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Officer webifiers have been QUADRUPLE nerfed

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Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol Doctrine.	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:26:00 - [1] I was just heading to Jita to grab a few new fittings for my Sin to improve the tank on it a bit. Figured it should be a snap. Bought the modules, headed back to home and started fitting up my ship. To my suprise, the ship would not accept the fittings due to grid issues. Alright, so I looked at EFT and a back-dated version of it and my fears were confirmed... Officer webs have been 4 times nerfed. From the patch notes, you can see this is true (the nerfs are in bold): Originally by: QR Patch Notes Stasis webifiers now have a maximum effective speed reduction of -60%. This changed from the maximum effective speed reduction of -90%. In order to compensate, all standard webifiers and faction variants will have either better range and CPU fitting requirements, better range and speed factor, or better speed factor and CPU fitting requirements. Officer variants will now have up to 20km range (reduced from 40km) and a speed reduction factor between 55-60%. Capacitor use, power grid and CPU fitting requirements have been tweaked depending on meta level. Okay so, let's review. Standard webs have been hit over the head with a speed reduction. Faction webs have been boosted to have an increase in webbing power, and improved fitting requirements. Officer webs on the other hand have had 1) Range Nerf 2) Speed Reduction Nerf 3) Capacitor Usage Nerf 4) Grid Fitting Nerf So basically they've been beaten to a pulp by the nerfbat. Allow me to illustrate: Here's our webifiers before the nerf: Note its soft and gentle curves, with a bit of attitude from the single orange leaf on top of it. This is a desirable orange. Now, here is an officer webifier after the nerf: Beaten one too many times with the nerfbat? I think so. CCP you have gone too far with officer webs. I realize it's in "your best interests" to keep players happy, but please explain how this keeps the players happy or is in your best interests? Thanks. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.quafeultra.com
Captain Falcord Gallente Ghost Festival	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:27:00 - [2] The orange part was hilarious, I didn't see it coming. ---<---@ JackFalcord
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:27:00 - [3] And them be better now. They were a bit too powerful Ofcourse bigger bonus should also mean bigger PG/cap/CPU use too. My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Vaal Erit Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:29:00 - [4] Omg, I get it, you are rich and can afford l33t officer items on your faction whatever ship. Good for you. You are so awesome and we all bow to your glorious pwnzoring of all teh nooblars. I for one am glad that MS don't have a 34km+ sphere or unjammable death anymore. So unbalacned. Wahhh, wahh. You are brain dead for not selling that officer web the moment the new web stats were released on sisi. -- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol Doctrine.	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:31:00 - [5] Originally by: Sheriff Jones And them be better now. They were a bit too powerful Ofcourse bigger bonus should also mean bigger PG/cap/CPU use too. It already was. Originally the officer webs used up 1500 grid. Now they use AT LEAST 1900. 400 more grid is like looking back at the EANM nerf. 6 CPU more to EANM IIs. It literally BROKE the Ishtar and many other ships as well in ability of fitting a fine tank. Tell me that this isn't the same. They went overboard. 1500 grid was enough. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.quafeultra.com
Sheriff Jones Amarr Clinical Experiment	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:33:00 - [6] Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 04/12/2008 12:33:47 Originally by: Siigari Kitawa It already was. Originally the officer webs used up 1500 grid. Now they use AT LEAST 1900. 400 more grid is like looking back at the EANM nerf. 6 CPU more to EANM IIs. It literally BROKE the Ishtar and many other ships as well in ability of fitting a fine tank. Tell me that this isn't the same. They went overboard. 1500 grid was enough. Different mod, so by default, it's not the same. I don't see a problem with it. If you want that extra oomf, you need to give up something else. With the 1500, were you able to fit everything or were you in a spot where you had to think "one more gun or this web?", if not, it was broken. Extra bonus should always come with a cost. Like interceptors; MWD gives you a lightning fast ship, but AB keeps burning when scrambled. My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit.
Nathalia Itiero The Aduro Protocol Doctrine.	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:34:00 - [7] Whine much about your economy? Not like it's a super expensive module. Do mission for a few weeks and you have enough? :) His point is that officer webs are OFFICER webs, they shouldnt be only marginally better. You get what you pay for, a expensive item should be better and more awesome than the cheap t2 equivalent.
Karille Gallente Cold Templars Templar Initiative	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:36:00 - [8] Whoooooooo Caaaaaaaares?
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol Doctrine.	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:44:00 - [9] Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 04/12/2008 12:45:34 Originally by: Sheriff Jones Different mod, so by default, it's not the same. I don't see a problem with it. If you want that extra oomf, you need to give up something else. With the 1500, were you able to fit everything or were you in a spot where you had to think "one more gun or this web?", if not, it was broken. Extra bonus should always come with a cost. Like interceptors; MWD gives you a lightning fast ship, but AB keeps burning when scrambled. Here's the thing, let's compare these webs: Gallente Navy Stasis Webifier: Range: 14km Web Power: 60% Cap Usage: 1 cap/second Grid Usage: 1 MW Mizuro's Modified Stasis Webifier: Range: 17km Web Power: 55% Cap Usage: 3 cap/second Grid Usage: 1900 MW Okay first of all, I can overload a Gallente Navy web and get 60% webbing power at 18.2km for ONE GRID, whereas it now costs me 1900 grid just to web for 55% at 17km. Yes I can overload to 22.1km, but the simple fact is that for 1900 grid the range is no longer a benefit when I can achieve that with a faction module. You could never get a Domination Web (previously 15km/90%) to what the Mizuro Web's base was (25km/75%) so tell me that webifiers have been adjusted on a fair slider. Even still with the new way the webs work, you aren't going to have (and I quote): Originally by: Vaal Erit I for one am glad that MS don't have a 34km+ sphere or unjammable death anymore. So unbalacned. Well with the current mechanics that can't happen even if the web was at 25km or more, because the VELOCITY PENALTY is down to 55, instead of 75% (which isn't even that great to begin with compared to other webs!) It just seems to me they got unfair treatment and were hit with the nerfbat once. Then whoever was beating the mods with the nerfbat got a little splatter of orange in their mouth and it tasted good, so they beat it again. And again. And again, until there was no more juice left and they were left with this hunk of pulp that you could recognize was supposed to be a webifier but barely functioned as one that should have instead been polished, shined and kissed by the sun. Grr >=\| www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.quafeultra.com
Karille Gallente Cold Templars Templar Initiative	Posted - 2008.12.04 12:49:00 - [10] The overloaded web won't work forever, so you have to pay the price for always on performance.

Jacque Custeau Knights of the Minmatar Republic	Posted - 2008.12.04 13:16:00 - [11] I understand the performance nerf on officer webs. Did any of the devs explain why it needed a grid nerf or did they just sneak it in there? This is a battleship sized mod, not a Super-cap module. So if WD II becomes FOTM and Super-cap pilots use it, will it get a grid nerf? -------------------
Bazman Caldari Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2008.12.04 13:27:00 - [12] I assume the grid nerf was because of a certain someone fitting a gotans web to a rapier pre web changes and being able to web out to 249km :P -----
DubanFP Caldari R.U.S.T.	Posted - 2008.12.04 13:31:00 - [13] Edited by: DubanFP on 04/12/2008 13:31:29 I took you remotely seriously, then came the orange comments... _______________ "It's not about the look of your ship or the size of your guns. It's about how much **** you can @#$# up with it"
Lux Exterior The Scope	Posted - 2008.12.04 13:41:00 - [14] Oranges are not the only fruit... "That which does not kill us makes us stronger" Friedrich Nietzsche
Winterblink Body Count Inc.	Posted - 2008.12.04 14:16:00 - [15] Originally by: Bazman I assume the grid nerf was because of a certain someone fitting a gotans web to a rapier pre web changes and being able to web out to 249km :P
Ikserak tai	Posted - 2008.12.04 16:09:00 - [16] (Slaps forehead) forgot to pack oranges in my lunch today... YOU'VE NEVER ROCKED 'TIL YOU'VE UNDOCKED.
Varrakk Phantom Squad Axiom Empire	Posted - 2008.12.04 16:12:00 - [17] Please give officer webs additional range again. Theres no incentive to use these anymore when faction modules have virtually the same stats for a fraction of cost and fittings.
ElCoCo KIA Corp KIA Alliance	Posted - 2008.12.04 17:26:00 - [18] Best module narf evah! Now if only those stinky resellers would get realistic and sell me a couple for cheap to put in my bhaal I do pitty the supercap pilots that bought these though. Talk about a 5-6 bil mod going down to like 1bil (struggling to fetch that as well). Boink!
Fortiter Kurtz's Kommandos	Posted - 2008.12.04 17:56:00 - [19] Originally by: Varrakk Please give officer webs additional range again. Theres no incentive to use these anymore when faction modules have virtually the same stats for a fraction of cost and fittings. signed Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Artemis Rose Sileo In Pacis	Posted - 2008.12.04 19:32:00 - [20] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa CCP you have gone too far with officer webs. I realize it's in "your best interests" to keep players happy, but please explain how this keeps the players happy or is in your best interests? Thanks. I'm sure we are all canceling our accounts so fast we'll crash CCP's account services section of the webpage any moment now. . .. ... .. . Any moment now! CCP will feel OUR RAGE! *** Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine, Self Banstick +2 WTB: +666 E-peen killboard stats

Bronson Hughes ADVANCED Combat and Engineering	Posted - 2008.12.04 19:45:00 - [21] Originally by: Bazman I assume the grid nerf was because of a certain someone fitting a gotans web to a rapier pre web changes and being able to web out to 249km :P I have a feeling this may have had something to do with it. I don't think the fitting nerf was about BS vs. Cap/Supercap, I think it was to prevent sub-BS ships form fitting them. I believe that the same fittign nerf happened to the officer Nosses and Neuts for the same reason (i.e. no Curse nuking cap from 70+ km). Granted, these situations did not happen that often, but I guess CCP didn't want them to happen at all. -------------------- "I am hard pressed on my right; my centre is giving way; situation excellent; I am attacking." - Ferdinand Foch at the Battle of the Marne
Fortiter Kurtz's Kommandos	Posted - 2008.12.05 05:28:00 - [22] Before the web nerf, officer webs like the Mizuro's Statis Webifier had a 25km web range. It also had a 1,500 powergrid usage. After the nerf, it has a 17km range and has the 1,900 powergrid usage slapped onto it. Compare the Mizuro's modified web to a Domination web and you will see why its broken. Domi web Range - 15 km Meta Level - 9 Powergrid Usage - 1 MW Mizuro's web Range - 17 km Meta Level 11 Powergrid Usage - 1,900 MW The next officer webs are Hakim's (18km-2,100mw/error should be 2,000mw), Gotan's (19km-1,800mw/error should be 2,1000mw), Tobias' (20km-2,200mw). So why the high power grid usage? The highest range has gone from 40km to 20km so limiting the shiptypes that these webs are used on is really no longer needed, if it ever was.. As for the person that said it was needed because of a rapier pilot webbing from 240km out, by all means let them. Falcons can jam from that far and if some guy wants to put on a (used to be) 6billion web and go into combat, then by all means let him. Can we get a comment from a dev on this? Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Ackaroth Plundering Penguins	Posted - 2008.12.05 05:50:00 - [23] I came here for the "QUADRUPLE" and stayed for the oranges. 10/10 for comedy in thread. Plundering Penguins is recruiting PVP pilots. See Recruitment Thread for details.
Mag's MASS	Posted - 2008.12.05 06:49:00 - [24] Edited by: Mag''s on 05/12/2008 06:50:48 Sold both my Gotans webs as the nerf patch hit sisi. When it hit there, the writing was on the wall tbh. Edit: I do agree though, the whole point of officer webs was the range. Mag's Originally by: Avernus One of these days, the realization that MASS is no longer significant will catch up with you.
Naomi Knight Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.12.05 12:12:00 - [25] Originally by: Karille Whoooooooo Caaaaaaaares? This ,as the answer is nobody.
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2008.12.05 12:53:00 - [26] Originally by: Naomi Knight Originally by: Karille Whoooooooo Caaaaaaaares? This ,as the answer is nobody. Just because the majority of pvpers are ****poor, doesn't mean others are. I personally like these changes cause these webbers are now affordable enough to use on battleships in pvp. _________________________________________________
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol Doctrine.	Posted - 2008.12.05 13:37:00 - [27] Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 05/12/2008 13:38:41 Originally by: madaluap Originally by: Naomi Knight Originally by: Karille Whoooooooo Caaaaaaaares? This ,as the answer is nobody. Just because the majority of pvpers are ***poor, doesn't mean others are. I personally like these changes cause these webbers are now affordable enough to use on battleships in pvp. That argument doesn't make sense. "Now that I can afford it I can finally use it. Oh wait, why do I want to buy it if it's not as useful as it was when I wanted it..." That's like saying this: Back when the PSP was released, before firmware 1.5.0 I think it was, you could put homebrew on it and make it all cool with customizations, ports, and other things. Well let's say that you wanted the PSP with homebrew, only now they've released a NEW PSP and Sony has dropped the price fifty bucks. "ALRIGHT! It's affordable!" you scream. Only now it isn't able to do what you wanted it to do because the new firmware removes the homebrew capability. *This is being used in an "as-is" argument. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.quafeultra.com
madaluap Gallente Mercenary Forces	Posted - 2008.12.05 14:28:00 - [28] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 05/12/2008 13:38:41 Originally by: madaluap Originally by: Naomi Knight Originally by: Karille Whoooooooo Caaaaaaaares? This ,as the answer is nobody. Just because the majority of pvpers are ***poor, doesn't mean others are. I personally like these changes cause these webbers are now affordable enough to use on battleships in pvp. That argument doesn't make sense. "Now that I can afford it I can finally use it. Oh wait, why do I want to buy it if it's not as useful as it was when I wanted it..." That's like saying this: Back when the PSP was released, before firmware 1.5.0 I think it was, you could put homebrew on it and make it all cool with customizations, ports, and other things. Well let's say that you wanted the PSP with homebrew, only now they've released a NEW PSP and Sony has dropped the price fifty bucks. "ALRIGHT! It's affordable!" you scream. Only now it isn't able to do what you wanted it to do because the new firmware removes the homebrew capability. *This is being used in an "as-is" argument. I'm not arguing, im talking about my personal situation They were billions, now they are (just) a bil = i can afford them. I didnt look to much @ them in the past, because they were to expensive. Now i look @ them and I see them as a completely new module. A module that performs the way i want to, for a pricetag that I can afford. What better: A OMGBBQ module you cannot use because its too expensive or a VERY decent module that you can afford. _________________________________________________
Ethan Tomlinson The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2008.12.05 14:38:00 - [29] signed... horrible nerf anyone that says otherwise is an absolute **tard How do those numbers even make sense? what horrible newb intern ccp developer sat down and thought I'll make a tobias web with a 33% increase in range (20km) up from domination web (15km) require 220000% more power? this is not to mention that the bloody thing used to have twice the range and used less powergrid I bet the only thing we will see out of this is faction webifiers getting a 10000% boost in powergrid usage CCP did you go to the nearest deVry college walmart campus for your programers? this guy is a bloody ****. Please do yourself a favor and fire him
Crellion Art of War Exalted.	Posted - 2008.12.05 14:40:00 - [30] Originally by: madaluap Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 05/12/2008 13:38:41 Originally by: madaluap Originally by: Naomi Knight Originally by: Karille Whoooooooo Caaaaaaaares? This ,as the answer is nobody. Just because the majority of pvpers are ***poor, doesn't mean others are. I personally like these changes cause these webbers are now affordable enough to use on battleships in pvp. I'm not arguing, im talking about my personal situation They were billions, now they are (just) a bil = i can afford them. I didnt look to much @ them in the past, because they were to expensive. Now i look @ them and I see them as a completely new module. A module that performs the way i want to, for a pricetag that I can afford. What better: A OMGBBQ module you cannot use because its too expensive or a VERY decent module that you can afford. Man I may be horribly wrong and respect for flying maxed blaster ships back in early 2005 when i was a noob and all but I strongly suspect now (having read hundreds of your forum posts) that you are just a glorified carebear Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim.*



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