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Please fix torpedoes

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 8 post(s)
PY4EEK Caldari Terracorp Inc. Rebellion Alliance	Posted - 2008.08.29 04:40:00 - [1] http://killboard.tauceti-federation.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=88993 Torpedoes vs Smartbombs = Smartbombs win. See damages Phoenix This is normal?
Sheial Tarlien Minmatar The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2008.08.29 05:12:00 - [2] A) Whine Alt is Whiny B) That Titan melted in like a min C) Citadel torps are sweet, don't like flight time? way to plan ahead.
Grarr Dexx Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2008.08.29 05:23:00 - [3] This thread is original.
PY4EEK Caldari Terracorp Inc. Rebellion Alliance	Posted - 2008.08.29 09:30:00 - [4] Don't like damage = 0 (see link). it's not right.

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.08.29 10:19:00 - [5] The current mechanic is that torpedoes gets blown up if they take too much damage. This can be done by using a smartbomb or defender missiles. This is not a bug, since it is by design. If you think that the design should change, then you are welcome to make a suggestion in the "Features and Ideas discussion forum". If you want to talk about bugs, then you should bug report the issue after which you are welcome to make a thread about it here. Again, calling game mechanics you do not like "Broken" and saying that they should be "Fixed" is not the right way to go. Making a thread in the "Features and Ideas discussion" where you state what the problem is, why it is a problem, how you suggest it should be changed/balanced is constructive.

Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2008.08.29 10:51:00 - [6] Originally by: CCP Casqade The current mechanic is that torpedoes gets blown up if they take too much damage. This can be done by using a smartbomb or defender missiles. This is not a bug, since it is by design. http://killboard.tauceti-federation.com/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=88993 Phoenixes: 8 Damage dealt: 191 Weapon used: Ogre I. Are you seriously trying to tell us that this is an intended effect? That it is intended that one dreadnought, and half the weapon systems of another, are utterly useless in capital engagements? And yes, this does affect all capital engagements, and not just Titan/MS kills, because carriers sit next to dreadnoughts to cover them with their smartbombs.

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.08.29 11:06:00 - [7] What I am saying is this: It is not a bug, therefore it should not be in this forum. I am also saying this: It might need to be balanced, but this is not the correct forum for that. Suggestions go to the "Features and Ideas discussion" forum.

white kight SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs	Posted - 2008.08.29 11:18:00 - [8] Edited by: white kight on 29/08/2008 11:17:46 http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=774603&page=5 What like this one where we have been waiting for a dev response for months? Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.08.29 11:27:00 - [9] Yes, exactly that. Which is a thread I've linked everyone to that believes that this is a bug so far. But people seem to insist that smartbombs affecting Citadel Torpedoes is a bug and keep making threads about it in the Game Development forum. Previous thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799 If you know bugs that affect the Citadel torpedo, I'm very willing to look into it and discuss them here.

white kight SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs	Posted - 2008.08.29 11:36:00 - [10] Originally by: CCP Casqade Yes, exactly that. Which is a thread I've linked everyone to that believes that this is a bug so far. But people seem to insist that this is a bug and keep making threads about it in the Game Development forum. Previous thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799 If you know bugs that affect the missiles, I'm very willing to look into it and discuss them here. Is there no way we can actually get a response to say that CCP are looking into it or something. At the moment it seems as if it is being ignored completely? I spent a lot of isk on a dread + skills + everything else to have it do on average 0 dps on everything it tries to shoot!!!!! Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint

BiggestT Caldari Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.08.29 11:53:00 - [11] Originally by: CCP Casqade Yes, exactly that. Which is a thread I've linked everyone to that believes that this is a bug so far. But people seem to insist that smartbombs affecting Citadel Torpedoes is a bug and keep making threads about it in the Game Development forum. Previous thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799 If you know bugs that affect the Citadel torpedo, I'm very willing to look into it and discuss them here. If this forum is for bugs why is there a suggest improvements for ship/mods posts in this forum? Their not about bugs.. Proudly annoying FC's since 2007
LuckyStrike	Posted - 2008.08.29 11:56:00 - [12] More then half of the threads on this forum are about design changes, since forever ;) - Alt_

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.08.29 12:40:00 - [13] Originally by: BiggestT If this forum is for bugs why is there a suggest improvements for ship/mods posts in this forum? Their not about bugs.. Originally by: LuckyStrike More then half of the threads on this forum are about design changes, since forever ;) Just because "everyone else is doing it" doesn't mean you have to do the same. Some of the threads here are about changes and fixes that are currently being tested on the test server. An example of this would be the Speed changes.

Johann Jeneau Gallente Cricas Portuguese Korp Soul of Fountain	Posted - 2008.08.29 13:53:00 - [14] Good job! Finally someone puting an order into these foruns (and i'm not being sarcasic) ps: sorry for the bad english I like my steaks bloody as hell
white kight SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs	Posted - 2008.08.29 14:09:00 - [15] Originally by: CCP Casqade Originally by: BiggestT If this forum is for bugs why is there a suggest improvements for ship/mods posts in this forum? Their not about bugs.. Originally by: LuckyStrike More then half of the threads on this forum are about design changes, since forever ;) Just because "everyone else is doing it" doesn't mean you have to do the same. Some of the threads here are about changes and fixes that are currently being tested on the test server. An example of this would be the Speed changes. But I went ahead and moved 5 threads that didn't belong here. Please may i ask a serious question Cascade? Are CCP going to have a look at Citadel Torps to see whether there is something that can be done to stop making the phoenix crap and the nafalgar slightly less crap? We have had that thread up for ages with ideas about rebalancing and everything but we cannot get a dev response for it unless it is in the wrong forum? Thanks in advance White Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.08.29 14:23:00 - [16] Hi white kight. I cannot speak for Game Design on this, but I know that they are currently looking into missile problems in connection with the speed changes. I know for fact that they have read that thread and most of the other threads in the Features and Ideas discussion. I hope knowing this helps a bit. Originally by: white kight I like the way they reply to someone with a small thread in the wrong part of the forum. Maybe we should spam the wrong forums about getting citadels sorted then they may actually listen!!!!!!! This is probably a bad idea, since it is not really constructive at all. There is a difference between listening and replying to a thread. Like I said earlier, I know for fact that the thread has been read and the issue "listened to". But there is no way to force people to reply to your thread.

PY4EEK Caldari Terracorp Inc. Rebellion Alliance	Posted - 2008.08.29 14:33:00 - [17] Originally by: CCP Casqade The current mechanic is that torpedoes gets blown up if they take too much damage. This can be done by using a smartbomb or defender missiles. This is not a bug, since it is by design. If all torpedoes explode, it is a bug and a imbalance. Too little life torpedoes. Why not blown projectiles? Why not protect against lasers? Why only missiles? Dreadnought must kill, otherwise it is not a dreadnought, Jump Freighter.
white kight SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs	Posted - 2008.08.29 14:38:00 - [18] Originally by: CCP Casqade Hi white kight. I cannot speak for Game Design on this, but I know that they are currently looking into missile problems in connection with the speed changes. I know for fact that they have read that thread and most of the other threads in the Features and Ideas discussion. I hope knowing this helps a bit. Originally by: white kight I like the way they reply to someone with a small thread in the wrong part of the forum. Maybe we should spam the wrong forums about getting citadels sorted then they may actually listen!!!!!!! This is probably a bad idea, since it is not really constructive at all. There is a difference between listening and replying to a thread. Like I said earlier, I know for fact that the thread has been read and the issue "listened to". But there is no way to force people to reply to your thread. TBH i was joking about the spam but thank you very much for the reply. Obviously it is nice just to have a reply to just say that we are being listened to. Thank you very much White Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Jim Raynor Caldari Shinra	Posted - 2008.08.29 14:42:00 - [19] You're right, it's not a bug. It's a game balance issue. It's still a huge issue though, the Phoenix is basically incapable of harming of capital ships equipped with smart bombs (which is a common fit on carrier/ms/titan). I guess the question is, should capital ships that fit large smart bombs be immune to a Dreadnought in Siege Mode? Nalfgar loses a lot of DPS too and it's already a not exactly a great ship either. ------ I'll make a sig later.
SlaineMor Minmatar Sicarri Covenant	Posted - 2008.08.29 14:56:00 - [20] Edited by: SlaineMor on 29/08/2008 15:00:08 In this case the other 70 ships more than made up for it!!! And it is a game mechanic... as defenders are utterly crap at their designed role (not saying they're broken - just crap!) people use Smarties... some people used to run smarts in battleship utility slots - dont see it that much these days though Hard to do though to keep up an almost constant wall of smartbomb energy.. not really do-able on a BS and smaller... Good tactics for the Titan though when waiting for what must feel like hours between DD's!!! Change Defenders I say.. make them launch cluster of missiles or Chaff to defend against missiles.. Eat my Rusty Bullethole!


CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.08.29 15:38:00 - [21] Originally by: PY4EEK Why not blown projectiles? Why not protect against lasers? Why only missiles? Why does Tracking Disruptors only affect turrets and not missiles? - Because they are different weapons. They all have their pros and cons. If they didn't, the only different thing would be the shape and color. That is not something we're trying to achieve when things are balanced. Originally by: white kight TBH i was joking about the spam but thank you very much for the reply. Obviously it is nice just to have a reply to just say that we are being listened to. I understand that. A healthy discussion on an issue is always something we prefer, but sometimes it is just not possible to have over an internet forum. Fanfest is a great place to have discussions about issues. Face to face with someone who is just as passionate about the game as you are, yet you have different opinions and ways about how to achieve a better game. It is really one of the highlights of the year.

white kight SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs	Posted - 2008.08.29 16:06:00 - [22] Originally by: CCP Casqade Fanfest is a great place to have discussions about issues. Face to face with someone who is just as passionate about the game as you are, yet you have different opinions and ways about how to achieve a better game. It is really one of the highlights of the year. I would come over but it is really expensive. Its over ú500 for flights alone Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.08.29 16:15:00 - [23] Where are you flying from? http://www.icelandair.co.uk/home/packages/london/detail/store65/item28986/

white kight SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs	Posted - 2008.08.29 16:25:00 - [24] Originally by: CCP Casqade Where are you flying from? http://www.icelandair.co.uk/home/packages/london/detail/store65/item28986/ It would have been London or Stanstead but i didn't see that deal on the site. Thats looking much better Yay i have CCP looking t see if i can come to Fanfest, thats customer service for you Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Synapse Archae Amarr Demonic Retribution Un-Natural Selection	Posted - 2008.08.29 17:53:00 - [25] Casquade thanks for all the responses in this thread. Good to see devs posting a bit more. If you keep it up people will start realizing that they are listened to in F&I. Don't give up. As for fanfest, tickets and hotel for me from boston would be about $1000, plus tickets from here to boston maybe $250, plus all the money I would spend on beer....ouch. Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
Etien Aldragoran DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:05:00 - [26] Originally by: CCP Casqade Yes, exactly that. Which is a thread I've linked everyone to that believes that this is a bug so far. But people seem to insist that smartbombs affecting Citadel Torpedoes is a bug and keep making threads about it in the Game Development forum. Previous thread: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=846799 If you know bugs that affect the Citadel torpedo, I'm very willing to look into it and discuss them here. Then perhaps you should look into fixing that bug in the forum's description where it's not telling people to only talk about bugs and suspected bugs. According to the description for this board, we're supposed to give feedback from the test server. I've smartbombed a dread's torps to zero damage in my carrier on Sisi. My feedback on that is it shouldn't happen. For other ships to have their damage negated to zero at any range, multiple ships would have to be specially fit to make the most out of damps and tracking disruptors. For citadels, where there is no option of fitting a better tracking or longer range gun, you just have to fit a few smartbombs and you can completely negate nearly 100% of all damage. I just gave feedback, along with comments to changes and fixes, as the board description suggested I do.
Straight Chillen Gallente Solar Wind	Posted - 2008.08.29 19:55:00 - [27] am i the only one who knows u can fit a turret on the phoenix? _
Vladimir Tinakin Caldari Hadean Drive Yards Archaean Cooperative	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:23:00 - [28] Originally by: Straight Chillen am i the only one who knows u can fit a turret on the phoenix? 1 unbonused turret. Oh yeah, thats parity I suppose while we're discussing alternate fits, you know that you can fit armor reps on it too?
Lord Fitz Project Amargosa	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:30:00 - [29] HP of a Citadel Torp is 650 (database dump) Smartbomb damage starts at 300 / 7.5 seconds, 6000m3 range for T2 (much more for faction and with higher skills) A Citadel Torp will move at 1125m/s (max skills). So it's possible to sneak one by a single T2 smartbomb. But Three of them will take out 71% of incoming fire. Four of them will take out all incoming torps. Two Amarr Navy Smartbombs 375 damage, 7.5 second activation (max skills), 7,500m range. Will destroy 89% of incoming citadel torps. Three will destroy all of them. Two of the lowest EM Officer smartbombs will destroy 98% of them, and two of the next up will destroy 100%. Note that more will be destroyed if the Phoenix / Nagalfar pilots don't have missile projection V. Personally I see smartbombs destroying missiles as fine when it is damage mitigation, but total damage removal ? I guess for a single ship it wouldn't be so much of an issue, but it can remove the damage of infinite missile based ships shooting it. Train for another dread I guess is the available solution.
Asno Malo	Posted - 2008.08.29 20:32:00 - [30] Greetings, Originally by: Etien Aldragoran I've smartbombed a dread's torps to zero damage in my carrier on Sisi. My feedback on that is it shouldn't happen. For other ships to have their damage negated to zero at any range, multiple ships would have to be specially fit to make the most out of damps and tracking disruptors. When used correctly, the following ships can be used singly to negate the entire damage output of another ship; Titan -- Usually affects multiple ships Falcon -- Usually only affects 1 or 2 targets Arazu -- Though it is limted to a very narrow area of effectiveness Pilgrim -- Though it has to take some damage to get into range Any Logistics -- They negate through armor / shield repair Any non-shuttle / non-freighter class ship



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