Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 50 60 .. 67 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 7 post(s) |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan Turing Tested
2387
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:46:00 -
[841] - Quote
I cant believe I didnt think this thread would give me a sad when I first saw it :( *** Vote MTU For CSM *** "They feel the need to cover their ears and eyes in horror at your very presence." - Pontianak Sythaeryn Omnis nomiom nom nom nomi |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2709
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:48:00 -
[842] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Thanks self. Whether you choose to manufacture for domestic use or export back to high sec market is your own choice. Doesn't change that you will have up to a 20% better margin of minerals to play around with, which outstrips that of a high-sec industrialist. Stark raises a good point on manufacturing slots. But that just slows you down, doesn't stop you from capitalising the same profit eventually if you so wish, and for domestic use and war purposes, that has not been decreased by the change anyways. Takes just as long to manufacture now as it will post-change. I will STILL have logistics costs where highsec players have none, and that 20% is assuming I can get compressed ore at exactly the price of the highsec reprocessed minerals, which is not going to happen. Stop stating the same thing over and over again as if it's suddenly going to be correct one of these days. It's still a massive massive under-simplification of the situation. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20205
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:49:00 -
[843] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Oh, so its a "fact" that 20% better refining efficiency does nothing to enable or disable Null manufacturing? Yes. 20% better refining efficiency enables more ready access to local ores (if you can live with the logistics). It does not enable null manufacturing, nor does it enable null manufacturing to be competitive with highsec. Far more than just minerals (or even a few more minerals) is needed for that to happen.
So here's your homework for today: look up the words GÇ£necessaryGÇ¥ and GÇ£sufficientGÇ¥.
Quote:I'm just not stupid enough Doubtful. Oh, sorry, interrupting people like that is bad mannersGǪQuote:not to recognise the benefits the changes concretely result in for null. You can deny them till you are blue in the face, but its ridiculous to think or perceive otherwise. GǪbut that's just yet another one of your straw arguments, and unless you want to keep being a target of ridicule, you really should stop using those. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2709
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:50:00 -
[844] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:Binary logic in a ternary situation. Good job buddy. What is the ternary of enables and disables? Lets go back to school: en-+a-+ble (-ò-n-üGǦb+Öl) tr.v. en-+a-+bled, en-+a-+bling, en-+a-+bles 1. a. To supply with the means, knowledge, or opportunity; make able: a hole in the fence that enabled us to watch; techniques that enable surgeons to open and repair the heart. b. To make feasible or possible: funds that will enable construction of new schools. 2. To give legal power, capacity, or sanction to: a law enabling the new federal agency. 3. To make operational; activate: enabled the computer's modem; enable a nuclear warhead. My use of the term was appropriate. Tippia is just grasping for straws. Also. GUYS, STOP THE PRESS! ACCORDING TO LUCAS AND TIPPIA THIS IS ACTUALLY A NULL NERF! HOW CAN THIS HAPPEN?! Enable/disable is binary, sure. But a change can enable, disable, or neither enable nor disable null industry. For example, if they put in a change to put a blue star Jita's background somewhere, that change would neither enable or disable null sec industry.
The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Mario Putzo
Welping and Dunking.
406
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:53:00 -
[845] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:
Never said you were a goon, and you don't need to live in nullsec to be a nullsec apologist. There is no reason for passive income to exist on the level it does (and mining is not passive sorry). Supporting making income while off line and not playing is quite comical.
So you are against PI then.
Yes I am. I am against anything that generates potential income while on is not actively logged in and playing the game. This includes PI in HS, LS, NS, and Moons in LS and NS.
But if they are to stay then they need to be rebalanced to better reflect the risk value. IE. Moving all the High Ends to Low Sec and moving the mid ends to Null Sec. Everyone knows that Moons and Planet defense is harder in Low Sec, and that the safety of pilots in system is much lower than anywhere else in space (aside from Worm Holes.) |
Salvos Rhoska
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
416
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:54:00 -
[846] - Quote
Aah, so Tippia and Lucas both agree its a nerf to null then.
Sorry, I was wrong! The changes infact do not benefit null in anyway shape or form!
*waits for enormous groundswell of nullites to resist the impending nerf* *not one raises a finger*
Its funny that your vociferous and pathological resistance to any and all anti-null commentary has come full circle to the point that you perceive even objective assessment and support of the benefits of a change to null, as being anti-null. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2710
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:56:00 -
[847] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote:baltec1 wrote:Mario Putzo wrote:
Never said you were a goon, and you don't need to live in nullsec to be a nullsec apologist. There is no reason for passive income to exist on the level it does (and mining is not passive sorry). Supporting making income while off line and not playing is quite comical.
So you are against PI then. Yes I am. I am against anything that generates income while on is not actively logged in and playing the game. This includes PI in HS, LS, NS, and Moons in LS and NS. But if they are to stay then they need to be rebalanced to better reflect the risk value. IE. Moving all the High Ends to Low Sec and moving the mid ends to Null Sec. Everyone knows that Moons and Planet defense is harder in Low Sec, and that the safety of pilots in system is much lower than anywhere else in space (aside from Worm Holes.) So you are against manufacture, research and the entire market system too?
And the risk in lowsec is not inherent, it occurs due to the type of players that play there. If it's rewards were increased it would attract different players and would be identical to NPC null. If anything, low sec is inherently safer since sentry guns exist which stop frigates freely aggressing at gates and stations. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2710
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 17:58:00 -
[848] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Sorry, I was wrong! Tippia and Lucas have shown that the changes infact do not benefit null in anyway shape or form!
*waits for enormous groundswell of nullites to resist the impending nerf* *not one raises a finger*
Its funny that your vociferous and pathological resistance to any and all anti-null commentary has come full circle to the point that you perceive even objective assessment and support of the benefits of a change to null, as being anti-null.
The entire impetus of these changes is for improving null, yet you are arguing against that. Madness. Wow, you are getting to the bottom of the stupid barrel with this one. Please state where EITHER OF US stated that it's a null nerf.
Let me be absolutely clear, since basic English appears to be beyond you. YES, null industry will be buffed, but NO null industry will not be buffed to the point of being competitive with high sec.
The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan Turing Tested
2388
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:00:00 -
[849] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Sorry, I was wrong! Tippia and Lucas have shown that the changes infact do not benefit null in anyway shape or form!
*waits for enormous groundswell of nullites to resist the impending nerf* *not one raises a finger*
Its funny that your vociferous and pathological resistance to any and all anti-null commentary has come full circle to the point that you perceive even objective assessment and support of the benefits of a change to null, as being anti-null.
The entire impetus of these changes is for improving null, yet you are arguing against that, as if it was not so. Madness.
I have no idea how you came to any of the above conclusions.
I am assuming you are either;
a) Reading threads from an alternate universe
b) Operating on a binary system
c) Failing skill checks
At any rate, you need to take five minutes and have a breather because you already have done half the things you've accused the others of.
So please
Pretty please
With Sugar on top
Clean the ******* car *** Vote MTU For CSM *** "They feel the need to cover their ears and eyes in horror at your very presence." - Pontianak Sythaeryn Omnis nomiom nom nom nomi |
Salvos Rhoska
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
416
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:00:00 -
[850] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:YES, null industry will be buffed, but NO null industry will not be buffed to the point of being competitive with high sec.
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Beneficiaries of the change are: -Null entities capable of financing the refinery efficiency installations -Null sec entitites with renters who now have some degree of added incentive to mine, refine and provide resources to null domestically. -Those renters, to some degree, depending on how sov owners adjust their rent, access to facilities, protection and possivle incenrive programs to ensure a greater flow of minerals from null domestically. -POS owners with compression capability throughout the universe. -Null sec entitites with the infrastructure to manufacture and sell products both to high sec markets, and also some null markets.
Those who stand to lose from the changes are:: -Reprossecors. -Mission/rat/plex runners -Entities currently dependant on what mission/rat/plex runners bring in. -High sec industrialists who now have to compete with null industrialists who have a wider margin owing to the better refinement efficiency in their native space -Miners without personal access to advanced refining facilities, in high sec as their raw output will be suppressed by the margins of compression services, in null sec because you will have to pay for the privilege as rent, which suppresses your profits.
@Ramona McCandless: It was sarcasm. I'm not very good at these games that Lucas and Tippia play. I prefer saying what I mean and meaning what I say. |
|
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2710
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:04:00 -
[851] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:YES, null industry will be buffed, but NO null industry will not be buffed to the point of being competitive with high sec.
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Beneficiaries of the change are: -Null entities capable of financing the refinery efficiency installations -Null sec entitites with renters who now have some degree of added incentive to mine, refine and provide resources to null domestically. -Those renters, to some degree, depending on how sov owners adjust their rent, access to facilities, protection and possivle incenrive programs to ensure a greater flow of minerals from null domestically. -POS owners with compression capability throughout the universe. -Null sec entitites with the infrastructure to manufacture and sell products both to high sec markets, and also some null markets.
Those who stand to lose from the changes are:: -Reprossecors. -Mission/rat/plex runners -Entities currently dependant on what mission/rat/plex runners bring in. -High sec industrialists who now have to compete with null industrialists who have a wider margin owing to the better refinement efficiency in their native space -Miners without personal access to advanced refining facilities, in high sec as their raw output will be suppressed by the margins of compression services, in null sec because you will have to pay for the privilege as rent, which suppresses your profits. @Ramona McCandless: It was sarcasm. I'm not very good at these games that Lucas and Tippia play. I prefer saying what I mean and meaning what I say. Are you serious? You are just going to repost your incorrect list which CLEARLY STATES the aboslute opposite to what I just posted as if that somehow clears things up?
At this point it clear you are just a troll. Go back to your bridge and come back when you either have half a clue about what you are talking about or the desire to engage in an actual discussion on the subject rather than just spamming us with your little list.
The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Salvos Rhoska
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
417
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:06:00 -
[852] - Quote
Lucas Kell wrote:]Are you serious? You are just going to repost your incorrect list which CLEARLY STATES the aboslute opposite to what I just posted as if that somehow clears things up?
It states exactly what you said, but in more detail.
However, since you agree that these changes buff null, please provide your own list of how it does infact buff null.
Go ahead. Do it. Lets see how many points your list disagrees with mine on. |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan Turing Tested
2389
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:06:00 -
[853] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote: @Ramona McCandless: It was sarcasm. I'm not very good at these games that Lucas and Tippia play. I prefer saying what I mean and meaning what I say.
Salvos Rhoska wrote: HERPADERPA DERRR.
Yeah, well I'd stop with that childishness for a start then. *** Vote MTU For CSM *** "They feel the need to cover their ears and eyes in horror at your very presence." - Pontianak Sythaeryn Omnis nomiom nom nom nomi |
Jenn aSide
STK Scientific Initiative Mercenaries
5128
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:06:00 -
[854] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:YES, null industry will be buffed, but NO null industry will not be buffed to the point of being competitive with high sec.
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Beneficiaries of the change are: -Null entities capable of financing the refinery efficiency installations -Null sec entitites with renters who now have some degree of added incentive to mine, refine and provide resources to null domestically. -Those renters, to some degree, depending on how sov owners adjust their rent, access to facilities, protection and possivle incenrive programs to ensure a greater flow of minerals from null domestically. -POS owners with compression capability throughout the universe. -Null sec entitites with the infrastructure to manufacture and sell products both to high sec markets, and also some null markets.
Those who stand to lose from the changes are:: -Reprossecors. -Mission/rat/plex runners -Entities currently dependant on what mission/rat/plex runners bring in. -High sec industrialists who now have to compete with null industrialists who have a wider margin owing to the better refinement efficiency in their native space -Miners without personal access to advanced refining facilities, in high sec as their raw output will be suppressed by the margins of compression services, in null sec because you will have to pay for the privilege as rent, which suppresses your profits. @Ramona McCandless: It was sarcasm. I'm not very good at these dishonest games that Lucas and Tippia play. I prefer saying what I mean and meaning what I say.
That's a cop out, they arne't being dishonest, they are telling you the truth as they see it and yo are too emotionally invovled to understand that.
I serioulsy dislike seeing people have the "you must be trolling me" reaction when people disagree with them. It means that in your mind you think you are important enough for someone to lie to you, when in fact you are not (none of us are). |
stoicfaux
4248
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:08:00 -
[855] - Quote
Mario Putzo wrote: Yes I am. I am against anything that generates potential income while one is not actively logged in and playing the game. This includes PI in HS, LS, NS, and Moons in LS and NS.
Uhm... does that include market orders? Because, you know, they work even if don't login for 90 days.
WASABI: Warp Acceleration System Ancillary Boost Injected(Gäó)
|
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2710
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:09:00 -
[856] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Lucas Kell wrote:]Are you serious? You are just going to repost your incorrect list which CLEARLY STATES the aboslute opposite to what I just posted as if that somehow clears things up? It states exactly what you said, but in more detail. How does it? In what possible way does:
Lucas Kell wrote:YES, null industry will be buffed, but NO null industry will not be buffed to the point of being competitive with high sec. and
Salvos Rhoska wrote:-High sec industrialists who now have to compete with null industrialists who have a wider margin owing to the better refinement efficiency in their native space. Say even remotely the same thing?
Seriously, how do you even manage to get through life with this attitude? You assume everything you state is fact then assume that when people say the opposite, what they really mean is what you said, thus they validate you. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Salvos Rhoska
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
417
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:09:00 -
[857] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:I serioulsy dislike seeing people have the "you must be trolling me" reaction when people disagree with them. It means that in your mind you think you are important enough for someone to lie to you, when in fact you are not (none of us are).
Yes, I agree completely.
That applies perfectly to Tippia and Lucas, who have done the "you must be trolling" reaction thing because they disagree more times than I can count already.
@Lucas Kell: Still waiting on that list. Not going to put your money where your mouth is?
Produce a list of what you perceive as benefits to null from these changes. We can then crossreference it with mine and see just how "wrong" my list was. |
EI Digin
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
1879
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:09:00 -
[858] - Quote
Is this what winning feels like? |
Dagar Bly
EvE Character Portrait REDUX
7
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:11:00 -
[859] - Quote
Jenn aSide wrote:Salvos Rhoska wrote:[quote=Lucas Kell]YES, null industry will be buffed, but NO null industry will not be buffed to the point of being competitive with high sec.
[quote=Salvos Rhoska] I serioulsy dislike seeing people have the "you must be trolling me" reaction when people disagree with them. It means that in your mind you think you are important enough for someone to lie to you, when in fact you are not (none of us are).
So much this, knock it off, who really wants to be the best at neckbeard online anyway? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20205
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:13:00 -
[860] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Sorry, I was wrong! Tippia and Lucas have shown that the changes infact do not benefit null in anyway shape or form! Incorrect.
Quote:Its funny that your vociferous and pathological resistance to any and all anti-null commentary has come full circle to the point that you perceive even objective assessment and support of the benefits of a change to null, as being anti-null. Strawman.
Quote:The entire impetus of these changes is for improving null, yet you are arguing against that Incorrect.
Sorry, that's a mirror you're talking to. We're over here GåÆ GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
|
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan Turing Tested
2389
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:15:00 -
[861] - Quote
I just... Im done
*jams fork in leg* *** Vote MTU For CSM *** "They feel the need to cover their ears and eyes in horror at your very presence." - Pontianak Sythaeryn Omnis nomiom nom nom nomi |
Salvos Rhoska
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
417
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:19:00 -
[862] - Quote
Tippia and Lucas:
Please, take a moment and outline to us what you perceive as the benefits to null from these changes? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20205
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:21:00 -
[863] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Tippia and Lucas: Please, take a moment and outline to us what you perceive as the benefits to null from these changes? Please learn to read. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2711
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:21:00 -
[864] - Quote
Ramona McCandless wrote:I just... Im done
*jams fork in leg* Yeah I'm pretty much there too. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Lucas Kell
JSR1 AND GOLDEN GUARDIAN PRODUCTIONS SpaceMonkey's Alliance
2711
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:23:00 -
[865] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Tippia and Lucas:
Please, take a moment and outline to us what you perceive as the benefits to null from these changes? No. I'm done with you. No matter what is said you repeat the same thing over and over. I've said over and over what it is I believe and still you repeat the same thing.
I get it, you think null is going to be super amazing and hugely benefit and kick high sec out. You're wrong. If you don't like it, that's your problem. I'm done listening to your repetitive unsupported points on a subject you have no experience in. Grow up. The Indecisive Noob - A new EVE Fan Blog for news and stuff. |
Onictus
Silver Snake Enterprise Fatal Ascension
873
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:23:00 -
[866] - Quote
Kaivar Lancer wrote:CCP basically gave null sec an ISK printing press.
More isk for you, null bears.
Oh yeah, ever move a capital in and out of null? 900isk per isotope times 20-60 thousand depending on routing.
There is a reason that there isn't a lot of industry going on. |
Salvos Rhoska
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
417
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:25:00 -
[867] - Quote
So there we have it.
Both Tippia and Lucas refuse to outline what they perceive as the benefits to null from these proposed changes.
Its a simple request, and since they both prodess themselves as experts on the matter, youd think they would be glad to provide their own analysis of what benefits these changes provide to null. But no. They wont. Not what they are paid for it seems. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
20205
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:27:00 -
[868] - Quote
Salvos Rhoska wrote:Both Tippia and Lucas refuse to outline what they perceive as the benefits to null from these proposed changes. Incorrect.
Quote:Its a simple request GǪthat has been fulfilled long ago, but since it didn't offer anything you could twist or contort with your strawman fallacies, you now have to resort to red herrings in a failed attempt to distract from the fact that you were unable to respond to them.
Quote:Not what they are paid for it seems. It certainly isn't, especially since we have no obligation to do so. And yet we did. Fancy that. And yet could only respond with fallacies. Fancy that tooGǪ GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skill plan 2.1. |
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan Turing Tested
2389
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:29:00 -
[869] - Quote
Onictus wrote: No you chose not to, Delve has an NPC pocket, there is nothing stopping you.
Likewise EVERYONE rents, null sucks when you are trying to jam 1700 into a couple constilations, for a corp of 5-6 its a unending money maker. The difference is that renter systems are usually off limits to the alliance that is renting them out. So there is a fraction of the competition for resourses.
This is the scalability issue that is discussed all of the time.
I dont think you and I are talking about the same thing.
Pockets or not, it makes no difference. *** Vote MTU For CSM *** "They feel the need to cover their ears and eyes in horror at your very presence." - Pontianak Sythaeryn Omnis nomiom nom nom nomi |
Sentamon
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
1517
|
Posted - 2014.03.23 18:29:00 -
[870] - Quote
Kaivar Lancer wrote:CCP basically gave null sec an ISK printing press.
More isk for you, null bears.
I free Titan in every soup bow! ~ Professional Forum Alt -á~ |
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 30 40 50 60 .. 67 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |