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Daan Sai Polytrope	Posted - 2008.10.30 04:37:00 - [31] Edited by: Daan Sai on 30/10/2008 04:38:11 I still think allowing a small spread in MWD speeds (10-15%, say from base 500% up to ~550/575% max) would give some cool factor back to faction modules without breaking the speed bank. Cap penalty and sig radius bonuses are boring, especially if you are already cap stable with the plain modules. The uniformity of the speed bonus accross all MWDs is a bit meh PS: some of us race, and couldn't care less about sig radii or cap penalties, (as we are already OK with the cap penalties now)
Bronson Hughes ADVANCED Combat and Engineering	Posted - 2008.10.30 15:37:00 - [32] Originally by: Daan Sai Edited by: Daan Sai on 30/10/2008 04:38:11 I still think allowing a small spread in MWD speeds (10-15%, say from base 500% up to ~550/575% max) would give some cool factor back to faction modules without breaking the speed bank. I agree that there should be some variation; have some MWDs keep the default cap and sig radius penalties in exchange for a slightly higher speed boost. 550% max seems reasonable. Also, did anyone else notice the pre-emptive nerf to AB-ceptors? Their sig radius reduction bonus got changed to a MWD sig radius penalty reduction; it looks like they'll have a smaller sig with a MWD than before, but bigger than before with an AB. Granted, they'll still be bloody hard to track up close and personal with an AB running, but it won't be impossible. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne
Opertone Caldari SIEGE. United Legion	Posted - 2008.10.30 18:31:00 - [33] transport ships occator new - bonus: Gallente Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo capacity per level; +5% velocity per level Transport Ships Skill Bonus: -5% armor repairer duration per level; -5% bonus to power requirements of armor plates Role Bonus +2 warp strength TQ - bonus: Gallente Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo +5% velocity, 15% shield and armor kinetic, 10% shield and armor thermal Transport Ships Skill Bonus: -5% armor repairer duration, -5% armor repairer cap need viator new - bonus: Gallente Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo capacity per level; +5% velocity per level Transport Ships Skill Bonus: -5% armor repairer duration per level; -10% bonus to cpu need of covert ops cloaks Role Bonus: can fit covert ops cloaks bustard new - bonus: Caldari Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo capacity per level +5% velocity per level Transport Ships Skill Bonus: +5% shield booster boost amount -5% bonus to power requirements of shield extenders Role Bonus: +2 warp strength TQ - bonus: Caldari Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo +5% velocity, 15% shield and armor thermal resist., 10% shield and armor kinetic resist. per level Transport Ships Skill Bonus: +10% shield booster boost amount crane Caldari Industrial Skill Bonus: +5% cargo capacity per level; +5% velocity per level Transport Ships Skill Bonus: +5% shield booster boost amount; -10% bonus to cpu need of covert ops cloaks Role Bonus: can fit covert ops cloaks
Lili Lu Purveyors of Uber Research Valuables and Ships	Posted - 2008.10.30 19:55:00 - [34] The Vengeance looks too sluggish to be using rockets. Suffering from blaster ship syndrome. In general looks like Amarr ships becoming bricks without the extreme range Caldari has always enjoyed to compensate for formerly being the bricks.
Elea Electronica Gallente Dragon Enterprises	Posted - 2008.10.30 22:33:00 - [35] Edited by: Elea Electronica on 30/10/2008 22:35:45 Transport Ships Skill Bonus: -5% armor repairer duration per level on Viator/Occator are actually BUGT it also reduce the repairing ammount by 5% per level. Or these ships getting a role penalty what is atm not visible in the description. But with good skills and rig¦s fittet a Occator can fit a 1600mm plate ending up at 13220 Armor HP (not take in any Armor Implants, Boosters or T2 rig¦s).
BadMessage Minmatar	Posted - 2008.11.01 21:44:00 - [36] Thanks Opertone! I have been experiencing some difficulties getting on the Sisi server.
Klandi Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.11.01 23:03:00 - [37] I would like to echo my thanks to Opertone on releasing this info. I will not go on to Sisi as it is not REALLY a test server if you can't test out ships you would like to fly or experience the effect of skills at lvl5. I have argued in the past that this would be an advantageous move - creating a desire to fly a particular ship or attain a particular lvl - but it got poo-pooed by GMs.
Mikal Drey Minmatar ORIGIN SYSTEMS Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.02 07:19:00 - [38] Originally by: Klandi I would like to echo my thanks to Opertone on releasing this info. I will not go on to Sisi as it is not REALLY a test server if you can't test out ships you would like to fly or experience the effect of skills at lvl5. I have argued in the past that this would be an advantageous move - creating a desire to fly a particular ship or attain a particular lvl - but it got poo-pooed by GMs. there is other people who would prefer regular mirrors there are other people who would prefer to test their ships at their current levels there are others who actually test out non combat and look at interfaces/UI/char sheet developments/missions etc etc the way SISI is currently run by CCP seems to work well with minor fustrations. one of the big fustrations is lack of information to whats been changed or "in testing" sooooooooooooooooooo props to the OP for providing some :) o7
Mag's MASS	Posted - 2008.11.02 10:41:00 - [39] Originally by: Daan Sai The uniformity of the speed bonus accross all MWDs is a bit meh Indeed. Lets face it, why would you buy a faction MWD? So you get a little more cap, wow. Mag's Originally by: Avernus One of these days, the realization that MASS is no longer significant will catch up with you.
Delichon The First Foundation SOLAR FLEET	Posted - 2008.11.02 11:31:00 - [40] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Yes it will be - use heavy missiles to engage cruisers. Cruise missiles are snipe weapon against BS. Two questions 1) Do you use it as one in regular fleet battles (50+ fleet-BS against 50+ fleet-BS)? 2) Do you intend to use it as one after the patch in regular fleet battles? ------------------------------------------ All nerfs are meant to hurt you personally. They will be nerfing you directly next. EVE A new game every 6 months. (c) Atomos Darksun
Roemy Schneider BINFORD	Posted - 2008.11.02 12:38:00 - [41] Originally by: Mag's Originally by: Daan Sai The uniformity of the speed bonus accross all MWDs is a bit meh Indeed. Lets face it, why would you buy a faction MWD? So you get a little more cap, wow. ... and thus cap recharge and so on... if you go for MWD anyways. i dont intend to. but i hate curses nonetheless - putting the gist back into logistics
Chssmius Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.11.03 04:37:00 - [42] Originally by: Opertone crow new - mass 999,000 kg, inertia 2.17 TQ - mass 1,000,000 kg, inertia 3.1 Caldari Frigate Skill Bonus: 10% bonus to Kinetic Missile damage per level Interceptor Skill Bonus: 15% reduction in MicroWarpdrive signature radius penalty and 10% bonus to Missile Velocity per level raptor new - mass 1,075,000 kg, inertia 2.17 TQ - mass 1,075,000 kg, inertia 3.1 Caldari Frigate Skill Bonus: 5% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret Damage and 10% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret optimal range per level Interceptor Skill Bonus: 15% reduction in MicroWarpdrive signature radius penalty and 5% bonus to Warp Scrambler and Warp Disruptor range per level Where is the role bonus? I am assuming it was omitted.... I think I am dreading the changes this next patch will bring. Sure, the raptor and other previously "less than" useful ships may be more useful. Sure, some WAY overused ships will get hit with the nerf bat. Sure, frigates and crusiers may be more useful in general. But, why nerf the hell out of many battleship, missiles, blasters, AC, and many of the T2 ships? It seems like CCP is throwing the baby out with the bathwater. The current mechanics on TQ largely work and work well. The exceptions are a broad spectrum bias toward large, high investment, expensive ships(with makes sense from a market standpoint), the rare case of ships that can fit setups which are obviously overpowered in current mechanics, and ships/ship classes searching for a role(most of the AF class). The overall speed nerf combined with the significant buff to speed related damage reduction makes me cringe to think of how the battle field with be shaped in the future. Originally by: Opertone 1 MN Microwarpdrive II new - max speed bonus 500%, capacitor penalty -17 % TQ - max speed bonus 550%, capacitor penalty -25 % 1 MN gistii A-type Microwarpdrive new - max speed bonus 500%, capacitor penalty -3%, signature penalty 422 % TQ - max speed bonus 661 %, capacitor penalty -25 %, signature penalty 661 % to be continued As I understand it, MWDs will also stop working when pointed by a scram or warp disruptor. IMO, this will make MWDs best for snipers trying to maintain range(good for defense or well planed attacks), but will break close in combat conventions. Inside of about 30km an AB will be more reliable, easier to fit, less cap hungry, with no sig penalty, and (after the speed changes) may very well let someone passive tank a ship class or two higher(provided they don't get triple painted or double webbed). Granted, currently ABs are(from my experience used in PvP) exclusively to move a BS or BC to a gate in less than a minute, or by suicide frigates that can't fit a MWD for whatever reason. But I am not sure this change is really for the better, as any ship that is intended to use a MWD(all intys, several T1 and most T2 cruisers) automatically have to face what are essentially +20km webs(more with range bonuses and faction points). Am I mistaken in these assessments?
dojocan81	Posted - 2008.11.03 06:40:00 - [43] Originally by: Chssmius As I understand it, MWDs will also stop working when pointed by a scram or warp disruptor. Am I mistaken in these assessments? Only warp Scramblers are going to disable MWD's, not Disruptors
Virgo I'Platonicus Ex Eventus Corpi	Posted - 2008.11.04 18:33:00 - [44] any updates to the list? <3
Skar Rynn	Posted - 2008.11.04 18:53:00 - [45] speaking as a caldari whos ALWAYS been big fat and slow compared to other races, we'll figure out the changes as usual and solemly weep in the ashes of what could have been rofl. anyway because the crane can fit the cov ops cloak now does that also mean that it can warp while cloaked??
Ezekiel Sulastin Gallente Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.11.04 18:53:00 - [46] Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 04/11/2008 18:57:29 Even CCP isn't dumb enough to have the 24 km point turn off MWDs. That might actually nerf something other than blasters into the ground, not to mention making it impossible to come up with any good argument that they aren't useless. On a side note, does anyone know how the Thorax MWD capacitor bonus works with the new MWD bolloxery? As it stands now, it takes a flat 5% off the penalty for each rank of cruiser - so at cruiser I, the penalty is 20% not 25%, and at Cruiser V the penalty is 0%. Obviously, the <25% penalty MWDs can break this - would the 'rax actually get MORE capacitor from fitting a better MWD? (Not that I plan on ever using the thing again, but I want to see if CCP screwed something ELSE up ) ----
MyOwnSling Gallente RONA Corporation RONA Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.04 19:02:00 - [47] Originally by: Ezekiel Sulastin Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 04/11/2008 18:57:29 Even CCP isn't dumb enough to have the 24 km point turn off MWDs. That might actually nerf something other than blasters into the ground, not to mention making it impossible to come up with any good argument that they aren't useless. On a side note, does anyone know how the Thorax MWD capacitor bonus works with the new MWD bolloxery? As it stands now, it takes a flat 5% off the penalty for each rank of cruiser - so at cruiser I, the penalty is 20% not 25%, and at Cruiser V the penalty is 0%. Obviously, the <25% penalty MWDs can break this - would the 'rax actually get MORE capacitor from fitting a better MWD? (Not that I plan on ever using the thing again, but I want to see if CCP screwed something ELSE up ) In my experience, you never got -0% cap at lvl5 cruiser. The bonus is not 5 percentage points, it is 5% improvment upon the 25% penalty. ------------- Stop whining. Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face...
Ezekiel Sulastin Gallente Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.11.04 19:10:00 - [48] Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 04/11/2008 19:09:57 Originally by: MyOwnSling In my experience, you never got -0% cap at lvl5 cruiser. The bonus is not 5 percentage points, it is 5% improvment upon the 25% penalty. Incorrect. To confirm that I was not misreading it, I even went to the trouble of removing the MWD from my Thorax - 1718 cap with, 1718 cap without. It is an absolute subtraction, rather than relative.
Kalintos Tyl Minmatar	Posted - 2008.11.04 19:10:00 - [49] when it first come it were giving ship more cap dunno how it is now.
MyOwnSling Gallente RONA Corporation RONA Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.04 19:29:00 - [50] Originally by: Ezekiel Sulastin Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 04/11/2008 19:09:57 Originally by: MyOwnSling In my experience, you never got -0% cap at lvl5 cruiser. The bonus is not 5 percentage points, it is 5% improvment upon the 25% penalty. Incorrect. To confirm that I was not misreading it, I even went to the trouble of removing the MWD from my Thorax - 1718 cap with, 1718 cap without. It is an absolute subtraction, rather than relative. That's odd because my deimos gets a reduction when I fit a MWD on it. Haven't checked in a while though. ------------- Stop whining. Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face...
Davik Rendar Open All Hours	Posted - 2008.11.04 23:28:00 - [51] The Rax and Deimos get a Cap bonus when you fit a named/T2 MWD. Here's a screenshot of a rax fitted with a named MWD (sorry cant fit a T2) with Gal Cruiser 5. Rax MWD Bonus As you can see the cap bonus is +6%.
Ezekiel Sulastin Gallente Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.11.05 00:19:00 - [52] Edited by: Ezekiel Sulastin on 05/11/2008 00:18:54 Originally by: Davik Rendar The Rax and Deimos get a Cap bonus when you fit a named/T2 MWD. Here's a screenshot of a rax fitted with a named MWD (sorry cant fit a T2) with Gal Cruiser 5. Rax MWD Bonus As you can see the cap bonus is +6%. @: I give it a day on TQ before the devs 'fix' it -.- why did I open my mouth ._.
StainLessStealRat Space Oddysey Pupule 'Ohana	Posted - 2008.11.05 06:27:00 - [53] Originally by: Deva Blackfire Originally by: TZeer And BTW, that 500 DPS you have, will only be 200 DPS, max, when the cruiser is doing 200m/s.... then you can start adding resists... and before you know it the cruiser is tanking your cruise missiles... Yes it will be - use heavy missiles to engage cruisers. Cruise missiles are snipe weapon against BS. If cruise are for snipe against BS then they need way more dps as even in a small/ Mid sized fleet ie 4-7 BS when the target pops half the DPS will be in mid flight when the target has popped plus the initial delay in DPS need to be compinsated by DPS IMO. Bit off topic but in the gangs im in snipe Ravens are given the role of anti HAC/HIC due to there short commings compared too Lasers/rails against fast changing primarys,so this is really a heavy blow to Raven pilots who already feel like tourist who entered the wrong door into the bull ring instead of the stands.

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