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Blacksuns
PAX AMARRIA INDUSTRIES
1
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Posted - 2012.04.10 20:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi everyone,
I have just joined Pax indy corp as i dont have the time to run my own corp, I was mining with them for 2 hours on my first day, but i dint get any isk for my services which i dont mind the corp is fairly small atm so am goin to do anything i can to help get the corp of the ground,
Heres ur wage miner
When i was looking for a corp to join i noticed only a few bigger corps which offer some kind of payment system or buy back progarm using the contracts system.
I think it might be a good idea to put something in place in game a system which is part of the corp window given my CCP which allows the corp to setup payments to miners once the settings are in place, it can be enabled via the fleet window so the fleet members who are mining will get paid for say how long they have been mining or how much they have mind,
Open to ideas on this, it would save alot of CEO's Directors setting there own payment system up and paying out members with some kind of system in place the miners in corps will get paid for the work.
Blacksuns |
Adam Dinkleberg
Copacabana
0
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Posted - 2012.04.10 21:28:00 -
[2] - Quote
Or you could sell the ore on the market, that also pays you. |
Kasutra
Tailor Company
23
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Posted - 2012.04.10 21:59:00 -
[3] - Quote
I don't think getting paid for time logged on ops (that is, receiving an "hourly salary") is a common enough arrangement to warrant an additional game feature. Especially when it's rather easy to keep track of out of game.
Also, don't work for someone if you're not sure how (and by extension, if) you're getting paid. :| |
Rengerel en Distel
Khanid Research Corporation
36
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Posted - 2012.04.10 22:26:00 -
[4] - Quote
I think most corps pay by what you mine, or a share of the OP in general. Seems like you're in the wrong corp.
Don't assume bad intent, when stupidity is the much more likely cause. |
DIsposible Hero
State War Academy
Caldari State
18
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Posted - 2012.04.10 22:45:00 -
[5] - Quote
Yeah, most corps will pay you for the amount of ore mined. There are of course corps which recruit newbies and don't pay them, and basically just use them as free labour for as long as it takes them to catch on. Make sure your corp isn't one of those. |
Boomhaur
10
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Posted - 2012.04.11 03:24:00 -
[6] - Quote
I wouldn't work for free if I were you, this is Eve were good at exploiting people for whatever we can. Proceed with caution. |
D3F4ULT
35
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Posted - 2012.04.11 04:59:00 -
[7] - Quote
What my corp does is we have a group of mega hulks that rip away belts. We don't pay newer members a percentage, but we help them with whatever they need.
If you need a fitted frigate you give me the estimate price of what you need and I will personally see to it you get the funds. This makes it easier to avoid smaller factors of miners that do less than a Retriever.
Creator of CCP ZULU - Incarna : Pants Online ( http://youtu.be/AObrlCf3Dcs ) |
Revolution Rising
Gentlemen of Better Ilk
321
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Posted - 2012.04.11 05:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
There's some good ideas in store for this CSM I am betting.
If they tackle modular POS in the next year I'm sure it will come up.
CSM7 Skype Leak
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Gallinari
EVE University
Ivy League
0
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Posted - 2012.04.11 08:09:00 -
[9] - Quote
Why are you mining for free?? LOL. Corps should pay you your share of what you mined and if they dont you need to quit ASAP. Sometimes they even divide among whoever took part in the mining OP. Regardless you should have been paid a fair share so if you arent then say something and then quit. |
Jastra
Black Thorne Corporation
Black Thorne Alliance
26
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Posted - 2012.04.11 09:16:00 -
[10] - Quote
You are in the wrong corp
<<<<<<<<< |
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Sidrat Flush
EntroPrelatial Industria
EntroPraetorian Aegis
11
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Posted - 2012.04.11 10:20:00 -
[11] - Quote
Hmm, most corp mining ops for corp profits aren't directly reimbursed via funds/etc. However they should be providing options that will enable you to upgrade your industrial ship or mining yield through slot 7 or 10 implants.
Your corp should also have a buy back programme at the very least so the ore you mine personally could be sold back to the corp at generally less than Jita prices but the third thing a corp could do is offer a monthly/weekly/fortnightly dividend off their profits from the corp mining ops provided you participated of course.
Every corporation however is different so find one that suits your play style and if corp ops are mandatory without any incentive or reward then question their motives and evaluate your options very quickly.
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Gatan Hahran
Brukterer
DUCT TAPE UNION
98
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Posted - 2012.04.11 11:08:00 -
[12] - Quote
hey mate, i like your working attitude.
clearly you are in the wrong corp. when you are done with the free mining i need about 17200 bestower loads of tritanium moved around here from minmatar space to jita and i cant be bothered to undock in my charon because uhm.. im lazy.
i might pay you when you are finished, dunno yet.
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Skorpynekomimi
Omega Vector
170
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Posted - 2012.04.11 14:14:00 -
[13] - Quote
My alliance does mining ops thusly:
You mine.
It's refined by the hauler, who has perfect refine pretty much everywhere.
10% is deducted, then split between alliance and haulers.
You get the remainder.
You can then arrange with the appropriate people to sell the minerals to the alliance, usually for 5-10% below market. Generally, if it's known you're just going to sell them on the market, someone offers to buy them off you before you drag them all the way back to your home. |
Kalipoli
State War Academy
Caldari State
13
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Posted - 2012.04.11 17:35:00 -
[14] - Quote
You should always be reimbursed for your time.
My corp does it like this. Every two weeks we update our prices on all materials. If a miner mines solo and decides to sell to corp our prices are clearly listed and very very fair, usually about 5% below jita buy sometimes even with it. We buy everything from salvage to minerals and have our prices listed and updated bi weekly.
When it comes to mining ops, everyone brings their best yeilding ship and mines for as long as they can during the op. we track the amount of time spent in the op and divide the minerals by how much time you were in the op. The corp takes 10% off the top for providing the boost and the remaining 90% of minerals are either sold right away to pay members or stockpiled for manufacturing. In essence no matter what, our members are paid for the minerals that they mine. (with a boost of around 60% even with the corp taking 10% of the top everyone mines and makes more isk.) The corp then either stockpiles the minerals for manufacturing or sells some if we stockpiled to much. If the minerals sold are sold at above the rate we baught them the profit is calculated and our members benefit from the dividend if they purchased shares like we recommended :).
You should always be paid for your time. Although if you prefer to mine for free my corp would be more than willing to benefit from that. or even force isk down your throat if you are unwilling to work for pay. |
Styth spiting
Ion Corp.
Citex Alliance
18
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Posted - 2012.04.11 18:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
Blacksuns wrote:
I have just joined Pax indy corp as i dont have the time to run my own corp, I was mining with them for 2 hours on my first day, but i dint get any isk for my services which i dont mind the corp is fairly small atm so am goin to do anything i can to help get the corp of the ground,
Chances are the mining op was a non profit mining op to help raise money for the corp, pay for bills, buy items for the corp, etc. Normally these are good things as long as you are part of a corp that does invest the isk into the corp needs instead of pocketing it.
You need to find out what type of op's your corp runs, and confirm before hand if its a for profit (you make isk) non profit (corp makes isk) and what % the corp takes.
Also you have to understand that it does take time to figure out the payments. Based on how your corp handles payouts they may need to check everyone's API data to see what there skills were, check each ships fittings, figure out how much you actually mined, haul all the minerals and sell it off, and then make all the contracts.
Blacksuns wrote:
When i was looking for a corp to join i noticed only a few bigger corps which offer some kind of payment system or buy back progarm using the contracts system.
Most corps have a system like this which is normally an ore buying program. From my experience these tend to be 5% or 10% of the ores value based on Jita prices. Which is great (more so for new miners) when you consider you don't lose anything to refining, tax at station or deal with logistics of hauling (or losing your hauler/minerals).
Blacksuns wrote:
I think it might be a good idea to put something in place in game a system which is part of the corp window given my CCP which allows the corp to setup payments to miners once the settings are in place, it can be enabled via the fleet window so the fleet members who are mining will get paid for say how long they have been mining or how much they have mind,
There are a number of problems with this suggestion.
- Corps may pay more based on your mining abilities (perfect miner vs someone in a covetor).
- As a players skills in mining increase the corp may payout more, which would mean every few days the system would need to be updated.
- Some ops members may have max yield, other times they may be setup for max tank.
- Some corps have a "sliding scale" tax amount based on how much ore you have sold to the corp (solo mining) meaning the more ore you sell to the corp the less they take over a period of time.
- Fleet history is not an effective way to manage how much ore a member has mined. The system can be easily exploited and should not be used when figuring out miners yield for a mining op.
Fleet history exploit example: Miner fills cargo hold. Miner jetcans 15,001 ore. Miner then takes 15,000 mineral from jetcan, and repeat. According to the fleet log this miner just looted 30,001 minerals (initial mining of 15,001 ore + the looting of 15,000 from the jetcan).
The best option really is to simply have a spread sheet the fleet director / whoever handles payments that tracks players skills / ship used, minutes mined, and total yield from the op. Adding something like this into eve would just make things much more complicated. Now don't get me wrong, there are many things that could be added that would make mining ops much easier to manage.
Kalipoli post is spot on how mining ops normally (or should) function. It's really the only way to make sure everyone is paid for the amount of work they did, it's the easist system to manage, and really the best overall system for both the people handling payments, minerals and miners. The only problem with Kalipoli's posted system is if you have a mix of players with different skills or ships some players will get paid out more than they would have mined (example a covetor mining vs a hulk). Its just a matter of tracking players industry skills, and ships used.
A much better option that would make mining op's 10 times easier would be Orca's having access logs, which can be sorted by member name, and exported. After the op is finished you could see all ores miners placed in the Orca (so no more issues with jetcan scamming, brining ore to station, etc). Players get paid out for ores they placed into the Orca. The only problem with this would be when Orcas pilots tractor in jetcans, which I'm sure their would be a simple fix for that.
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Drew Solaert
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
114
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Posted - 2012.04.11 20:55:00 -
[16] - Quote
Mining for free is a complete joke.
A good corp will give you some compensation in either ISK or ship access later down the line. (I can't remember the last time my main paid for his own ship)
For every player ship that blows up, the wheels of the economy turn slightly faster. -áDo your bit today. -áGo out and PEW.
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