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Tetsuya Tsyung
Plantains
1
   |
Posted - 2012.04.01 06:56:00 -
[1] - Quote
Ok so im sure youve probably seen this kind of post hundreds of times before so first of all forgive me. I have looked through alot of the posts but a couple questions I have are still un anwsered.
A brief overview, im a fairly new 5 mill SP pilot, my main focus is on mission running and eventually incursions with regards to making ISK. I have recently moved up to a Maelstrom (perhaps a little soon) and find I can solo MOST level 4's, I have agood setup which works for this, and the plan is to probably move up to a Mach for incursioning. So with only 5 mill skillpoints, I have alot of training to do in this regard.
Now for the odd change of scenery, I have started joining corp members on lowsec PvP roams, and whilst they have been great on reccomending fits, I always like to throw it out to a wider audience.
So obviously key factors are I am uber noob at PvP, dont want to spend heaps of ISK (aiming for less than 50mill) and my skills arnt great, I can now fit T2 shield kit, but guns are all still T1 and most core skills at 4.
Probably going for a tackler kind of setup, get in, scramble and web, and stay alive is my main aim. Usually flying with 4-10 corp members it seems.
So Im after a simple Rupture fit for PvP perlease, as far as I can tell armour fit is the only one to look at for this?
425AC's, neuts,
MWD, scramble and web,
with lows being 1600mm armour, gyros etc. Yes?
Rigs id suggest armour hardeners????
And for Cane, it seems to be split between armour tanking and passive shield tank, so really what are the pros and cons of the two?
I currently have a Cane setup for armour tank PvP which im quite happy with, 60-70% resists, 10k armour, my DPS is low though at 250 (T1 guns remember....).
So 425's, mefium and small neut, mids are MWD/AB,
2 webs and scramble,
lows are 1600mm, a gyro or 2, damage control and cpl of armour hardeners
Rigs I have fitted armour hardeners?
Or shield tank would be the same high and mids,
But lows a cpl of Gyros, some shield power relays,
And Core purgers for Rigs
So ill get to the point now (finally....) As a nooblet PvPer, should I go shield tank Cane (my shield skills are better than armour) , Armour tank cane, or for time being go cheaper and stick with armour rupture?????
Thanks for your time (patience) and replies! |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
720
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 07:57:00 -
[2] - Quote
Opinions differ, but at 5 mil SP I would not recommend flying a Hurricane in anything but light PvE at all. At your skills and fittings, you are far underperforming for a Hurricane, and that means that anything that you could take on won't engage you, while those things that do engage you expect you to be far better -- resulting in a horrible death for you.
Stick to the Rupture if you want a heavy ship. It's cheap, reliable, and ugly enough to motivate you to skill up to fly shinier things.
That was all regarding the choices you put out. My personal recommendation? Stick to frigates, particularly the Rifter. Especially with T1 fittings, you can lose them in droves, learning valuable PvP lessons with every encounter with no real ISK cost. They're fast and nimble, which means you don't have to be trapped in unfavorable encounters, and you are also the worst nightmare of some of the bigger ships, which fail at hitting frigates.
Just my 0.02 ISK.
Rifterlings - Small gang lowsec combat corp specializing in frigates and cruisers (all races, not just Rifters!). US Timezone veterans and newbies alike are welcome to join. Come chat in the "we fly rifters" in-game channel. Free fitted frigates for members! |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
515
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 08:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
Ruptures are nothing to sneeze at even if you have low skillpoints.
[Rupture - Armor]
[Lows]
Damage Control I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane I
800mm Reinforced Steel Plates I
Gyrostabilizer I
[Mids]
10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Scrambler I
Stasis Webifier I
[Highs]
Dual 180mm AutoCannon I
Dual 180mm AutoCannon I
Dual 180mm AutoCannon I
Dual 180mm AutoCannon I
Small Nosferatu I
Small Energy Neutralizer I
[Rigs]
(empty)
(empty)
(empty)
[Drones]
1x Valkyrie I
4x Warrior I
Notes: Dirt cheap and everything should fit (if it doesn't, train up the skill "Electronics"). Fit T2 when you can, meta equipment when you can't, neither if you want to keep things "dirt cheap." No matter what, this ship eats most frigates alive.
There is also this...
[Rupture - Shield]
[Lows]
Damage Control I
Gyrostablizer I
Gyrostablizer I
Tracking Enhancer I
Tracking Enhancer I
[Mids]
10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Scrambler I
Large Shield Extender I
[Highs]
220mm AutoCannon I
220mm AutoCannon I
220mm AutoCannon I
220mm AutoCannon I
Small Nosferatu I
Small Energy Neutralizer I
[Rigs]
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
(empty)
(empty)
[Drones]
1x Valkyrie I
4x Warrior I
Notes: Packs a fair bit more punch that the armor version, but also has far less EHP. Use speed to your advantage and try to stay outside of the 10km "zone of death." The rig is also fairly cheap (only a couple hundred thousand ISK).
edit:
Quote:lows a cpl of Gyros, some shield power relays,
And Core purgers for Rigs
Pro-tips:
-never passive tank your PvP ship. Unless you can get your recharge rate into the mid to upper hundreds (with some decent resistances) the incoming DPS you will experience in a PvP fight will almost always overwhelm your defenses. Plus passive shield tanking gimps your ship overall.
- mobility is always key as you want to get into range before the other guy does. It also can help you GTFO if the guy brings in "friends"
- Try to find the right balance of "tank" and "gank" that you feel most comfortable with. Going too far into the "tank" end of things leaves you with mediocre damage while being too "ganky" will often leave you with too poor a defense to see out the end of an engagement.
"Just because I seem like an idiot, doesn't mean I am one."
~Unknown |
Tetsuya Tsyung
Plantains
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 15:54:00 -
[4] - Quote
Thanks for advice guys. Id say I was barking down the right tree, just possibly running before I can walk.
From what you say I think ill stick with the armour tanking for PvP, stick with a frigate for a few more runs, move up to Rupture, then up to Cane.
So im guessing Rifter is prob the simplest choice? Best way to fit it? |
Xi 'xar
Mise en Abyme
17
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 16:04:00 -
[5] - Quote
Take a look at www.rifterdrifter.com - lots of rifter fits on there that are great.
One thing to bear in mind - some of the Meta 2 - 4 items can be a lot better than the T1 versions and only be slightly less effective than T2, whilst still costing a lot less.
Some more reading: http://www.evealtruist.com/search/label/know%20your%20enemy
http://reduplication.wordpress.com/category/explore-low-sec/
http://reduplication.wordpress.com/category/live-low-sec/
http://mrsnypes.blogspot.com/2010/07/burnt-lands.html
|
Ottersmacker
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
126
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 18:54:00 -
[6] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:
[Mids]
10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Scrambler I
Large Shield Extender I
try to stay outside of the 10km "zone of death."
Pretty sure you meant "Warp Disruptor" on that one then m8.
(also projectile rigs are very cheap and you can probably squeeze 425mm AC-s on it)
The Order of the Falcon or Hin +ˇslenska f+ílkaor+¦a is a national Order of Iceland |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
515
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 21:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ottersmacker wrote:ShahFluffers wrote:
[Mids]
10MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Scrambler I
Large Shield Extender I
try to stay outside of the 10km "zone of death."
Pretty sure you meant "Warp Disruptor" on that one then m8. (also projectile rigs are very cheap and you can probably squeeze 425mm AC-s on it)
For the sake of newbies looking at this thread, I decided to make those ruptures using the "no skills" option in EFT and keep them "dirt cheap" (the hull is only 7-8 million plus 1 million for all the mods... "cheap" rigs would add on a couple hundred thousand per)
Plus dual 180s and 220s track WAY better than the 425s (again, people browsing for fits here have minimal skill support... best to go with weapons that have inherently better tracking to compensate).
As for the disruptor vs. scrambler... it can go either way for different reasons. Warp Disruptors allow you to point at range and the Rupture is more than capable of keeping up with most ships. However, armor-fit Ruptures are quite "fat" and you do want to use that stasis web to your advantage. In which case, better go use a warp scrambler and completely shut down the other ship's MWD.
"Just because I seem like an idiot, doesn't mean I am one."
~Unknown |
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
165
|
Posted - 2012.04.01 23:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
As a general rule, you shouldn't use flat T1 mods. You can get meta 1-3 mods for very little ISK (often times less than or barely more than flat t1) which are generally better.
Quote:Opinions differ, but at 5 mil SP I would not recommend flying a Hurricane in anything but light PvE at all. At your skills and fittings, you are far underperforming for a Hurricane, and that means that anything that you could take on won't engage you, while those things that do engage you expect you to be far better -- resulting in a horrible death for you.
I don't think 5 mil SP, if focused appropriately, is necessarily too little to be flying a cane. However, canes are significantly more expensive than ruptures and so it's probably not worthwhile unless he has infinite money for some reason. |
Ottersmacker
Genos Occidere
HYDRA RELOADED
126
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 16:39:00 -
[9] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:it can go either way
No it shouldn't in the case of what I quoted (the shield fit). You see, what you said was controversial - you correctly mention the "10km zone of death", and yet force the pilot into that range by gimping the fit with a scrambler (7.5-9km). Does not compute. So it needs a disruptor, lest it always die whenever committing within scram range because it has paper hp, or always miss out on the kill when staying out of scram range because of no tackle.
Obviously scram is fine and even preferred for the armor fit (and the pitiful falloff of the smaller guns doesn't hurt either). As for the tracking - regardless of SP - EVE isn't "orbit at distance" and the sooner people learn it, the better.)
The Order of the Falcon or Hin +ˇslenska f+ílkaor+¦a is a national Order of Iceland |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
518
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 18:14:00 -
[10] - Quote
Ottersmacker wrote:ShahFluffers wrote:it can go either way No it shouldn't in the case of what I quoted (the shield fit). You see, what you said was controversial - you correctly mention the "10km zone of death", and yet force the pilot into that range by gimping the fit with a scrambler (7.5-9km). Does not compute. So it needs a disruptor, lest it always die whenever committing within scram range because it has paper hp, or always miss out on the kill when staying out of scram range because of no tackle. Obviously scram is fine and even preferred for the armor fit (and the pitiful falloff of the smaller guns doesn't hurt either). As for the tracking - regardless of SP - EVE isn't "orbit at distance" and the sooner people learn it, the better.)
Oh damn... didn't look close enough. Thought you were referring to the armor one. DERP! Make the necessary alterations.
"Just because I seem like an idiot, doesn't mean I am one."
~Unknown |
Jouron
Hadon Shipping
28
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 21:00:00 -
[11] - Quote
If your in a gang ask if they want Armor or shield. Tank accordingly.
If your soloing definetly go with the Shield rupture. Dont think it can do much? take a look at EVE is Easy's solo rupture video.
The rupture is like the poor mans vagabond. It can be deadly if you pick your fights right. |
Lost Greybeard
Fenrir's Dogs of War
Union 0f Revolution
4
|
Posted - 2012.04.02 23:06:00 -
[12] - Quote
Ottersmacker wrote:ShahFluffers wrote:it can go either way Obviously scram is fine and even preferred for the armor fit (and the pitiful falloff of the smaller guns doesn't hurt either). As for the tracking - regardless of SP - EVE isn't "orbit at distance" and the sooner people learn it, the better.)
To be fair, if you pick an orbital path that keeps you perpendicular to most everything shooting you in a tight enough formation it actually works pretty well. Actually getting in close enough to click that orbit button without doing something dumb that drops your angular to zero is a harder problem, though. |
Raekek
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
1
|
Posted - 2012.04.03 14:32:00 -
[13] - Quote
Tetsuya Tsyung wrote:Thanks for advice guys. Id say I was barking down the right tree, just possibly running before I can walk.
From what you say I think ill stick with the armour tanking for PvP, stick with a frigate for a few more runs, move up to Rupture, then up to Cane.
So im guessing Rifter is prob the simplest choice? Best way to fit it?
Yes rifter. Keep in mind only fly what you can afford to lose, especially in PvP there is a guaranteed chance that you WILL lose your ship. I recommend moving up to the thrasher after that. It's almost the perfect ship when considering price vs. value and you will have a lot of fun flying it.
Having more SP does not obligate you to get a bigger ship. Plenty of veteran players still fly a rifter / thrasher.
This fit does not require rigs but you might want to get them when you have more isk / skills. I recommend getting the collision accelerator though because it is pretty cheap.
[Thrasher - Armor]
[Lows]
Damage Control I
400mm Reinforced Steel Plates I
[Mids]
1MN MicroWarpdrive I
Warp Scrambler I
Stasis Webifier I
[Highs]
150mm Light AutoCannon I
150mm Light AutoCannon I
150mm Light AutoCannon I
150mm Light AutoCannon I
150mm Light AutoCannon I
150mm Light AutoCannon I
150mm Light AutoCannon I
Rocket Launcher I
[Rigs]
Small Projectile Collision Accelerator I
Small Trimark Armor Pump I
Small Trimark Armor Pump I
|
Uppsy Daisy
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
98
|
Posted - 2012.04.04 20:25:00 -
[14] - Quote
The most popular pvp hurricane fittings are here: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1068991#post1068991
Make T2 guns a priority. Barrage ammo is a must be fly minmatar effectively
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