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![Protoplasmo Protoplasmo](https://images.evetech.net/characters/2035346376/portrait?size=64)
Protoplasmo
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Posted - 2008.09.15 10:50:00 -
[1]
Is there a science to market manipulation Eve-O forum threads? Is it an art?
Is it as simple as saying something like this?: "What is up with N-Type Energized Membranes in Heimatar, dudes?"
I welcome your tips and tricks on market manipulation threads, related anecdotes and war stories, and even your unhelpful "no one's ever going to tell you their secrets if they actually work" comments. (To forestall some other common responses, I did read through the stickies, and I should confirm that this thread is neither an IPO nor a bond offering.)
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![Midas Man Midas Man](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1992013616/portrait?size=64)
Midas Man
Caldari Dzark Asylum
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Posted - 2008.09.15 11:08:00 -
[2]
0 a) Research 1) Buy up everything 1 a) Research More 2) Relist at your Price 2 a) Research some more for good measure 3) Profit 3 a) back to step 1 if successful b) Back to missions if not lol
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![Mr RnD Mr RnD](https://images.evetech.net/characters/268210142/portrait?size=64)
Mr RnD
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Posted - 2008.09.15 11:10:00 -
[3]
/me goes and buys up N-Type Energized Membranes
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![Svanna Gulmi Svanna Gulmi](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1083822012/portrait?size=64)
Svanna Gulmi
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Posted - 2008.09.15 12:16:00 -
[4]
Hmm well i'd be carefull, i'm not going to go into what i did recently but it was along the same lines. People are stupid, greedy and work to some odd rules. Just because people will now make more from what you relist higher, doesn't meen they will relist at the higher price. You may find yourself buying 2 or 3 times the stock you initially calculated because people will continue to go by the historic price for the item. Good luck to you and everything but just know your market very well before you commit to it!
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![Shad0wsFury Shad0wsFury](https://images.evetech.net/characters/604639162/portrait?size=64)
Shad0wsFury
Slacker Industries
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Posted - 2008.09.16 00:33:00 -
[5]
Be careful when trying to strong-arm the market. My suggestion would be to not commit to trying to run the market on any specific item unless you're committed to going "balls deep" and doing anything and everything that might be necessary to keep control of the market on that item, at least until you sell what inventory you have.
I recently tried this with an item, and while I was successful, it was more due to luck than anything else (ie. lots of people didn't undercut me horribly). I COULD have lost a great deal of ISK, but managed to make a decent profit.
Very risky trying to control the market for certain items unless you have the bankroll to deal with ANYTHING coming your way. Even if some dude hauls in 1000 pieces from Jita or something, you MUST be able to buy them and resell them, or you lose.
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![Anas Damona Anas Damona](https://images.evetech.net/characters/669188382/portrait?size=64)
Anas Damona
KOM TV
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Posted - 2008.09.16 03:06:00 -
[6]
I'll reserve 100 shares, pending an audit.
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![Frenden Dax Frenden Dax](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1869223808/portrait?size=64)
Frenden Dax
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Posted - 2008.09.16 04:02:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Anas Damona I'll reserve 100 shares, pending an audit.
...
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![Protoplasmo Protoplasmo](https://images.evetech.net/characters/2035346376/portrait?size=64)
Protoplasmo
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Posted - 2008.09.16 19:24:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Anas Damona I'll reserve 100 shares, pending an audit.
[attempt at humour] My business plan did not include hiring an auditor, but if you put down a deposit on those shares, I will be happy to oblige. By the way, the shares will be 1 billion ISK each, similar to Ray's offering. A tiny down payment of a mere 2% should suffice toward hiring an auditor. So when I get your 2 billion ISK, Anas Damona, I'll set up the audit. [/attempt at humour]
Still hoping for more further suggestions, tips, pointers and so forth regarding market manipulation via the Eve-O forums.
For example, it seems that any post in Market Discussions is likely to be subject to relatively well-informed scrutiny, so perhaps it is best to post mildly-disguised manipulation threads in other forums.
E.g., carrying through the example I used above, (i) posting leading questions in Ships and Modules about the merits of N-Type membranes, or even (ii) risking my sanity by posting in CAOD, mentioning the module type in passing just to get it into retail consumers' minds.
Any more thoughts?
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![Anas Damona Anas Damona](https://images.evetech.net/characters/669188382/portrait?size=64)
Anas Damona
KOM TV
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Posted - 2008.09.17 13:34:00 -
[9]
Money transferred, awaiting results of audit.
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![Midas Man Midas Man](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1992013616/portrait?size=64)
Midas Man
Caldari Dzark Asylum
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Posted - 2008.09.17 15:40:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Protoplasmo
Still hoping for more further suggestions, tips, pointers and so forth regarding market manipulation via the Eve-O forums.
For example, it seems that any post in Market Discussions is likely to be subject to relatively well-informed scrutiny, so perhaps it is best to post mildly-disguised manipulation threads in other forums.
E.g., carrying through the example I used above, (i) posting leading questions in Ships and Modules about the merits of N-Type membranes, or even (ii) risking my sanity by posting in CAOD, mentioning the module type in passing just to get it into retail consumers' minds.
Any more thoughts?
Market manipulation works best in silence. By publising it you only open yourself up to bigger market players (a) taking over the manipulation (b) ruining your attempt for Lols. You also open yourself up to the hordes of Manipulators to scared to try it alone and therefore jump on any manipulation attempt they see causing over supply and manipulation fail. Finally you will attract the attention of Stock pilers that ferrit away small amounts of thier traded items against the day someone attempts a manipulation.
For every noob you catch in you trap you will catch someone savvy enougth to spot your attempt and maybe trap you.
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![Protoplasmo Protoplasmo](https://images.evetech.net/characters/2035346376/portrait?size=64)
Protoplasmo
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Posted - 2008.09.17 17:17:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Anas Damona Money transferred, awaiting results of audit.
[responding to strained attempt at humour] Unfortunately, any such ISK was not transferred to me, which, if you re-read my post above, you'll see was required. [/responding to strained attempt at humour]
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![iskopoly iskopoly](https://images.evetech.net/characters/2012366263/portrait?size=64)
iskopoly
Amarr Royal Amarr Institute
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Posted - 2008.09.17 17:25:00 -
[12]
this thread fails to deliver :( . It is all about the ISK
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![Karanth Karanth](https://images.evetech.net/characters/937395076/portrait?size=64)
Karanth
Gallente Eve's Brothers of Destiny FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2008.09.17 17:37:00 -
[13]
That depends, did the price of N-Types go up in Heimatar?
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Wheel of Whineage |
![Protoplasmo Protoplasmo](https://images.evetech.net/characters/2035346376/portrait?size=64)
Protoplasmo
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Posted - 2008.09.17 17:47:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Karanth Did the price of N-Types go up in Heimatar?
N-Type Reactive Membrane Is (local rat-specific) are up somewhat, but there's still room for improvement on that item, and plenty of room for participation in the three other damage types.
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![scroft scroft](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1632429196/portrait?size=64)
scroft
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Posted - 2008.09.18 05:08:00 -
[15]
Hey you might take a first step and look at mini-manipulation...no this doesn't mean working the arms of a height challenge being...rather this is what i do.
Take a market for a single item you know well. Something that sells around 200 units (or 600mil isk) a day. Wait...understand the typical lowest sell price. Buy stock in at the lowest price sustainable by the market. Wait...look at when the amount of items for sale (more so maybe the amount of individual sellers) is well below average. Buy-out every seller, (should be around 20% of daily sales or 120m isk) then relist the stuff you just bought AND the stuff you stocked up on at a 30% higher price than the norm..BUT do it as 7-8 individual small amount of units sales rather than one lump sum. DONT buy any more stock unless it's single units. If the price goes down to market normal the worst case is that you break even or lose very little..DONT artificially support eh market by buying out all stock as the earlier posts suggest (that is a very nice way to lose a lot of cash)...
That's about it. The chances are that you will make a few sales at 30%+ profit then a few at 20% and then the market will settle for a couple of days at a 5%-10% price above normal while people see the price increase in the market and go far out to buy cheap product. Try and sell everything in 1 day. Buy out the market at peak times (sunday afternoons PST when everyone has ran out of weekend stuff to do), and only if you can be at the keyboard every second until you sell out..
PS.. as the market settles you should notice that people have gone to secondary supply areas to try and buy up all the stock to bring to your newly heightened price market so sell. Two things happen; the price at the secondary supply area dramatically increases; the sudden influx of items to the market you are in starts to plunge the item price as people start to sell off items they are making little profit on. SOOOO any stock you didn't sell take off the market and take to the secondary supply areas and do the whole trick again in reverse.
I have fun watching this happen.
scroft/orangecrush
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![scroft scroft](https://images.evetech.net/characters/1632429196/portrait?size=64)
scroft
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Posted - 2008.09.18 05:31:00 -
[16]
Sorry small error here.. last paragraph should be
"bring to your newly heightened price market to sell."
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![Shadarle Shadarle](https://images.evetech.net/characters/694207010/portrait?size=64)
Shadarle
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Posted - 2008.09.19 04:28:00 -
[17]
Cloaking devices seem to be the current way to make large amounts of ISK, but don't tell anyone, wouldn't want to let the secret out!
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![KtoJest KtoJest](https://images.evetech.net/characters/449606961/portrait?size=64)
KtoJest
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.09.19 07:47:00 -
[18]
'Any more thoughts?'
Yeah, how many people read the forums?
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![Chomin H'ak Chomin H'ak](https://images.evetech.net/characters/986933089/portrait?size=64)
Chomin H'ak
The Trivenerate
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Posted - 2008.09.19 16:21:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Shadarle Cloaking devices seem to be the current way to make large amounts of ISK, but don't tell anyone, wouldn't want to let the secret out!
Gods, man... you can do better than that.
Originally by: Frenden Dax My heart hopes that people aren't that stupid, but my experiences thus far suggest otherwise.
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![Yakia TovilToba Yakia TovilToba](https://images.evetech.net/characters/747034915/portrait?size=64)
Yakia TovilToba
Halliburton Inc.
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Posted - 2008.09.19 16:27:00 -
[20]
I don't think you can read a guide or some general how-to hints and then go out and successfully manipulate the market, at least not on large scale. You need lots of isk for that, and you need a high level of dedication, it requires a good knowledge of a certain market and item, how it is produced/looted, what volumes it is traded, how fast it can be reproduced by industrialists if you try to create an artificial shortage, are there substitution goods or complementary goods for that item ... and many other things.
For the manipulation strategy i'd recommend to read some books on stock market manipulation, especially some of the good old methods are interesting, which you can't do nowadays, since you'd get in trouble with the stock exchange supervisory authority. Search for that tactics and try to understand the ideas behind them and you will be able to apply some of them on eve markets. But don't expect anyone sharing a successful strategy, knowledge on this field is a valuable asset that people won't give away for free, and some of that strategies would become worthless if everone tried to do them.
_________ My e-peen |
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