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Faye Rapture
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Posted - 2008.12.11 21:41:00 -
[1]
So apparently there are different blasters for different situations? I hear people saying, "Oh, I use so-and-so for tank and so-and-so for gank."
So how do I know the difference? Or rather, which ones do what? Which is for highest damage, etc etc.
Electron Blaster
Neutron Blaster
Ion Blaster
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Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
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Posted - 2008.12.11 21:56:00 -
[2]
I don't use blasters, but all turrets have variants in the same size class. You need to look info on the turrets and compare the attributes. I would guess that things like rate of fire, tracking, range, damage modifier and fitting requiremets will be different. I would guess that the one with the best damage output is hardest to fit and has worse tracking than the lower damage blasters. This makes it impossible to fit a tank, that is as good, when using guns with lower fitting requirements. You have to decide what you need more and adjust your fitting accordingly.
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Mal Lokrano
Gallente
LFC
Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2008.12.11 22:18:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Mal Lokrano on 11/12/2008 22:20:05
By damage and range wise it goes from best to worse:
Neutron
Ion
Electron
Neutrons are the best and have the best range and damage, but they also have very large fitting requirements which makes them a little unpopular for fits. Most tend to like the Ion as it is a little easier to fit, and put other stuff on the ship as well.
I personally am a Neutron guy myself. It really depends on what you want. Tank wise you might have to go with Ions so you can save CPU and PG for the tank. If you want gank then you will want all the CPU and PG to damage mods and the guns themselves with just a buffer tank if at all.
Note I am no expert at fits but this is what i have taken over the past few months from around the forums.
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When going to a party with wine, women, and song. Always acertain the vintage of the first two. |
Slade Trillgon
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2008.12.12 00:32:00 -
[4]
First as stated above get very familiar with the item description page in the item info. This will tel you alot of information that is needed. You can also get a basic idea of what is "better" by looking at the meta level of the items. Meta 1 - Meta 4 -Tech II and so on.
I would say that you always want to fit the best guns that you have the room for, PG and CPU. You can check the PG and CPU requirements under the fitting page in the item info.
If you want to tank then you need to fit your tank first and then put the best weaponry you can fit on. Also you want to try to maintian unity in your weapon selection. If you want to gank then you want to fit the best guns possible first, then damage mods, tracking mods, mods to assist your cap, and if room is left then fit a tank or none at all.
I hope this will be of additional help. I tried to not get to particular to avoid handing out incorrect info.
Slade
 Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Please go sit in the corner, and dont forget to don the shame-on-you-hat!
≡v≡ |
Tzar'rim
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Posted - 2008.12.12 01:13:00 -
[5]
Per usual one of the most important stats is forgotten; tracking.
Tracking = damage. Again, tracking = damage. The lighter guns are easier to fit, have better tracking and worse range and damage. Thing is that most of the time the difference in outright damage is just 5% and while you lose range by getting a smaller gun, you gain tracking (and the possiblity to get a more balanced fit on your ship).
So "fitting the biggest gun you can find" is in most situations the wrong way to do it because it means you tracking is lower and you are limited in your setup options.
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Tai Paktu
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2008.12.12 01:25:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Tzar'rim
Per usual one of the most important stats is forgotten; tracking.
Tracking = damage. Again, tracking = damage.
This. Oh God, this.
Tracking is seriously underrated in EvE. One of the only reasons that the Neutron-fit Gankthron can be as effective as it is, is because of that 7.5% per level tracking bonus. Without it, Neutrons have a hard time hitting for crap.
OP, learn to manage your transversal and range and you'll be alright.
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Slade Trillgon
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2008.12.12 01:34:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Slade Trillgon on 12/12/2008 01:35:15
Originally by: Tzar'rim
Per usual one of the most important stats is forgotten; tracking.
Tracking = damage. Again, tracking = damage. The lighter guns are easier to fit, have better tracking and worse range and damage. Thing is that most of the time the difference in outright damage is just 5% and while you lose range by getting a smaller gun, you gain tracking (and the possiblity to get a more balanced fit on your ship).
So "fitting the biggest gun you can find" is in most situations the wrong way to do it because it means you tracking is lower and you are limited in your setup options.
So if you read what I typed up would you say what I said is wrong, misleading, or neutral considering I said fit the "best" gun possible when I spoke of gank setups. Also, would you say what I said about tank set ups was of any use?
Trying to figure out, if in my still limited knowledge, if I should not post on these type of topics.
Slade
Originally by: Niccolado Starwalker
Please go sit in the corner, and dont forget to don the shame-on-you-hat!
≡v≡ |
Tzar'rim
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Posted - 2008.12.12 01:44:00 -
[8]
But that's the point; the 'best' gun isn't neccesarily the biggest one, it depends on the situation and the target. One shouldn't fit to maximize a number (dps in this case), once should fit to augment a tactic and scenario.
If a BS doesn't get bonus to tracking and it fits the biggest short range guns it's going to have SERIOUS tracking problems. Not only does it directly influence damage because of the basic chance to hit, but also because the chance to hit affects the quality of the hit. And that's not even talking about trying to hit undersized targets, same thing for cruisers trying to hit frigs or frigs attacking drones.
Also; I wasn't replying to you directly (otherwise I'd have quoted you) but more in general.
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Mara Rinn
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.12.12 03:33:00 -
[9]
One problem I have with blasters is simply that you have to spend so much time closing in on your enemy before you can actually use the blasters.
For what it's worth, my Dominix pilot uses rail guns and sentry drones. She burns away or warps in to extreme range (50km), plonks the sentry drones down, and proceeds to tear shreds off everything (even frigates). The trick here is that railguns have atrocious tracking, but at 50km away a frigate can be orbiting my ship at 15km, doing 3km/s and the railguns and sentry drones will still be able to track it quite happily (with or without webifier).
The best way to figure out what is the appropriate weapon for your designated target is to fit the biggest, baddest ones first (Neutron Blaster Cannon), try shooting your target. Watch the log - how many times did you miss? How many times did you hit? How many times did you do better than hit - criticals, wrecking shots, etc. Now go fit the Electron Blaster Cannons and try shooting your designated targets. Watch the log again. Which weapon system gives you the greatest DPS? Use that one for gank. Just remove a turret or two when you're fitting for tank.
Note that if you can fit four Neutron Blaster Cannons, it's going to be easy enough to fit five Ion Blaster Cannons - you might even squeeze six Electron Blaster Cannons into the available PG/CPU. Due to their higher rate of fire, the extra cannon(s) might actually give you more DPS than the Neutron Blasters. Don't be fooled by the faster tracking on the lesser turrets though - they track faster, but can't shoot as far - meaning that your targets will effectively be tracking faster to start with.
The only way to be sure what works for you is to fit your ship out, and take it for a spin. Use NPCs in missions or duel your friends to figure out what works best for you.
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F'nog
Amarr
Celestial Horizon Corp.
Celestial Industrial Alliance
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Posted - 2008.12.12 06:47:00 -
[10]
I agree with Tzar about tracking. That's why I prefer the middle choice for most weapons.
But when people complain about the range of the smaller blasters I just laugh. With AM ammo, we're talking about basically nothing here, no matter the ship class. So who cares if one isn't as long range as another. You still have to be in their face to use it.
Maybe if you want to use Iron, there's something to think about. But I just know why people care. Range with blasters is the least of my considerations.
Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari
F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
Originally by: Chribba
Go F'nog! You're a hero! Not a Zero!  /me bows
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Tai Paktu
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2008.12.13 10:02:00 -
[11]
Just use Null. A decently skilled Neutron Mega should be able to hit out to 20km or with Null loaded. Granted, that's deep in fall-off but it could be worse, you could have Barrgae loaded. The argument could (and has) been made that at that range, a Null Blasterboat becomes a less efficient knock-off of a Pulseboat. Different flavours to different tastes and all that.
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Aion Amarra
Minmatar
New Eden Research Organisation
StarFleet Federation
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Posted - 2008.12.13 14:36:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Aion Amarra on 13/12/2008 14:36:11
As for the tracking, I'd like to note that this is -very- relevant to blasters (and probably to autocannons as well, I'm not skilled to use them), and not very relevant to Pulse Lasers. Amarr ships tend to fit the largest closerange guns without issues, and they track well enough to hit stuff at their optimals.
In PvE, they do a decent job of toasting anything as long as it doesn't get to close. (You have drones to clean up stray frigates). BS are toast at pretty much any range within optimal.
In PvP, you're doing something wrong when trying to hit an inty that is already tackling you with your main guns, without at least having a scrambler and double webs on it. (Unlikely unless you're for some reason PvPing in a Paladin. What the hell are you doing PvPing in a Paladin?)
Mind that in usual fleet warfare you'll fit your BS with long range guns anyway, so the tracking question is kinda moot.
EDIT: Mostly posted this not to answer the OP, but to make sure that newbies that read this do not get confused.
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Kessiaan
Minmatar
Army of One
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Posted - 2008.12.13 15:22:00 -
[13]
Everything that was said above, especially about tracking.
Generally I've found the high PG/CPU requirements of neutrons just aren't worth it most of the time, unless you're doing something unusual like putting light blasters on a cruiser, where it has plenty of grid for them.
Ions will track better, and with a magstab do more damage and still use less grid. On larger hulls that have the slots to fit two or three magstabs electron blasters will do just as much damage as neutrons and leave enough PG to fit something resembling a tank.
... besides, I've said all I'm going to say. You're reading my sig now! Bwa!
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