
As a side note, the amount a station takes from you is:
Percent Station Takes = 5 - ((Corp Standing/4)*3)
Metallurgy? That's a science skill. Speeding up ML/ME research :)
Metallurgy is required for the reprocessing skills.
__________________________________________________
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2004.06.08 15:23:00 -
[25]
and yes you are correct for laughing at 20 mill for harvies Bohr.
but eveidentally you can't read that I'm not selling harvies and I am selling elites.
Cough
And why am i even bothering with a char named Bohr......your boring me. read before typing especially if your going to quote someone
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Meisaku
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Posted - 2004.06.11 15:28:00 -
[26]
They definetely need a mining forum... so many miners... |
wayz
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Posted - 2004.06.12 09:30:00 -
[27]
what!! a mining post that I'mnot in yet, well I am now. Nothing I can say really though as these guys have pretty put everything you could possibly need to know about mining except a detailed article and ninja mining and I'm hoping no ones gonna be posting one of them [8)
you wanna know how to ninja mine you'll have to practice and work it out yourselves as us 0.0 ninja miners dont want the prices of our rare minerals coming down even more.
btw guys: whats the score with DCM now and when will it be worth doing
Wayz: cmon X hurry up I aint got all day!
Twisted Xistance: oh yeah lol.... anyway, you have got all day you benefit scrounging jobbless schmoe!
Wayz: too chey :) |
Verlan
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Posted - 2004.06.22 20:16:00 -
[28]
How can I get these better mining drones? I heard about an "escrow system"? How does one access it? I can't seem to find anything on the market other than basic mining...
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