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Inquiry regarding Amarr slave trade

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Kephael Caldari Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate EVESpace	Posted - 2008.10.04 22:00:00 - [1] Greetings fellow capsuleers, I'm in the process of acquiring a Charon class Caldari freighter and am interested in utilizing it to further the slave trade in Amarr space. Would any of you experienced slave traders out there venture to enlighten me about what sort of profit margins I can expect? Where is the main trade hub for the slave trade? I would venture down to Amarr space myself but have been rather busy selling minerals. Also, how do the slaves behave when put into giant secure cargo containers, I intend to utilize my cargo hold to maximum effectiveness. I look forward to your responses, Kephael
Archbishop Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.04 22:15:00 - [2] Since you are going to participate for profit instead of the worthy cause of enlightenment I'm not sure what type of advice I can give you specifically as that is not the focus I have as a slave owner. I will say it is beneficial to provide the slaves with at least 3.0 m3 of space to sleep. Over three years ago the SPCS published slave guidelines for basic care and treatment. SPCS GUIDELINES FOR SLAVE CARE Note these are old standards and the SPCS board no longer is active. I will be planning a new set of guidelines shortly and assembling a new board as the current board was dismissed several years ago. A summary of the final guidelines: #1) Transport space should be a minimum of 1.0 m3 of space. Permanent living quarters should be a minimum of 3.0 m3 of space although shift bunking is permitted. #2) Six hours of sleep minimum as well as 1 additional hour on the Sabboth day. #3) Slaves should have at least four hours per day available as time to study the holy scriptures. Actual desk time should be four hours however other forms of education may be substitued including implant or subliminal education and training via loudspeaker during work periods. #4) Two bathing periods each week minimum for common stock slaves. House slaves and office slaves should be permitted more bathing periods if desired by the Slave Holder or by the requirements of the post. #5) Two meals is sufficient but set daily minimum requirements in nutrient levels per Amarrian Consulate of Health standards to support and sustain human life. The food should be of appealing consistency and taste. Food not of appealing taste and appearance but of sufficient nutritional value may be substituted as a disciplinary measure. #6) Each slave should when possible be kept with its family as a slave is more inclined to work hard when happy around its family. The standard should remain when compatible with job duties and the wishes of the Slave Holder. #7) Each slave is expected to work a minimum of 9 hours per day and a maximum of 15 hours per day unless a need to extend is required to serve the needs of the Empire (example: wartime ship construction). A minimum of six hours per day is acceptable on the Sabboth at Slave Holder discretion. #8) No slave exercising acceptable behavior should be denied Vitoc. The witholding of Vitoc is allowed as a control and disciplinary measure. #9) Punishment by Slave Holders is permissible as long as the purpose is just in order to ensure discipline. While permanent injury is not recommended it is up to the Slave Holder to conduct that punishment he deems necessary. #10) No slave should be killed without just cause by the Slave Holder. #11) Slave breeding is permitted under clean conditions which do not permanently harm the livestock. #12) Holders who fail to follow guidelines will be labelled "non-SPCS compliant". #13) A slave upon the attainment of an age which renders it unable to work shall be permitted to stay with families or obtain government assistance if freed. #14) Slaves should have access to suitable medical care at Slave Holders expense. #15) Slave Holders should designate several senior trusted slaves among their herd to assist in slave funeral ceremonies. These ceremonies will be carried out by Amarrian clergy and will focus on the slaves relationship with God. The immediate families of dead slaves will be permitted a three day "off" period for grieving and to attend the funeral if the needs of the Empire do not conflict. While the SPCS recommended 1.0 m3 for transport I recommend at least 6.0m3 per slave (twice their mass) so they have room to pray and live while in transport. But the minimum per SPCS guidelines is still 1.0 m3 but this is now below "humane" standards in my book. I hope that assists you. Archbishop PIE WEBSITE ARCHBISHOP PORTAL
BloodBird Gallente Tactical Freedom Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.04 22:41:00 - [3] Way to go signing up to the KOS list of every single anti-slaver faction out there. I get the feeling you might just be out to annoy as many people as possible and to start a raging debate between the Matari, the Imperials and anyone else that cares for human lives more than you seem to do. I mean, the entire "Put the slaves in containers for max effectiveness" just says it all, no-one who actually wanted to trade with slaves for profit would deliver containers filled with corpses. It's hard to breathe in containers after all, unless you intend to actually do something about the slave's needs? Sig source
Lordus Mark Amarr RDK Trusting Holders	Posted - 2008.10.05 01:54:00 - [4] We will gladly accept some of your live stock and even give you some advise. First of all, and unlike some have said here, human lives are a diferent matter. Slaves are property and live stock. Keep this in mind if you want to maximise your profits. ******************************** RDK Trusting Holders** Need a job done? Quietly? Have a word with us.
Kephael Caldari Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate EVESpace	Posted - 2008.10.05 14:46:00 - [5] Originally by: BloodBird Way to go signing up to the KOS list of every single anti-slaver faction out there. I get the feeling you might just be out to annoy as many people as possible and to start a raging debate between the Matari, the Imperials and anyone else that cares for human lives more than you seem to do. I mean, the entire "Put the slaves in containers for max effectiveness" just says it all, no-one who actually wanted to trade with slaves for profit would deliver containers filled with corpses. It's hard to breathe in containers after all, unless you intend to actually do something about the slave's needs? I can't say I've actually been in the containers, are we positive they are air tight? I'm sure the slaves could survive the trip which lasts but a few hours in them.
Anneka Tong B. S. Radioactive Sheep Farm	Posted - 2008.10.05 17:12:00 - [6] Originally by: Kephael I can't say I've actually been in the containers, are we positive they are air tight? I'm sure the slaves could survive the trip which lasts but a few hours in them. Since by insisting on using the containers, you're clearly determined to disregard both the argument about slavery as an institution, and the welfare standards mentioned by Archbishop, I thought I'd point out the technical issues. Air/water supply and heating to keep the slaves alive during the trip is one thing, trivial to set up. However, as everyone knows, cargo containers are fitted with Planck bubble generators, which is how they are able to hold more than their own volume. I'd say it's these Planck bubble generators that are the problem relating to the containers. Exposing living creatures to the Planck bubble is not a good idea. They will not survive. Which means the generators on the containers have to be disabled. So you're not saving any cargo space. So, if you're set on transporting slaves, for profit, then you can't use containers, and you'd be best to use welfare standards such that they arrive both alive and healthy. I like genetic engineering Past projects: The Radioactive Sheep Current project: CyberCow
Veron Daerth Amarr Blood Meridian	Posted - 2008.10.05 17:21:00 - [7] Originally by: Anneka Tong So, if you're set on transporting slaves, for profit, then you can't use containers, and you'd be best to use welfare standards such that they arrive both alive and healthy. This is, indeed the case, Pilot. And you should also make sure several of your vessel's crew are qualified medical personnel. Dead and injured and sick slaves dont accomplish much work, so its in your best interests to keep the healthy and their shots up to date. That last part is really important, too. Every planet and station has its own microbes, bacteria, viruses, etc. and they dont always get along with the human immune system. Having your slaves immunized to the systems or planets known pathogens will cut down on overall deaths and, while relatively costly, will increase your bottom line by lowering wastage due to death. May the Light of God guide and protect you, Pilots.
Kephael Caldari Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate EVESpace	Posted - 2008.10.05 19:42:00 - [8] Edited by: Kephael on 05/10/2008 19:45:00 Loading the slaves into dozens of cargo containers would have been quite a hassle anyways, I've just ordered a Charon from a Gallente capsuleer, I always thought they abhorred the practice of slavery. Oh well, isk talks. See you on the trade lanes and glory to the state, Kephael
Vendrin Caldari Stimulus	Posted - 2008.10.05 21:20:00 - [9] You should consider bringing those slaves into Caldari State Space with your Charon and expanding the market.
Archbishop Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.10.06 01:11:00 - [10] I would like to place a preliminary order for say 100,000 slaves if you can obtain them. Please contact me via evemail with your time needed to gather such a number and the price you seek. Archbishop PIE WEBSITE ARCHBISHOP PORTAL
Vaden Khale Amarr the united	Posted - 2008.10.06 02:36:00 - [11] I would also like to place an order. Mail me details. I will require delivery and am willing to pay for the extra trouble.
Arelius Sarum Amarr Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.06 04:55:00 - [12] My guidline for keeping slaves: - Pay them the minimum wage and they can go worry about their own accomodations. It's cheaper for me to pay them a small wage than to house and feed them. Per Ardua ad Astra - Through Adversity, to the Stars
A Soporific Caldari Venom Pointe Industries	Posted - 2008.10.06 05:17:00 - [13] Originally by: Vendrin You should consider bringing those slaves into Caldari State Space with your Charon and expanding the market. This is an absolutely wonderful idea if you feel like using said Charon in a shootout with State Navy and Customs Officials. The transport of slaves without a license is illegal in the State, and license to transport slaves are currently held exclusively by a handful of non-capsuleer organizations. For unaffiliated capsuleers, slavery is just as illegal in the State as it is in the Federation but for rather different reasons.
XFreedomX	Posted - 2008.10.06 05:23:00 - [14] Seems Jita has a population control problem, Caldarian growning babies out of test tubes I guess. You should try working a deal with your government to ship "immigrants" to Amarr. Make sure you travel via Amammake and make a quick stop at the top station.
Telemicus Thrace Thrace Inc	Posted - 2008.10.06 05:55:00 - [15] Originally by: Kephael Perhaps I will be able to locate a matari abolitionist who would be interested in freeing these slaves and inadvertently support the industry at the same time! Certainly. I don't see how crippling your ship, freeing the men and women on board and executing you and your crew actually supports the slave trade but we'll be happy to oblige. Come via Amamake. Thrace Inc Poster
Vendrin Caldari Stimulus	Posted - 2008.10.06 10:26:00 - [16] Originally by: A Soporific Originally by: Vendrin You should consider bringing those slaves into Caldari State Space with your Charon and expanding the market. This is an absolutely wonderful idea if you feel like using said Charon in a shootout with State Navy and Customs Officials. The transport of slaves without a license is illegal in the State, and license to transport slaves are currently held exclusively by a handful of non-capsuleer organizations. For unaffiliated capsuleers, slavery is just as illegal in the State as it is in the Federation but for rather different reasons. Amazing... I wonder why I would have suggested a thing.....
soldieroffortune 258 Gallente Trinity Council	Posted - 2008.10.06 16:44:00 - [17] Originally by: Archbishop Since you are going to participate for profit instead of the worthy cause of enlightenment I'm not sure what type of advice I can give you specifically as that is not the focus I have as a slave owner. I will say it is beneficial to provide the slaves with at least 3.0 m3 of space to sleep. Over three years ago the SPCS published slave guidelines for basic care and treatment. SPCS GUIDELINES FOR SLAVE CARE Note these are old standards and the SPCS board no longer is active. I will be planning a new set of guidelines shortly and assembling a new board as the current board was dismissed several years ago. A summary of the final guidelines: #1) Transport space should be a minimum of 1.0 m3 of space. Permanent living quarters should be a minimum of 3.0 m3 of space although shift bunking is permitted. #2) Six hours of sleep minimum as well as 1 additional hour on the Sabboth day. #3) Slaves should have at least four hours per day available as time to study the holy scriptures. Actual desk time should be four hours however other forms of education may be substitued including implant or subliminal education and training via loudspeaker during work periods. #4) Two bathing periods each week minimum for common stock slaves. House slaves and office slaves should be permitted more bathing periods if desired by the Slave Holder or by the requirements of the post. #5) Two meals is sufficient but set daily minimum requirements in nutrient levels per Amarrian Consulate of Health standards to support and sustain human life. The food should be of appealing consistency and taste. Food not of appealing taste and appearance but of sufficient nutritional value may be substituted as a disciplinary measure. #6) Each slave should when possible be kept with its family as a slave is more inclined to work hard when happy around its family. The standard should remain when compatible with job duties and the wishes of the Slave Holder. #7) Each slave is expected to work a minimum of 9 hours per day and a maximum of 15 hours per day unless a need to extend is required to serve the needs of the Empire (example: wartime ship construction). A minimum of six hours per day is acceptable on the Sabboth at Slave Holder discretion. #8) No slave exercising acceptable behavior should be denied Vitoc. The witholding of Vitoc is allowed as a control and disciplinary measure. #9) Punishment by Slave Holders is permissible as long as the purpose is just in order to ensure discipline. While permanent injury is not recommended it is up to the Slave Holder to conduct that punishment he deems necessary. #10) No slave should be killed without just cause by the Slave Holder. #11) Slave breeding is permitted under clean conditions which do not permanently harm the livestock. #12) Holders who fail to follow guidelines will be labelled "non-SPCS compliant". #13) A slave upon the attainment of an age which renders it unable to work shall be permitted to stay with families or obtain government assistance if freed. #14) Slaves should have access to suitable medical care at Slave Holders expense. #15) Slave Holders should designate several senior trusted slaves among their herd to assist in slave funeral ceremonies. These ceremonies will be carried out by Amarrian clergy and will focus on the slaves relationship with God. The immediate families of dead slaves will be permitted a three day "off" period for grieving and to attend the funeral if the needs of the Empire do not conflict. While the SPCS recommended 1.0 m3 for transport I recommend at least 6.0m3 per slave (twice their mass) so they have room to pray and live while in transport. But the minimum per SPCS guidelines is still 1.0 m3 but this is now below "humane" standards in my book. I hope that assists you. Archbishop you savages. . . . . Originally by: soldieroffortune 258 "*Eve is about making yourself richer while making the other guy poorer*"
Elizabeth Winton	Posted - 2008.11.22 20:01:00 - [18] Originally by: soldieroffortune 258 Originally by: Archbishop Since you are going to participate for profit instead of the worthy cause of enlightenment I'm not sure what type of advice I can give you specifically as that is not the focus I have as a slave owner. I will say it is beneficial to provide the slaves with at least 3.0 m3 of space to sleep. Over three years ago the SPCS published slave guidelines for basic care and treatment. SPCS GUIDELINES FOR SLAVE CARE Note these are old standards and the SPCS board no longer is active. I will be planning a new set of guidelines shortly and assembling a new board as the current board was dismissed several years ago. A summary of the final guidelines: #1) Transport space should be a minimum of 1.0 m3 of space. Permanent living quarters should be a minimum of 3.0 m3 of space although shift bunking is permitted. #2) Six hours of sleep minimum as well as 1 additional hour on the Sabboth day. #3) Slaves should have at least four hours per day available as time to study the holy scriptures. Actual desk time should be four hours however other forms of education may be substitued including implant or subliminal education and training via loudspeaker during work periods. #4) Two bathing periods each week minimum for common stock slaves. House slaves and office slaves should be permitted more bathing periods if desired by the Slave Holder or by the requirements of the post. #5) Two meals is sufficient but set daily minimum requirements in nutrient levels per Amarrian Consulate of Health standards to support and sustain human life. The food should be of appealing consistency and taste. Food not of appealing taste and appearance but of sufficient nutritional value may be substituted as a disciplinary measure. #6) Each slave should when possible be kept with its family as a slave is more inclined to work hard when happy around its family. The standard should remain when compatible with job duties and the wishes of the Slave Holder. #7) Each slave is expected to work a minimum of 9 hours per day and a maximum of 15 hours per day unless a need to extend is required to serve the needs of the Empire (example: wartime ship construction). A minimum of six hours per day is acceptable on the Sabboth at Slave Holder discretion. #8) No slave exercising acceptable behavior should be denied Vitoc. The witholding of Vitoc is allowed as a control and disciplinary measure. #9) Punishment by Slave Holders is permissible as long as the purpose is just in order to ensure discipline. While permanent injury is not recommended it is up to the Slave Holder to conduct that punishment he deems necessary. #10) No slave should be killed without just cause by the Slave Holder. #11) Slave breeding is permitted under clean conditions which do not permanently harm the livestock. #12) Holders who fail to follow guidelines will be labelled "non-SPCS compliant". #13) A slave upon the attainment of an age which renders it unable to work shall be permitted to stay with families or obtain government assistance if freed. #14) Slaves should have access to suitable medical care at Slave Holders expense. #15) Slave Holders should designate several senior trusted slaves among their herd to assist in slave funeral ceremonies. These ceremonies will be carried out by Amarrian clergy and will focus on the slaves relationship with God. The immediate families of dead slaves will be permitted a three day "off" period for grieving and to attend the funeral if the needs of the Empire do not conflict. While the SPCS recommended 1.0 m3 for transport I recommend at least 6.0m3 per slave (twice their mass) so they have room to pray and live while in transport. But the minimum per SPCS guidelines is still 1.0 m3 but this is now below "humane" standards in my book. I hope that assists you. Archbishop you savages. . . . . I agree.
Alica Wildfire Minmatar Federal Investigations Agency	Posted - 2008.11.22 20:51:00 - [19] The barter with human life for profit keeps me speechless. Some call us Mitar savages and barbarians but to follow barbaric values like honor, freedom, braveness, loyality or love is nothing I am ashamed off. To give the freed slaves the right of revenge on their torturers and slavers when I free a transport is something you may call savage. The piking on of the frozen bodies of the slain slavers on the antennas and ships rams you may call savage, I call it justice and an act of deterrent. There is no enlightening in suppression, torture and work until death. Whoever tells other should go to the next slavemarket and sell himself and spend the money on the Reintegrationproject of the newly freed on Pator Prime. For the rest of you slaverscum out there: wait with your final bill of profit until we found you. Nobody closes a bill on slavery without us Mitar freedom fighters. -- FREEDOM, PUNK & AUTOCANNONS
Drakonus Laerdon Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.11.22 23:35:00 - [20] Originally by: Alica Wildfire The barter with human life for profit keeps me speechless. Some call us Mitar savages and barbarians but to follow barbaric values like honor, freedom, braveness, loyality or love is nothing I am ashamed off. To give the freed slaves the right of revenge on their torturers and slavers when I free a transport is something you may call savage. The piking on of the frozen bodies of the slain slavers on the antennas and ships rams you may call savage, I call it justice and an act of deterrent. There is no enlightening in suppression, torture and work until death. Whoever tells other should go to the next slavemarket and sell himself and spend the money on the Reintegrationproject of the newly freed on Pator Prime. For the rest of you slaverscum out there: wait with your final bill of profit until we found you. Nobody closes a bill on slavery without us Mitar freedom fighters. You "ARE" savages and barbarians. Not to mention bloodthirsty, ignorant sinners. You also ally yourselves with those who celebrate sin and decadence, the Gallente. Fortunately, those Minmatar slaves in our care will not be subjected to your ape-like ways. They will live out their lives in humble service, and those lucky few who become Enlightened by the Grace of God will perhaps have their sins forgiven by the Almighty. It is difficult and tiresome to care for them, but such is our burden as the Chosen of God. --------------- Non Nobis, Domine, Non Nobis, Sed nomini tuo da gloriam.
BloodBird Gallente Duty.	Posted - 2008.11.23 00:33:00 - [21] Originally by: Drakonus Laerdon You "ARE" savages and barbarians. Not to mention bloodthirsty, ignorant sinners. You also ally yourselves with those who celebrate sin and decadence, the Gallente. Fortunately, those Minmatar slaves in our care will not be subjected to your ape-like ways. They will live out their lives in humble service, and those lucky few who become Enlightened by the Grace of God will perhaps have their sins forgiven by the Almighty. It is difficult and tiresome to care for them, but such is our burden as the Chosen of God. Your a sad, ignorant little fool, PIE zealot. As the original inquiry of this tread is a despicable request for how to miss-treat his fellow human as a simple commodity, I see no harm in de-railing the entire discussion even more than it already is, with a few questions. I can easily guess the answers to all of these but here goes. Why would you consider the Minmatar to be 'savage' and 'barbaric'? What actions credit them for these terms? The Gallente 'celebrate' 'sin' and 'decadence', in what way? Your savage methods of 'enlightening' your charges through slavery is a working one because a slave that works all his life, because his Amarrian master says so really earn enlightenment, how? Why would someone that is kidnapped, and denied his basic human rights including freedoms of speech and movement, as well as career choice actually care what you try to force on him? If I started to try and educate people in the glory of god without slavery and on a volunteer-basis, would I be considered a heretic for not following 'proper' procedures? Lastly, why are you so much better than everyone else? After all, you are not slaves, how can you be ‘improved’ in the eyes of god then? I can already guess the answers to the above questions, but it would be in your best interest as a spreader of your faith and belief to answer them regardless. Honestly, I'd have you all written off as a backwards, blind, despicable, self-loving, self-righteous and simply debased people, were it not for a great deal of honest, trustworthy and up-standing people among your kind. Count yourself lucky you have people like Veron Daerth to prove not all Amarr are blind zealot's with a superiority-complex. Sig source
Drakonus Laerdon Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2008.11.23 01:00:00 - [22] Edited by: Drakonus Laerdon on 23/11/2008 01:00:55 The old man raises an eyebrow Struck a nerve, did I? I've been called everything on this summit from oppressive slaver sc.um to slave-loving liberal. Your words leave no wound on me, heathen. Your Gallentean nature betrays you: you see something you don't understand and you attack it. I believe in the definate order of the universe, Mr. Bloodbird. I believe in a Right and Wrong, and I reject other's versions of it if it contradicts Scripture. I am not here to engage in philosophical debate, I've done enough of that over my long lifetime. I care not about your opinions of how I see the world, just remember that I will fight to the death to protect what is Right, and remind the Minmatar terrorists of who they truly are. Good day to you. --------------- Non Nobis, Domine, Non Nobis, Sed nomini tuo da gloriam.
Sophie Starsparrow	Posted - 2008.11.23 02:39:00 - [23] Edited by: Sophie Starsparrow on 23/11/2008 02:41:45 Sophie giggles Terrorists? Minmatar? laughs Do you know how we get our children to bed, eat their vegetables, take a bath when they don't want to? We tell them if they are not good, the Amar will come and take them and make them slaves. And it works. It terrifies them. It's true too. You probably even take pride in the fact that you scare little children. What do you tell yours? That if they are not good, the Minmatar will come and free their slaves? Doesn't sound very effective. Oh, I know! It makes so much sense now. Be good or God will be angry at you. That's why you cling to your God. He is the terrorist.
BloodBird Gallente Duty.	Posted - 2008.11.23 03:30:00 - [24] Originally by: Sophie Starsparrow Be good or God will be angry at you. That's why you cling to your God. He is the terrorist. Out of all the things god could be called, it amuses me to no end that 'terrorist' is very fitting. Good choice, Miss. Starsparrow. Sig source
Sophie Starsparrow	Posted - 2008.11.25 05:24:00 - [25] Thank you. I say the same to you with your decision to join Duty : Good choice Mr. Bloodbird
Seriphyn Inhonores Gallente Noctis Fleet Technologies	Posted - 2008.11.25 14:35:00 - [26] The Amarr trying to enslave the Jovians. Enough said.

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