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Expect more sov-space backstabs.

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Liz Laser	Posted - 2009.02.05 19:52:00 - [1] Many 0.0 Sov-space alliances are going to see their drudges heading off to wormhole space. Wormhole space doesn't have Sovereignity, and will have the T3 materials everyone wants. I believe that the knowledge of this helped fuel the backstab that is currently in the headlines, and I suspect that as the realization sets in that 0.0 sov-space is soon to be yesterday's news, a lot more people are going to be emboldened to sever ties and get whatever isk and infamy they can in the process.
Sun Clausewitz	Posted - 2009.02.05 19:53:00 - [2] Originally by: Liz Laser Many 0.0 Sov-space alliances are going to see their drudges heading off to wormhole space. Wormhole space doesn't have Sovereignity, and will have the T3 materials everyone wants. I believe that the knowledge of this helped fuel the backstab that is currently in the headlines, and I suspect that as the realization sets in that 0.0 sov-space is soon to be yesterday's news, a lot more people are going to be emboldened to sever ties and get whatever isk and infamy they can in the process. ummm.... no
Kahega Amielden Minmatar Suddenly Ninjas	Posted - 2009.02.05 19:58:00 - [3] I doubt it. Mass limitations and such and the randomness of wormholes will keep it more or less for small gangs. Also, it will be profitable ,but there's no way it will be better than dyspro moons. Originally by: Catharacta My CNR runs on salvager tears.
mcnuggetlol Amarr Outlandish Operations	Posted - 2009.02.05 19:59:00 - [4] Originally by: Kahega Amielden I doubt it. Mass limitations and such and the randomness of wormholes will keep it more or less for small gangs. Also, it will be profitable ,but there's no way it will be better than dyspro moons. It'll be too unreliable to be a constant source of income for alliances.
Liz Laser	Posted - 2009.02.05 20:00:00 - [5] Edited by: Liz Laser on 05/02/2009 20:00:55 Originally by: Kahega Amielden I doubt it. Mass limitations and such and the randomness of wormholes will keep it more or less for small gangs. Also, it will be profitable ,but there's no way it will be better than dyspro moons. Dyspro moons don't drop T3 blueprints or T3 materials. So why is guarding one more valuable than ratting in wormholes?
Liz Laser	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:24:00 - [6] Originally by: mcnuggetlol Originally by: Kahega Amielden I doubt it. Mass limitations and such and the randomness of wormholes will keep it more or less for small gangs. Also, it will be profitable ,but there's no way it will be better than dyspro moons. It'll be too unreliable to be a constant source of income for alliances. Well, the only reliable source of Tech 2 BPOs was a rogue dev. Assuming we all face equal and fair UNreliability of Tech 3 BPO drops, why won't the first few people to get them be sitting on much nicer thrones than any in sov space? I really think that sov-space will be yesterday's news. If Tech 3 is the end all / be all for the next year or two, then the only thing sovereignity has to offer is a reliable place to use and research blueprints. Frankly, it doesn't seem that hard to find manufacturing and research space in empire, so its only a convenience.
Sky Grunthor Minmatar The Dead Parrot Shoppe Inc.	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:26:00 - [7] why are you assuming they will drop bpo's? They could just as easily drop 3 run bpc's exclusively like officer spawns do. ------------------------------------------------- Search: Sky Grunthor
Elysarian Minmatar dudetruck corp	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:28:00 - [8] Originally by: Liz Laser Originally by: mcnuggetlol Originally by: Kahega Amielden I doubt it. Mass limitations and such and the randomness of wormholes will keep it more or less for small gangs. Also, it will be profitable ,but there's no way it will be better than dyspro moons. It'll be too unreliable to be a constant source of income for alliances. Well, the only reliable source of Tech 2 BPOs was a rogue dev. Assuming we all face equal and fair UNreliability of Tech 3 BPO drops, why won't the first few people to get them be sitting on much nicer thrones than any in sov space? I really think that sov-space will be yesterday's news. If Tech 3 is the end all / be all for the next year or two, then the only thing sovereignity has to offer is a reliable place to use and research blueprints. Frankly, it doesn't seem that hard to find manufacturing and research space in empire, so its only a convenience. If holding 0.0 is a good source of income at the moment then the same people who hold ISK now will be the ones able to buy T3 BPO's & materials from the small gangs & solo players who explore W-Space surely? ===================================== It smells of spoon! =====================================
Liz Laser	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:32:00 - [9] Depends on the ambitions of those intrepid explorers, I guess. It's an industrialist's dream. But a ratter may just sell it to the highest bidder.
Alora Venoda GalTech Whiskey Creek Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:35:00 - [10] well, 0.0 has fancy ores that you can't find in empire. it also has fancy loots... but if T3 makes all those obsolete, then 0.0 will be left to the bottom feeders... and a new era of chaos will begin as vast areas of 0.0 go unclaimed, no intel channels, no red/blue standings... but i highly doubt that big alliances will just let go of their controlled space. it's not just about controlling the resources, but also having a place to call their own. plus it doesn't look like w-space will contain very many actual isk faucets... and those rats in 0.0 will still have an important purpose.
Guillame Herschel Gallente Buffalo Soldiers	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:44:00 - [11] Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Liz Laser	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:46:00 - [12] Originally by: Alora Venoda but i highly doubt that big alliances will just let go of their controlled space. it's not just about controlling the resources, but also having a place to call their own. plus it doesn't look like w-space will contain very many actual isk faucets... and those rats in 0.0 will still have an important purpose. I'm not saying no one will inhabit sov-space and just let it go. I'm saying that if people perceive it will be second in desirability to wormhole-space and that controlling huge swaths of 0.0 sov-space is non-essential, you have all the ingredients for making more sov-space backstabs a likely occurrence. Have pockets full of stolen isk and cut ties to yesterday's news and head into a bright shining future with an infamy that you just can't buy, even from gold sellers. :-)
Elysarian Minmatar dudetruck corp	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:53:00 - [13] Originally by: Liz Laser Originally by: Alora Venoda but i highly doubt that big alliances will just let go of their controlled space. it's not just about controlling the resources, but also having a place to call their own. plus it doesn't look like w-space will contain very many actual isk faucets... and those rats in 0.0 will still have an important purpose. I'm not saying no one will inhabit sov-space and just let it go. I'm saying that if people perceive it will be second in desirability to wormhole-space and that controlling huge swaths of 0.0 sov-space is non-essential, you have all the ingredients for making more sov-space backstabs a likely occurrence. Have pockets full of stolen isk and cut ties to yesterday's news and head into a bright shining future with an infamy that you just can't buy, even from gold sellers. :-) ...or Controlling masses of null-sec == good as you have more options for wormhole openings inside space you control?
Liz Laser	Posted - 2009.02.05 22:58:00 - [14] Originally by: Elysarian ...or Controlling masses of null-sec == good as you have more options for wormhole openings inside space you control?[/quote Damn you and your intelligent insights! Now I have to do the math to see how much of the universe is sov-space compared to how much is empire. Of course, that's only important if you WANT to come back from wormhole space. It will be interesting to see how many Alice's drop through the rabbit hole and never want to leave.
Wolfgang Achari	Posted - 2009.02.05 23:03:00 - [15] Originally by: Elysarian Originally by: Liz Laser Originally by: Alora Venoda but i highly doubt that big alliances will just let go of their controlled space. it's not just about controlling the resources, but also having a place to call their own. plus it doesn't look like w-space will contain very many actual isk faucets... and those rats in 0.0 will still have an important purpose. I'm not saying no one will inhabit sov-space and just let it go. I'm saying that if people perceive it will be second in desirability to wormhole-space and that controlling huge swaths of 0.0 sov-space is non-essential, you have all the ingredients for making more sov-space backstabs a likely occurrence. Have pockets full of stolen isk and cut ties to yesterday's news and head into a bright shining future with an infamy that you just can't buy, even from gold sellers. :-) ...or Controlling masses of null-sec == good as you have more options for wormhole openings inside space you control? iirc, wormholes in high-sec can lead to the same wormhole space as 0.0 wormholes. So controlling more nullsec space only means that the wormholes you find could potentially have fewer people that use the same wormhole you did to get into it. Of course that's not a guarantee since you should be able to find shortcuts from high-sec to nullsec via wormholes.
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.02.05 23:05:00 - [16] Edited by: Zeba on 05/02/2009 23:06:35 Originally by: Guillame Herschel Hehehe. 'right-click' save as.
Shirley Estyre	Posted - 2009.02.05 23:17:00 - [17] you all missing 1 point. some w-systems will have dyspro moons ;-)
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.02.05 23:20:00 - [18] Originally by: Shirley Estyre you all missing 1 point. some w-systems will have dyspro moons ;-) With an even harder logistics chain to get it to empire than from 0.0 so no it will not be a significant source. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Washell Olivaw	Posted - 2009.02.05 23:37:00 - [19] Originally by: Liz Laser Edited by: Liz Laser on 05/02/2009 20:00:55 Originally by: Kahega Amielden I doubt it. Mass limitations and such and the randomness of wormholes will keep it more or less for small gangs. Also, it will be profitable ,but there's no way it will be better than dyspro moons. Dyspro moons don't drop T3 blueprints or T3 materials. So why is guarding one more valuable than ratting in wormholes? T3: Cruiser sized modular ships T2: Frig, destroyer, cruiser, battlecruiser and battleship sized ships and almost every module in the game. Yes, dyspro moons will be worthless... Originally by: Signature Everybody has a photographic memory, some people just don't have film.
Alora Venoda GalTech Whiskey Creek Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.06 00:00:00 - [20] Originally by: Zeba Originally by: Shirley Estyre you all missing 1 point. some w-systems will have dyspro moons ;-) With an even harder logistics chain to get it to empire than from 0.0 so no it will not be a significant source. well, if you consider how cheap it is to setup a small tower and fuel it for a week compared to how much dysp you can harvest in that same amount of time... heck just collecting dysp for 2 days at even half of the current price would more than pay for the tower, and you can haul back the goods in a single blockade runner... the price of dysp would have to plummet to below 10% of its current value before it would be a waste. ofc if the Sleepers decide to siege any towers that are anchored... well that's a whole different story. ~~~~ ~~~~ ~~~~ Take away the risk and it would make flying around in space utterly pointless. Take away the flying around part and you make EVE into a space themed spreadsheet application.
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.02.06 00:05:00 - [21] Originally by: Alora Venoda ofc if the Sleepers decide to siege any towers that are anchored... well that's a whole different story. This is the exact situation I'll be waiting to be tossed on the forums after someone sets one up cause in the dev blog thread the devs were being pretty brassy about 'yeah you can anchor a tower in w-space but snicker snicker try holding it' then never commented on it again. inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan
Alora Venoda GalTech Whiskey Creek Alliance	Posted - 2009.02.06 00:25:00 - [22] Originally by: Zeba Originally by: Alora Venoda ofc if the Sleepers decide to siege any towers that are anchored... well that's a whole different story. This is the exact situation I'll be waiting to be tossed on the forums after someone sets one up cause in the dev blog thread the devs were being pretty brassy about 'yeah you can anchor a tower in w-space but snicker snicker try holding it' then never commented on it again. yup, i would be amazed to see an NPC fire up a cyno and some huge Sleeper cap ship shows up and pwns my tower. the awesomeness of the sight alone would be worth the effort.
Liz Laser	Posted - 2009.02.06 00:42:00 - [23] Originally by: Alora Venodayup, i would be amazed to see an NPC fire up a cyno and some huge Sleeper cap ship shows up and pwns my tower. the awesomeness of the sight alone would be worth the effort.[/quote Definitely worth the price of the subscription, if you're there to witness it.
Jack Jombardo Amarr Alternative Realities	Posted - 2009.02.06 01:10:00 - [24] Some thinks must be considert: - CCP knows how important the T2 market is for many players (pilots and producer) - T3 was mentioned to be in the middle of T1 and T2 - there will be only Cruiser-size hulls (no intis/ew/assaults, no T2 BS/BC) So after the first "hype" most player will get back to normal business and old 0.0 will for sure not be irelevant. Some player/corps/allys might focus on the new space but most will stay in old space. It might happen, that here and there a hole opens where new allys can catch a system/constelation but most sovs will stay the same after 10th March.
Gunnanmon Gallente UNITED STAR SYNDICATE	Posted - 2009.02.06 01:12:00 - [25] Originally by: Sun Clausewitz Originally by: Liz Laser Many 0.0 Sov-space alliances are going to see their drudges heading off to wormhole space. Wormhole space doesn't have Sovereignity, and will have the T3 materials everyone wants. I believe that the knowledge of this helped fuel the backstab that is currently in the headlines, and I suspect that as the realization sets in that 0.0 sov-space is soon to be yesterday's news, a lot more people are going to be emboldened to sever ties and get whatever isk and infamy they can in the process. ummm.... no Sun says you're wrong. So I guess you're wrong.
Jack Jombardo Amarr Alternative Realities	Posted - 2009.02.06 01:16:00 - [26] Originally by: Alora Venoda Originally by: Zeba Originally by: Alora Venoda ofc if the Sleepers decide to siege any towers that are anchored... well that's a whole different story. This is the exact situation I'll be waiting to be tossed on the forums after someone sets one up cause in the dev blog thread the devs were being pretty brassy about 'yeah you can anchor a tower in w-space but snicker snicker try holding it' then never commented on it again. yup, i would be amazed to see an NPC fire up a cyno and some huge Sleeper cap ship shows up and pwns my tower. the awesomeness of the sight alone would be worth the effort. Would be cool AI but I'd rather see it in combination with the random wormholes. You can bring a tower, some moduls and fuel ... but will you ever find the way back from old space to exact this system? Who knows :)
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.02.06 01:26:00 - [27] Originally by: Jack Jombardo Would be cool AI but I'd rather see it in combination with the random wormholes. You can bring a tower, some moduls and fuel ... but will you ever find the way back from old space to exact this system? Who knows :) Well logistics will be moar difficult but nowhere near impossible to do efficiently. Once setup in the w-system all you do is have your prober scan a new wormhole and poke his head through it. If it leads to empire then pop an indy through with the loots to contract to a trade alt and then refill stocks from the nearest suppliers. If the indy gets had a bit of bad luck and gets stuck in empire just scan for another wormhole and have the indy get to it asap. Tbh i see a nice little distributed market system poping up in random higg sec systems to cash in on just this kind of situation. Indy pops out of w-space and runs a market check as the clock is ticking. So any merchants who happen to have the needed pos fuel and other common consumables close to the hole should be able to sell/buy at a markup to the frantic indy pilot. At least thats my reasoning for currently seeding small amounts of ammo and other consumable stocks around empire.

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