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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Maddy Joringer
United Society of Xziles The Skeleton Crew
0
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:07:00 -
[1] - Quote
How do u defend against Gankers ? am a new player and i honestly got no clue....
Yesterday i saw a known ganker come into a system and there was nothing i could do about it, coz if i ever attacked him i would get blown up by concord... I was actually thinking in the lines of creating an anti ganking unit or.... Miner protection squads...but. I don't have a clue how to do it if concord gets in the way ....
BTW..am brand new..... |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
363
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 08:10:00 -
[2] - Quote
As soon as the ganker shoots you in highsec, they get a GCC, which allows other players to shoot them for 15 minutes, meaning any player who is nearby that wants to shoot back at the ganker can go right ahead. CONCORD just prevents you from pre-emptively shooting at the ganker without having the same set of consequences they do when they gank. |
Maddy Joringer
United Society of Xziles The Skeleton Crew
0
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:13:00 -
[3] - Quote
Snow Axe wrote:As soon as the ganker shoots you in highsec, they get a GCC, which allows other players to shoot them for 15 minutes, meaning any player who is nearby that wants to shoot back at the ganker can go right ahead. CONCORD just prevents you from pre-emptively shooting at the ganker without having the same set of consequences they do when they gank.
Any ganker which shoots me in highsec is gonna get blown up by concord or me .. Gankers are suicide squads..the Trick is to preemptively attack them.... there is no point shooting a suicide bomber after he has blown himself up....
Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this.... |
Frying Doom
Tinfoil Hat News Ltd.
269
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
If you are a new player you really have nothing to worry about.
Your gear will not be expensive enough to make ganking worth it. Any Spelling, gramatical and literary errors made by me are included free of charge.
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Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
363
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:Any ganker which shoots me in highsec is gonna get blown up by concord or me .. Gankers are suicide squads..the Trick is to preemptively attack them.... there is no point shooting a suicide bomber after he has blown himself up....
Oh ok then guess you've got this all figured out fly safe o7o7o7
Maddy Joringer wrote:Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this....
I like how you're new and yet you've already figured out how Eve works.
Hint: you have no clue how Eve works |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
717
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
The key is to remove CONCORD so that suicide gankers can be preemptively attacked. eh |
Spikeflach
Echo's of Liberty Dominatus Atrum Mortis
61
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:19:00 -
[7] - Quote
There isn't much you can do, unfortunately. there is the 15m GCC, but usually the ganker just docks up and lets the timer run out.
Though there is a very very small window of opportunity to shoot the ganker before concord pops the ganker when the ganker has initiated his gank. Chances are you might pop him, but he may still manage to gank his target.
Only real defense being offense is wardecs which if its a npc corp alt ganking character makes that idea go out the window. |
Spikeflach
Echo's of Liberty Dominatus Atrum Mortis
61
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:21:00 -
[8] - Quote
Snow Axe wrote:
I like how you're new and yet you've already figured out how Eve works.
Hint: you have no clue how Eve works
People tell you that you have no clue how eve works. This is how eve works. |
Maddy Joringer
United Society of Xziles The Skeleton Crew
0
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:22:00 -
[9] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this....
I like how you're new and yet you've already figured out how Eve works.
Hint: you have no clue how Eve works[/quote]
So your saying i can shoot at a Ganker before he attacks an Exhumer without me getting killed ? If so how ?
Next time give a reply with some proper information rather than cheap shots.. am looking for a proper discussion and not a mud slinging contest |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
363
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 08:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
Spikeflach wrote:People tell you that you have no clue how eve works. This is how eve works.
That and "brand new" players having game mechanics and defenses all figured out - well, enough to ask for more nerfs, anyway. |
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Brinxter
Bite Me inc Exhale.
4
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:23:00 -
[11] - Quote
Or you could let him blow you up one time in a cheap ship, then hunt him down for killrights :P |
Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
717
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:24:00 -
[12] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:So your saying i can shoot at a Ganker before he attacks an Exhumer without me getting killed ? If so how ?
Next time give a reply with some proper information rather than cheap shots.. am looking for a proper discussion and not a mud slinging contest
Is the ganker -5 or lower? Shoot him.
Is the ganker engaging an exhumer, thus getting a GCC? Shoot him.
Is the ganker being chased by faction police? Shoot him. eh |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
363
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 08:26:00 -
[13] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:So your saying i can shoot at a Ganker before he attacks an Exhumer without me getting killed ? If so how ?
Next time give a reply with some proper information rather than cheap shots.. am looking for a proper discussion and not a mud slinging contest
I tell you that the moment the gankboat opens fire on you, you (or anyone else) can fire back. If you can't figure out how to use that information to your advantage, or if you're unwilling to do 5 minutes of reading just about anywhere to figure out how ganks even work, then you deserve to lose your Exhumer.
BTW, how'd you get an Exhumer if you're "brand new"? That's about a month's worth of focused training to even sit in a hull, let alone do anything with it. |
Maddy Joringer
United Society of Xziles The Skeleton Crew
0
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:28:00 -
[14] - Quote
Richard Desturned wrote:Maddy Joringer wrote:So your saying i can shoot at a Ganker before he attacks an Exhumer without me getting killed ? If so how ?
Next time give a reply with some proper information rather than cheap shots.. am looking for a proper discussion and not a mud slinging contest Is the ganker -5 or lower? Shoot him. Is the ganker engaging an exhumer, thus getting a GCC? Shoot him. Is the ganker being chased by faction police? Shoot him.
The problem is the very narrow window of opportunity... You just need a lot of luck.... If concord does get like removed in which case gradually i do believe the game could get interesting.. Miners would be forced to work together with merc comrps to protect them... would be interesting...
I know the game coz i read a lot about the game before joining.I want to know where i use my money...
I don't have an Exhumer and i have never been a victim of ganking.... Jesus snoz axe . Wtf is with all the hostality..go pour some cold water on ur head |
TheBig Bukowsky
High Safety
35
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:33:00 -
[15] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:How do u defend against Gankers ?
Information is power. If you know them, you can easily avoid them. Join the Hisec anti-gankers public channel. I don't want to keep spaming forums with this. If you're interested feel free to contact me. |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
363
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 08:41:00 -
[16] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:The problem is the very narrow window of opportunity... You just need a lot of luck.... If concord does get like removed in which case gradually i do believe the game could get interesting.. Miners would be forced to work together with merc comrps to protect them... would be interesting...
You don't need luck, you need sensor boosters. |
sweetrock
State War Academy Caldari State
26
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:44:00 -
[17] - Quote
There is no feesable way to protect from gankers, there are items such as ship scanners which tells gankers what your ships fitting is.
If your flying a small ship they will gank you in something small, if your in a freighter and they want to kill you, they come in numbers with larger ships.
You CANNOT defend yourself from gankers what so ever!
The reality is, gank ships are cheap and usuialy flown by alts ot people with massive amounts of isk in thier wallet, they try once and fail, they will come back again on principle and get the job done. |
Maddy Joringer
United Society of Xziles The Skeleton Crew
0
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 08:47:00 -
[18] - Quote
sweetrock wrote:There is no feesable way to protect from gankers, there are items such as ship scanners which tells gankers what your ships fitting is.
If your flying a small ship they will gank you in something small, if your in a freighter and they want to kill you, they come in numbers with larger ships.
You CANNOT defend yourself from gankers what so ever!
The reality is, gank ships are cheap and usuialy flown by alts ot people with massive amounts of isk in thier wallet, they try once and fail, they will come back again on principle and get the job done.
that's sad to hear. this sounds more like an exploit .. IF there is a lack of effective counter for ganking |
RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
1740
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Posted - 2012.06.03 08:57:00 -
[19] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:Snow Axe wrote:As soon as the ganker shoots you in highsec, they get a GCC, which allows other players to shoot them for 15 minutes, meaning any player who is nearby that wants to shoot back at the ganker can go right ahead. CONCORD just prevents you from pre-emptively shooting at the ganker without having the same set of consequences they do when they gank. Any ganker which shoots me in highsec is gonna get blown up by concord or me .. Gankers are suicide squads.. the Trick is to preemptively attack them.... there is no point shooting a suicide bomber after he has blown himself up.... Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this....
A typical gank requires every single one of the 15s CONCORD response time to kill the Hulk. Tank your Hulk and a Nado/Mael fit for blapping dessies will kill enough destroyers to keep your hulk alive for the duration of the gank.
Here are some other options you might try during this trying time.
1. Continue Mining like normal and Accept the losses 2. Continue Mining as normal but in a Covetor and Accept the losses 3. Mine in a Rokh, comfortably immune* to Suicide Ganks 4. Tank your Hulk and Accept a lower number of Losses from edge case profit based ganks. 5. Tank your Hulk with RR and be comfortable immune to Suicide Ganks 6. Mine in a Normally Fit Hulk but use a short range D-Scan to escape ganks 7. Set up safespots such that you can maintain a rough orbit in range of a roid by aligning to each BM in turn 8. Set up Hulks to Web each other, mine aligned to 1 SS at 7m/s (warpable speed) (can be done @ max yield) 9. Watch local for known gankers, accept the occasional gank from unknown ganks 10. Mine in Mission pockets 11. Mine in Grav Sites, occasionally scanning D-Scan 12. Tank your Hulk and have friends in BLAP AC Nados ready to shoot (one should kill a Cat before you die, failing the gank) 13. Tank your Hulk and have friends with ECM 14. Tank your Hulk and run 5x Med ECM drones and accept that you'll die if they fail 15. Mine in Lowsec (can be done solo in a quiet system) 16. Mine in Null (can be done solo in a quiet NPC sov system) 17. Mine in WH space
*all cases of immunity from Suicide Ganks assume profit-based ganks. Non-Profit based ganks are rare and are not something that can be negated by game mechanics changes besides eliminating ganks, thus can be ignored.
All of these options have advantages and disadvantages. All of them will work. Not all of them are perfect.
If ALL of these options do not work for you, please describe your very special situation, and I'll come up with a custom solution or call you names. You know, depending... Single-Shard, Player Driven-áSandbox.
5 words. That's what makes it special. |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
363
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 09:05:00 -
[20] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:that's sad to hear. this sounds more like an exploit .. IF there is a lack of effective counter for ganking
Ganks of all kinds run on a knife's edge - they need to do as much damage as they can within X amount of time (X being CONCORD's response time), but they also need to keep it confined to as small a cost as possible so they won't just lose money doing it over and over again.
Think of it this way: You've got a Hulk (most common gank target), and you end up having 2-3 T1 fit Catalysts try to take you out (T1 fit is the most common for multiples, T2 is reserved generally for solo ganking). They've got the math worked out - they've scanned your ship, they estimate your tank as best they can (you may have implants, or offgrid Orca bonuses) and bring just enough firepower to take you out before CONCORD finishes them off. If you do ANYTHING to disrupt that, a jamming cycle, popping one of them before they finish all of their cycles (remember, they're full gank fit, so they have 0 tank), anything at all, and the gank will fail as they won't have done enough DPS to finish you before CONCORD finishes them.
And remember, that's just one method to deal with them. RubyPorto's list above mine is a far better example of just what's at your disposal to minimize ganking as much as possible. I say minimize though, as nothing is guaranteed in Eve, and you may just run across someone who decides they want you dead, cost be damned. That's a problem you can have in any ship hull, though. |
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Rajan Marelona
Hedion University Amarr Empire
5
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Posted - 2012.06.03 09:11:00 -
[21] - Quote
There are two ways to protect from most suicide gankers : have more tank than they expect you to have, or fly something that is not worth ganking. |
Lexmana
Imperial Stout
508
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 09:45:00 -
[22] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:Snow Axe wrote:As soon as the ganker shoots you in highsec, they get a GCC, which allows other players to shoot them for 15 minutes, meaning any player who is nearby that wants to shoot back at the ganker can go right ahead. CONCORD just prevents you from pre-emptively shooting at the ganker without having the same set of consequences they do when they gank. Any ganker which shoots me in highsec is gonna get blown up by concord or me .. Gankers are suicide squads.. the Trick is to preemptively attack them.... there is no point shooting a suicide bomber after he has blown himself up.... Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this.... A gank fit tornado has even less tank than a max yield hulk. How can it be impossible to gank back? Miners are helpless by choice not by game design. |
Maddy Joringer
United Society of Xziles The Skeleton Crew
5
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 09:50:00 -
[23] - Quote
Lexmana wrote:Maddy Joringer wrote:Snow Axe wrote:As soon as the ganker shoots you in highsec, they get a GCC, which allows other players to shoot them for 15 minutes, meaning any player who is nearby that wants to shoot back at the ganker can go right ahead. CONCORD just prevents you from pre-emptively shooting at the ganker without having the same set of consequences they do when they gank. Any ganker which shoots me in highsec is gonna get blown up by concord or me .. Gankers are suicide squads.. the Trick is to preemptively attack them.... there is no point shooting a suicide bomber after he has blown himself up.... Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this.... A gank fit tornado has even less tank than a max yield hulk. How can it be impossible to gank back? Miners are helpless by choice not by game design.
Gank the gankers ? |
Snow Axe
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
364
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 09:59:00 -
[24] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:Gank the gankers ?
If you like. Wait for them to open fire and killing them back saves you your ship and sec status (which lets you use something more suited to the task). |
Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
93
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 10:04:00 -
[25] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:How do u defend against Gankers ? am a new player and i honestly got no clue....
Yesterday i saw a known ganker come into a system and there was nothing i could do about it, coz if i ever attacked him i would get blown up by concord... I was actually thinking in the lines of creating an anti ganking unit or.... Miner protection squads...but. I don't have a clue how to do it if concord gets in the way ....
BTW..am brand new.....
Short version, you can't shoot it before he gives the first shot to someone.
Then 2 things happen, he becomes global and everyone can shoot including you but at this right moment YOU give his corp/fleet mates the right to hunt you and take you down for 15min.
If you really want to pvp in good conditions without having to use all the perv mechanics of high sec move on to some better place. High sec it's by far the worst form of pvp in this game, Even Wow pvp servers are a lot better, players skill too.
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Romar Agent
Ishukone Regional Headquarters
54
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Posted - 2012.06.03 10:23:00 -
[26] - Quote
Probability defense.
In short: Do not mine where the gankers are.
Needs a little experience and some research. |
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University Minmatar Republic
2299
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 10:24:00 -
[27] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:
Any ganker which shoots me in highsec is gonna get blown up by concord or me .. Gankers are suicide squads..the Trick is to preemptively attack them.... there is no point shooting a suicide bomber after he has blown himself up....
Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this....
Exactly, so the best defense is to just not do any mining and file a complaint with CCP.
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Richard Desturned
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
719
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 10:30:00 -
[28] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:file a complaint with CCP.
Regarding? eh |
Lexmana
Imperial Stout
508
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 10:33:00 -
[29] - Quote
DeMichael Crimson wrote:Maddy Joringer wrote:
Any ganker which shoots me in highsec is gonna get blown up by concord or me .. Gankers are suicide squads..the Trick is to preemptively attack them.... there is no point shooting a suicide bomber after he has blown himself up....
Hence.... the game mechanics favours the gankers too much and makes miners in high sec totally helpless.... CCP should fix this....
Exactly, so the best defense is to just not do any mining and file a complaint with CCP. Because you are entitled to .... what exactly? |
gfldex
541
|
Posted - 2012.06.03 10:43:00 -
[30] - Quote
Maddy Joringer wrote:this sounds more like an exploit .. IF there is a lack of effective counter for ganking
There are very effective ways to counter suicide ganks. But why would we tell you? We _want_ to gank folk who don't even want to spend the few seconds it needs to write a proper, easy to read sentence.
When someone burns down your sandcastle, bring sausages. |
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