| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Ethan Magnar
   |
Posted - 2004.06.20 16:07:00 -
[1]
Greetings,
I have a Nostromo n52 gamepad, which allows you to macro certain keyboardkeys. I was thinking about making a macro that switches my mining lasers on. It'd go like this:
<press/release F1>
<press/release F2>
<wait 20 seconds>
<press/release F3>
<press/release F4>
<wait 20 seconds>
<press/release F5>
This way I can have nice rotation of my mining lasers, without having to worry about my cargospace filling up or having my laptop on next to me with the clock open in order to synchronise the lasers.
I know how people feel about macro mining, but this would, of course, still require you to be present at your keyboard. 
Is this allowed? |
Nicholas Marshal
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 16:10:00 -
[2]
I don't believe that CCP would have a problem with this. It is completely different from macros.
|
Sarek Galathos
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 16:12:00 -
[3]
I don't see a problem with it.
The n52 is designed for macros...it's not cheating. Like you said, you still have to be present at the keyboard to use it. Some friends of mine used it to play Call of Duty and again in Final Fantasy XI.
It would be a stupid thing to get banned over, if you do.
------------------------------------
Sarek Galathos
Versatech Interstellar Limited
Pilot: Gamma Wing (Agent Division)
|
Ethan Magnar
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 16:20:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Sarek Galathos
It would be a stupid thing to get banned over, if you do.
Well I agree, but considering how people react to the term 'macro' I wanted to make sure :)
Thx at any rate.
|
Silex D'Arden
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 16:31:00 -
[5]
Been meaning to ask someone....how is that game pad? Comfortable?
|
Ethan Magnar
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 16:46:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Silex D'Arden
Been meaning to ask someone....how is that game pad? Comfortable?
It's got one flaw: theres no good button to replace the spacebar, there is one for your thumb located on the right but it is VERY rigid, so I hardly use it.
I have read reviews tho that the quality of the units varies, so you need to be lucky to get a good one it seems.
Other than that, it's really nice, need some time adjusting tho.
|
cashman
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 16:52:00 -
[7]
Eh, people...what exactly is different about making a gamepad do macro than from making a program do macro?
Its both automated right? I would say it is against the EULA, just as using utils for it is. 
____________________________________
»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»
|
Ethan Magnar
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 17:02:00 -
[8]
The difference is that I'm not some greedy bastard with 3 accounts who needs a macro so he can mine completetly afk.
|
Max Hardcase
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 17:12:00 -
[9]
Also the difference is that he uses this ONCE when he starts mining.
Macro miners use macros to move the mouse ( to move ore etc )
|
GM Ender
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 17:17:00 -
[10]
Ok. I¦m not going to say that we officially approve of using this type of gamepad. However, as long as you¦re not AFK, only on-line on one account at a time and responsive to hails, we won¦t make an issue out of it either. Although technically, I suppose it¦s against the EULA, in reality, it conforms to the basic principle, i.e. it doesn¦t give the distinct advantage that AFK macro mining does. In that regard, it¦s similar to the ³ber-keyboard/battle console the guy who had too much time on his hands made a while back. That is, while not really what the devs intended, didn¦t really violate the spirit of the game.
|
Bug
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 17:24:00 -
[11]
Automated keystrokes are wrong and against the EULA, period.Any arguements you might have against it are futile. "But but but, i'm not a greedy macro miner so its okay to use them really" doesn't cut it.
I mean if the devs would tell the playerbase that its "okay" to use macro's, aslong as its not being used on a major scale.. where do you draw the line?Lets not even go there.
|
cashman
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 17:25:00 -
[12]
So using macro programs for mining while sitting infront of the screen with only 1 account online, is ok then? 
____________________________________
»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»
|
Bug
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 17:30:00 -
[13]
Originally by: cashman
So using macro programs for mining while sitting infront of the screen with only 1 account online, is ok then?
Yep, looks like Ender just opened Pandora's box.Just like the UO team did a few years ago.I retract my last statement, let the macro'ing begin!
w00t!
|
Sochin
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 17:35:00 -
[14]
I really don't know how CCP would have found out about you doing this if you hadn't just told them.
Nemo me impune lacessit
|
Kel Shek
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 19:04:00 -
[15]
you aren't really that dumb, are you bug?
ya seem nice and smart and all.... but the distinction between having a device turn your mining lasers on with one button press, and practically making an AI to stripmine a belt while your sleeping, or whatever, is REALLY REALLY quite obvious.
and for goodness sake, mining in this game isn't even f'ing repettitive. definitely NOT worthy of the time it would take to make an attended macro...
though unattended mining macros (as in, not just afk mining with an indy) is disgusting, and they should all have their characters erased.
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
ActiveX
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 19:41:00 -
[16]
But how do you know someone is unattended? I've seen people mine for 12 hours and never leave the computer...
____________
Sex / Rank 9 / SP: 1280 of 2304000 
|
Bug
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 20:08:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Kel Shek
but the distinction between having a device turn your mining lasers on with one button press, and practically making an AI to stripmine a belt while your sleeping, or whatever, is REALLY REALLY quite obvious.
Thats just it - obvious to you and me maybe. 
I've played too many games prior to this one where the developers have come out with half arsed statements on the subject of macroing/cheating.Often this leads to macro-curious players trying them out, where before they felt hold back by the thought of severe punishments.And once you start with one automated process, its very easy to move on to another.
In my opinion there needs to be a clear boundary.Cross the line and you're toast, clear and simple.None of this "Oh but its okay, as long as you . . ."
Originally by: Kel Shek
definitely NOT worthy of the time it would take to make an attended macro...
With the advent of the autoscanner, you would be surprised how easy it is to make a basic stripmine macro.It Takes like 30-35 minutes with free downloadable software.
|
Del Narveux
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 20:51:00 -
[18]
I think Ender made it fairly clear that that 'line' is crossed when your macro requires no human intervention once you start it up. All the dudes macro seems to do is start his lasers (dunno why this is so important), he still sits at keyboard to transfer ore, and haul it back, probably even more attentively than I do since my miner ship is fixed up so it takes several minutes before the hold is full.
And Ender also raises an interesting point: does CCP look down on those who are at the/a keyboard but are running multiple accounts/comps to mine or do whatever?
_________________
[SAK] And Proud Of It!
aka Cpt Bogus
Is that my torped sig cloaking your base? |
Kel Shek
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 21:00:00 -
[19]
Del, its more of an issue when your mining into a container...
my thorax, as is frequently seen, if I start all 5 lasers at once, the last one or two, will dump a good amount, or all of their pull into space, since the first 3.5 filled my cargo bay. mining into a container, I transfer the ore from the first two, then the second two, then the 5th and drones... thus keeping it so the lasers stay on, instead of having to be restarted, and wasting ore, and so on.
(for those who don't know... you then have an industrial ship pick up the ore, making transportation of it FAR more efficient)
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
NeoMorph
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 21:32:00 -
[20]
I have used a N50 for ages... Recently upgraded to the N52 and love it.
I built the N52 into the left arm of my chair and a logitech thumb track ball into the right arm. This means I can sit back and play Eve without moving much which for me is a godsend as I'm disabled.
All the N52 is is an alternative keyboard and mouse and CCP cant make us all use the same keyboards and mice to play Eve.
-------------------------------------------
<Stavros> the first motor bike i ever rode
<Stavros> was a honda gold wing
<Ak-Gara> hah
<Stavros> |
MOOstradamus
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 22:15:00 -
[21]
Quote:
and responsive to hails
What if I don't want to respond or what if I used an auto-response utility 
Quote:
and for goodness sake, mining in this game isn't even f'ing repettitive
Haaaaaaaaaaahahahhahahahahahahhahahahaha !!
So can we use macro's now or not ... Make your mind up and don't get all fuzzy !! 
MOOrovingian "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
|
sutty
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 22:26:00 -
[22]
ok If you press ctrl alt shift M, you get a little box that appears, at the top of this box is somthing called "cursor" if these numbers perfectly the same everytime like they would if you was using a macro then obviously ccp can tell. As they just look at there logs :)
|
Alexis Machine
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 22:42:00 -
[23]
I use a custom keyboard for FPS games. (I have a problem remembering which key crouches/lays down and which attaches my bayonete... I've stabbed too many teammates by accident while trying to lay down lol) Best advice is not to tell anyone you're using it. People react funny when they think you have some "uber-advantage". Regardless of if you do or not.
----------------sig----------------------------
Dtai'kai'-dte sa-de nau'gkon dtain'aun bpi-de.
if you don't wake up, i'll have to stop kissing you. all that flailing has made you sleepy. you rest while i untie you. stay here until they find you. My hand made mannequin. i won't let them get you. they'll know you're mine by the fingerprints on your throat. isn't she lovely? isn't she wonderful? like the *****s that we are, swatting flies from the wounds we design. |
Idara
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 23:29:00 -
[24]
That shouldn't get you in trouble. Hell, you'll still be moving the mouse around to unload your hold into a can and such, that's when the cursor would move around. So you're cursor position will be the same as you activate the lasers, but that's just using the ingame shortcuts already provided, which have your mouse stay still anyways.
Idara
Section Leader - Security & Warfare
Member of Metatron Incorporated |
Maya Rkell
|
Posted - 2004.06.20 23:43:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Bug
Originally by: cashman
So using macro programs for mining while sitting infront of the screen with only 1 account online, is ok then?
Yep, looks like Ender just opened Pandora's box.Just like the UO team did a few years ago.I retract my last statement, let the macro'ing begin!
w00t!
Attended macroing vs Unattended macroing.
Pretty DARN clearcut to me.
"As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade" |
MOOstradamus
|
Posted - 2004.06.21 04:20:00 -
[26]
Quote:
Attended macroing vs Unattended macroing.
Pretty DARN clearcut to me.
First define 'attended' then prove 100% (without the use of spycams) whether someone is paying attention to EVE and their computer or not ...
MOOrovingian  "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
|
Pandora Panda
|
Posted - 2004.06.21 05:31:00 -
[27]
If someone is responsive and only running one account, its more or less impossible to prove that theyre macroing. The reply by Ender is simply a recognition of that fact. I read it less as a 'this is something that is permissible' than 'this is something we cant catch, but isnt a huge deal'.
Besides, anyone who's macroing is probably aware of the fact that CCP is quite bad at catching macroers.
--------------------------------------------
CONCORD: Kneecapping Pilots for Misdemeanors Since 2003 |
McWatt
|
Posted - 2004.06.21 06:07:00 -
[28]
Originally by: GM Ender
Ok. I¦m not going to say that we officially approve of using this type of gamepad. However, as long as you¦re not AFK, only on-line on one account at a time and responsive to hails, we won¦t make an issue out of it either. Although technically, I suppose it¦s against the EULA, in reality, it conforms to the basic principle, i.e. it doesn¦t give the distinct advantage that AFK macro mining does. In that regard, it¦s similar to the ³ber-keyboard/battle console the guy who had too much time on his hands made a while back. That is, while not really what the devs intended, didn¦t really violate the spirit of the game.
k. most horrible post i read for quite some time. could someone please erase this ****?!?
1. we knew for a long time that ccp isn t serious about going after macro users. this is the final conformation.
the looser again is the honest player.
2. you realy expect ppl to switch of the macro while going to the loo? answering a phone call? watching a goal on the telly?
no advantage? wtf are you talking about?
|
Kel Shek
|
Posted - 2004.06.21 09:22:00 -
[29]
I'm coming to this EVE off of the game A Tale in the Desert.
in that game, mining requires clicking once every... ~15-20 seconds, depending on certain things.
even considering that with this game, you have to move the ore from the cargo into a can every... maybe once or twice a minute? its still not as clicky. (and more productive per click, once you get to that point too)
and for making other things... like say, cooking limestone into lime, some ways of doing it required 3 clicks every 10 seconds, and it was far LESS productive per dozen of those clicks than any one click you do in this game.
THOSE sort of things, are worthy of macroing.
and I am all against unattended macros, or certain types of attended macros(if it allows you to do something better than you could do manually)
but for cripes sake, this is talking about 1 case, with a function that makes it so your lasers turn on in a certain manner. this is not a macro to automate mining, this is not something that allows you to stripmine an asteroid belt while your on vacation, this is an adaptation for a harmless feature that should already be in the game's normal utilitys, in some form or another.
seriously, come the hell on. theres a HUGE, VERY obvious difference between the two.
the thing in question is a bandaid to a minor annoyance. patching an irritation is not inherently leading to being able to sew together a frankenstein monster. in fact they are hardly comparable.
Quote:
2. you realy expect ppl to switch of the macro while going to the loo? answering a phone call? watching a goal on the telly?
why should they? but IMO, they aughta put in detection systems such that they can have someone drop by and wave hello, and if theres no response, the person is kicked off, (or maybe blown up would be more suiting) and if they are caught again, and cannot provide a reasonable explanation to why they did not respond, and how what they were doing was such that they COULD not be bothered to show any sign of life... then they be permabanned, or something to that effect.
:shrug: if you have a person come by and verify their being someone at the keyboard or not...
and if the person is still there and paying enough attention to respond, do you REALLY care if they are doing all the clicks and such manually, as long as they are present enough to answer "hello" to a GM?
in ATITD, there were some of those type things, and certain things that were KNOWN to trip the macro-alarm, one particular story of such interaction, is the person (knowing they were going to trigger it... the GM warps in, they say "moo" before the GM even gets to say anything, or after saying hi, or whtever, and the gm smiles and goes back to their business. (that particular trigger was prone to having a huge amount of false positives in certain circumstances)
how much advantage does soeone being able to have their mining lasers timed properly with only one click, rather than 5 manually timed clicks, really have?
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
Del Narveux
|
Posted - 2004.06.21 09:43:00 -
[30]
Kel: I mine to a can too, and I know the advantage of phasing out your lasers (though I dont have to). My point was, in your post you made it fairly clear that you needed to have your lasers spaced out *exactly* 20 seconds apart, rather than just approximately spaced out, and I was just curious as to why that sort of accuracy was such a big deal.
_________________
[SAK] And Proud Of It!
aka Cpt Bogus
Is that my torped sig cloaking your base? |
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |