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Researcher Qual
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Posted - 2008.11.21 15:14:00 -
[1]
I'm about 45 days out from being able to fly an Orca and i've been watching the market and have so far seen prices that range from 800 mill to 1.5 bill.
Obviously, this is to be expected immediately after it was released as people are prepared to both charge AND pay way over the odds to get a new toy/status symbol but I'm curious as to where people think the price will be when it stabilizes (in 2 weeks, 2 months, whenever that is).
As an addendum, does someone know what's the actual mineral/component cost of building an Orca?
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Xonox Galatorg
Gallente
Pulsar Combat Supplies
Alternative Realities
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Posted - 2008.11.21 15:17:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Xonox Galatorg on 21/11/2008 15:21:21
My guess is 450-500mil. On the low end probably around 420mil.
EDIT: The actual material cost is something like 370mil. However tritanium prices have been going up quite a bit and I don't have my spreadsheet in front of me right now to see what kind of material cost it is based on my current mineral prices. Of course your material price will depend on what kind of price you can get your minerals for.
-Xonox
Pulsar Combat Supplies, Director of Production and POS |
Karl Mattar
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
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Posted - 2008.11.21 15:34:00 -
[3]
The Orca blog (shortly before release) said they expected sale pricing to settle at around 400 million.
I'm within a few days of being able to fly one, but I'm not training the last skill until the pricing drops significantly. I don't need one that bad, and the release pricing is just too high.
This is like when there was a Hulk monopoly and we were all paying half a billion for the hull alone. There are just a few people selling them right now, and they are making you pay a 100-200% markup just for the privilege of buying it.
Give it sometime, and you'll save a ****ton of ISK. |
Researcher Qual
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Posted - 2008.11.21 15:36:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Researcher Qual on 21/11/2008 15:36:40
thank you both for your replies :)
 Originally by: Karl Mattar
Give it sometime, and you'll save a ****ton of ISK.
precisely my thought, thank you for confirming that.
doesn't hurt me to wait, as i won't be using it for mining anyway, but for a mobile exploration base :)
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2008.11.21 15:44:00 -
[5]
Recently did a small spreadsheet with ME 0 values. Used the Jita Mineral Index for my prices. Roughly 450m in mineral costs. This means that 700 - 800m is a very fair price for an Orca.
Why?
ROI on bpo's. ROI for gathering 50m+ trit. ROI on factory times and the logistic train on production. ROI on skill training for the building thereof.
Enjoy.
PS: I don't make, sell or buy/flip Orcas.
To Shar -verb:
1 - To say what you mean.
2 - To say what it means.
3 - To say something mean. |
Arthor Dark
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Posted - 2008.11.21 15:59:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Recently did a small spreadsheet with ME 0 values. Used the Jita Mineral Index for my prices. Roughly 450m in mineral costs. This means that 700 - 800m is a very fair price for an Orca.
Why?
ROI on bpo's. ROI for gathering 50m+ trit. ROI on factory times and the logistic train on production. ROI on skill training for the building thereof.
Enjoy.
PS: I don't make, sell or buy/flip Orcas.
Very fair for the manufacturers, but not for the buyers. I anticipate that Orcas would sell for alot less than 700m.
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Lord Fitz
Project Amargosa
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Posted - 2008.11.21 15:59:00 -
[7]
Since the blog was written they added 4 more parts to it (about 30m worth). also mineral prices have gone up. So about 450m to build. The components alone are selling for 550-700m at the moment though so. Actual assembly cost of an Orca, if you were to build one just buying an Orca BPO would be 700m.
Over time of course they are and will come down, but expect 500m ish for quite a while. Even though a lot of BPOs were bought, not many have the components to keep them all in production, and below about 50m/orca profit, they are simply not worth the effort to gather the materials / build components, since other things become more profitable at that point.
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░▒▓ ORCAs Available Early and Cheap ▓▒░ |
Lord Fitz
Project Amargosa
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Posted - 2008.11.21 16:01:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Arthor Dark
Very fair for the manufacturers, but not for the buyers. I anticipate that Orcas would sell for alot less than 700m.
Yes, fair for the buyers too.
If people stopped buying any ships at all, the material cost would go down and then so would the cost.
If you think it's unfair for the buyers, become a manufacturer, you'll quickly learn that capitals aren't quite as easy to build your own as other ships, thus the reason for the premium. (most buyers would better spend that time actually mining).
_____________________________
░▒▓ ORCAs Available Early and Cheap ▓▒░ |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2008.11.21 16:30:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Arthor Dark
Very fair for the manufacturers, but not for the buyers. I anticipate that Orcas would sell for alot less than 700m.
I think the last forum ban I got was for calling someone a moron. So I'm not going to call you a moron. Really, I'm not calling you a moron at all. |
Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2008.11.21 16:30:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Lord Fitz
Originally by: Arthor Dark
Very fair for the manufacturers, but not for the buyers. I anticipate that Orcas would sell for alot less than 700m.
Yes, fair for the buyers too.
If people stopped buying any ships at all, the material cost would go down and then so would the cost.
If you think it's unfair for the buyers, become a manufacturer, you'll quickly learn that capitals aren't quite as easy to build your own as other ships, thus the reason for the premium. (most buyers would better spend that time actually mining).
Which is why even with the glut in the capital market they can still garner upwards of a 20% margin. The logistics of them can be literally nightmares.
A single freighter build is close to 1 1/2 freighter full of noncompressed minerals for instance.
/i know they call it a sub-capital, but it uses nothing but cap parts... that makes it a capital in my book |
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Karl Mattar
Caldari Independent Navy Reserve
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Posted - 2008.11.21 16:32:00 -
[11]
Whenever there is a new ship available that I want, I usually wait about three months before purchasing to see where pricing stabilizes. Hopefully by then a happy medium in the market has been reached.
On one hand, there's a lot of interest right now. Many people are looking at this ship as a solution to a variety of logistical issues, and it is. Long-term, however, just as many may find that it doesn't meet their needs in the exact way they anticipated. There may be a certain amount of resale of "lightly used" Orcas.
Additionally, mining ships traditionally have a fairly low rate of loss. Exceptions occur, like the recent Jihad against mining vessels, but over all mining ships are used in a fairly risk-adverse manner that tends to make a lower turnover rate than combat ships. This will also serve the buyer in the long term as supply will tend to outweigh demand. Any time you have a ship that people can make incredible profit margins on, you need a steady demand to keep the sales going.
As my esteemed colleague has pointed out, people are currently expecting to make these profits as a means of recouping time and isk invested in the production tree. There are people who are currently investing to be able to produce these (and other) ships. As more manufacturering comes online, this will only serve to push the price down further.
For the seller, the time to make the profit is now. For a buyer who is willing to wait, the time to make the best deal is in a few months.
This is market pvp at it's finest. :) |
Taikun
Gallente
20th Legion
Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.11.22 04:33:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Arthor Dark
Very fair for the manufacturers, but not for the buyers. I anticipate that Orcas would sell for alot less than 700m.
1. "Fair" is for snot nosed brats to learn on weekends playing tee-ball and soccer. "Fair" has no place in the open market.
2. ME-1 Orca BPO cost 392m as of today to build. EVENTUALLY I it drop down to a price close to its's build cost plus a premium as but as it stands now... demand far exceeds supply and the price will remain as high as the market morons will pay for them.
Taikun
A criminal is a person with predatory instincts who has not sufficient capital to form a corporation. |
Albert Wittmann
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Posted - 2008.11.22 09:42:00 -
[13]
We build our first Orca for 353 Mio. ISK, we stored the cheap minerals, before the Orca BPO was coming into market. Now the cheapest productionprice for the Orca at 394 Mio. ISK.
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KISOGOKU
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Posted - 2008.11.22 10:25:00 -
[14]
Edited by: KISOGOKU on 22/11/2008 10:25:56
Mineral cost mineral cost , what i dont see is BPC cost .A single run BPC going at 4-5m for per run and orca need 83 run BPCs = 330-410m BPC cost if you dont own bpos ,If you own bpos you can make BPC/componenets and sell why bother to produce orca ?
Now you see why orca prices will stay at high until bpc/component price drop 
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Silkiah
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Posted - 2008.11.22 11:42:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Silkiah on 22/11/2008 11:43:04
Cap Ship Component bpc's are *alot* more than 1m ISK/run right now, in some places. I'll qualify that with the near-universal exception of Jita, where competition is stronger and prices more competitive (read: hopefully lower) but in Domain I've seen cap ship component bpc's go up by as much as 400% from their "pre-ORCA" averages.
Whether you buy the Orca relevant cap ship component bpc's (and assuming you *already* have the minerals in hand to manufacture said components) or buy them off the Market right now, it's going to amount to the same 200% or so premium to buy an Orca for the foreseeable future.
Effectively, it comes down to what is your time worth to YOU?
For some folks, at least, just buying the Orca now (at it's release price) is an acceptable trade-off when they balance that against the time and ISK lost from their other enterprises *IF* they were to do all the mining, bpc purchasing, manufacturing and so on to build the Orca themselves.
Timing is everything. 
And yes, I'm one of those profiteering goobs, building and selling cap ship components at whopping profit margins, because I do own the bpo's.
Silkiah
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Shintai
Gallente
Balad Naran Orbital Shipyards
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Posted - 2008.11.22 12:53:00 -
[16]
An Orca now is about 400mio..if you got for 11billion in BPOs. It will be along time before the price drops. The demand for capital components for the 0.0 wars and trit price is driving it up. Plus ofcourse the return of investment.
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Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry |
McFly
C0LDFIRE
RUDE Alliance
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Posted - 2008.11.22 13:35:00 -
[17]
I've been building the orca since release now. But I also prepared and had all my hulks nd corp mates in the belts for the lowends. We had to work from BPCs as we only have a quarter of the Component BPOs. I sold my first in auction on the forums for 1 Billion (I also had one of the first out of production (POS Array + Prestaged Components + 13th Online when QR Launched) My Second I've sold for 700mil to a member of my alliance.
I'm in ME Research now because the market is crazy, and many of the BPC sellers are running out of stock now. But with the weeks I've spent in the belts on my own time to amass the trit and other lowends, it's about time it paid off. Capital building takes a lot of management of jobs, BPCs, Minerals, Attention, Not to mention a lot of assets in place to be done efficiently.
The Price will come down, but as with all things, the price will be dependant on the mineral pricing.
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Matthew
Caldari
BloodStar Technologies
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Posted - 2008.11.22 15:39:00 -
[18]
Just several things to bear in mind:
1) The demand for the Orca will be pulling up demand for all it's constituent parts. Looking at the Jita capital component market, the spike in both volume and price is clear. Once Orca demand goes back to more sane levels, I would expect the capital components to fall back as well.
2) Current Orca demand is not representative of long-term demand. At the moment demand is spiked massively due to having to bootstrap the initial stock of these ships in the universe. Once this is done, the demand will fall back to the standard level of replacing lost ships and equipping new players. I expect the competitive squeeze at this stage to get rather interesting.
3) Long-term, once all the initial spikes have worked through the system, I would expect the Orca to settle to the same sort of profit margin as freighters. Which is a lot lower than the 75%+ figure some people are throwing around. Though I make no prediction around how long it will take to get to that long-term position.
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Recently did a small spreadsheet with ME 0 values. Used the Jita Mineral Index for my prices. Roughly 450m in mineral costs. This means that 700 - 800m is a very fair price for an Orca.
Why?
ROI on bpo's. ROI for gathering 50m+ trit. ROI on factory times and the logistic train on production. ROI on skill training for the building thereof.
450m in mineral costs now. What happens to that when the excess demand for minerals being caused by excess Orca demand flattens out? Not to mention the increase in mineral supply that the Orca can facilitate once they are out there in sufficient numbers.
Why should the long-term ROI for Orcas be significantly better than that for freighters?
Interesting exercise I just did using component and ship prices from Jita. Looking at the component prices, there is an obvious spike in the market when the Orca announcement went out, so I've taken prices from just before that spike, as these are likely to represent the long-term level they will return to once the excess Orca demand is cleared. (NB: ME0 blueprint used for this)
Component market price of Charon: 910mill
Market price of Charon: 850mill
Component market price of Providence: 886mill
Market price of Providence: 880mill
Component market price of Obelisk: 883mill
Market price of Obelisk: 850mill
Component market price of Fenrir: 874mill
Market price of Fenrir: 840mill
Component market price of Orca: 452mill
Expected long-term price of Orca: 422 to 450 mill
Clearly there will be some ME-related reasons for my cost figures coming out higher than sale figures. Though I do also note that freighter prices do not seem to have increased in response to the increase in components, especially the capital cargo bay. But I see no reason not to expect a similar behaviour to apply to the Orca.
-------
There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines. |
Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2008.11.22 15:45:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Matthew
Clearly there will be some ME-related reasons for my cost figures coming out higher than sale figures. Though I do also note that freighter prices do not seem to have increased in response to the increase in components, especially the capital cargo bay. But I see no reason not to expect a similar behaviour to apply to the Orca.
Freighter prices should see a rise within another 2 weeks. Remember that its at least half a month for most people to pull one from minerals to finished product. |
Shintai
Gallente
Balad Naran Orbital Shipyards
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Posted - 2008.11.22 16:02:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Shintai on 22/11/2008 16:03:46
Originally by: Matthew
Just several things to bear in mind:
1) The demand for the Orca will be pulling up demand for all it's constituent parts. Looking at the Jita capital component market, the spike in both volume and price is clear. Once Orca demand goes back to more sane levels, I would expect the capital components to fall back as well.
2) Current Orca demand is not representative of long-term demand. At the moment demand is spiked massively due to having to bootstrap the initial stock of these ships in the universe. Once this is done, the demand will fall back to the standard level of replacing lost ships and equipping new players. I expect the competitive squeeze at this stage to get rather interesting.
3) Long-term, once all the initial spikes have worked through the system, I would expect the Orca to settle to the same sort of profit margin as freighters. Which is a lot lower than the 75%+ figure some people are throwing around. Though I make no prediction around how long it will take to get to that long-term position.
Originally by: Shar Tegral
Recently did a small spreadsheet with ME 0 values. Used the Jita Mineral Index for my prices. Roughly 450m in mineral costs. This means that 700 - 800m is a very fair price for an Orca.
Why?
ROI on bpo's. ROI for gathering 50m+ trit. ROI on factory times and the logistic train on production. ROI on skill training for the building thereof.
450m in mineral costs now. What happens to that when the excess demand for minerals being caused by excess Orca demand flattens out? Not to mention the increase in mineral supply that the Orca can facilitate once they are out there in sufficient numbers.
Why should the long-term ROI for Orcas be significantly better than that for freighters?
Interesting exercise I just did using component and ship prices from Jita. Looking at the component prices, there is an obvious spike in the market when the Orca announcement went out, so I've taken prices from just before that spike, as these are likely to represent the long-term level they will return to once the excess Orca demand is cleared. (NB: ME0 blueprint used for this)
Component market price of Charon: 910mill
Market price of Charon: 850mill
Component market price of Providence: 886mill
Market price of Providence: 880mill
Component market price of Obelisk: 883mill
Market price of Obelisk: 850mill
Component market price of Fenrir: 874mill
Market price of Fenrir: 840mill
Component market price of Orca: 452mill
Expected long-term price of Orca: 422 to 450 mill
Clearly there will be some ME-related reasons for my cost figures coming out higher than sale figures. Though I do also note that freighter prices do not seem to have increased in response to the increase in components, especially the capital cargo bay. But I see no reason not to expect a similar behaviour to apply to the Orca.
You should ask yourself how long those freighters have been on the market waiting for buyers.
Also it cost only about 6B in BPOs to make a freighter on your own. And in the start with cheap trit. You had a 300-400mio profit per freighter.
Orca cost about 11B in BPOs. And surprise surprise. The profit is about the same.
So long term ROI is slower and longer on Orca than it is on freighters.
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Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry |
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Matthew
Caldari
BloodStar Technologies
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Posted - 2008.11.22 16:37:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Shintai
Note: Your freighter prices are also completely wrong. They cost less than 725mio to make with market minerals and ME0. And ME0 Orca also cost less than you write. Did you use ME0 components too?
Just because the total mineral requirement costs 725mill, does not make that the cost of manufacturing the freighter. It's the mineral cost of manufacturing the components required for a freighter.
If you use that 725mill figure to cost up your freighter production, then you are subsidising your freighter production with your component production. It's exactly the same fundamental mistake as saying "minerals I mine myself are free".
I used market prices for the components, hence ME on the components is irrelevant.
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There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines. |
Shintai
Gallente
Balad Naran Orbital Shipyards
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Posted - 2008.11.22 16:51:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Matthew
Originally by: Shintai
Note: Your freighter prices are also completely wrong. They cost less than 725mio to make with market minerals and ME0. And ME0 Orca also cost less than you write. Did you use ME0 components too?
Just because the total mineral requirement costs 725mill, does not make that the cost of manufacturing the freighter. It's the mineral cost of manufacturing the components required for a freighter.
If you use that 725mill figure to cost up your freighter production, then you are subsidising your freighter production with your component production. It's exactly the same fundamental mistake as saying "minerals I mine myself are free".
I used market prices for the components, hence ME on the components is irrelevant.
What? Component prices atm is screwed alot. I dont know if you noticed it. Some components got 300% profit, other dont. Plus the selection of components is very small and I doubt you could even make 1 freighter.
If you got the freighter BPOs, Thats 4 components BPOs and 1 ship BPO. Then thats what it cost. So 725mio. And unlike your "free mineral statement". This is a profit all the way if you wanted.
Your higher cost is simply just putting alot of money into other peoples pocket. Since you lack the ability to make the components yourself.
So no I am not subsidizing my freighter. Its just not build with the most expensive and perhaps non selling parts you could find.
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Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry |
Matthew
Caldari
BloodStar Technologies
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Posted - 2008.11.22 17:02:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Kazzac Elentria
Freighter prices should see a rise within another 2 weeks. Remember that its at least half a month for most people to pull one from minerals to finished product.
I guess this approach is a difference of opinion on how to handle such price changes.
I view all my stock as a mineral-equivalent, and the whole manufacturing process as simply a method of conversion with the potential to increase or decrease the overall value of that stock.
Hence, when prices shift, I treat them as profit/loss on the mineral speculation side of my operation, and roll that through my entire production chain.
This then has a consequent impact on the profit/loss figures for the rest of the chain, providing a good indication of where my priorities should lie as the transition works its way through the markets, given the differing inertia in the different markets, and the differing impacts of any given change.
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There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines. |
Matthew
Caldari
BloodStar Technologies
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Posted - 2008.11.22 17:17:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Shintai
What? Component prices atm is screwed alot. I dont know if you noticed it. Some components got 300% profit, other dont. Plus the selection of components is very small and I doubt you could even make 1 freighter.
Are the ones that currently have 300% profit the ones used in the Orca by any chance?
And yes, I know that the majority of components never actually come to market, but the market price was the only tool I had at short notice to try and do this evaluation.
Originally by: Shintai
If you got the freighter BPOs, Thats 4 components BPOs and 1 ship BPO. Then thats what it cost. So 725mio. And unlike your "free mineral statement". This is a profit all the way if you wanted.
Yes, it's profit, but it's not profit on manufacturing the freighter. It's profit on manufacturing both the freighter and it's components.
It's exactly the same as the "free minerals" situation. In the incorrect case, people treat the profit of the whole chain as profit on manufacturing the item, when really it is the profit on both manufacturing the item and mining the minerals.
The problem with rolling both activities into one profit calculation is that it becomes impossible to tell if you are actually making negative profit in one stage of the chain, and hence could be making more isk with less effort, by eliminating an activity.
Admittedly it is harder to determine the true split in the capital production case, due to the poor state of the component market. However, that does not mean you should not try.
At the very least, you need to factor in an opportunity cost for the manufacturing slot time you expend on producing the components. Otherwise you are not even representing the true cost of manufacturing the components, let alone the true market price of those components.
Originally by: Shintai
Your higher cost is simply just putting alot of money into other peoples pocket. Since you lack the ability to make the components yourself.
Yes, it's putting money into other people's pockets. But it's also freeing up a lot of isk (that I now haven't invested in the component BPOs) and manufacturing slot time that I can dedicate to other isk-making activities. If I can use that to make more isk than I spend buying in the components, then putting isk into other people's pockets makes perfect business sense.
Now, I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case in this specific instance. But what I am saying is that you are not going to know if it is or not if you only use your raw mineral cost figure.
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There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines. |
Jacque Custeau
Knights of the Minmatar Republic
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Posted - 2008.11.23 01:44:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Jacque Custeau on 23/11/2008 01:45:36
People keep forgetting the billions in capital component bpo's that are needed. When you need minerals in large quantities you need competitive buy orders. You need a freighter to move minerals and components around. There is all that time and slots used to build components.
Long story short, ships that are not built directly from minerals are a headache, in terms of finance, logistics and even skills. I am in a situation now where I am forced to spend 28 days training advanced mass production 5 just to use an extra slot. That is reflected in the price. The price will come down, but a 100-150 mil markup on these ships is more than fair.
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Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2008.11.23 05:44:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Matthew
I view all my stock as a mineral-equivalent, and the whole manufacturing process as simply a method of conversion with the potential to increase or decrease the overall value of that stock.
Hence, when prices shift, I treat them as profit/loss on the mineral speculation side of my operation, and roll that through my entire production chain.
This then has a consequent impact on the profit/loss figures for the rest of the chain, providing a good indication of where my priorities should lie as the transition works its way through the markets, given the differing inertia in the different markets, and the differing impacts of any given change.
You are one of the few, trust me.
We traders (part time builders) make billions off people who do not do the same and there are times where we literally reprocess thousands of items for the minerals they contain because of it. |
Matthew
Caldari
BloodStar Technologies
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Posted - 2008.11.23 14:42:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Jacque Custeau
Long story short, ships that are not built directly from minerals are a headache, in terms of finance, logistics and even skills. I am in a situation now where I am forced to spend 28 days training advanced mass production 5 just to use an extra slot. That is reflected in the price. The price will come down, but a 100-150 mil markup on these ships is more than fair.
That's what you may consider fair. But if enough people consider 50-100mill, or even 25-50mill to be a fair price for their labour, then that's what the market price will end up being based on. My argument is that there are already ships with similar logistical requirements on the market, so it would be a reasonable assumption that the profit margin on the Orca will end up at a similar level to these existing ships.
Originally by: Kazzac Elentria
You are one of the few, trust me.
We traders (part time builders) make billions off people who do not do the same and there are times where we literally reprocess thousands of items for the minerals they contain because of it.
And I'm glad that you do. Though I'm sure there are some margins to be made, even off me, simply due to lack of time on my part. I view traders as a valuable signalling mechanism, a service which I (indirectly) pay for via the trading margins left. Which is quite a nice auto-pricing system, as the further out I am from market price, the more important that signalling is, and the more margin is there to "pay" for it.
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There is no magic Wand of Fixing, and it is not powered by forum whines. |
Tillyn
Gallente
ShadowLight Production
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Posted - 2008.11.23 17:40:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Tillyn on 23/11/2008 17:39:56
teh raw mineral cost is about 400 mil not taking into consideration bpc's to build the orca
that should be around an extra 150 mil for all bpc's
so total should be 500-550 mil for an at cost orca
"Rather Death than Disgrace"
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Sven Xai
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Posted - 2008.11.23 18:35:00 -
[29]
Not sure if this has been said yet, but one of the things affecting current cost is that this soon most if not all orcas made are made at or near base bpo production values. Maybe some time and materials research has been placed, but not enough to really drive the market down. A single copy can take 6 weeks to make ( less with better skills ) SO I was suprised when I saw a copy on day 3 of patch :P
Eventualy the manufacturing monguls will have perfect production, making the perfect material cost of the base bpo be => the average best price in your system. |
Kazzac Elentria
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Posted - 2008.11.23 20:39:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Sven Xai
Eventualy the manufacturing monguls will have perfect production, making the perfect material cost of the base bpo be => the average best price in your system.
This was the case from day one, quite a few of us who produce capital ships already had the BPO library to start churning out parts well in advance of the ships release.
If you had a successful Freigher, Rorq program, you could easily move into Orca production prelaunch. |
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