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Dirty Wizard
The Geedunk Expedition
2
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Posted - 2011.09.13 15:53:00 -
[1] - Quote
So I was told that it's absolutely necessary to fly either a logistics ship or a pirate faction battleship in order to do Incursion content. Anything less is insufficient.
Is this true?
Is a pirate faction battleship esssential to do Incursion content?
What about navy issue BS's or marauders
I'd like to know now before dropping the money for an expensive ship that isn't truely necessary.
(I'm not going solo on this, we do have a team of players going at it). |
gfldex
0
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Posted - 2011.09.13 15:56:00 -
[2] - Quote
Dirty Wizard wrote:(I'm not going solo on this, we do have a team of players going at it).
If none of the players in your team can answer your questions about incursions you should not use expensive ships to run them.
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Esna Pitoojee
Knighthood of the Merciful Crown
0
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Posted - 2011.09.13 16:10:00 -
[3] - Quote
Alright, the short answer is no - I see plenty of people flying Ravens, Maelstroms, shield-tanked Megas, etc... just make sure you're in a very-high-DPS boat with a good number of turrets or launchers on it.
Long answer: While not strictly neccesary, being in a faction BS vastly improves your incursion experience in two major ways. First, when a "pickup" fleet is looking to get people, they're going to pick that pirate BS over a standard T1 one (and if there are a lot of people wanting to get in that day, you may be at the back of a long line). Second, you'll simply run through incursion sites far faster, which aside from simply speeding up your moneymaking also also betters your chances of beating a fleet contesting your fleet on a site.
Lastly... as was said, there should be people who are able to answer this for you. If not, well... may want to hold off on that Mach or Vindicator for a bit? |
Dirty Wizard
The Geedunk Expedition
2
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Posted - 2011.09.13 16:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
Esna Pitoojee wrote:
Lastly... as was said, there should be people who are able to answer this for you. If not, well... may want to hold off on that Mach or Vindicator for a bit?
Well my corp mates were the ones who told me that a pirate faction BS is absolutely necessary. I just didn't know if that was a true statement or just overkill.
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Xercodo
Xovoni Directorate
50
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Posted - 2011.09.13 16:46:00 -
[5] - Quote
Nah a Tier 3 BS will do fine
It might not punch out the same DPS or tank but it'll work
The Drake is a Lie |
Mr LaForge
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
47
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Posted - 2011.09.13 19:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
a Mael, Mega, or even a Rokh will do in a pinch. Hell I've even seen good Hype fits because of the mid slot count they have. Pirate faction ships get certain bonuses that make them attractive.
Having said that a Paladin combines the best of a Nightmare and a Vindicator into one ship and is a Marauder. |
Ackbarre
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
5
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Posted - 2011.09.13 19:47:00 -
[7] - Quote
Really the best ships to use for Incursions aren't Battleships at all. It's better to use a T3 since they have a smaller sig radius and will take less damage than a BS. Plus can tanked to close to a BS in EHP. The Legion can be tanked to around 130k EHP and can do 600 DPS with a smaller sig radius than any BS. The Loki with the Immobility Drivers subs are very handy too. Everyone already knows about Tengus and how tanky they can be. But really I've seen all manner of ships used for Incursions including Recons and Command Ships. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
16
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Posted - 2011.09.13 19:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
A few reasons the Nightmare is preferred:
* It shield tanks well, and shield reps happen at the start of a cycle and take less time, so repping is easier when targets change.
* It has really great range with tachyons.
* It does EM / therm damage which Sanshas are weak to.
* It is fairly fast, which can negate a portion of the incoming damage.
However, I don't think there is a requirement for it though.
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gfldex
0
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Posted - 2011.09.13 20:06:00 -
[9] - Quote
Xercodo wrote:Nah a Tier 3 BS will do fine
It might not punch out the same DPS or tank but it'll work
It's indeed pretty hard to beat an Abaddon when it comes to hurt them Incursion Sanshas. |
gfldex
0
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Posted - 2011.09.13 20:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tau Cabalander wrote:
* It does EM / therm damage which Sanshas are weak to.
Incursion Sanshas have uniform resistances.
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Large Collidable Object
morons.
Interstellar Hobos
174
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Posted - 2011.09.13 20:09:00 -
[11] - Quote
Tau Cabalander wrote:
* It does EM / therm damage which Sanshas are weak to.
Whilst that is true for normal Sansha, Incursion Sansha have a uniform tank, just as they deal uniform damage...
Edit: too slow - damn slow ipad...
morons are recruiting. You know who you are! |
Lady Go Diveher
The Independent Troll Society
15
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Posted - 2011.09.13 22:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
Quote:* It shield tanks well, and shield reps happen at the start of a cycle and take less time, so repping is easier when targets change.
The difference only matters if you're in a squishy ship in the mothershio fight. Elsewhere, the cycle time is of negligible importance.
Quote:* It has really great range with tachyons.
Until they're balanced, incursions = vanguards. To which you'll want pulse lasers.
Quote:* It does EM / therm damage which Sanshas are weak to.
It's already been said . . .
Quote:* It is fairly fast, which can negate a portion of the incoming damage.
Two issues:
a) On vanguards you won't move.
b) Where you are moving, you'll be webbed to fuckery if you are targeted, making your speed unimportant.
Have you actually done any of these? 
To the OP:
If you're doing them with friends .. then form the fleet with them and tell them to **** themselves sideways with their eliteness. A Maelstrom performs fine in place of a Machariel, and the others have a vaguely T1 shoe in too.
If you're running in the fleets found in BTL .... yeah you'll not get picked up quickly as they can't see past pirate battleships (despite issues like gun sig radius and tracking meaning a ******* Cane will out DPS them in most sites FFS) and you'll quickly get bored.
The funny thing with those channels is that there will be enough people spamming their fits into the channel at any one time to form 3 or more fleets, yet they're all sitting on their dicks waiting for an "FC" to approve and come show them how to shoot predictable rats.
Your best bet, is to gain a little confidence and do them yourself with friends. |
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Industrial Complex
Cosmic Consortium
57
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Posted - 2011.09.14 02:23:00 -
[13] - Quote
There are two basic types of ship you'll be flying in Incursions: DPS or Logistics. There are other specialised types ("anchor" in some fleets, off-grid boosters, fire support, etc), but the basics are either lots of DPS, or logistics.
The single concern of every ship on grid is to have enough buffer to allow logistics to repair you before you blow up. For cruisers, this will be about 30k EHP, for battleships you want 90k EHP, and for all ships you want high resistances across the board. After that you need to look at delivering effective DPS to the targets you will be facing.
Here's a Hurricane fit from the BTL Incursion site.
Here's a Nightmare fit from the same site.
Note that many fleets will end up with specialist ships such as a Vindicator, Huginn or Loki which has the job of webbing targets for the battleships to hit. There will be ships who target paint targets for the fleet, etc. All fittings need to take into account the abilities of the rest of the fleet, so it doesn't necessarily make sense to pick cookie-cutter fittings from these sites. That Nightmare won't need a webifier fitted if you have a specialist webber in the fleet - let the Loki do the webbing, which allows the Nightmare to fit more tank or DPS mods. The Nightmare pilot might feel the webber allows his drones to kill nearby frigates more easily. For every design choice there is an alternative choice that is just as valid.
The fascination with pirate faction ships seems to be due to the relative ease of fitting for a combination of "sufficient tank" and "lots of DPS" (with the Vindicator and Bhaalgorn being obvious standouts for their webifier bonuses). With sufficient DPS you can finish Vanguard sites in a few minutes (from the time you activate the acceleration gate to the time you're warping out: less than five minutes). With low DPS you will take tens of minutes to finish a Vanguard site, to the point that other fleets will enter and finish the site while you're still pecking away at one of the cruisers or battleships. Thus if you have low DPS you'll find that you "lose" sites and waste a lot of your time.
I'm only getting into incursions myself. I would recommend reading through incursion guides such as the BTL Incursions site.
Note that when I mention "DPS" in this post, what I really means is "DPS effectively delivered to a target". It's no use having an EFT DPS of 1050 when you can't get any shots to hit a target because it's moving too fast. Thus the number of tracking bonuses on that Nightmare, and the use of specialist webifying/target painting ships.
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ChromeStriker
2
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Posted - 2011.09.14 08:47:00 -
[14] - Quote
@OP- dude/dudet iv see people fly shield baddons, armour rokh's, and even the odd scorp IN FLEETS! someone will take you somewhere eventually... of course if your in a better ship your more likely to get picked and not get weird looks
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Nulla Curas |
Aryndel Vyst
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
46
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Posted - 2011.09.14 13:31:00 -
[15] - Quote
Dear OP. Come find us and we'll show you how to incursion. We're a helpful bunch! |
Taedrin
Kushan Industrial
8
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Posted - 2011.09.14 13:46:00 -
[16] - Quote
Aryndel Vyst wrote:Dear OP. Come find us and we'll show you how to incursion. We're a helpful bunch!
Sadly, while goons can sometimes be helpful, most of the time they are just trying to blow you up.
I would be very wary about any offers of "help" from a goon. While generally I am in full support of their goonish activities, I would prefer if they try to avoid 'griefing' newbies who are asking for help in the New Citizens Q&A forum. |
Ackbarre
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
5
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Posted - 2011.09.14 22:34:00 -
[17] - Quote
Taedrin wrote:Aryndel Vyst wrote:Dear OP. Come find us and we'll show you how to incursion. We're a helpful bunch! Sadly, while goons can sometimes be helpful, most of the time they are just trying to blow you up. I would be very wary about any offers of "help" from a goon. While generally I am in full support of their goonish activities, I would prefer if they try to avoid 'griefing' newbies who are asking for help in the New Citizens Q&A forum.
We just want love too. And we want to share our love of newbies to all newbies. |
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