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No seriously
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:28:00 -
[1]
Edited by: No seriously on 09/09/2008 15:29:02
I got jumped by one of these earlier. Now I'll admit that I'm new to PVP in this game, and I'm not rich, and I don't have a billion skillpoints.
But come on - it has all the advantages and none of the drawbacks.
Ever other interceptor in the game sacrifices something. Range or damage. Fastest interceptor in the game. Its damage was murdering me, and it was out of range of EVERYTHING I tried to do. I even tried to overheat my web.
How is this balanced? There has to be a nerf incoming.
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Terianna Eri
Amarr
Scrutari
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:37:00 -
[2]
With 2 speed mods it goes only 6km/s. There are faster interceptors, easily, including the beamsader.
With 2 range mods, and 2 range rigs, it gets 17km optimal range. There are interceptors with more range than this, easily, including the crow.
With no damage mods, it gets about 100 dps with scorch, from the 17km optimal range. There are interceptors with more damage than this, such as, say, the Taranis.
The pulsesader sacrifices speed, damage, and cap stability (no room for CPR, does not permarun) for range.
How do you get "murdered" by 100 dps? Less, actually, since they're permarunning the MWD and point and therefore can't permarun the guns?
__________________________________
 Originally by: Arthur Frayn
How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
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whisk
Gallente
The Movement
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:37:00 -
[3]
Adapt or Die |
Trevor Warps
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:37:00 -
[4]
Yep, they are nerfing whiners soon.
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Alt altski
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:37:00 -
[5]
Oh noes you got killed by something ='(
Lets nerf it to make the game a little easier for you.
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No seriously
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:42:00 -
[6]
Edited by: No seriously on 09/09/2008 15:44:55
Originally by: Terianna Eri
With 2 speed mods it goes only 6km/s. There are faster interceptors, easily, including the beamsader.
With 2 range mods, and 2 range rigs, it gets 17km optimal range. There are interceptors with more range than this, easily, including the crow.
With no damage mods, it gets about 100 dps with scorch, from the 17km optimal range. There are interceptors with more damage than this, such as, say, the Taranis.
The pulsesader sacrifices speed, damage, and cap stability (no room for CPR, does not permarun) for range.
How do you get "murdered" by 100 dps? Less, actually, since they're permarunning the MWD and point and therefore can't permarun the guns?
However, the taranis has to get into web range and cut mwd to do its 200 dps. A blaster-ranis vs. anything other than another inty is a deader-ranis. Drones are also destroyable. Smarties, target->kill.
I don't see how a beam crusader could go faster since it has to deal with far worse tracking. Right? And its damage can't be ANYWHERE near as good a pulse crazysader?
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Leon 026
Caldari
Vorace.
Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:49:00 -
[7]
Crusader isnt the only interceptor that can fight outside web range. Crows (rockets and lights), arty-claws and railranises can all attack from outside web range.
There's always the option to fly with a buddy in an anticeptor ship to act as escort.
Recruiting |
No seriously
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:51:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Leon 026
Crusader isnt the only interceptor that can fight outside web range. Crows (rockets and lights), arty-claws and railranises can all attack from outside web range.
True. But none of them can come close to the dps at that range. The railranis least of all, since it's near impossible to make cap stable and its drones are poppable (a good 1/3 of its dps).
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Jodi Goulsti
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:53:00 -
[9]
Originally by: No seriously
A blaster-ranis vs. anything other than another inty is a deader-ranis.
:lol:
OK.
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No seriously
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:55:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Jodi Goulsti
Originally by: No seriously
A blaster-ranis vs. anything other than another inty is a deader-ranis.
:lol:
OK.
Am I wrong?
Cruiser + web vs. blaster-ranis = ?
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Leon 026
Caldari
Vorace.
Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.09.09 15:57:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Leon 026 on 09/09/2008 15:59:41
What ship + fitting where you flying anyhow?
The DPS of various inties entirely depends on the pilot. I've seen "100 DPS" crows using light missiles.
PS - Blasteranis is a horrible dogfighter. The entire point of the blasteranis, seeing that its an old school interceptor design, is to either engage ships that dont have a web, or to fight within web range where the enemy guns don't track.
Recruiting |
Spectre3353
Gallente
The Python Cartel
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Posted - 2008.09.09 16:22:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Leon 026
Blasteranis is a horrible dogfighter.
Don't ever, ever, ever speak again. I just want to punch you in the throat so bad right now. God.
-----
My Pirate Blog: http://evenewb.blogspot.com/
My Ransom Board: http://www.pcransomboard.com/ |
Leon 026
Caldari
Vorace.
Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.09.09 16:30:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Spectre3353
Originally by: Leon 026
Blasteranis is a horrible dogfighter.
Don't ever, ever, ever speak again. I just want to punch you in the throat so bad right now. God.
Are you implying that I'm wrong to say its a horrible dogfighter?
Recruiting |
Gimpb
Sturmgrenadier Inc
Cosmic Anomalies
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Posted - 2008.09.09 16:51:00 -
[14]
Originally by: No seriously
Edited by: No seriously on 09/09/2008 15:57:02
Originally by: Leon 026
Crusader isnt the only interceptor that can fight outside web range. Crows (rockets and lights), arty-claws and railranises can all attack from outside web range.
True. But none of them can come close to the dps at that range. The railranis least of all, since it's near impossible to make cap stable and its drones are poppable (a good 1/3 of its dps).
All I'm saying is, the pulse-crusader bears a STRIKING resemblance to a "flawless" or "optimal" ship/setup.
Um, rail ranis damage is not low--it's high. It's not as high as blasters of course, but it's still high. If I remember correctly, higher than a pulse sader. Also, the ranis' high structure gives it a beastly damage control tank. Of course a rail ranis will be slower than a sader with less tracking but more range and more tank.
In short, yes, the crusader is good for killing ceptor, but it's not the only one and it's not clearly the best one either.
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Lubomir Penev
interimo
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Posted - 2008.09.09 16:55:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Leon 026
Originally by: Spectre3353
Originally by: Leon 026
Blasteranis is a horrible dogfighter.
Don't ever, ever, ever speak again. I just want to punch you in the throat so bad right now. God.
Are you implying that I'm wrong to say its a horrible dogfighter?
Yeah since overloading the blasteraranis became completely hax. It sucked before because there was no way in hell it could catch a faster long range inty, now with overloading this happens everywhere everyday.
--
I'm done whining about AFs, it looks like they are making them right \o/ |
Jodi Goulsti
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Posted - 2008.09.09 16:57:00 -
[16]
Originally by: No seriously
Originally by: Jodi Goulsti
Originally by: No seriously
A blaster-ranis vs. anything other than another inty is a deader-ranis.
:lol:
OK.
Am I wrong?
Cruiser + web vs. blaster-ranis = ?
It depends. Obviously, it's not a win button but I have had good success with a blaster taranis in lowsec belts. I think the last one I lost was to a three man cruiser militia gang that I mistakenly engaged although I did manage to pop one of their thoraxes before biting it myself.
There are places and roles where other inties would fare better, but the blanket statement that the blaster taranis is only an inty killer is patently untrue.
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Leon 026
Caldari
Vorace.
Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.09.09 16:59:00 -
[17]
Uh-huh. So the blasteranis can overload.... so can other inties. Granted, the advantage of the overload is on the first person who does it, but doesnt change the fact that you're not only trying to dogfight with an inty with crippling short range weapons, but you're trying to 'catch' another inty by entering a higher high-speed dogfight realm, where crippling short range weapons is even more of a disadvantage.
Recruiting |
No seriously
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Posted - 2008.09.09 17:02:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Jodi Goulsti
There are places and roles where other inties would fare better, but the blanket statement that the blaster taranis is only an inty killer is patently untrue.
Fair enough, my words were poorly chosen.
Appears that nobody really seems to agree with me that the Crusader is overpowered though... so... cool. I'll chalk this one up to a personal lack of understanding about PVP. I'm still pretty new to this whole scene.
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Lubomir Penev
interimo
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Posted - 2008.09.09 17:05:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Leon 026
Uh-huh. So the blasteranis can overload.... so can other inties. Granted, the advantage of the overload is on the first person who does it,
That's exactly why I think overloading more or less broke interceptor fights, outcome of fights often depend on "where" you are in your mwd cycle, because you cannot overload mid cycle. As it doesn't depend on char or player skills this saddens me quite a bit.
--
I'm done whining about AFs, it looks like they are making them right \o/ |
Leon 026
Caldari
Vorace.
Exalted.
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Posted - 2008.09.09 17:12:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Lubomir Penev
Originally by: Leon 026
Uh-huh. So the blasteranis can overload.... so can other inties. Granted, the advantage of the overload is on the first person who does it,
That's exactly why I think overloading more or less broke interceptor fights, outcome of fights often depend on "where" you are in your mwd cycle, because you cannot overload mid cycle. As it doesn't depend on char or player skills this saddens me quite a bit.
Well, I think overloading is part of that. But I'd personally put in polycarbs on that list (since those allow heavier ships to have nearly the same role of an inty, with much more firepower) and also add in huginn/rapiers on that list. We (inties) really don't need MORE ships added to the vast collection of ships that destroy average interceptors without blinking. And people wonder why some opt to go "heavy-pimp".
Recruiting |
Johan Price
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Posted - 2008.09.09 17:24:00 -
[21]
This may be true if the crusader has 3 mid slots, but it doesn't.
2 Mid slots is a drawback no matter how you look at it.
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr
The Cosa Nostra
La Cosa Nostra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.09.09 17:25:00 -
[22]
Sixty seconds of 100 DPS at most, before they have to break off. They're also pretty slow, and when they are fast they are so goddamn bad at turning.
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2008.09.09 17:30:00 -
[23]
1. Crusader only has 2 mids wich is a HUGE flaw.
2. Taranis with a skilled pilot can kill pretty much ANY inty.
3. Crusaders pretty much always die to equally skilled taranii
4. Crow can do 70dps from 42km, how is that for range vs damage?
L2p.
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[Video] Support Barrage |
Felix Dzerzhinsky
Caldari
Wreckless Abandon
Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.09.09 19:22:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
2. Taranis with a skilled pilot can kill pretty much ANY inty.
3. Crusaders pretty much always die to equally skilled taranii
A saider should beat a ranis. . .infact, if you are getting caught by a ranis in a saider or a crow. . .then you should not be flying the fast ships.
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GO BLUE!! |
Terianna Eri
Amarr
Scrutari
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Posted - 2008.09.09 19:28:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
2. Taranis with a skilled pilot can kill pretty much ANY inty.
3. Crusaders pretty much always die to equally skilled taranii
A saider should beat a ranis. . .infact, if you are getting caught by a ranis in a saider or a crow. . .then you should not be flying the fast ships.
Pulsesader going 5.5km/s in orbit at 17km away, orbiting Taranis.
Taranis overheats MWD to 5+km/s, overheats web, webs, eats?
__________________________________
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
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Lyria Skydancer
Amarr
Eve Defence Force
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Posted - 2008.09.09 19:30:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
2. Taranis with a skilled pilot can kill pretty much ANY inty.
3. Crusaders pretty much always die to equally skilled taranii
A saider should beat a ranis. . .infact, if you are getting caught by a ranis in a saider or a crow. . .then you should not be flying the fast ships.
You can speed fit all you like. A similar isk fitted ranis will overheat and web you. A sader generally loses to a blasteranis. Overheat has made taranis into a murderboat when flown by a skilled pilot. You obviously have not encountered these situations. I have. More then a dussin times. I know the outcome.
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[Video] Support Barrage |
Lubomir Penev
interimo
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Posted - 2008.09.09 20:29:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Felix Dzerzhinsky
Originally by: Lyria Skydancer
2. Taranis with a skilled pilot can kill pretty much ANY inty.
3. Crusaders pretty much always die to equally skilled taranii
A saider should beat a ranis. . .infact, if you are getting caught by a ranis in a saider or a crow. . .then you should not be flying the fast ships.
Exactly, and yet Blasteranises beats pulse Crusaders everyday, because overloading broke the paradigm that the fastest dictates range. This will be true (again) if you can overload mwd mid cycle, in the meantime a blasteranis is a pwnmobile.
--
I'm done whining about AFs, it looks like they are making them right \o/ |
Chienka
Victory Not Vengeance
SOLAR WING
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Posted - 2008.09.09 20:34:00 -
[28]
Not to mention the absolutely horrible warp-disruptor style locking range that causes you to lose lock every 5 seconds on the beamsader.
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Spectre3353
Gallente
The Python Cartel
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Posted - 2008.09.09 20:52:00 -
[29]
Taranis loses lock at about the same range as the Crusader, so that point is kind of moot.
The big thing that most of you don't seem to take into account when discussing an inti fight is AGILITY and ORBIT. Just because an inti is faster than another doesn't mean shit about whether or not it will get caught. If you are in a Taranis, even without overheating you can simply MWD straight at where your opponent's orbit is going to put them and eventually wind up in web range as the pilot orbiting will be going fast as hell and their ship won't alter orbit fast enough. I am sure there are pilots out there that are smart enough to account for this during a dogfight but I have yet to run into any of them. Add in overheating to the equation (faster MWD and farther web range) and it just becomes even more of a guaranteed splattering.
The bottom line is this: If two inti's with approximately equal pilot skill and gear get into a fight, the one with the web will win. |
Lubomir Penev
interimo
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Posted - 2008.09.09 21:09:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Spectre3353
Taranis loses lock at about the same range as the Crusader, so that point is kind of moot.
He said BEAM Crusader. Railranis operate in pulse Crusader range, beam sader operate at edge of disruptor range that is very close to its lock range. Some people even fit a lock range rig for that reason.
--
I'm done whining about AFs, it looks like they are making them right \o/ |
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