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PG balance problems with Tier 3 BS.

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Dantes Revenge Caldari	Posted - 2008.11.03 06:52:00 - [1] While sifting through the skill sets, I have noticed that most of the skills give bonuses to CPU or Cap. This leaves us with problems of PG lack when fitting most bigger ships. At first, I thought maybe a skill set would be nice to reduce the PG requirement of turrets until I did a test. When I did a test with all skills at lvl5 using the Tier3 battleships. Abaddon - 8x Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I: Required PG 27000: Available 26250 All weapons that use 3750 or higher are not possible. This means T2 Tachyon Beam Lasers are not possible either. This knocks out all 6 of the Tachyon variants of lasers including the T2. Rokh - 8x 425mm Railgun II: Required PG 18900: Available 18750 This is the only one that can't be fitted. Hyperion - No issues with Blasters or rails. Maelstrom - No issues with a full rack of any Autocannons or Howitzers. Loads of PG left after a full rack of autocannons is fitted. It appears that the laser users are being gimped. The best battleship can't even fit a full rack of a third of the list of available Beam lasers, Caldari can't fit a full rack of one of thier available Railguns. That's with nothing else fitted as well! Galente and Minmatar can fit anything with plenty of PG left over. Can we have a balance to allow us to fit all the weapons in the list? It seems a bit pointless to have nearly a third of our available weapons unavailable due to PG requirements. Even the price of these weapons reflects their popularity and ATM, they are the cheapest you can buy, maybe because it pointless to try to fit them. Giving Caldari a railgun boat and then making the T2 railguns use so much PG that they can't be fitted doesn't make sense either. A bit of balancing here please since Two of the races can use every weapon in their list, even the T2 weapons that Caldari can't use with PG to spare. While Amarr can't even use a full third of their T1 weapons. -- There's a simple difference between kinky and perverted. Kinky is using a feather to get her in the mood. Perverted is using the whole chicken.
Washell Olivaw	Posted - 2008.11.03 08:05:00 - [2] Balance looks at the whole picture, not one single stat. Originally by: Signature Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
Sigras	Posted - 2008.11.03 09:03:00 - [3] i see that the caldari can use power diagnostic systems to augment their grid, but it does stand to wonder why the tacyons are in the game if they're unuseable
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2008.11.03 09:17:00 - [4] Originally by: Sigras i see that the caldari can use power diagnostic systems to augment their grid, but it does stand to wonder why the tacyons are in the game if they're unuseable Pure gank with 2 T2 RCUs allows for T2 tachyons on an abaddon, but forget about fitting plates or tank at that point, you even need one RCU to fit a full rank of Mega Beam IIs. (Tachyons are oversized guns, so should be hard to fit imho) But a general reduction in the grid needs of Beam Lasers would be most welcome, not to the point where packing a full rank of T2 tachyons is easy ofcourse, but a full rack of T2 Mega Beams should be possible without fitting mods.
Hesod Adee Federal Defence Union	Posted - 2008.11.03 09:42:00 - [5] Edited by: Hesod Adee on 03/11/2008 09:43:32 Originally by: Dantes Revenge Abaddon - 8x Tachyon Modulated Energy Beam I: Required PG 27000: Available 26250 All weapons that use 3750 or higher are not possible. This means T2 Tachyon Beam Lasers are not possible either. This knocks out all 6 of the Tachyon variants of lasers including the T2. Throw in a reactor control 1 and it now has 28875 grid. Quote: Rokh - 8x 425mm Railgun II: Required PG 18900: Available 18750 This is the only one that can't be fitted. Available with a single reactor control 1 - 20625 Aren't there also some implants that increase your ships powergrid ? I don't understand much about balance, but I understand that it looks at the entire setup, not just one or two stats. Your complaint was that the guns couldn't be fitted, yet they can be if your willing to use a low slot and/or implants. So I don't see a problem. ---------------------------------------------- I support skill queues.
Dantes Revenge Caldari	Posted - 2008.11.03 18:10:00 - [6] Originally by: Meiyang Lee Originally by: Sigras i see that the caldari can use power diagnostic systems to augment their grid, but it does stand to wonder why the tacyons are in the game if they're unuseable Pure gank with 2 T2 RCUs allows for T2 tachyons on an abaddon, but forget about fitting plates or tank at that point, you even need one RCU to fit a full rank of Mega Beam IIs. (Tachyons are oversized guns, so should be hard to fit imho) But a general reduction in the grid needs of Beam Lasers would be most welcome, not to the point where packing a full rank of T2 tachyons is easy ofcourse, but a full rack of T2 Mega Beams should be possible without fitting mods. But that's my whole point. Why can Galente and Minmatar fit every type of gun and still have a perfect tank. Caldari have the better situation since they shield tank and the RCU doesn't affect it. Amarr have to use lows to tank, so fitting any RCU's gimps their tank. Having to waste 2 lows gimps the tank far enough that it makes the setup pointless, yeah, you have nice DPS but you won't last long enough for it to be useful to you. Ultimately, what's the point in having the Tachyons in the game to start with if the best BS can't even fit them? You don't need RCU to fit Mega beam II's, even with my skills, I can fit a full rack with nearly 4K PG to spare. -- There's a simple difference between kinky and perverted. Kinky is using a feather to get her in the mood. Perverted is using the whole chicken.
Laechyd Eldgorn Caldari Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.11.03 19:01:00 - [7] dont use beams Also I want to whine that my rokh doesn't have enough capacitor to use blasters.
Dantes Revenge Caldari	Posted - 2008.11.04 07:56:00 - [8] Edited by: Dantes Revenge on 04/11/2008 07:56:57 Originally by: Laechyd Eldgorn dont use beams Also I want to whine that my rokh doesn't have enough capacitor to use blasters. Great idea, now maybe you can propose a method of using MWD in missions so we can get close enough to use the pulse lasers. Tachyon beam lasers are an Amarr weapon that Amarr ships can't fit. Your Rokh doesn't have the cap to use blasters because they are not a Caldari weapon If you're going to post a negative response, at least have the curtesy to use a reasonable arguement. I say again, what is the point of a range of Amarr weapons that the top Amarr BS can't fit? They may as well be removed from the game. -- There's a simple difference between kinky and perverted. Kinky is using a feather to get her in the mood. Perverted is using the whole chicken.
Evan Batarr	Posted - 2008.11.04 08:28:00 - [9] Edited by: Evan Batarr on 04/11/2008 08:28:53 Originally by: Dantes Revenge Edited by: Dantes Revenge on 04/11/2008 07:56:57 Originally by: Laechyd Eldgorn dont use beams Also I want to whine that my rokh doesn't have enough capacitor to use blasters. Great idea, now maybe you can propose a method of using MWD in missions so we can get close enough to use the pulse lasers. Tachyon beam lasers are an Amarr weapon that Amarr ships can't fit. Your Rokh doesn't have the cap to use blasters because they are not a Caldari weapon If you're going to post a negative response, at least have the curtesy to use a reasonable arguement. I say again, what is the point of a range of Amarr weapons that the top Amarr BS can't fit? They may as well be removed from the game. Well, they can - but at a COST! Period. Maybe you should start to compare the DPS of the weapons you're talking about and while doing so not forget that Laser weapons don't use Ammo (so no reload time = more DPS)! As others already pointed out it makes absolutely NO sense to just look if a Tier 3 Bs can fit a full rack of the biggest racial weapons. What if I tell you that although a Maelstrom can fit a full Rack of 1400mm T2 it underperforms to even an Apoc if used as a Long Range Fleet BS?? And after the next patch it will be completely useless as Fleet BS (Tempest and Typh are already) while all other races still have a Sniper. THAT is unbalanced!

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