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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
2496
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Posted - 2014.07.23 18:11:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hi everyone,
The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf. We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
We're expecting this discussion to evolve over the coming weeks as the new system settles down and people figure out what bonuses they'd find most valuable. We'd be looking at shipping these changes in one of the two following scheduled releases, depending on how this discussion goes.
So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good?
-Greyscale |
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Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Fidelas Constans
1044
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 18:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
MOAR SLOTS |
Celor Ma'fer
Jouhinen Inc
10
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 18:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
Looking forward to this thread. I'm going to give it a few days to see how things suit. |
Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
720
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 18:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
Glad to hear that y'all went the TE reduction route instead of cost reduction. Time Efficiency is a great way to reward skill training without creating an additional disparity between old and new industrialists that has to be overcome before the new industrialist can compete meaningfully with the old. This post was crafted by a member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay. |
Dr Cedric
Independent Miners Corporation Care Factor
58
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Posted - 2014.07.23 18:27:00 -
[5] - Quote
Not sure how related it is, but how about some equipment reprocessing boost skills
Also, it's easy enough to add skills for material and production efficiency (totally forgot the new names)
Also, how about ship/module specific skills i.e., reduced material req/faster production time for cruisers, or medium turrets (could base it off of BP class)
Also, mineral/component "mastery" skills to allow a builder to reduce material requirements for specific components and minerals (say 1% per level?)
Could also add skills for boosting POS module usage of industry and research things. Cedric
|
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
43
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Posted - 2014.07.23 18:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
New skills - production efficacy works the same as old one just 2%lv instead of 5. - one that reduces install cost. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
591
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 18:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
when you are adding new industry skills, do something to make Battleship Construction V have a use please! |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
593
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 18:59:00 -
[8] - Quote
Elite Mass Processing is the obvious choice. |
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc Brave Collective
1241
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 19:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
A promising discussion :) Signature Tanking - Best Tanking. Beware the french guy!
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Mackenzie Nolen
XYJAX
11
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Posted - 2014.07.23 19:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
A new skill that amplifies team bonus (e.g. "Team Management"). 10% per level seems reasonable, so a team that provides a 2% ME bonus for instance would provide a 3% ME bonus for someone who had this skill at level 5.
Of course I still think this is what the adv industry skill bonus *should* have been changed to :) |
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Opertone
Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State
294
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 19:31:00 -
[11] - Quote
hmmm, as an economist with factory experience
unfinished production, "work in progress"
ability to start a new production without some of the required materials???
when you get all the needed 'input' you can add it later to the job, which may sit at 80% completion, depending on how much stuff is missing, this way you may save time required for long jobs, while you wait for your components to arrive.
ability to control wastage over time efficiency??
"production efficiency?'
you can speed things up proportionally to increasing the wastage factor, spend more minerals but get your ammunition produced faster. Save some, but job takes a lot longer.
Fine refinement control,
Refining and reprocessing jobs will take time afaik . You may speed things up by 50% when you give up precious and hard to recover trace materials, such as megacyte, morphite, which usually make up 1-2% anyway.
Non stop production cycle
You can produce something without the hassle of manually resetting the jobs, example - ammuniton.
With this skill you can setup extra continuous jobs.
"Production espionage" You will be able to actually see what sort of things are produced by others, with more detail and station, system, region wide...
Some ideas which you may not like, do not blame me |
NEONOVUS
Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us
870
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 19:31:00 -
[12] - Quote
So clarifying, material requirement reductions are looked down upon? |
Antillie Sa'Kan
Forging Industries Silent Infinity
559
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 19:50:00 -
[13] - Quote
Just some quick (and possibly terrible) ideas off the top of my head.
Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Industrial Process Management: 1% reduction in manufacturing job install costs per level, requires Advanced Mass Production V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, mem/cha.
Scientific Process Management: 1% reduction in research job install costs per level, requires Advanced Laboratory Operation V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, int/cha.
Group Dynamics: 2% bonus to team effects per level, requires Social V and Advanced Industry V, rank 6, cha/int. |
Kyoso Shintaro
THI Command Templis Heavy Industries
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 20:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
What about a skill that let you use a team that was x number of jumps or ly away? |
Cekle Skyscales
The Scope Gallente Federation
55
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 20:14:00 -
[15] - Quote
Specialization skills that further reduce the time for specific types of jobs by 1% per level |
Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
4131
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 20:25:00 -
[16] - Quote
Maybe a set of skills that add another 'phantom' facility to the POS/system for the job that player started. Or a skill that improves the bonus one gets from Teams, if you have one working in the system. Sovereignty and Population New Mining Mechanics |
Masao Kurata
Z List
59
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 20:28:00 -
[17] - Quote
Just please don't add anything that reduces costs, as any cost reduction skill will be as mandatory as the old skill was, and thus just a time sink and barrier to entry rather than a meaningful training decision.
Actually please don't add anything. You created actual industry gameplay in crius, that's a good thing, it doesn't have to be accompanied with more skill queue online. |
NEONOVUS
Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us
870
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 20:43:00 -
[18] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Just some quick (and possibly terrible) ideas off the top of my head.
Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Industrial Process Management: 1% reduction in manufacturing job install costs per level, requires Advanced Mass Production V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, mem/cha.
Scientific Process Management: 1% reduction in research job install costs per level, requires Advanced Laboratory Operation V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, int/cha.
Group Dynamics: 2% bonus to team effects per level, requires Social V and Advanced Industry V, rank 6, cha/int. Seems decent, just more take less time things. |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
141
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 20:50:00 -
[19] - Quote
Rapid Prototyping: x% reduction in invention or T2 production time. (As invention seems to be the only thing without a specific global skill)
Exotic Assembly: x% material efficiency for faction production. (With corresponding increase in material requirements for faction BPCs; still not a prereq for entry due to high margins on faction items) |
Commander A9
The Scope Gallente Federation
616
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 20:52:00 -
[20] - Quote
I suppose any skill offering a reduction in time requirements is a welcomed addition.
Speaking of changes...
I'm assuming that the Career Agents for industry have had their tutorial information updated to address the latest industry changes? Recommendations: -enable ships wobbling in hangar view (pre-Captains Quarters) -add more missions (NPC fleet vs. NPC fleets that actually shoot) -less focus on graphics, more on mechanics...and STOP NERFING EVERYTHING! Tune in to NewEdenRadio.com for awesome music! |
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Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
1310
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 21:00:00 -
[21] - Quote
Specialist Recovery - 10% per level recovery of input materials when cancelling a job.
Encryption Specialist - 2% per level improved chance of invention.
Corporate Specialist - 10% per level increase in POS ME savings (2% -> 3% @ Level V)
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Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
595
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 21:04:00 -
[22] - Quote
I think that any new skills need to be specialized: you pick skills to make you better at t1 battleships, t2 cruisers, t2 mods, etc. Accordingly I'd do skills for basic and advanced small/medium/large ship construction, each with a TE bonus for small (destroyers and frigates), medium (cruisers and battlecruisers) and large (battleships) jobs. Similarly for modules.
I think the TE bonus should be rather high but so should the skill rank, so that it's a valuable skill to train but hard to just max out all of them. Also, because it's TE, a newer player competes on the same level, just with less volume, |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
142
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 21:15:00 -
[23] - Quote
Footprint Reduction: x% decrease in job weight when determining your system's industrial indexes.
If that makes any sense. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
622
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 21:27:00 -
[24] - Quote
The skills required to actually create the teams would be good. Probably better in some kind of PI structures, a University centre or similar. |
Vincent Athena
V.I.C.E.
2832
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 21:35:00 -
[25] - Quote
"More jobs" is obvious. A somewhat different way of doing that is to have a skill that allows me to have more jobs in the queue, even though I am limited to 11 that are currently active. Think of the skill queue: I can have a dozen or more skills queued up, even though I can only train one at a time. How about having industry jobs the same way? A skill that lets me queue up more than I can have running. As soon as a job finishes, the next drops down out of the queue and begins.
This also makes the TE skill more useful. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/ |
Max Kolonko
High Voltage Industries Ash Alliance
436
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 22:24:00 -
[26] - Quote
Skill that effectively reduces (just for You) system index for given industry activity (i.e. instead of reducing by X% cost of instal reduce by one "level" the cost index of a system (using the scale presented in client - whatever the value actually means)) - one such skill for every type of activity
Skill to further increase number of slots for each activity type
Skill to further increase range of remote job activation (to a total of 50 jumps)
Skills for teams: - skill that increase effect of team by 5% of their effect (so at lvl 5 team that gives 8% will give 10%) - skill that reduce cost of hiring team by x% percent of the additional cost (so reducing from lets say in example of 10% more cost team to maybe 5% at lvl 5??)
Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff? |
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
145
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 23:42:00 -
[27] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote: The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
3%/level reduction in what? Fees? Taxes? Materials?
Since the skill would be useless on taxes, it should be applied to fees. |
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
423
|
Posted - 2014.07.23 23:44:00 -
[28] - Quote
Petrified wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote: The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
3%/level reduction in what? Fees? Taxes? Materials? Since the skill would be useless on taxes, it should be applied to fees. length of time it takes to do the job |
Loraine Gess
Confedeferate Union of Tax Legalists
448
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 00:04:00 -
[29] - Quote
I was very happy to get 1% TE bonus per level, 3% is going to be ridiculously great. More skills past that? Might allow consolidation of industrial alts... |
Kenneth Skybound
Gallifrey Resources
105
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 00:19:00 -
[30] - Quote
Skill ideas:
Site Director: -2% Build time per level when docked at station/within force field range of job location.
Advanced Industrial Reclamation: Allows reprocessing of non-ores as an industry job. Requires a blueprint for the item (consuming 1 run per item), unbuilds in 50% build time for a base 70% recycled amount, recycled amount affected by scrap metal reprocessing skill. AIR skill reduces unbuild time by 10% per level.
Extended Research Processes: Allows for the queuing of invention jobs, +1 job per level to a max of 6 queued jobs.
And one a bit different, Spatial Compression: +5% container capacity for compressed space containers (eg GSC's). |
|
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs
3959
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 01:04:00 -
[31] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so. Well, that's surprising.
That's actually pretty good.
Have you been into the Brenniv+¡n?
CCP Greyscale wrote:So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good? * Team pay reduction. * NPC tax reduction. * X% chance per level of creating a BPC with extra runs, one per level.
I'm kind of on-the-fence about additional slots. It is currently a limiting factor, and I'm concerned what might happen if that limit is removed. Though I'd like to be an Industry Tycoon. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1438
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 01:28:00 -
[32] - Quote
Good sounding advanced ideas Skills for job queue sounds a great idea. Recovery of cancelled jobs. Skills that allow starting a job with only part of the resources, i.e. partial escrow, but you can't deliver the job till you supply the remaining materials. Skills that allow remote manipulation of POS set ups, placing/removing mods, reloading guns etc.
Bad sounding advanced ideas. Additional TE or ME bonuses. Things that make teams better Things that reduce cost
Basically, things that add game play or new branches, good. Things that exist purely to increase profit in some way. Bad. |
Iris Bravemount
Eldar Army
343
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 01:30:00 -
[33] - Quote
I really like the idea of being able to queue jobs, so that the TE becomes more relevant (not saying it is irrelevant, far from it).
I also agree with people saying that any skill that directly reduces costs (as opposed to TE reducing the cost by shortening the job's duration) would be a step back to the old system. Please don't add any of those.
Skills to optimize team usage would be nice, but again, those would most likely end up being "must haves", so they would also be a step back.
The specializing skills are already in the games (frigate construction, etc). It would be nice if those gave a 2% per level time reduction to all relevant items (in this case, all frigates, not only t2 frigates). The same could be done to the datacore skills, but maybe they already are useful enough as they are. So skills like "Mining laser production", simply granting 2% time reduction per level to all mining lasers could be nice. The categories already exist, thanks to team specialisations.
Then there is a wild idea : a skill that reduces the volume of produced items by "some percentage that doesn't bring mineral compression back". Mostly thinking about capital parts here, as they are a pain to move anywhere but in highsec, where you can use freighters. Since this would interfere with the market needing all items of a type to be identical (packaged) this could come with a new state for an item ("sealed" ?) from which you could assemble or repackage it to use it or put it on the market. "I will not hesitate when the test of Faith finds me, for only the strongest conviction will open the gates of paradise. My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity." - Paladin's Creed |
Arthur Aihaken
Erebus Solia
3732
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 02:13:00 -
[34] - Quote
Infiltration, espionage and sabotage. I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week. |
Erutpar Ambient
The Flying Tigers Black Core Alliance
181
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 02:57:00 -
[35] - Quote
I guess the Idea here is to have something that's going to have some effect that isn't "mandatory" like Material Efficiency was right?
How about something this.
-Self Sufficient: Reduce the impact your jobs have on the system by 5%
This will be nice for Null Sec where you may be limited on building locations. It doesn't impact you directly, but it does impact the people you play with.
So with everyone at level 5 (make it high multiplier, 10x?) the system can utilize 1/3 more people than a system with everyone at level 0 for the same price.
It's not a mandatory skill like Material Efficiency 5 (don't need to wait for it to start building things) And it makes for a happy neighborhood. |
Antihrist Pripravnik
T-AFK and counting
533
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 03:53:00 -
[36] - Quote
Mackenzie Nolen wrote:A new skill that amplifies team bonus (e.g. "Team Management"). 10% per level seems reasonable, so a team that provides a 2% ME bonus for instance would provide a 3% ME bonus for someone who had this skill at level 5.
Of course I still think this is what the adv industry skill bonus *should* have been changed to :)
Not a very good idea. The whole point of Crius was that the industrial landscape should be organic and not concentrated in a few systems. Increasing benefits for Teams creates more difference between systems with and without teams, which forces players to swarm to high-quality team locations. Industrial activity must be based on player choices and not on FOTW systems. There is no freedom of choice in FOTW mechanics. o.0 |
Antihrist Pripravnik
T-AFK and counting
533
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 03:55:00 -
[37] - Quote
Erutpar Ambient wrote:I guess the Idea here is to have something that's going to have some effect that isn't "mandatory" like Material Efficiency was right?
How about something this.
-Self Sufficient: Reduce the impact your jobs have on the system by 5%
This will be nice for Null Sec where you may be limited on building locations. It doesn't impact you directly, but it does impact the people you play with.
So with everyone at level 5 (make it high multiplier, 10x?) the system can utilize 1/3 more people than a system with everyone at level 0 for the same price.
It's not a mandatory skill like Material Efficiency 5 (don't need to wait for it to start building things) And it makes for a happy neighborhood. Brilliant idea o.0 |
Orvmus
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 03:55:00 -
[38] - Quote
At least refund the SP to players and allow them the ability to choose whether to invest in this new, and in my case completely useless, skill. This change may benefit hardcore Industry players but has absolutely no value to the rest of us who previously had it trained. |
Erutpar Ambient
The Flying Tigers Black Core Alliance
182
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 04:03:00 -
[39] - Quote
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:Erutpar Ambient wrote:I guess the Idea here is to have something that's going to have some effect that isn't "mandatory" like Material Efficiency was right?
How about something this.
-Self Sufficient: Reduce the impact your jobs have on the system by 5%
This will be nice for Null Sec where you may be limited on building locations. It doesn't impact you directly, but it does impact the people you play with.
So with everyone at level 5 (make it high multiplier, 10x?) the system can utilize 1/3 more people than a system with everyone at level 0 for the same price.
It's not a mandatory skill like Material Efficiency 5 (don't need to wait for it to start building things) And it makes for a happy neighborhood. Brilliant idea Thank ya sir!
Maybe if they like this idea they'll take some of my other ideas more seriously. :)
I'm always thinking about how to benefit everyone the most with the least amount of over-impact on everything as a whole. I put a lot of pride in my ability to come up with these "everybody wins" type of ideas/scenarios. |
Antihrist Pripravnik
T-AFK and counting
533
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 04:07:00 -
[40] - Quote
Orvmus wrote: it's as though CCP has zero knowledge when it comes to how Industry works in their own game.
Oh, they know... The prices are pumped intentionally, but that's a subject for another thread.
o.0 |
|
Roo Gryphon
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 05:19:00 -
[41] - Quote
Opertone wrote:hmmm, as an economist with factory experience
unfinished production, "work in progress"
ability to start a new production without some of the required materials???
when you get all the needed 'input' you can add it later to the job, which may sit at 80% completion, depending on how much stuff is missing, this way you may save time required for long jobs, while you wait for your components to arrive.
ability to control wastage over time efficiency??
"production efficiency?'
you can speed things up proportionally to increasing the wastage factor, spend more minerals but get your ammunition produced faster. Save some, but job takes a lot longer.
Fine refinement control,
Refining and reprocessing jobs will take time afaik . You may speed things up by 50% when you give up precious and hard to recover trace materials, such as megacyte, morphite, which usually make up 1-2% anyway.
Non stop production cycle
You can produce something without the hassle of manually resetting the jobs, example - ammuniton.
With this skill you can setup extra continuous jobs.
"Production espionage" You will be able to actually see what sort of things are produced by others, with more detail and station, system, region wide...
Some ideas which you may not like, do not blame me
This....
|
Winthorp
2347
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 05:25:00 -
[42] - Quote
Wrecked Reverse engineering.
- Provides a buff to the % chance of returning a successful job when reverse engineering from a Wrecked item.
(No one in their right mind reverse engineers from a wrecked item when the success rate and yeild is so low compared to malfunctioning and intact. End result to make them useful) |
Antihrist Pripravnik
T-AFK and counting
534
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 05:49:00 -
[43] - Quote
Winthorp wrote:Wrecked Reverse engineering.
- Provides a buff to the % chance of returning a successful job when reverse engineering from a Wrecked item.
(No one in their right mind reverse engineers from a wrecked item when the success rate and yeild is so low compared to malfunctioning and intact. End result to make them useful) That would be a game balance issue, not something that should be included as a skill.
Anyway, I don't know if it's low, but I've been getting 33% success rate out of wrecked hulls for a while. o.0 |
Winthorp
2348
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 05:51:00 -
[44] - Quote
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:Winthorp wrote:Wrecked Reverse engineering.
- Provides a buff to the % chance of returning a successful job when reverse engineering from a Wrecked item.
(No one in their right mind reverse engineers from a wrecked item when the success rate and yeild is so low compared to malfunctioning and intact. End result to make them useful) That would be a game balance issue, not something that should be included as a skill. Anyway, I don't know if it's low, but I've been getting 33% success rate out of wrecked hulls for a while.
Yes but the cost versus reward ratio for paying for data interface is not worth your time. |
Antihrist Pripravnik
T-AFK and counting
534
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 05:54:00 -
[45] - Quote
Winthorp wrote:Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:Winthorp wrote:Wrecked Reverse engineering.
- Provides a buff to the % chance of returning a successful job when reverse engineering from a Wrecked item.
(No one in their right mind reverse engineers from a wrecked item when the success rate and yeild is so low compared to malfunctioning and intact. End result to make them useful) That would be a game balance issue, not something that should be included as a skill. Anyway, I don't know if it's low, but I've been getting 33% success rate out of wrecked hulls for a while. Yes but the cost versus reward ratio for paying for data interface is not worth your time.
Could be... I was doing it more as a bonus and to try out T3 building. It brought some profit, but I was not dedicated to the task. o.0 |
Mhari Dson
Lazy Brothers Inc
112
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 07:02:00 -
[46] - Quote
Orvmus wrote:At least refund the SP to players and allow them the ability to choose whether to invest in this new, and in my case completely useless, skill. This change may benefit hardcore Industry players but has absolutely no value to the rest of us who previously had it trained.
I hope you took the removal of this skill in to account when you increased the material costs for everything, prices are going to rise through the roof once the current stocks are depleted - it's as though CCP has zero knowledge when it comes to how Industry works in their own game.
Actually the updated skill going live next week applies (at 5) a modifier to your effective jobs, making 11 slots as effective as 12.65 wich is an unprecedented concession in the industry side of eve. |
Eodp Ellecon
Northstar Cabal Tactical Narcotics Team
8
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 07:10:00 -
[47] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:"More jobs" is obvious. A somewhat different way of doing that is to have a skill that allows me to have more jobs in the queue, even though I am limited to 11 that are currently active. Think of the skill queue: I can have a dozen or more skills queued up, even though I can only train one at a time. How about having industry jobs the same way? A skill that lets me queue up more than I can have running. As soon as a job finishes, the next drops down out of the queue and begins.
This also makes the TE skill more useful.
This 'cascading' would be useful given our new interface shows needed materials to do a job. If you're short of components, then fire up components and ship build autostarts when component job (auto) completes. |
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine In Tea We Trust
547
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 07:14:00 -
[48] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so. Nice. Much better than the previous bonus.
CCP Greyscale wrote:We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills). We have to rule out anything that reduces costs, because that would just bring back the same problems the old Production Efficiency skill caused... but worse because it would be even less attainable.
You could add more per character industry slots, but I'm not sure that CCP is in a place where it can afford the resultant reduction in alt accounts. |
Awkward Pi Duolus
Pator Tech School Minmatar Republic
9
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 08:43:00 -
[49] - Quote
Thank you very much for the 3% per level for this skill - I think it's a good compromise.
For new skills, perhaps the theme can be "time". I support some ideas mentioned already, since some of the higher rank research times have gotten a little ridiculous:
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Tinkering: 3% reduced invention job time per level, requires Science V, Jury Rigging V, and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
One more suggestion: Increase in the amount of time a team will be in system. 5% per level, giving a max of 25% additional time one has teams for. |
Amarisen Gream
Lone Wolf Union Yulai Federation
41
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 08:53:00 -
[50] - Quote
I like most of the ideas I've read. The one thing I wanna stress is specializing.
Give us say AI-Small Hull - +1 slot per level when producing frigates/destroyer sized hulls. Unable to train AI-Medium Hull or AI-Large hull until skill is V.
Any skill that adds slots needs to limit the player from grabbing other like skills right away.
Copy Right Infringment: +1 run per level when producing from factional BPCs. I.e. A 1 run SOE BPC is not a 6 run at mac level, but only if you max run the BPC. If only 1 run is done it consumes the print.
Most just wanna see things that allow us to niche are selves in to a spot. I see my corp mates doing T2 and know that I don't wanna compete with them b/c they have acess to resources that I don't at a greater discount than I can get.
Personally - would love more PI changes that maybe could tie Industrial work and PI together. (Some former post of mine minus the while Corp owning the colony) xoxo Amarisen Gream http://thegreameve.wordpress.com -Looking to improve the player experience-
|
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Sigras
Conglomo
823
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 09:02:00 -
[51] - Quote
I had an idea to introduce divisions of labor into the game a while ago... This would provide the same specialized training that is currently in the combat training to industry as well.
The Idea add a few dozen skills for industry to give a bonus to specific things.
Examples: T2 Construction - 2% reduction in T2 manufacturing time per level T2 Construction Specialization - 1% reduction per skill level to the material requirements needed for T2 production (requires T2 Construction level 5) Starship Construction - 2% reduction in manufacturing time of starships per skill level. Battleship Construction Specialization - 1% reduction per skill level to the material requirements needed for battleship production (requires starship construction level 5) Cruiser Construction Specialization - 1% reduction per skill level to the material requirements needed for cruiser production (requires starship construction level 5) Gallente Construction - 2% reduction in manufacturing time of Gallente products per skill level. Gallente Construction Specialization - 1% reduction per skill level to the material requirements needed for Gallente products (gallente ships, ammo, components, blasters, etc) per skill level. (requires Gallente Construction level 5) Module Construction - 1% reduction per skill level to the material requirements needed for module production Ammo Construction - 1% reduction per skill level to the material requirements needed for ammo production
You may notice that many of these skills overlap and that is intentional. That way, if you're building a Kronos, that build is effected by Starship Construction, Battleship Construction Specialization, Gallente Construction and its specialization, and T2 construction and its specialization.
All of these bonuses can stack to give you quite a huge savings if you specialize in producing one specific thing, but the days of having one character who can perfectly manufacture all the things would be over. (or at least > 5 years off)
Right now I can start a new alt and have him learn to perfectly manufacture 90% of the items in game in two weeks. I could give him mass production from range in less than two months, and then I would have an alt that "does manufacturing"
It seems ridiculous to me to train for a month or two and say "ok I've mastered that part of the game now what?"
The Effects The current manufacturers in the game will begin to train the new skills. Prices wont rise on anything as nobody suddenly got worse at manufacturing, but people would start training to manufacture specific things. They would be able to increase their margins in those items over unspecialized people.
Thoughts? |
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation Ineluctable.
637
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 09:08:00 -
[52] - Quote
Quote:...its current form is a huge accessibility problem for industry... (#157) |
probag Bear
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
57
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 09:31:00 -
[53] - Quote
I think an extra of 15% time reduction is a good deal of oomf as it is.
As of right now, specialization between research and manufacturing is very possible. As in, there is little to no overlap between manufacturing skills, and invention/ME/TE skills. You can train up a perfect 10-slot inventor that can't even come close to manufacturing his products, and you can train up a perfect 10-slot manufacturer that can't even come close to inventing his blueprints. Reverse Engineering sits in its own little corner, but that's just how Reverse Engineering does things.
Long story short, I would hesitate to tack bonuses to invention/ME/TE onto a manufacturing skill. Same with anything that affects job install costs as a whole, since again, that makes Advanced Industry something you'd always be getting on both your invention/ME/TE alts and your manufacturing alts. Reprocessing and Teams bonuses I dislike for another reason: you only need to train them on one character, and bam, you've got 100% of the benefits across every single one of your characters. The scaling is a bit strong on that.
Which puts me on the spot to come up with something original, since I just called pretty much every idea in this bad. My creative juices aren't flowing this morning at all, but as a compromise, I do absolutely love this suggestion:
Bad Bobby wrote:Maybe you could add a skill that allows us to resize the S&I window by 10% per level too. |
Amarisen Gream
Lone Wolf Union Yulai Federation
41
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 09:50:00 -
[54] - Quote
Also need Industrial Tycoon.
This skill does nothing but show how awesome you are at sitting and staring at a bulking and pretty industrial window.
SP Gained from having Industrial UI open.
--sorry needed a little fun--
On a more clear thought
Industrial hardiness +1% effectiveness to all industrial hulls per level. Needs some polish to the idea, and limits to say in space stuff, not roles or bonuses. xoxo Amarisen Gream |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
2505
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 10:31:00 -
[55] - Quote
Retar Aveymone wrote:When you are adding new industry skills, you should do something to make Battleship Construction V have a use (along with Industrial Construction V, which I believe is also useless).
Reasonable.
NEONOVUS wrote:So clarifying, material requirement reductions are looked down upon?
Generally speaking, cost reductions can be considered as having a lower probability of being implemented, all other things being equal. Ditto anything which requires significant feature work (eg queueing - that's a feature with a skill attached, not a skill modifying an existing number).
Sentient Blade wrote:Specialist Recovery - 10% per level recovery of input materials when cancelling a job.
Erutpar Ambient wrote:-Self Sufficient: Reduce the impact your jobs have on the system by 5%
These are very cool. More stuff like this, to change variables you don't normally think of, are of great interest to us :) |
|
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
622
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 11:18:00 -
[56] - Quote
Mad Scientist - x% chance per level that an invention job produces a faction BPC |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
145
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 12:16:00 -
[57] - Quote
Erutpar Ambient wrote: Thank ya sir!
Maybe if they like this idea they'll take some of my other ideas more seriously. :)
What do you mean "your idea?" :P
|
Nina Smirnoff
Federal Defense Union Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 12:30:00 -
[58] - Quote
First, 3%/level is a lot! Too much supply increase without any demand change..... 2% would be enough, imho.
Secobd, some random ideas:
I would love to see bonus to 3 kinds of 'specializations' or 3 kind of industrialists: -The nomad industrialist (people that like to do it cheap, always moving to the lowest index system) - The hermit (people that like to do it alone in a dark corner, they set home on a system and stay there). - Team Member (people that like to do it with others, like big manufacturing corporations)
"Nomad" skills: The general idea is: help it move and abuse the low install cost. - Improved Workforce: "X% ME/Level + Y% increase install cost/level" ME bonus but a heavy install penalty. My first idea was -0.5%ME and 20%install cost increase. - Improved Anchoring: "Decrease anchoring time by X%/level" Moving is boring and slow. People need support skill do to it faster. 10% per level sounds good. -Improved Structure Packing: "Reduce POS' and POS Modules' volume by X%/level" I thought about a cargohold bonus, but that would be too generic. A bonus just to transport pos and pos modules sounds inoffensive.
"Hermit" skills: The general idea is: improve his system or make it more dificult to other peoples to move in - "Self Suficient: Reduce the impact your jobs have on system by 5%" ( by Erutpar) I like this idea, but I think number should be greater. Its a tricky skill. If everyone trains it, it becomes useless. - Micro Management: "Increase team bonus by X% and reduce it's salary by Y% if noone is using it" Checked on install time only.
"Team Member" skills: The general idea: improve working with your corp and reduce the penalty to work in the same system. - Shared Workforce:"X% discount on install job for every other corp job on the system" Of course you need a cap on the maximum discount (30%?). X could be a small number like 0.1%... |
Celor Ma'fer
Jouhinen Inc
10
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 12:37:00 -
[59] - Quote
Komi Toran wrote:Erutpar Ambient wrote: Thank ya sir!
Maybe if they like this idea they'll take some of my other ideas more seriously. :)
What do you mean "your idea?" :P
Obviously someone who doesn't read, even small, threads before posting.
The only issue I can see arising from this is the fact that it does apply to everyone in the system. Which means that all the Industrialists that work in the same system as you do benefit from your skills, even if they don't train them themselves. If the skill could be somehow made to reduce the SCI just for your character, then that would be perfect. |
Omnathious Deninard
Novis Initiis
2434
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 12:52:00 -
[60] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:When you are adding new industry skills, you should do something to make Battleship Construction V have a use (along with Industrial Construction V, which I believe is also useless). Reasonable. I think these skills would be well suited for a 2% reduction in production time. Exploration Loot T3 Balance Concept |
|
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
147
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 13:00:00 -
[61] - Quote
Celor Ma'fer wrote:Obviously someone who doesn't read, even small, threads before posting. Nah, be nice. He phrased the effect more clearly than I did. Plus, his post got the attention of CCP, while mine didn't.
I do like my name for the effect much better. "Self sufficiency" could mean anything.
Celor Ma'fer wrote:The only issue I can see arising from this is the fact that it does apply to everyone in the system. Which means that all the Industrialists that work in the same system as you do benefit from your skills, even if they don't train them themselves. If the skill could be somehow made to reduce the SCI just for your character, then that would be perfect. This is actually why I like the skill, as it functions in a way no other skill would. Besides, if it only applied on your end, it would either a) have little effect except in completely dead systems or b) be a flat out price reduction, which some feel would make it a barrier to entry. This idea is neither: corporations, alliances, and players with a dozen alts will all see benefits by making sure their industrialists have the skill trained. |
Mackenzie Nolen
Xyjax
13
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 13:05:00 -
[62] - Quote
Antihrist Pripravnik wrote:The whole point of Crius was that the industrial landscape should be organic and not concentrated in a few systems. Increasing benefits for Teams creates more difference between systems with and without teams, which forces players to swarm to high-quality team locations.
Bluntly, I'm not the one that created teams, CCP is. Your entire argument is a proposition for removing teams entirely and has no bearing on the skill proposed. As I assume teams are here to stay, a 10%/level team efficiency bonus wouldn't even bump a weak team past the values provided by stronger teams within the natural variation already present in team bonus %'s.
That said, it might be interesting to make the bonus a flat increase rather than a % based one; say, 0.1% improvement to base team bonus values per level. This would have the effect of improving weaker teams marginally more than already strong teams, which would in fact serve as a relief valve on player swarming as you could eventually benefit more from weaker/cheaper/"easier to win bids for" teams. Kind of like hyperspatial accelerator mods. |
Castimirr
Seafalcon Industries
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 13:35:00 -
[63] - Quote
Vincent Athena wrote:"More jobs" is obvious. A somewhat different way of doing that is to have a skill that allows me to have more jobs in the queue, even though I am limited to 11 that are currently active. Think of the skill queue: I can have a dozen or more skills queued up, even though I can only train one at a time. How about having industry jobs the same way? A skill that lets me queue up more than I can have running. As soon as a job finishes, the next drops down out of the queue and begins.
This also makes the TE skill more useful. ...
This. Very much this.
Also something like the old ME skill that only applies to a category, like the mineral processing ones. At least then you could specialize. |
Celor Ma'fer
Jouhinen Inc
10
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 13:40:00 -
[64] - Quote
Komi Toran wrote:Celor Ma'fer wrote:Obviously someone who doesn't read, even small, threads before posting. Nah, be nice. He phrased the effect more clearly than I did. Plus, his post got the attention of CCP, while mine didn't. I do like my name for the effect much better. "Self sufficiency" could mean anything. Celor Ma'fer wrote:The only issue I can see arising from this is the fact that it does apply to everyone in the system. Which means that all the Industrialists that work in the same system as you do benefit from your skills, even if they don't train them themselves. If the skill could be somehow made to reduce the SCI just for your character, then that would be perfect. This is actually why I like the skill, as it functions in a way no other skill would. Besides, if it only applied on your end, it would either a) have little effect except in completely dead systems or b) be a flat out price reduction, which some feel would make it a barrier to entry. This idea is neither: corporations, alliances, and players with a dozen alts will all see benefits by making sure their industrialists have the skill trained.
Yep, fair play.
Have you looked at how much the SCI scale has changed since the update today? It looks like the SCI bar is split into 12 steps, (it's probably not I know) the system I manufacture in was step 10 before DT and now it is step 4. However the cost for manufacturing is the same, which means that when systems actually get towards the top end they will be really expensive.
I think this skill has more weight behind it than it did earlier, certainly for me. |
Soldarius
Deadman W0nderland Test Alliance Please Ignore
743
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 13:49:00 -
[65] - Quote
Awkward Pi Duolus wrote:Thank you very much for the 3% per level for this skill - I think it's a good compromise. For new skills, perhaps the theme can be "time". I support some ideas mentioned already, since some of the higher rank research times have gotten a little ridiculous: Antillie Sa'Kan wrote: Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Tinkering: 3% reduced invention job time per level, requires Science V, Jury Rigging V, and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Tinkering. ha. Love the name. These and many more posts have some great ideas.
An industrial tycoon skill for more lines would be good. A scientific guru skill for more research jobs would be really useful. I can't tell you how many times I've run up against that stupid 10 job limit and had to tell customers "Sorry you have to wait because all 10 of my research slots are full."
GÇ£I personally refuse to help AAA take space from itself so it can become an even shittier version of itselfGÇ¥ -Grath Telkin, 2014. |
Saraki Ishikela
Deep Space Adventure Time
50
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 13:57:00 -
[66] - Quote
I've always found the time reduction skills to be a waste. Say I'm at work for 8 hours and a job takes 8 hours to finish, reudcing the time to 6 hours nets me 0 gain. Unless there is a way to queue up additional jobs I have tradiationally always avoided anything that finishes a job faster as I normally see a 0 gain out of it. One newbies quest to ExploreEVE: Youtube:www.youtube.com/exploreeve- Blogspot:http://exploreeve.blogspot.com Twitter:www.twitter.com/exploreeve - Facebook:www.facebook.com/exploreeve |
Soldarius
Deadman W0nderland Test Alliance Please Ignore
743
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 14:12:00 -
[67] - Quote
Saraki Ishikela wrote:I've always found the time reduction skills to be a waste. Say I'm at work for 8 hours and a job takes 8 hours to finish, reudcing the time to 6 hours nets me 0 gain. Unless there is a way to queue up additional jobs I have tradiationally always avoided anything that finishes a job faster as I normally see a 0 gain out of it.
This. Also, specialist skills would be very useful. Having the T2 prerequisite skills actually give you some benefit other than "must train to do" would be nice. Then more people might actually train them.
When I first started eve 5+ years ago, I thought I had to have that skill just to build T1 ships. Nothing about them says T2.
GÇ£I personally refuse to help AAA take space from itself so it can become an even shittier version of itselfGÇ¥ -Grath Telkin, 2014. |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
148
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 14:15:00 -
[68] - Quote
Soldarius wrote:[quote=Saraki Ishikela]This. Also, specialist skills would be very useful. Having the T2 prerequisite skills actually give you some benefit other than "must train to do" would be nice. Then more people might actually train them. They do give a benefit besides "must train to do;" they increase your chance of invention success.
|
hfo df
Ramm's RDI Tactical Narcotics Team
22
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 14:38:00 -
[69] - Quote
- Back alley production
Gain access to use a team 1 system per level away of where the team is located. (At increased team salary [per system] salary costs.) => free ride on others' teams next door.
- Negotiation (old charisma trade skill)
Reduces salary by 2% per level. So a 10% salary will be 9% at level 5.
- Ebay
Enter a bid amount in ISK on a team (eg 100mil). The game will make the minimum bid needed to win the team. Auto bid will be at most 50% (at skill level 5, 10% a level) lower then the initial bid (eg will bid 50 mil, auto increasing till 100 mil).
|
Mackenzie Nolen
Xyjax
13
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 14:48:00 -
[70] - Quote
hfo df wrote:Back alley production Gain access to use a team 1 system per level away of where the team is located. (At increased team salary [per system] salary costs.) => free ride on others' teams next door.
This one I particularly like, but instead of a new skill I suggest this functionality get added to the heavily nerfed and existing "Scientific Networking" skill.
|
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Nar Tha
Neural-Boost.com
165
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 16:26:00 -
[71] - Quote
My OCD is kicking in.
If you're making this skill affecting all scientific/industrial activities, it:
- should be renamed
- doesn't fit into only the "Production" skill category anymore
- should also have the skill "Science" as a requirement, maybe even more
|
Eodp Ellecon
Northstar Cabal Tactical Narcotics Team
8
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 16:33:00 -
[72] - Quote
Amarisen Gream wrote:Also need Industrial Tycoon.
This skill does nothing but show how awesome you are at sitting and staring at a bulking and pretty industrial window.
Actually, now that the station slot limitation is removed from game, there is no reason that we can't have a Industrial Science Tycoon akin to market trading path. Given that some ME10 / TE20 are going to take an (A)eon of time, there might now be need or use of, say 30+ jobs. No idea what implications that would have for the researched BPO market or invention routines. This would likely however nerf the usefulness of otherwise low-skill research alts.
I'm not a fan of adding dozens of skills that simply 'specialize, specialize, specialize' every specialization under the EVE sun. When considering the invention and skill plan for bonuses it would be reasonable that a toon trained to USE a [ fill in blank ] on the field in PVE/PVP situation would have an understanding of its use. Consider then the regular skills influences in a positive towards industrial ends in the form of an 'Advance Design Templating' skill that factors both sides of the game.
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Captain StringfellowHawk
Forsaken Reavers Rim Worlds Protectorate
143
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 17:03:00 -
[73] - Quote
How about an Advanced Industry skill for Ice mining, the ability to Convert different isotopes to the others. Say 2 or 3 Nitrogen converts to 1 Oxygen etc etc. Maybe using the Reaction arrays or some other process.
Possibly make it unique conversion to the rorqual since the Compression array now exists and except for just a booster removed a lot of uniqueness from it. |
5n4keyes
Sacred Templars DARKNESS.
96
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 17:44:00 -
[74] - Quote
Advanced Contracting, So I can make more than 21 contracts to sell everything I have built! |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3575
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 18:41:00 -
[75] - Quote
Mackenzie Nolen wrote:hfo df wrote:Back alley production Gain access to use a team 1 system per level away of where the team is located. (At increased team salary [per system] salary costs.) => free ride on others' teams next door.
This one I particularly like, but instead of a new skill I suggest this functionality get added to the heavily nerfed and existing "Scientific Networking" skill.
Sure, you can't run jobs from station any more, but you can run them from a whole other region... Woo! CSM 9! http://fuzzwork.enterprises/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
Ocih
Space Mermaids Somethin Awfull Forums
659
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 19:26:00 -
[76] - Quote
I don't want advanced Industry skills. I want accountability and visibility in industry.
You build it, you put your name on it or in the case of EVE your corporation name. Not only does this allow the players to boycott corporate Industry it shows where there are monopolies in industry. One could argue it's an opportunity for epeen too. Space Mermaids becomes known for Prophecy Hulls or more realistic, a Goon corp becomes noted for Archon hulls. It also allows us to prove or disprove myths of how noob corps are the Industrial pulse. |
Captain StringfellowHawk
Forsaken Reavers Rim Worlds Protectorate
143
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 19:33:00 -
[77] - Quote
Ocih wrote:I don't want advanced Industry skills. I want accountability and visibility in industry.
You build it, you put your name on it or in the case of EVE your corporation name. Not only does this allow the players to boycott corporate Industry it shows where there are monopolies in industry. One could argue it's an opportunity for epeen too. Space Mermaids becomes known for Prophecy Hulls or more realistic, a Goon corp becomes noted for Archon hulls. It also allows us to prove or disprove myths of how noob corps are the Industrial pulse.
With how quick assets die in eve I think this would be a wasted time for the development team. I do love it don't get me wrong, there are other games out that you put your name on what you make. But EVE's level of destruction with how a capital fleet could get wiped out at a moments notice, I think it would be a waste of assets. |
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
1901
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 19:33:00 -
[78] - Quote
might i suggest a sticky for this topic? There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:
Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad. |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3575
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 19:56:00 -
[79] - Quote
Team Administration
You receive, per level, (5% * the fraction of the system's bid that you provided.) of a teams fees Woo! CSM 9! http://fuzzwork.enterprises/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
1902
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 20:12:00 -
[80] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Team Administration
You receive, per level, (5% * the fraction of the system's bid that you provided.) of a teams fees
or maybe a skill that could increase the ability of the teams? There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:
Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad. |
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Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
1311
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 21:07:00 -
[81] - Quote
I really love the idea of a skill which effectively nullifies the effect that you have on the system index. Setting up in a deserted system is counter-productive because you're going to be increasing your own costs just by being there, a way to reduce this impact would be a big boost. |
Retar Aveymone
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
599
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 21:07:00 -
[82] - Quote
Saraki Ishikela wrote:I've always found the time reduction skills to be a waste. Say I'm at work for 8 hours and a job takes 8 hours to finish, reudcing the time to 6 hours nets me 0 gain. Unless there is a way to queue up additional jobs I have tradiationally always avoided anything that finishes a job faster as I normally see a 0 gain out of it. it's a waste for some jobs, but when I stick in a titan, week-long component run, or 8 ishtars I see gain out of that
TE is an tycoon skill because you need to be building at such vast volumes that your saved time outweighs the random time between job finishing and you logging in, so it is more niche but it is valuble |
Sabriz Adoudel
Mission BLITZ
3273
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 22:08:00 -
[83] - Quote
Omnathious Deninard wrote:CCP Greyscale wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:When you are adding new industry skills, you should do something to make Battleship Construction V have a use (along with Industrial Construction V, which I believe is also useless). Reasonable. I think these skills would be well suited for a 2% reduction in production time.
This person read my mind.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=346564 - a proposal to overhaul the Logistics skill https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=238931 - an idea for a new form of hybrid PVE/PVP content. www.minerbumping.com - ganking miners and causing chaos |
elitatwo
Congregatio
267
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 23:35:00 -
[84] - Quote
hfo df wrote:[list] Negotiation (old charisma trade skill) Reduces salary by 2% per level. So a 10% salary will be 9% at level 5. ]
Sorry dear, I have to inform you that the 'Negotiation' skillbook is a 'social' skill that gives you a 5% better agent pay per level for any NPC / Epic Arc mission you do. signature |
Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Fidelas Constans
1061
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 23:38:00 -
[85] - Quote
Didn't read whole thread yet but how about a skill to reduce team salary percentage? Something along 2-5% per level. Unions Connections or something. |
Matcha Mosburger
Manu Fortius space weaponry and trade
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 23:43:00 -
[86] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Just some quick (and possibly terrible) ideas off the top of my head.
Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Industrial Process Management: 1% reduction in manufacturing job install costs per level, requires Advanced Mass Production V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, mem/cha.
Scientific Process Management: 1% reduction in research job install costs per level, requires Advanced Laboratory Operation V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, int/cha.
Group Dynamics: 2% bonus to team effects per level, requires Social V and Advanced Industry V, rank 6, cha/int.
Edit:
Tinkering: 3% reduced invention job time per level, requires Science V, Jury Rigging V, and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
I like these I'd also like to see something similar towards specilization maybe:
Advanced Shipwright - 1% material cost (or 2% install cost) for hulls only
Advanced Modules- 1% material cost (or 2% install cost) for module production only
Advanced Rig Assmebly - 2% material cost (or 2% install cost) for Rig only (Also requires Rigging V) |
Matcha Mosburger
Manu Fortius space weaponry and trade
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.24 23:48:00 -
[87] - Quote
I'd also like to see something similar towards specilization maybe: (I'd prefer material reduction for these, but get the impression CCP isnt in favor of that. - Really I dont do huge runs, so TE offers the low quantity or part time indy no benefit)
Advanced Shipwright - 2% time reduction (or 2% install cost) for hulls only
Advanced Modules- 2% time reduction (or 2% install cost) for module production only
Advanced Rig Assmebly - 2% time reduction (or 2% install cost) for Rig only (Also requires Rigging V)
Advanced Space Construction - 2% time reduction in station/outpost/etc production
Other ones to affect the over all indy environment:
Advanced Labor Negotiations - Reduces the locatilty scaling tax by .5 per level. Requires Negotiation 5 and Adv Indy 5.
Your in a 10% start system? train skill to 5 Bam 7.5 % tax... your now more competative than yur corp mates or other indys in your area.
Industrial Accounting - Adv Indy 5 + Accounting 3 or 4 = Reduction in station or POS cost increase (base don number usage)
20 people running jobs? Indy account just reduce your cost increase to the equivlent of 10 people running jobs at that location. |
Kivena
EVE University Ivy League
43
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 11:17:00 -
[88] - Quote
Existing skill Customs Code Expertise could be used again for an industrial purpose - reducing the NPC tax from 10% to 5% at max level. This would of course run counter to CCPs (apparent) desire to move more manufacturing out of hisec.
Industrial Tax Codes Expertise (2x) Expertise in cutting through the red tape of industrial and research regulations. Reduces empire tax on industrial jobs by 10% per level.
And as other people have mentioned, giving the Frigate/Cruiser/Industrial/Battleship/Capital Ship Construction skills a per-level bonus to constructing the relevant ships would be an excellent idea. 2% duration or 2% installation cost reduction or something along those lines. Director of Education EVE University
Follow me on Twitter: @eveKivena
|
Masao Kurata
Z List
68
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 13:06:00 -
[89] - Quote
Production Line Management - Queue up to 4 jobs per level to be started when existing jobs become deliverable. To clarify, this does not affect your throughput, it just lets you keep production going with less clicks and less being logged in at the right time. Despite starting in a paused state, stopping one of these jobs will not return the materials, just like an active job. Installation cost is set when the job is queued and team availability is determined by the calculated start time for the job assuming all jobs run to delivery. Obviously if I'm missing anything that would allow you to get use out of a team beyond their normal life, that needs to be addressed, I think this is fine even if we allow pausing jobs though.
Something that would allow queuing jobs to depend on the input of existing jobs would be nice for players but probably hell to specify and develop. |
MoonglumX
Viaticus Consortium
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 13:50:00 -
[90] - Quote
Please, zero skills that lower cost enough to be mandatory at level V.
I think we need to dial up the crazy. What I would really find interesting is for skills that boost industry but only if you are in a Corp or on a POS (whichever is easier).
-- Corp. Engineer Efficiency : lowers your foot print to the system cost index by x% when running a corporation BPO/BPC job.
-- Corp. time efficiency: TE boosted by x% when running a corp BPO/BPC job.
-- Corp. Copy Efficiency: Copy times boosted by x% when copying a corp BPO.
-- Corp. Mineral Recovery: x% of minerals can be recovered from a canceled corp job.
I know a corp redo is coming. Just squeeze some stuff like this in there. |
|
Lloyd Roses
Artificial Memories Vertical.
674
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 14:12:00 -
[91] - Quote
This seems to be bound to those advanced skills only benefitting your produced volume, any fiddling around with the per-job efficiency would rather be a step back.
Pls make industry more mobile, so to say a reprocessing plant with its own warp drive, a production array available on the same fashion. "I honestly thought I was in lowsec"
|
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
148
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 14:25:00 -
[92] - Quote
MoonglumX wrote:I think we need to dial up the crazy. What I would really find interesting is for skills that boost industry but only if you are in a Corp or on a POS (whichever is easier). The problem is, it's so easy to create a corporation that these skills might as well have the corporation requirement removed. In fact, the only people the corporation skills will be unavailable to are, ironically, people already in a corporation but lacking industry roles. So you're basically telling industrialists to never join a corporation they are not a director of.
|
MoonglumX
Viaticus Consortium
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 14:53:00 -
[93] - Quote
Komi Toran wrote:MoonglumX wrote:I think we need to dial up the crazy. What I would really find interesting is for skills that boost industry but only if you are in a Corp or on a POS (whichever is easier). The problem is, it's so easy to create a corporation that these skills might as well have the corporation requirement removed. In fact, the only people the corporation skills will be unavailable to are, ironically, people already in a corporation but lacking industry roles. So you're basically telling industrialists to never join a corporation they are not a director of.
Creating corps should be easy. Finding good corps should be easy. Running corps should be easy (*within reason). Like I said, these skills should be put into the corp revamp. |
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
1444
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 15:18:00 -
[94] - Quote
MoonglumX wrote: Creating corps should be easy. Finding good corps should be easy. Running corps should be easy (*within reason). Like I said, these skills should be put into the corp revamp.
If such skills existed they should be Corp skills, not Industry skills. And if the Leader trains them they should benefit all jobs in the corp. This would make actual investment in corp skills matter for the leader rather than the current create the corp with a specialist alt, then plug in some random with no skills and just never update the corp. |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
148
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 15:36:00 -
[95] - Quote
MoonglumX wrote:Creating corps should be easy. Finding good corps should be easy. Running corps should be easy (*within reason). Like I said, these skills should be put into the corp revamp. You're missing the point. These skills creates a barrier in the game's social progression, where you're better off either as a solo player in your own corp or an established member of another corp than you are as a new member. That's not a good thing. |
Mackenzie Nolen
Xyjax
15
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 15:59:00 -
[96] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Mackenzie Nolen wrote:hfo df wrote:Back alley production Gain access to use a team 1 system per level away of where the team is located. (At increased team salary [per system] salary costs.) => free ride on others' teams next door.
This one I particularly like, but instead of a new skill I suggest this functionality get added to the heavily nerfed and existing "Scientific Networking" skill. Sure, you can't run jobs from station any more, but you can run them from a whole other region...
Let's not try to pretend that 95% of people with this skill didn't train it so their alt could sit in station while running research remotely at their POS. I'd be VERY curious to know what % of characters with this skill injected have it trained higher than level 1 or 2. |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
45
|
Posted - 2014.07.25 16:21:00 -
[97] - Quote
Mackenzie Nolen wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:Mackenzie Nolen wrote:hfo df wrote:Back alley production Gain access to use a team 1 system per level away of where the team is located. (At increased team salary [per system] salary costs.) => free ride on others' teams next door.
This one I particularly like, but instead of a new skill I suggest this functionality get added to the heavily nerfed and existing "Scientific Networking" skill. Sure, you can't run jobs from station any more, but you can run them from a whole other region... Let's not try to pretend that 95% of people with this skill didn't train it so their alt could sit in station while running research remotely at their POS. I'd be VERY curious to know what % of characters with this skill injected have it trained higher than level 1 or 2.
lv 3 was a short train and gave 15 jumps I believe. let me not worry about where I was in the region while haul crap around. |
Masao Kurata
Z List
69
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 04:08:00 -
[98] - Quote
Masao Kurata wrote:Production Line Management
Hmm, I think I should maybe expand on why I think this is a good idea now but might not have been before. Now personally I'm not an industrialist so my insight might be lacking, but it seems to me that there was little reason for industrialists to log on other than to keep their production lines running (including any hauling) and set up market orders before Crius. Now there is hopefully a dynamic industry landscape and more incentive to attack industrial starbases, creating actual gameplay for industrialists rather than log on, click buttons, log off. Scrapping the requirement to log on to click completely predetermined buttons in a predetermined order shouldn't be harmful in any way. |
Patrick Yaa
Starcade Group Elemental Tide
11
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 10:21:00 -
[99] - Quote
This is in addition to post #50
It might be madness, but in his last sentence, he mentioned something: Add skills to allow for superior products
This is, don't add ME/TE, something that benefits the producer, but the consumer. Add skills, that add HP, dmg, whatever to the BPs. This will have to be a wide array of skills, so you don't have to have an "entrance requirement" to make these, but a benefit when you specialize. There would be a need for this to be seen on the final product though, or else scamming :P
But yeah, so: Gallente Battleship Efficiency Specialization: 1% more armor HP/SL ORE Industrial Ship Efficieny Specialization: 1% to mining yield/SL Cpaital Ship Efficiency Specialization: 1% more structure HP/SL Caldari Cruiser Efficiency Specialization: 1% more shield HP/ SL Gallente Destroyer Efficiency Specialization: 1% more drone damage/SL and so on and so forth, lots of stuff to do.
This would ensure, that newbies whcich get into this will have a long way to skill, but once there, they are at least on par with the vets in this special field of operation. Your skills actually get you more money, because you can sell better products for more money
On the other hand - Market would get messy... or you get the option if you want to build with that skill or not, but can sell the better products only per contract
Or just move this system to BPs and do it all by invention, with an increased cost, more materials needed, more time needed... whaddayathink |
Venirious
Do It For The Lobster
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 11:33:00 -
[100] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Hi everyone,
The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf. We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
-Greyscale
So is that the final word on the 'Advanced Industry' skill itself?
I can't imagine I'm the only one that trained Production Efficiency to 5 that didn't intent to be a full blown industrialist. A lot of people have no need what so ever for jobs to finish faster which makes this skill quite useless. It's actually worse than useless, because atm I've lost ~700k worth of useful skill points, and to say I get to train MORE SP into other skills that may or may not benefit me doesn't help at all. |
|
Sjaandi HyShan
EVE University Ivy League
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 13:33:00 -
[101] - Quote
Venirious wrote: So is that the final word on the 'Advanced Industry' skill itself?
I can't imagine I'm the only one that trained Production Efficiency to 5 that didn't intent to be a full blown industrialist. A lot of people have no need what so ever for jobs to finish faster which makes this skill quite useless. It's actually worse than useless, because atm I've lost ~700k worth of useful skill points, and to say I get to train MORE SP into other skills that may or may not benefit me (particularly in my 'small-time' industry scale) doesn't help. P.E was required for the invested, but it was also useful for the small timers. This skill update is leaving this small-timer wanting an SP refund.
If they would implement a manufacturing queue, it would make all the new TE skills up in the air worth it. I know this isn't a little thing, but it is probably worthwhile for CCP to look at, as it would benefit sooo many and increase player support for new skills. There was already a manufacturing queue pre-Crius, it just also used a job "slot" from your skills. If they made it so that you could queue up on your own jobs (probably similar to how the skill queue operates) then it could really benefit players who don't have the time availability that some people do to log in at all times of the day. Also, it pushes the responsibility on the players, because if they are not using the bonuses it's their own fault, they can't blame it on anyone else.
---
Also, to those who are saying the Scientific Networking skill was nerfed, it was a MASSIVE buff. I had it trained to 3 before Crius and will probably take it to 4 now. It was so annoying to have a skill that allowed research job start-ups 15 jobs away, but had a regional boundary 13 jumps away, so I had to travel 14 jumps to start the job in the next jump's solar system (assuming it was near my max range). Now, I can go anywhere near my home base and not have to take the massive time hit when the regional boundaries don't line up nicely. 15 jump range is approximate to 30 minutes of jumps which I don't have to take as often. Thank you CCP!! |
Sirinda
Ekchuah's Shrine Comporium
376
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 13:35:00 -
[102] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Hi everyone,
The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf. We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
We're expecting this discussion to evolve over the coming weeks as the new system settles down and people figure out what bonuses they'd find most valuable. We'd be looking at shipping these changes in one of the two following scheduled releases, depending on how this discussion goes.
So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good?
-Greyscale
Polaris construction? |
Sjaandi HyShan
EVE University Ivy League
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 15:17:00 -
[103] - Quote
Here are my two cents on the 3% per level to all industry jobs.
No advanced skill in the game that I know of gives extra bonuses to something its base skill(s) does not. Advanced Industry should require Industry, Research, Metallurgy, and Science to at least IV before it could be injected to stay consistent. Otherwise, Advanced Industry should be reworked to be more like Astrometrics , where Industry would be renamed to Manufacturing and Advanced Industry would be renamed to Industry, and give bonuses to all the others industry time skills.
I've also thought of some considerations for the post Crius releases that should be taken into account, but that I don't think quite fit the topic of this original discussion. Here's a link to that thread. |
Lia' Vael
No More Ore Reclamation Enterprises
2
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 17:33:00 -
[104] - Quote
I'm still not happy with this, but thank you for the changes. I have only 2 or 3 jobs a week, so still it's a wasted skill for me as I'm not interested in capital manufacturing.
I beg you to let us choose what shall we spend those skllpoints! |
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
382
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 18:36:00 -
[105] - Quote
I agree with the bonus but adding as a pre-req seems like a bad idea. It will make it more difficult for new players to get into industry as many of the skills already have high and intense requirements which don't make sense.
Adding another rank 3 skill to them is not going to make it any better. Those of us who trained it in the past will survive, we don't need to make everyone else miserable just because some of us might have skipped training it to 5. |
Niko Lorenzio
United Eve Directorate
382
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 18:38:00 -
[106] - Quote
Honestly, CCP really needs to implement a policy that when you change what a skill does, you refund the skillpoints and let us decide if we want to put them back into that skill or spend it elsewhere. |
Yana Dean
Can-'Ka No Rey
0
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 19:40:00 -
[107] - Quote
I would like to see a skill wich further increases the ability to use more manufacturing / researching slots. For now you need multiple characters to generate a reasonable amount of profit via industry wich are equally skilled and doing all the same. As well you have to switch your characters (logging etc.).
If a single industry character wants to progress into large scale producing, this would be a nice skilling option. This will free up characterslots for other things/ways to do in New Eden, wich dont have to be the same. |
Sheeana Harb
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
30
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 20:25:00 -
[108] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:
So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good?
-Greyscale
I would suggest a skill that allows to queue up invention jobs.
Why? This might be just a personal issue, but one of the reason I felt burnout with the industry was the need to set a new invention job every 1 hour and 15 minutes (as I was inventing modules in a POS), with 3 characters, this resulted in a huge clickfest and soon after I started I wasn't looking forward to click through 30 jobs.
I would be perfectly fine with being able to queue only modules, drones and ammo, as they have short invention times. Ships are fine. If I were to make a line, it would say every BPC with under 10 hours of a single invention run should fall into the queue category.
Skill details: Queuing inventions should come at an extra cost (whichever is easiest to code; either lower success chance, longer time to complete or extra materials) as I believe players who log more often - to update their jobs - should be rewarded. However queuing should benefit to those who log in in the morning, go to work and return later that day and still feel that they have done something within the industry. |
Amarisen Gream
Lone Wolf Union Yulai Federation
41
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 20:31:00 -
[109] - Quote
Just wondering if people don't read through these forums. . .
I've seen about 10 post for extra slots or queue-able slots...
lol
edit - nvm. of 110 post, half seem to be ether for extra slots for queue-able slots! xoxo Amarisen Gream |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
150
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 20:31:00 -
[110] - Quote
Sheeana Harb wrote:This might be just a personal issue, but one of the reason I felt burnout with the industry was the need to set a new invention job every 1 hour and 15 minutes (as I was inventing modules in a POS), with 3 characters, this resulted in a huge clickfest and soon after I started I wasn't looking forward to click through 30 jobs. This is why it shouldn't be a skill, it should just be. But, invention is on the overhaul block, so hopefully it will get fixed then. So yes to the idea, but no to this basic functionality being but behind a skill hoop. |
|
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
47
|
Posted - 2014.07.26 21:23:00 -
[111] - Quote
Amarisen Gream wrote:Just wondering if people don't read through these forums. . .
I've seen about 10 post for extra slots or queue-able slots...
lol
edit - nvm. of 110 post, half seem to be ether for extra slots for queue-able slots!
must mean people are needing more slots so they can cut down on the amount of alts they have to run |
Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
781
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 03:22:00 -
[112] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf.
I guess that's the problem with Crius right now. Apart from being able to display bpos/bpcs in containers nothing really was an improvement to the way I used to do industry. In fact, there's a lot that is broken right now and I'm waiting for things to get fixed.
CCP Greyscale wrote:So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good? How about a skill that reduces material consumption? Remove insurance. |
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ISD Cyberdyne
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
1545
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 04:50:00 -
[113] - Quote
Added glue for visibility and support. Please remember to keep all comments, issues, and discussion constructive and in keeping with the forum rules.
Thank you. ISD Cyberdyne Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
12513
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 05:56:00 -
[114] - Quote
Storage efficiency.
Better understanding of space saving techniques during construction of ships. 2% reduction in packaged ship m3 per level. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship |
Shin Dari
Covert Brigade
48
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 09:58:00 -
[115] - Quote
I am just going to throw out whatever comes to mind, be prepared for some really bad ideas.
---POS skills--- Player owned structures are becoming more important, thus I suggest skills for making better use of POSes. * - Small POS fuel efficiency * -- Medium POS fuel efficiency (preq is SPFE IV) * --- Large POS fuel efficiency (preq is MPFE IV)
[Getting more powergrid and CPU from an race specific POS] * Amarr POS Output * Caldari POS Output * Gallente POS Output * Minmatar POS Output
[Improved racial POS bonusses] * Amarr POS Management * Caldari POS Management * Gallente POS Management * Minmatar POS Management
---Cost skills--- If CCP is going to make skills that reduce cost or materials, please make them heavy rank and specific to a type of product (this will prevent 'must have' skills). The best way to do this is to link such skills to science/datacore names, some examples:
* Graviton Manufacturing [tiny bonus to production of items linked to Graviton Physics] * Caldari Starship Manufacturing ["" Caldari Starship Engineering]
---Cargo skills--- These will help to make some activities more mobile. * Starship Packaging [Ships take up less volume in the cargo hold] * Structure Packaging [Structures (Deploy/Starbase/Sov) take up less volume in the cargo hold] * Material Packaging [Industrial materials take up less volume in the cargo hold, if possible] * Module & Rig Packaging [Rigs and equipment take up less volume in the cargo hold] * etc --- * Cargo Smuggling [The higher the skill the lower percentage of cargo will be detected by NPC and player cargo scans.]
---Other skills--- * Hidden Industry [Your jobs have less influence on the system index]
* Serial Job Planning [Skill to make improved use of Advanced Industry skill. It does this by linking multiple jobs into one chain job, the maximum length of the queue depends on the skill level (suggested 1 day per level)]
* Navy Infrigement [small chance to invent a navy faction BPC during T2 invention]
* Blueprint Copy Joining [The number of identical BPCs that can be joined together at a time, to a single BPC with the sum of the runs.]
|
Medalyn Isis
Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic
295
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 10:22:00 -
[116] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Hi everyone,
The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf. We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
We're expecting this discussion to evolve over the coming weeks as the new system settles down and people figure out what bonuses they'd find most valuable. We'd be looking at shipping these changes in one of the two following scheduled releases, depending on how this discussion goes.
So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good?
-Greyscale
**Sticky** - ISD Cyberdyne Awesome. This is a great change. As for advanced industry skills, perhaps a skill which affects the efficiency of teams. Ive not used stuff enough yet though so I'd have to get back to you on that.
Also awesome job on the whole industry expansion Greyscale, you deserve a holiday for all your hard work! |
Sheeana Harb
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
30
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 16:03:00 -
[117] - Quote
Amarisen Gream wrote:Just wondering if people don't read through these forums. . .
I've seen about 10 post for extra slots or queue-able slots...
lol
edit - nvm. of 110 post, half seem to be ether for extra slots for queue-able slots!
I'm very sorry if it bothers you whenever more people express similar opinions or desires.
However Greyscale called for a feedback and given that CCP is currently re-working invention, it's reasonable and well-timed to ask for more industry jobs per character, queueing, ect. And seeing multiple posts about certain features only shows that there is a desire to have them implemented.
Komi Toran wrote:This is why it shouldn't be a skill, it should just be. But, invention is on the overhaul block, so hopefully it will get fixed then. So yes to the idea, but no to this basic functionality being but behind a skill hoop.
Could you please elaborate more why you think having it tied to a skill is a bad idea? I'm interested. I always though it makes sense given inventions are intensive on skill points and if you dedicated your character down this path (if I recall correctly it takes about 2 months to be reasonably proficient in inventions), you certainly can afford an additional skill.
It can even be logically implemented: Each level of said skill gives ability to queue one extra run per invention job, up to max_runs_of_T2_BPC / 2. So at level 5, for modules (which have 10 runs T2 BPCs), you can queue 5 additional invention attempts behind one T1 BPC. |
Sal Landry
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
221
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 17:01:00 -
[118] - Quote
Sheeana Harb wrote: However Greyscale called for a feedback and given that CCP is currently re-working invention, it's reasonable and well-timed to ask for more industry jobs per character, queueing, ect.
It's unreasonable to keep posting about queuing when a CCP poster has specifically ruled out queuing in this very same thread. |
Sheeana Harb
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
30
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 20:44:00 -
[119] - Quote
Sal Landry wrote: It's unreasonable to keep posting about queuing when a CCP poster has specifically ruled out queuing in this very same thread.
Interesting. I've just went through the thread and can't seem to find anyone from CCP mentioning or rulling queueing out. Could you please provide a link to that specific post? I would like to know more.
|
Kyshonuba
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
28
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 20:51:00 -
[120] - Quote
Here it is Sheeana.
CCP Greyscale wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:
So clarifying, material requirement reductions are looked down upon?
Generally speaking, cost reductions can be considered as having a lower probability of being implemented, all other things being equal. Ditto anything which requires significant feature work (eg queueing - that's a feature with a skill attached, not a skill modifying an existing number)........... |
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Sheeana Harb
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
30
|
Posted - 2014.07.27 21:00:00 -
[121] - Quote
Kyshonuba wrote:Here it is Sheeana.
Thank you.
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Carniflex
StarHunt Mordus Angels
261
|
Posted - 2014.07.28 14:11:00 -
[122] - Quote
Hrmp. A mandatory skill everyone who ever made a little ammo for personal usage had to have at 5 gets changed to a time bonus skill ... To be frank I would have preferred to get that SP in green as with just 3% per level speed bonus it is kind of pointless to take that skill to 5 unless you are really hardcore industrialist.
So that leaves one with a hard decision on how to justify such skill at 5 that would be just fine at 4 for most people. If you introduce additional skills that are actually useful and need this at 5 you end up with the old situation where you need to have that skill at 5 to participate in industry in meaningful way. Because it's a prerequisite for something actually useful. If you throw in there a small amount of relatively useless skills it does not justify having that skill at 5 after such a serious change to it. Ohwell - ofcource I have some skill ideas (some are already mentioned in the previous pages as well)
(*) NPC tax reduction (do note than your standings should also count, same as they do when you do market orders). I would leave tax reduction from standings slightly larger than from skill as +10 standings are very significant grind for most people. (*) Ability to use teams some amount of jumps away (perhaps at inceased fee and additional skill that lowers that additional fee back towards normal). For example: You can use a team up to 5 jumps away with each jump increasing the team fee additional 20% (at 5 jumps the team fee is double that what it would be in your home system). Additional skill lowering the remote team fee by 10% per level. So you would end up at only 150% at 5 jumps instead of 200% of the team fee at max skill. (*) Additional manufacturing/research slots (obviously) (*) Specialized manufacturing skills or changing specific construction skills that they give some additional bonus to T1 manufacturing as well. For example: Battleship construction providing x% per level time bonus to all battleship construction jobs. Similar skills for modules (or specific module groups), anchorables, drones, ammo, etc. (*) Branding? Is it still in the plans? Some additional modifiers?, say that you can change the base items stats by 1% per level in combination with branding (would make balancing a nightmare ofc). Example: Ballistic Control II - base item has 10.5% ROF and 10% damage bonus. You increase ROF by 5% so the new RoF bonus is 11.025% - if needed you can penalize all other stats by the same percentage as well. Then introduce additional skill to lower these penalties to, say, half of the default. Probably a bit too big undertasking to just add couple new skills ;) But that is how a sandbox manufacturing should work. Give a player pile of points and let him minmax stuff. Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... *THWONK!* GOT the bastard. |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
47
|
Posted - 2014.07.28 15:57:00 -
[123] - Quote
Kyshonuba wrote:Here it is Sheeana. CCP Greyscale wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:
So clarifying, material requirement reductions are looked down upon?
Generally speaking, cost reductions can be considered as having a lower probability of being implemented, all other things being equal. Ditto anything which requires significant feature work (eg queueing - that's a feature with a skill attached, not a skill modifying an existing number)...........
good thing that it wasn't ruled out just things like that are a low probability of happening. |
Amarisen Gream
Lone Wolf Union Yulai Federation
41
|
Posted - 2014.07.28 16:08:00 -
[124] - Quote
Maybe CCP Greyscale would be kind enough, to issue a survey on Advanced Industry.
They've gotten a week or more worth of ideas. Now would be a good time to survey the player base and see how they feel about it all.
-- P.S. Sorry about my comment before about people no reading! But, there are a lot of redundant points being made. Which, at least in my history of looking for topics or points, hurts the over all develop. A simple +1 to ***** skill would awesome.
p.p.s. I'm still not standing for any skills that reduce ME/TE father than they are. . . Though thinking about it. Any specialization skill would need something that helps that player niche the market on that item. I'd feel much better for "hybrid" skills. Things skilled by the CEO/Directors that effect player corps. A lot of the ideas presented above would work with this. Also, it would help move people from NPC corps, and look for a corp with the play style they want to join in on. Would need a similar system for corps who like focus on the other game "jobs"
xoxo Amarisen Gream |
Matcha Mosburger
Manu Fortius space weaponry and trade
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.28 21:10:00 -
[125] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Retar Aveymone wrote:
So clarifying, material requirement reductions are looked down upon?
Generally speaking, cost reductions can be considered as having a lower probability of being implemented, all other things being equal. Ditto anything which requires significant feature work (eg queueing - that's a feature with a skill attached, not a skill modifying an existing number)...........
He said ruling out a skill attaching it a feature. I think the consensus is actually - TE skills suck for people not making massive loads or caps.
Sooo - add Production Queueing, period.
Not as a skill based feature, but a strait feature. This suddenly makes ALL the TE skills suggested relevant and useful for all players.
|
Adunh Slavy
1563
|
Posted - 2014.07.29 14:49:00 -
[126] - Quote
Cronyism - Gives a small standing bonus to NPC corp and/or faction based on what is built and where.
For Instance: Building a raven at a Caldari NPC corp, would give a 0.005% standing increase to that station's owning corporation and the faction. It would also give negative standings to Gallente faction, in this example.
Building a Domi at that same station would give no bonus of any kind. Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.-á-á- William Pitt |
Eodp Ellecon
Northstar Cabal Tactical Narcotics Team
9
|
Posted - 2014.07.30 14:27:00 -
[127] - Quote
The volume aspects of Data Sheets needs to be revisited especially in light of cargo reductions and/or fuel costs.
Their current 1.0 m3 is a little out of line when you consider where minerals, most salvage and Reports are on the order of .01m3
|
Carniflex
StarHunt Mordus Angels
266
|
Posted - 2014.07.30 20:16:00 -
[128] - Quote
Matcha Mosburger wrote: He said ruling out a skill attaching it a feature. I think the consensus is actually - TE skills suck for people not making massive loads or caps.
Sooo - add Production Queueing, period.
Not as a skill based feature, but a strait feature. This suddenly makes ALL the TE skills suggested relevant and useful for all players.
I just realized something which I did not think of before for some reason. With the removal of production efficiency skill (renamed to that adv industry) any character you have is already a perfect builder. Somewhat slower at it than your previous "perfect builder" but hey, who cares. You can now trump quality with quantity.
Granted if you already had all 3 slots per account trained up to be good builders it will not do a lot for you (because adv industry is kinda meh) but because of the limitation of slots it might have not made sense previously in many locations / situations. Now, however, just push them to 10 slots each.
Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... *THWONK!* GOT the bastard. |
Rapscallion Jones
Omnibus Solutions
42
|
Posted - 2014.07.31 12:02:00 -
[129] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Hi everyone,
The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf. We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
We're expecting this discussion to evolve over the coming weeks as the new system settles down and people figure out what bonuses they'd find most valuable. We'd be looking at shipping these changes in one of the two following scheduled releases, depending on how this discussion goes.
So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good?
-Greyscale
**Sticky** - ISD Cyberdyne
Let's face it, the majority of us are not neckbeards living in mom's basement glued to EVE 24/7. Most jobs do not last even a 24 hour cycle so we generally lose game time due to the realities of real life. We have a skill queue, why not a jobs queue.
How about a skill and an advanced skill that at lvl 5/5 grant a jobs queue equal to the max jobs you can have installed. This would not grant additional jobs only a queue. So maxed out you could have 11 jobs running and 11 jobs queued up.
This could have both Science and Manufacturing application. |
iwannadig
Nagibators Inc.
1
|
Posted - 2014.07.31 19:02:00 -
[130] - Quote
You removed region boundary for remote job control and this is cool. Now I would like to see a skill that allows players to see market orders +5 systems farther per level.
Also I would like to see manufacturing/science jobs count hardwiring. |
|
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
3355
|
Posted - 2014.07.31 22:52:00 -
[131] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Hi everyone,
The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf. We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
We're expecting this discussion to evolve over the coming weeks as the new system settles down and people figure out what bonuses they'd find most valuable. We'd be looking at shipping these changes in one of the two following scheduled releases, depending on how this discussion goes.
So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good?
-Greyscale
**Sticky** - ISD Cyberdyne
I don't understand. Why are you even bothering with this thread, other than the 3% announcement. Surely the cartels have already told you what skills you will create / modify, so why bother with the charade? |
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
1907
|
Posted - 2014.08.01 03:08:00 -
[132] - Quote
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
I don't understand. Why are you even bothering with this thread, other than the 3% announcement. Surely the cartels have already told you what skills you will create / modify, so why bother with the charade?
CARTELS?!?!?!?! in my EvE harrumph
There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:
Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad. |
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
450
|
Posted - 2014.08.01 03:51:00 -
[133] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote: The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building)....
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf.
Actually, as someone who already has this skill at level 5 on my industry main, I think this update is sufficient and needs no further oomf. Thanks, btw.
CCP Greyscale wrote: We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
While I do not personally object to this idea, on behalf of the younger players, I'll say this:
Please keep in mind that adding more skills always further increases the performance gap between older players and younger players, and makes it difficult, if not impossible, for the younger players to catch up and become competitive. This situation tends to discourage attracting new players to the game, too.
It is also very frustrating for younger players, who have to rejuggle their skill queues and attribute mappings, to optimally accommodate the new skills in their training plan. Remember, too, that players only get once-per-year remaps, after the initial ones are used up, and you can't buy them for ISK, nor using PLEX.
Older players, like me, don't have much else to train, so we can just slap the new skills in the queue and be done with them in shortest possible time to further improve our advantage over the younger players. Works out fine for me, but it isn't really fair.
|
|
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
3302
|
Posted - 2014.08.01 18:11:00 -
[134] - Quote
Removed a rumor post. ISD Dorrim Barstorlode Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
|
Captain StringfellowHawk
Forsaken Reavers Rim Worlds Protectorate
145
|
Posted - 2014.08.02 04:22:00 -
[135] - Quote
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode wrote:Removed a rumor post.
You know when "rumors" start to get removed they are most likely true. *tinfoils* Tons of rumors get posted all the time :P whatever it was gets quickly removed :P |
Orin Zhu
University of Caille Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2014.08.02 09:39:00 -
[136] - Quote
Quoted from a reddit thread :
"We dont want any rough barriers to entry for industry so we've murdered ME behind the wood shed." "Hey guys, we're adding an entire new skill tree with AI-V as a prereq!"
|
Emiko Rowna
Aliastra Gallente Federation
12
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 05:52:00 -
[137] - Quote
Shin Dari wrote: I am just going to throw out whatever comes to mind, be prepared for some really bad ideas.
...
* Navy Infrigement [small chance to invent a navy faction BPC during T2 invention]
...
Can we find a way to tie standings into this?
|
Anthar Thebess
635
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 07:52:00 -
[138] - Quote
I'm not industrialist, but will this not make more supers produced faster? Do we really need this?
Why we cannot make this skill bonus something else than speed of new supers introduced into the game. If you relay want to make it affect production time.
1 item produced = no bonus 2 or more items produced = 3% * skill level to Time Efficiency.
This way the stuff that is bad to this game will not be produced much more faster. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3631
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 14:32:00 -
[139] - Quote
Orin Zhu wrote:Quoted from a reddit thread :
"We dont want any rough barriers to entry for industry so we've murdered ME behind the wood shed." "Hey guys, we're adding an entire new skill tree with AI-V as a prereq!"
Material Efficiency (skill) was pretty much a barrier to doing any industry.
I don't see them adding skills which will be required in the same fashion, for doing basic T1 industry.
Greyscale did pretty much say that there would be no ME reductions from skill, for example.
TE reductions aren't required in the same way. you can make the same things, just slower, without it. Woo! CSM 9! http://fuzzwork.enterprises/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3631
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 14:37:00 -
[140] - Quote
Anthar Thebess wrote:I'm not industrialist, but will this not make more supers produced faster? Do we really need this?
Why we cannot make this skill bonus something else than speed of new supers introduced into the game. If you relay want to make it affect production time.
1 item produced = no bonus 2 or more items produced = 3% * skill level to Time Efficiency.
This way the stuff that is bad to this game will not be produced much more faster.
Just to clarify what the AI skill does.
It doesn't add to the blueprint's TE. It multiplies against it.
So at max levels, it's not a 35% reduction. It's a 32% reduction. Addition reductions (from POS arrays, for example) multiply in as well, so the 25% reduction of a POS doesn't make it a 60% reduction. It makes it a 49% reduction.
Of course, you already have the 20% reduction from Industry, so that takes it to a 59% reduction, rather than a 80% reduction. Woo! CSM 9! http://fuzzwork.enterprises/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
|
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
53
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 18:16:00 -
[141] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Orin Zhu wrote:Quoted from a reddit thread :
"We dont want any rough barriers to entry for industry so we've murdered ME behind the wood shed." "Hey guys, we're adding an entire new skill tree with AI-V as a prereq!"
Material Efficiency (skill) was pretty much a barrier to doing any industry. I don't see them adding skills which will be required in the same fashion, for doing basic T1 industry. Greyscale did pretty much say that there would be no ME reductions from skill, for example. TE reductions aren't required in the same way. you can make the same things, just slower, without it.
Which is most of the problem and complaints now. It was a skill you needed at 5 weather you made ammo once a month or if you ran all the slots allowed 24/7.
Now a TE skill doesn't do anything for the guy running a little ammo now and then but it will a really nice boon for those that run all there slots 24/7.
|
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
3631
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 18:29:00 -
[142] - Quote
I'm actually finding it handy for invention.
It's dropping some of the longer runs into a time frame where I can do two per session.
anyway:
Skills which gate basic functionality are bad. (like the learning skills) Skills which gate advanced functionality are fine.
Woo! CSM 9! http://fuzzwork.enterprises/ Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
54
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 18:36:00 -
[143] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Skills which gate basic functionality are bad. (like the learning skills) Skills which gate advanced functionality are fine.
no ones really saying its not. just that the learning skills were refunded instead of turned into some other skill. |
NEONOVUS
Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us
890
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 19:25:00 -
[144] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:I'm actually finding it handy for invention.
It's dropping some of the longer runs into a time frame where I can do two per session.
anyway:
Skills which gate basic functionality are bad. (like the learning skills) Skills which gate advanced functionality are fine.
I fully agree there, love that it now drops a lot of stuff to under 4 hours.
What of skills that add a free level to bps? IE if BP(ME|TE < cap) New_BP_Research = ME|TE + AI_New_Skill_level * % return(New_BP_Research )
That way it dovetails well with all the upsetness about perfect BPS being measured in years for some people, while still allowing for a market for researched BPs |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
54
|
Posted - 2014.08.05 20:18:00 -
[145] - Quote
NEONOVUS wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:I'm actually finding it handy for invention.
It's dropping some of the longer runs into a time frame where I can do two per session.
anyway:
Skills which gate basic functionality are bad. (like the learning skills) Skills which gate advanced functionality are fine.
I fully agree there, love that it now drops a lot of stuff to under 4 hours. What of skills that add a free level to bps? IE if BP(ME|TE < cap) New_BP_Research = ME|TE + AI_New_Skill_level * % return(New_BP_Research ) That way it dovetails well with all the upsetness about perfect BPS being measured in years for some people, while still allowing for a market for researched BPs
how is this any different than the ME skill? as there are only 10 distinct lvls of ME if it increases by only one ME lv its becomes a required skill for any bp that isn't ME 10. |
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
788
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 04:03:00 -
[146] - Quote
I will add my support for a skill (or skills) that lets us queue jobs.
Skills to specialize could be good, but the advantages need to be looked at very closely so that generalists and specialists can still compete somewhat.
Here's an idea: Rapid manufacturing. Let's you add RAM as an input in return for a much larger time reduction.
Efficient construction: Lets you increase the time to manufacture an item, at the end of the job some materials are refunded.
Concurrent manufacturing: Let's you install the same blueprint multiple times (so you can have multiple jobs of the same thing going at once). You still can't make more than the number of max runs though. |
Kale Freeman
Dirt 'n' Glitter I Whip My Slaves Back and Forth
29
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 07:40:00 -
[147] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:I'm actually finding it handy for invention.
It's dropping some of the longer runs into a time frame where I can do two per session.
anyway:
Skills which gate basic functionality are bad. (like the learning skills) Skills which gate advanced functionality are fine.
I'm not sure that the learning skills gated any functionality. They were just a long train that improved a specific aspect of the game. Specifically they improved the rate at which you gained skillpoints.
There are other similar skills that are a long-ish train that improve specific areas of the game. eg the modified skill that now reduced job times for industry. It simply improves the rate at which you can build/invent/copy/research. The old production efficiency was also simply a sill that improved a specific aspect of the game. If reduced the amount of materials you needed to manufacture something.
None of them actually gate anything.
None of them gate advanced functionality either. They are simply a long train to get to improved performance in some aspect of the game. |
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
852
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 09:52:00 -
[148] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:I will add my support for a skill (or skills) that lets us queue jobs.
Skills to specialize could be good, but the advantages need to be looked at very closely so that generalists and specialists can still compete somewhat.
Here's an idea: Rapid manufacturing. Let's you add RAM as an input in return for a much larger time reduction.
Efficient construction: Lets you increase the time to manufacture an item, at the end of the job some materials are refunded.
Concurrent manufacturing: Let's you install the same blueprint multiple times (so you can have multiple jobs of the same thing going at once). You still can't make more than the number of max runs though. Not sure I like those examples.
Reducing build time at the expense of increased material needs or even isk is fine, but reducing material usage in exchange for increase build time is not something I would support.
Nor could I support the multiple quing of BPC's, (and it would be BPC's, as you can just increase the number of runs from BPO's.) I view the run limitations on BPCs and the need to reinstall jobs manually as an important limiting factor in the industry balanacing process. http://meme-generator.me/media/created/d3r3t8.jpg |
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
788
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 10:12:00 -
[149] - Quote
Hakan MacTrew wrote:[quote=Xindi Kraid]
Nor could I support the multiple quing of BPC's, (and it would be BPC's, as you can just increase the number of runs from BPO's.) I view the run limitations on BPCs and the need to reinstall jobs manually as an important limiting factor in the industry balanacing process. As I said, you shouldn't be able to get more runs out of a blueprint just by queuing it multiple times. If you have a blueprint with 5 runs, and you install a 3 run job, you can only then install another 2 run job at which point the BPC is used up. |
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
852
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 10:29:00 -
[150] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:Hakan MacTrew wrote:Nor could I support the multiple quing of BPC's, (and it would be BPC's, as you can just increase the number of runs from BPO's.) I view the run limitations on BPCs and the need to reinstall jobs manually as an important limiting factor in the industry balanacing process. As I said, you shouldn't be able to get more runs out of a blueprint just by queuing it multiple times. If you have a blueprint with 5 runs, and you install a 3 run job, you can only then install another 2 run job at which point the BPC is used up. Yes, but why not just install the full 5 runs in the first place? I see no need to 'stack' jobs in the manner you are suggesting, other than a shortage of materials that could be remedied inbetween runs.
I wouldn't have a problem with materials being used on a 'per run' basis as each run is completed, rather than having all the materials for the build being taken away when the job in installed. http://meme-generator.me/media/created/d3r3t8.jpg |
|
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
788
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 15:01:00 -
[151] - Quote
Hakan MacTrew wrote:Xindi Kraid wrote:Hakan MacTrew wrote:Nor could I support the multiple quing of BPC's, (and it would be BPC's, as you can just increase the number of runs from BPO's.) I view the run limitations on BPCs and the need to reinstall jobs manually as an important limiting factor in the industry balanacing process. As I said, you shouldn't be able to get more runs out of a blueprint just by queuing it multiple times. If you have a blueprint with 5 runs, and you install a 3 run job, you can only then install another 2 run job at which point the BPC is used up. Yes, but why not just install the full 5 runs in the first place? I see no need to 'stack' jobs in the manner you are suggesting, other than a shortage of materials that could be remedied inbetween runs. I wouldn't have a problem with materials being used on a 'per run' basis as each run is completed, rather than having all the materials for the build being taken away when the job in installed. By running multiple jobs at the same time they get done more quickly.
It would be interesting to be able to start a partially filled job and finish stocking it up later.
Maybe we could have a skill for continuous production: Lets you install a job for a specific duration and at regular intervals (based on the completion time of one item) it will pull materials from the indicated hangar and deliver completed items. If you don't have enough materials installed the job pauses. if the maximum runs have been exhausted the job cancels. Manually canceling the job will have it complete the current item in progress then return the blueprint (canceling a second time will return the print immediately but the material inputs will be lost) |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
54
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 15:04:00 -
[152] - Quote
Hakan MacTrew wrote:Xindi Kraid wrote:Hakan MacTrew wrote:Nor could I support the multiple quing of BPC's, (and it would be BPC's, as you can just increase the number of runs from BPO's.) I view the run limitations on BPCs and the need to reinstall jobs manually as an important limiting factor in the industry balanacing process. As I said, you shouldn't be able to get more runs out of a blueprint just by queuing it multiple times. If you have a blueprint with 5 runs, and you install a 3 run job, you can only then install another 2 run job at which point the BPC is used up. Yes, but why not just install the full 5 runs in the first place? I see no need to 'stack' jobs in the manner you are suggesting, other than a shortage of materials that could be remedied inbetween runs. I wouldn't have a problem with materials being used on a 'per run' basis as each run is completed, rather than having all the materials for the build being taken away when the job in installed.
because of the very reason you stated. or the other solution to the issue that you stated also works. |
Selphentine
Insane Waffles
1
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 22:45:00 -
[153] - Quote
Maybe something with some dynamic, maybe based on your activity even? Something like 5% per skill level that a blueprint-copy wont consume on run, dont applies for faction or capital blueprints (ofc)... Or something that maybe includes the hacking-minigame in that order? Depending on the blueprint, starting hacking, success will allow one run without the blueprint getting "consumed", fail will alert the station managers and cause a standing loss to the corp... Mh. From very easy to very hard depending on the blueprint, skills increase virus strength. This would really need an insane amount of fine balancing, so the copies dont get used that much that it really affects much, but on the other hand, may increase the profit marge for a single person that is willing to risk something... Mh. Just a direction to think about, nothing that is yet remotly finished. Maybe some teams from pirate factions could make hacking a bit easier... ;) Important is ofc that in both cases this wont work with large amounts of runs, neither with too good blueprints. |
NEONOVUS
Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us
890
|
Posted - 2014.08.06 23:06:00 -
[154] - Quote
Lady Rift wrote:
how is this any different than the ME skill? as there are only 10 distinct lvls of ME if it increases by only one ME lv its becomes a required skill for any bp that isn't ME 10.
But you can still use a ME 10 bp, and by the same it loses the point if all you have is an ME10
Which is the point really, its a diminishing skill as you have many methods to boost a bpo already, and this one effects only you without giving a the bar is now this high for entry
Sort of like how copper heat sinks over aluminum slow the rise to a thermal shutdown, but do nothing to increase that horrid point.
Where as the old ME skill was adding fresh thermal paste and actively raised the temperature, something that had to be done. |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
57
|
Posted - 2014.08.07 00:32:00 -
[155] - Quote
NEONOVUS wrote:Lady Rift wrote:
how is this any different than the ME skill? as there are only 10 distinct lvls of ME if it increases by only one ME lv its becomes a required skill for any bp that isn't ME 10.
But you can still use a ME 10 bp, and by the same it loses the point if all you have is an ME10 Which is the point really, its a diminishing skill as you have many methods to boost a bpo already, and this one effects only you without giving a the bar is now this high for entry Sort of like how copper heat sinks over aluminum slow the rise to a thermal shutdown, but do nothing to increase that horrid point. Where as the old ME skill was adding fresh thermal paste and actively raised the temperature, something that had to be done.
the complaints Ive seen are alot of OMG it takes xxx long to research this bp to lv 10. This skill just lets them avoid that.
Would it be allowed to work with BPCs? |
Judgement Sunwalker
Goblin Wares
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.07 03:13:00 -
[156] - Quote
Hello Capsuleers,
This is my first time posting in any forum, so criticize away. After reading almost every post and reply on this topic. I came to understand most people don't want skills that have to do anything with Reducing Time or Materials for manufacturing things. So I came up with some ideas. Don't know if they're good or bad.
*Note* I understand the restrictions and limitations of my ideas. So be my guess on tinkering the ideas or be inspired to come up with something new.
Control Tower Specialist - Reduces fuel requirement by 2% per level on end production. (1 fuel block less on level 5) *Includes Faction Control Towers
Rig Specialist GÇô Reduces drawback by 4% per level on end production. (20% by level 5, So it's 1 % less in drawback)
Ship Specialist - Increases ship hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (Not structure hit points only)
Drone Specialist GÇô increases drone hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (5% Hitpoints by level 5)
Ammunition Specialist GÇô Increase damage by 1% per level on end production (5 % damage by level 5)
**Note** I did some calculations, and to me it doesn't sound over powering. |
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
789
|
Posted - 2014.08.07 21:09:00 -
[157] - Quote
Judgement Sunwalker wrote:Hello Capsuleers,
This is my first time posting in any forum, so criticize away. After reading almost every post and reply on this topic. I came to understand most people don't want skills that have to do anything with Reducing Time or Materials for manufacturing things. So I came up with some ideas. Don't know if they're good or bad.
*Note* I understand the restrictions and limitations of my ideas. So be my guess on tweaking the ideas or be inspired to come up with something new.
Control Tower Specialist - Reduces fuel requirement by 2% per level on end production. (1-4 fuel blocks less on level 5) *Includes Faction Control Towers
Rig Specialist GÇô Reduces drawback by 4% per level on end production. (20% by level 5, So it's 1 % less in drawback)
Ship Specialist - Increases ship hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (Not structure hit points only)
Drone Specialist GÇô increases drone hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (5% Hitpoints by level 5)
Ammunition Specialist GÇô Increase damage by 1% per level on end production (5 % damage by level 5)
**Note** I did some calculations, and to me it doesn't sound over powering. As awesome as it would be to be able to somehow modify the final product (something I have been wanting to be a possibility for a LONG time), it would totally munch the database. Packaged items don't have any extra stats (contents, HP, etc.) so they are much thinner, and they can be stacked.
Being able to modify the stats of an item on production would either A. require every item to have 5 new versions (one of each level 1-5 in addition to the existing level 0) so they can be delivered packaged, or they would have to remain unpackaged (as packaging purges the extra stuff)
|
Judgement Sunwalker
Goblin Wares
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.07 22:42:00 -
[158] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:Judgement Sunwalker wrote:Hello Capsuleers,
This is my first time posting in any forum, so criticize away. After reading almost every post and reply on this topic. I came to understand most people don't want skills that have to do anything with Reducing Time or Materials for manufacturing things. So I came up with some ideas. Don't know if they're good or bad.
*Note* I understand the restrictions and limitations of my ideas. So be my guess on tweaking the ideas or be inspired to come up with something new.
Control Tower Specialist - Reduces fuel requirement by 2% per level on end production. (1-4 fuel blocks less on level 5) *Includes Faction Control Towers
Rig Specialist GÇô Reduces drawback by 4% per level on end production. (20% by level 5, So it's 1 % less in drawback)
Ship Specialist - Increases ship hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (Not structure hit points only)
Drone Specialist GÇô increases drone hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (5% Hitpoints by level 5)
Ammunition Specialist GÇô Increase damage by 1% per level on end production (5 % damage by level 5)
**Note** I did some calculations, and to me it doesn't sound over powering. As awesome as it would be to be able to somehow modify the final product (something I have been wanting to be a possibility for a LONG time), it would totally munch the database. Packaged items don't have any extra stats (contents, HP, etc.) so they are much thinner, and they can be stacked. Being able to modify the stats of an item on production would either A. require every item to have 5 new versions (one of each level 1-5 in addition to the existing level 0) so they can be delivered packaged, or they would have to remain unpackaged (as packaging purges the extra stuff)
I understand the limitations of this idea. And after reading your reply. I think I came up with a possible solution.
As a requirement of having the skill maxed out before producing the item.
Ex. Antimatter Charge S Improved Skills - Industry I, Ammunition Specialist V Materials - Same as right now or +/- (5%-10%) Outcome - Antimatter Charge S Improved (100) Stats - Range Bonus -50% Thermal 5.25, Kinetic 7.35
Ammunition Specialist being a 1x or 2x skill, So it drops the coming up with 5 new versions to 1, to add already existing ones. (Standard, Improved, Faction,and Tech II) And of course scaling out the rest of the skills I mentioned. *Note* I know it does sound a bit ridiculous, but it's kind of like learning all skills necessary to build Tech II ships. |
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
854
|
Posted - 2014.08.07 23:58:00 -
[159] - Quote
Judgement Sunwalker wrote:Hello Capsuleers,
This is my first time posting in any forum, so criticize away. After reading almost every post and reply on this topic. I came to understand most people don't want skills that have to do anything with Reducing Time or Materials for manufacturing things. So I came up with some ideas. Don't know if they're good or bad.
*Note* I understand the restrictions and limitations of my ideas. So be my guess on tweaking the ideas or be inspired to come up with something new.
Control Tower Specialist - Reduces fuel requirement by 2% per level on end production. (1-4 fuel blocks less on level 5) *Includes Faction Control Towers
Rig Specialist GÇô Reduces drawback by 4% per level on end production. (20% by level 5, So it's 1 % less in drawback)
Ship Specialist - Increases ship hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (Not structure hit points only)
Drone Specialist GÇô increases drone hitpoints by 1% per level on end production. (5% Hitpoints by level 5)
Ammunition Specialist GÇô Increase damage by 1% per level on end production (5 % damage by level 5)
**Note** I did some calculations, and to me it doesn't sound over powering. What you are asking for basically equates to the ability to create 'meta' items.
As Xindi explained, the way EVE works means you would litteraly have to have a new database entry for every single possible combination of changes made to every single item in the game. In short, your idea alone would mean that the amount of object data needed would be 600% of what it is presently.
It's a fun idea, but completely and utterly impractical.
Also, it does skew balancing a fair bit, because right now the vast majority of stuff can be equated to simplified baselines. When you start moving a few numbers the ramifications later on can be huge.
Oh, and befire I forget, can something be done with Astronautic Engineering please? http://meme-generator.me/media/created/d3r3t8.jpg |
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
789
|
Posted - 2014.08.08 02:24:00 -
[160] - Quote
I am not sure ammo warrants meta levels beyond the current T1, Faction, T2 we have now. As for ships, I would imagine if we could create meta level ships, the base versions would fall into disuse much the same way lower tier ships did under the old ship tier system. If that happened, then the skills to produce the higher meta ships would end up pretty much becoming a mandatory skill.
I could see this working with most modules though. For instance have a shield construction ability that lets you build meta shield modules.
EXAMPLE SHield Construction: prerequisites: Hydromagnetic Physics I, Quantum Physics i, Advanced Industry V Each level lets you produce the same level meta item.
It would Have to either require more materials (or specialized materials), or be chance based such that higher metas are still more expensive/rarer so as not to break the market (more than it is already, meta 1-2 isn't used much which is a needed fix in and of itself). I like the extra materials option myself, likely some sort of commodity rather than just extra minerals.
Of course there are a couple spots where it breaks down: 1. Stuff like propulsion modules that don't come in every meta level, which leaves some skill levels useless. 2. What to do with level V.
I suppose both problems could be somewhat alleviated if there were also time or materials (probably better the former) bonus attached to each skill level. For the second problem, I wouldn't mind it if there were some sort of Tech 2 meta item (meta level 6) that could be accessed with level V in the proper skill (I have always thought it would be nice to have meta T2 items. yes we have faction and deadspace items which are higher meta level than T2 (meta 5), but those don't take advantage of T2 specialization skills nor can they use T2 ammo) |
|
Judgement Sunwalker
Goblin Wares
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.08 02:25:00 -
[161] - Quote
What you are asking for basically equates to the ability to create 'meta' items.
As Xindi explained, the way EVE works means you would litteraly have to have a new database entry for every single possible combination of changes made to every single item in the game. In short, your idea alone would mean that the amount of object data needed would be 600% of what it is presently.
It's a fun idea, but completely and utterly impractical.
Also, it does skew balancing a fair bit, because right now the vast majority of stuff can be equated to simplified baselines. When you start moving a few numbers the ramifications later on can be huge.
Oh, and befire I forget, can something be done with Astronautic Engineering please?[/quote]
I explained a bit more, where you don't need to have too many new combinations for every single item. I sorry if it doesn't make too much sense, I half-assed the explanation. So I'm going to re edit the whole post, and add more examples and give more details. So it might take me a couple hours. |
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
854
|
Posted - 2014.08.08 15:58:00 -
[162] - Quote
Judgement Sunwalker wrote:I explained a bit more, where you don't need to have too many new combinations for every single item. I sorry if it doesn't make too much sense, I half-assed the explanation. So I'm going to re edit the whole post, and add more examples and give more details. So it might take me a couple hours. Ok, so we end up with new 'meta' equivelants for various things, (ammo in this case,) which become the new standard which relegate the baselines to pointlessness.
When was the last time you fitted a T1 module that had a meta alternative? http://meme-generator.me/media/created/d3r3t8.jpg |
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
790
|
Posted - 2014.08.08 18:17:00 -
[163] - Quote
Hakan MacTrew wrote:Judgement Sunwalker wrote:I explained a bit more, where you don't need to have too many new combinations for every single item. I sorry if it doesn't make too much sense, I half-assed the explanation. So I'm going to re edit the whole post, and add more examples and give more details. So it might take me a couple hours. Ok, so we end up with new 'meta' equivelants for various things, (ammo in this case,) which become the new standard which relegate the baselines to pointlessness. When was the last time you fitted a T1 module that had a meta alternative? I think meta levels need looked at a similar way to how ship tiers were changed.
Not only do we not see much use out of baseline T1 items, oftentimes meta 1 and 2 don't get used much either.
They all need to have tradeoffs and improvements that makes choosing between meta levels more than just, higher is better. |
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Hello-There
634
|
Posted - 2014.08.08 21:58:00 -
[164] - Quote
Module Optimization: gives an x% chance at a pirate/faction bpc by using meta level modules and the reverse engineering mechanic. The metas are consumed as your capsuleer strips out the best components and junks the rest. |
Laendra
Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation
52
|
Posted - 2014.08.08 22:51:00 -
[165] - Quote
Not sure if this is necessarily needed to be a skill, or just a process...but it is something that I feel should be doable by industrialists. Perhaps it is unlocked by Advanced Industry V
Industrial Scaling - Take advantage of economies of scale by merging multiple blueprint copies into one blueprint copy with an equal number of total runs combined and the same research levels as before. If all copies are not of the same research levels, the output is set to the lowest levels for Time and Material.
It should be instantaneous and not cost anything, much like ore compression.
Perhaps having Advanced Industry V as a pre-requisite, you could have another skill.
Advanced Research - Ability to perform Material or Time research on blueprint copies, 1 job per level.
|
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
855
|
Posted - 2014.08.08 23:00:00 -
[166] - Quote
Xindi Kraid wrote:Hakan MacTrew wrote:Judgement Sunwalker wrote:I explained a bit more, where you don't need to have too many new combinations for every single item. I sorry if it doesn't make too much sense, I half-assed the explanation. So I'm going to re edit the whole post, and add more examples and give more details. So it might take me a couple hours. Ok, so we end up with new 'meta' equivelants for various things, (ammo in this case,) which become the new standard which relegate the baselines to pointlessness. When was the last time you fitted a T1 module that had a meta alternative? I think meta levels need looked at a similar way to how ship tiers were changed. Not only do we not see much use out of baseline T1 items, oftentimes meta 1 and 2 don't get used much either. They all need to have tradeoffs and improvements that makes choosing between meta levels more than just, higher is better. I think I remember reading something about this. I am sure it is on the road map.
Pretty sure the meta modules will be 'equal' (ish) to standard T1, but will have benefits and drawbacks based on a balancing formula. Pretty sure multiple Faction mods were going to recieve a similar treatment, gaining and losing benefits depending on the racial predispositions. http://meme-generator.me/media/created/d3r3t8.jpg |
Xindi Kraid
Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
790
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 00:13:00 -
[167] - Quote
Hakan MacTrew wrote:Xindi Kraid wrote:Hakan MacTrew wrote:Judgement Sunwalker wrote:I explained a bit more, where you don't need to have too many new combinations for every single item. I sorry if it doesn't make too much sense, I half-assed the explanation. So I'm going to re edit the whole post, and add more examples and give more details. So it might take me a couple hours. Ok, so we end up with new 'meta' equivelants for various things, (ammo in this case,) which become the new standard which relegate the baselines to pointlessness. When was the last time you fitted a T1 module that had a meta alternative? I think meta levels need looked at a similar way to how ship tiers were changed. Not only do we not see much use out of baseline T1 items, oftentimes meta 1 and 2 don't get used much either. They all need to have tradeoffs and improvements that makes choosing between meta levels more than just, higher is better. I think I remember reading something about this. I am sure it is on the road map. Pretty sure the meta modules will be 'equal' (ish) to standard T1, but will have benefits and drawbacks based on a balancing formula. Pretty sure multiple Faction mods were going to recieve a similar treatment, gaining and losing benefits depending on the racial predispositions. I think they might have mentioned it at the last fanfest, but so far no news on when it's going to happen. |
Atkyaz Dreadstalker
Killer Sea Monkeys
4
|
Posted - 2014.08.09 03:06:00 -
[168] - Quote
So, We are looking at adding advanced industry skills. Something that will add game play to veteran players, without gimping new players. Some thing cool, that adds utility, but not advantage.
I am thinking just based on the name, advanced industry, it should be stuff that adds advanced abilities due to exceptional understanding of how industry works.
1- this one is a little far fetched, but might be cool. How about a skill like re-engineering, you can re-engineer modules to raise their meta level. This would allow highly experienced industrial players to produce modules that are otherwise only available as loot drops. Rather than just the basic meta 0 or T2 stuff. Maybe even so far as to re-engineer T2 meta 5 level modules into faction modules, or Faction modules into ded modules.
It would of course all need to be chance based, just like invention. The chances of getting a ded module could be low, say 10% chance of success, keep in mind you would be starting with an expensive faction module, While producing the common meta 4 from basic T1 would be a 95% chance with the skills maxed.
2- What about a skill that increases specialized cargo holds, like ore holds or fleet hangers, not normal cargo as that would require freighters to be rebalanced again. I am thinking understanding of advanced industry and how ships are built allows you to make better use of specialized cargo space adding say a 4% per level bonus to specialized cargo bays (20% at level 5). At level 5 it would be equal to an expanded cargo hold module, except that those holds are not affected by the modules, so not stacking issues. it would add a way to enhance those special cargoholds.
3- It would be really cool to have a set of skills that when trained by a CEO can affect attributes of POSes owned by the corp they are CEO of. Having a complete understanding of advanced industry (skill to 5) allows you to get the most out of starbase towers owned by your corp. perhaps several skills affecting anything from power grid and CPU, to shield and armor resists, or even fuel consumption.
My point is, having advanced industry trained to 5 as a prerequisite does not necessarily mean the skills have to be directly industrial related, they could be skills that allow you to apply industrial knowledge and understanding to other tasks.
That knowledge could even go into combat skills. for example, being an expert in advanced industry allows you to push the systems of your ship a little further than a pilot without detailed knowledge of how those systems are constructed.
4- Say for example, have a high tech weapons upgrade fitting skill that has both advanced industry and Advanced weapon upgrades as prerequisites. it reduces fitting costs of weapons just a little bit further. I am thinking about how Scotty on star trek was able to enhance the performance of the enterprise through detailed knowledge of how the systems were put together and how they worked. i.e. advanced industrial knowledge. Put that knowledge to use outside of just the construction of the equipment. |
Amerilia
Flight School of the Republic
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.10 09:46:00 -
[169] - Quote
"Automation" For each level, allow one additional industry job to be scheduled, which starts as soon as a job slot becomes available.
Especially useful for invention, as many inventions take less time than a night's sleep, and therefore applies to "Advanced Industry"
Could split that into two, one or each manufacturing and research.
Edit: Jsut realized this has been asked for already, well my support for the idea then. |
Grenn Putubi
Aim High SWAG Co
62
|
Posted - 2014.08.14 02:49:00 -
[170] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Sentient Blade wrote:Specialist Recovery - 10% per level recovery of input materials when cancelling a job. Erutpar Ambient wrote:-Self Sufficient: Reduce the impact your jobs have on the system by 5% These are very cool. More stuff like this, to change variables you don't normally think of, are of great interest to us :)
I like both of these ideas, the numbers probably need to be checked for balance.
Since there are ways to reduce the taxes paid for every other activity I can think of I don't see a reason for there not to be a skill to reduce the tax paid for industry. 10%/level for a 50% reduction in taxes paid at NPC stations would mirror most of the other tax reduction skills such as Customs Code Expertise. A bit boring perhaps, but something everyone would agree with and follows the existing system.
One of my favorite indy changes was the ability to control research and production based solely on distance without being restricted by region. I'd love to see that range increased further, so a new skill the requires Adv Indy 5 and Supply Chain 5 that increases production management range by another 5 jumps per skill level would be awesome. Could make a matching skill that requires Adv Indy or Adv Lab Ops 5 and Scientific Networking 5 to increase research operation range by an additional 5 jumps per level too.
I haven't done any bidding for Teams but I think it'd be cool for there to be a skill for that. Perhaps something like 'Specialized Labor Contracting - Increases the value of your bids for Teams by 5% per level' so you bid 1mil and it would count for 1.25mil while only costing you the 1mil. Not sure how balanced that would be since I haven't really played with the Team Bidding system at all. |
|
Argent Rotineque
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
4
|
Posted - 2014.08.14 05:59:00 -
[171] - Quote
I'd like to see each level open up different tradeoffs of cost/time/material efficiencies (nothing huge, but allow someone to do a precision job that raises the job cost and time significantly but shaves a slight fraction off the material cost, or rush jobs that have a big time savings in exchange for higher job costs and more waste, perhaps one that reduces the job cost for longer time/material usage etc). |
Apelacja
Fungi Company
86
|
Posted - 2014.08.14 14:33:00 -
[172] - Quote
freighters warp speed increase - name of skill doesn`t matter some capital industrial warp drive operation or whatever.
|
Aeana K
Open University of Celestial Hardship Art of War Alliance
103
|
Posted - 2014.08.19 08:26:00 -
[173] - Quote
Industry espionage skill.
Spy installed jobs in "X" distance (modified by the skill), and have a chance (modified by sthe skill) to take a copy of the installed BP.
make it a crime in HiSec.
EDIT: actually, it would be a set of skills regarding the topic, giving a profession branch. |
Pic'n dor
Epsilon Lyr Mordus Angels
26
|
Posted - 2014.08.19 21:45:00 -
[174] - Quote
Pack Rat : +5% capacity of standard and secure container
Advanced Pack Rat : +5% capacity of freight container (req PR 5)
Strategic Pack Rat : +5% capacity of siphon, tractor unit and mobile depot (req APR 5)
Corporate Hangar Mastery : +5% capacity of corporate hangar (req APR 5)
http://hydra-media.cursecdn.com/fallout.gamepedia.com/thumb/d/dc/Pack_Rat.png/163px-Pack_Rat.png
|
Justin Cody
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
253
|
Posted - 2014.08.24 02:51:00 -
[175] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:Hi everyone,
The Advanced Industry skill has been updated to give 3%/level reduction to all industry jobs (ie anything you can do in the industry window, not just building); this should be rolled out to TQ in the next week or so.
This should give *most* people a decent amount of value, but we'd like to give it some additional oomf. We are therefore planning on adding some more advanced industrial skills with AI at 5 as a prereq, so there's clear benefit to everyone in having it trained (plus it would be nice to have some more skills).
We're expecting this discussion to evolve over the coming weeks as the new system settles down and people figure out what bonuses they'd find most valuable. We'd be looking at shipping these changes in one of the two following scheduled releases, depending on how this discussion goes.
So... discuss! What sorts of advanced industry skills would be good?
-Greyscale
**Sticky** - ISD Cyberdyne
Have you ever considered some sort of synergy bonus to having certain level 5 skills trained rather than simply a new tier? |
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
864
|
Posted - 2014.08.24 20:19:00 -
[176] - Quote
Aeana K wrote:Industry espionage skill.
Spy installed jobs in "X" distance (modified by the skill), and have a chance (modified by sthe skill) to take a copy of the installed BP.
make it a crime in HiSec.
EDIT: actually, it would be a set of skills regarding the topic, giving a profession branch.
While I think that being able to 'steal' copies of installed BP's is ridiculous and detremental to industry, you did give me an idea...
Eruptar Ambient had the idea of "Self Sufficient - 5% reduction on personal impact on cost index."
How about using 'Espionage' to increase the effect?
Not a fully fleshed out idea yet, but it could be used to increase the running costs and decrease the profit margins of rivals. Not exactly sure how this skill would/could be implemented, but the concept is interesting. http://meme-generator.me/media/created/d3r3t8.jpg |
DrysonBennington
Aliastra Gallente Federation
168
|
Posted - 2014.08.24 20:59:00 -
[177] - Quote
Advanced Refining Procedures Skills so we can refine Banidine, Augumene, Mercium, Pithix, Green Arisite, Oeryl, Geodite and Polygypsum into minerals.
Maybe even new mineral types that when added to the manufacturing process of a module or ship will give it enhanced capabilities.
For example when Banidine is refined into Mineral X1 and then added to the Advanced Construction Options for a T2 Ion Blaster the Ion Blaster would receive a bonus to either fitting, damage, optimal range, tracking, falloff, reload time or overload bonus.
Each type of ore listed above would fit into a certain category of manufacturing such as Banidine for weapons, Augumene for armor, Mercium for shields, Pithix for propulsion, Green Arisite for mining modules and crystals, Oeryl for T2 scripts, Geodite for ship bonuses and Polygypsum for Nertle.
The bonuses would be controlled by the amount of mineral X1 put into the module or ship manufacturing.
For example using 10,000 units of mineral X1 from Banidine would reduce the fitting cost of the T2 Ion Blaster by 5%, 20k units would increase the tracking speed by 5%, 22k units would decrease the reload time by 5%, 25k units would increase the falloff by 5% along with the optimal range, 30k units of mineral X1 would increase the damage modifier of the Ion Blaster by 5%.
This along with the new skills involved would make manufacturing more fun and interesting and would actually give the manufacturer more options to sell their products to prospective buyers with. |
Qmamoto Kansuke
Killing with pink power
18
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 13:47:00 -
[178] - Quote
Kenneth Skybound wrote:Skill ideas:
Site Director: -2% Build time per level when docked at station/within force field range of job location.
Advanced Industrial Reclamation: Allows reprocessing of non-ores as an industry job. Requires a blueprint for the item (consuming 1 run per item), unbuilds in 50% build time for a base 70% recycled amount, recycled amount affected by scrap metal reprocessing skill. AIR skill reduces unbuild time by 10% per level.
Extended Research Processes: Allows for the queuing of invention jobs, +1 job per level to a max of 6 queued jobs.
And one a bit different, Spatial Compression: +5% container capacity for compressed space containers (eg GSC's).
I second that there should defo be a skill for queing jobs because some invention timers are plain nightmare at the moment. |
Manus Abyss
Special Assault Unit
0
|
Posted - 2014.08.26 16:16:00 -
[179] - Quote
Invention Management: Allows serial execution of invention jobs. Adds 1 job that can be chained to another per skill level.
please add :) |
Anthar Thebess
673
|
Posted - 2014.08.27 13:03:00 -
[180] - Quote
Remove this skill? Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes |
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CCP Greyscale
C C P C C P Alliance
2558
|
Posted - 2014.09.01 15:35:00 -
[181] - Quote
Posting to say I've not forgotten this. |
|
Medalyn Isis
Rosewood Productions Stain Confederation
302
|
Posted - 2014.09.01 22:20:00 -
[182] - Quote
I'm very happy with the advanced industry skill. It has sped up my invention/copying which is a massive boost to me for invention and building from copies. Perhaps increase it to 4% if possible, although 3% is still a decent boost in my mind. |
wicked cheese
Imperial Research Inovations
5
|
Posted - 2014.09.02 01:18:00 -
[183] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Just some quick (and possibly terrible) ideas off the top of my head.
Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Industrial Process Management: 1% reduction in manufacturing job install costs per level, requires Advanced Mass Production V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, mem/cha.
Scientific Process Management: 1% reduction in research job install costs per level, requires Advanced Laboratory Operation V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, int/cha.
Group Dynamics: 2% bonus to team effects per level, requires Social V and Advanced Industry V, rank 6, cha/int.
Edit:
Tinkering: 3% reduced invention job time per level, requires Science V, Jury Rigging V, and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
everything this man said! |
Report
Doomheim
6
|
Posted - 2014.09.02 01:18:04 -
[184] - Quote
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:Just some quick (and possibly terrible) ideas off the top of my head.
Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
Industrial Process Management: 1% reduction in manufacturing job install costs per level, requires Advanced Mass Production V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, mem/cha.
Scientific Process Management: 1% reduction in research job install costs per level, requires Advanced Laboratory Operation V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, int/cha.
Group Dynamics: 2% bonus to team effects per level, requires Social V and Advanced Industry V, rank 6, cha/int.
Edit:
Tinkering: 3% reduced invention job time per level, requires Science V, Jury Rigging V, and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.
everything this man said! |
Lonewolf174
Black VooDoo Asassins The Kadeshi
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.03 00:56:26 -
[185] - Quote
Employee Influence: TE reduction on jobs installed in a station (or maybe space too) that are owned by allaince/corp the character is a member of. (maybe a smaller bonus on stations with a hanger being rented?) |
Hakan MacTrew
MUTED VOID Takahashi Alliance
869
|
Posted - 2014.09.03 02:53:41 -
[186] - Quote
Specific skills that reduce time on given job types could work.
Not sure about having skills that reduce time only in stations/offices owned by the players corp/alliance.
How about a skill that gives a small increase to the chance of successful invention?
http://meme-generator.me/media/created/d3r3t8.jpg
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Mhari Dson
Lazy Brothers Inc
122
|
Posted - 2014.09.03 07:48:15 -
[187] - Quote
I like alot of this, but I favor either an invention queue or multi-run invention jobs (kinda silly i can build 3100 of a module in a month in 1 production run but I can only invent once per queuing)
I also support having additional science slots since those slots are used by 4 types of jobs, not just one like manufacturing.
In leu of either, separate the science jobs so that we have 2 sets of science slots, 1 set for invention/copying, 1 set for ME/PE research. |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
1063
|
Posted - 2014.09.09 23:05:35 -
[188] - Quote
Mhari Dson wrote:I like alot of this, but I favor either an invention queue or multi-run invention jobs (kinda silly i can build 3100 of a module in a month in 1 production run but I can only invent once per queuing)
I also support having additional science slots since those slots are used by 4 types of jobs, not just one like manufacturing.
In leu of either, separate the science jobs so that we have 2 sets of science slots, 1 set for invention/copying, 1 set for ME/PE research. I agree 100%, invention slots should have their own set of 10, or share with only copy slots, not all research slots.
|
Magic Crisp
Amarrian Micro Devices Curatores Veritatis Alliance
180
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 07:56:34 -
[189] - Quote
What about giving those outpost construction, capital construction, Advanced *shop construction skills a slight time reduction bonus? So even when one is to build something that has a low skill requirement on these, training said skills higher still has a benefit.
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Indigo Love-Jones
Fusion Enterprises Ltd Brothers of Tangra
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.10 16:17:00 -
[190] - Quote
Hi,
I know this topic is about Advance Industry but I would like to talk about the changes that have been made regarding industry.
Before the patch Production Efficiency was the most crucial skill to have if you want to build anything within Eve. Which was trained by anyone wanting to produce anything. This skill I am presuming has been changed to Advance Industry and has it's attribute changed to manufacturing time per skill level.
Research, Metallurgy was all about reducing the material needed and time needed to do research. Now since the patch this skills have been changed to material efficiency research speed per skill level and manufacturing time research per skills level. This is a major change to the original skill.
Initially players would specialised a character to perform blueprint copying only which will only need the skill Laboratory Operation and Advance Laboratory Operation.
Also players would dedicate a character for pure research which they would need Research, Metallurgy but not Production Efficiency due to the fact that character would not need to build anything but just do research on blueprints.
Now since the change, this has caused the specialised character for blueprint only certain problems. They have found out that they can no longer copy the blueprints they used to be able to copy due to the fact that the skill Research and Metallurgy is now needed to use that blueprint they used to make copy of.
Also for the specialised characters for Research only to find out that they will now need to train the Advance Industry skill in order for them to be efficient at research. Without the Advance Industry skill their research time is drastically reduced.
I would like to ask you developers what went on in your heads to make such a drastic change to Industry forcing everyone to train all form production and research skill? Regards, Indigo Love-Jones |
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Kelsi Monroe
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
6
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 12:23:00 -
[191] - Quote
Please don-¦t add time reduction skills off any kind. Last thing industry/market needs is more items dumped to an stagnated and oversupplyed situation. |
Kelsi Monroe
Ammo Delivery
6
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 12:23:50 -
[192] - Quote
Please don-¦t add time reduction skills off any kind. Last thing industry/market needs is more items dumped to an stagnated and oversupplied situation. |
Kann Du
Embers Children TOHA Conglomerate
7
|
Posted - 2014.09.12 17:20:06 -
[193] - Quote
Interesting changes, are the proposed GÇ£Invention chance outcomeGÇ¥ alterations also going to effect T3 subsystem invention? Specifically:
GÇó Success (exceptional): yields a ME 2 and TE 3 bonus to the outcome. GÇó Success (great): yields a ME 1 and TE 2 bonus to the outcome.
If so how will a bonus to ME effect Subsystem production? At the moment a better ME has no impact on the build requirements as they canGÇÖt go lower than 1. The same way teams giving an ME bonus are also pointless.
Or is my understanding of T3 production flawed?
|
xenoslave xeno
Minmatar Exploration Enterprises
0
|
Posted - 2014.09.14 05:43:37 -
[194] - Quote
im sorry I have one thing to pipe in about its far over do that there be a capital class mining barge since I started in 08 trit prices alone have gone from like 1.2-1.5 isk each to 5 or 6 isk each mainly due to the fact that mining is not fun nor as profitable as mission running for the high sec pilots or incursions or even trading but there are some who just want to either relax and mine to build ships and the like and lets face it since the ore reprocessing changes mining has become less and less profitable which is why its time for a change after all it is a player driven market like the drake just for an example when I bought my first one it costed me a hole 20 mil back then hard to get but it felt worth it no adays its over 50 mil almost triple the price because those who used to mine moved to mission running because they could make more isk faster and then buy bigger and better ships. and ice also now instead of knowing which systems have ice you have to be lucky and find it at the right time and hope the players with 10-15 alts haven't mined it already. I mean come on all you would have to do is make a t2 orca that would fit 6 strip miners I mean the design is already there for hard points hell you could even make it a kind of siege mode to make things interesting |
Maxis Lithium
Undead Dragons
1
|
Posted - 2014.09.15 16:41:36 -
[195] - Quote
Not an experienced eve player, but I'm pleased with Advanced Industry. As it effects all things Industry, it impacts my major bottle neck to Industry, which is ME research on BPOs By my math, I can cut the time needed to research ME on a BPO by 40% at max (Metallurgy 5%/lv. + Advanced Industry 3%/lv.) POS bonuses bring that further up. I find the new Industry system fairly intuitive. |
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
1063
|
Posted - 2014.09.16 02:18:39 -
[196] - Quote
my top 5 are
- Job installation cost reduction, like we have skills to reduce tax, and broker fees, one for the job installation cost would be nice.
- more research time reduction skills. this will not hurt a new players ability to compete, but could make researching some BPO's from ME 9-10 possible. Some BPO's take over 1 year for this reserch. At least make it resonable, even if still cost prohibitive.
- more slots per character. the characters skil limitation is the only limitation we now have with industry slot removal, the changes to copy and invention have been a hard hit on slot counts. I would like to see copy and invention share a set of 10 slots, independant of the 10 research slots we already have which would be left for ME and PE research.
- POS management skill. this would be a corporate skill that would be trained by the C.E.O. to reduce POS fuel costs. and possibly two additional skills to increase POS PG and CPU.
- clone facility management- this skill would decrease the cost of medical clones. not having it would not hurt new players as their clone costs are very low anyway. Maybe even add an advanced clone facility management skill, with the first one as a prerequisit that reduces it even more.
Some verteran players do not participate in small ship PVP only because their clone costs 10 times more to replace than the ship they would be flying. There is no need for this anti PVP isk sink to be so steep. besides, those with extremly high skill point characters are the ones who have the greatest need of additional useful skills to train, these skills would be a nessesity for veteran high skill point PVPers, but in no way be required or hurt newer players.
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GizzyBoy
Aperture Harmonics No Holes Barred
100
|
Posted - 2014.09.17 04:20:51 -
[197] - Quote
A few things.
Your Idea of an exceptional success is some what terrible, an exceptional success should have a much higher ME level to reflect that Idea of exceptional, the minimum level of a successful bpc needs to have 2 me particularly in the case of ships other wise a large number of things that produced a successful bpc would not be worth producing in the competitive eve market.
Failing that, perhaps you'd like to add me and pe level research for tech 2 bpcs, sure it could be double handling from our point of view, but in a number of cases its the only way to make currently un economic bpc's viable to build from. |
Komi Toran
Paragon Trust The Bastion
330
|
Posted - 2014.09.17 06:14:28 -
[198] - Quote
Sheeana Harb wrote:Could you please elaborate more why you think having it tied to a skill is a bad idea? I'm interested. Because it's UI, and locking UI behind artificial barriers is poor design.
|
Anthar Thebess
774
|
Posted - 2014.09.24 09:01:49 -
[199] - Quote
Remove this skill , without SP reimbursement.
New Gate Connections in EVE!
Support idea for new gates that will make some more places to thrive.
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Rumbaldi
Reasonable People Of Sound Mind
3
|
Posted - 2014.09.30 16:09:00 -
[200] - Quote
OK< not skills as such, I think there are enough skills and functionality needs to be cleaned up a bit.
- The more you produce of something the less time it take to build up to a max bonus.
For example you may make Void L ammo for example, for every 250,000 made you get a small percentage in the reduction of time to make up to say a max 10 or 15% time bonus. I would like to think that people that produce more of the same thing they would become specialised in that item or range of items.
- Quick create shopping lists
For example you pull up that T1 or T2 BPC to make something and Bam you are missing some of the components, to have an option (button to click) that puts the missing items and the number needed onto an ingame notepad so you can go to market and purchase those items.
- Enter more than the max number of jobs to determine purchases.
Tied in with option 2, I have say 10 T1 or T2 BPCs over the 10 BPCs I have 100 runs in total, i drag the 1st BPC onto the indy window and I am missing some items, so I will need to buy stuff for all 100 runs, therefore even though the max runs on the BPC is 10, I want to enter 100, then use the suggestion at #2 to create the shopping list.
|
|
Rumbaldi
Reasonable People Of Sound Mind
6
|
Posted - 2014.09.30 16:09:37 -
[201] - Quote
OK< not skills as such, I think there are enough skills and functionality needs to be cleaned up a bit.
- The more you produce of something the less time it take to build up to a max bonus.
For example you may make Void L ammo for example, for every 250,000 made you get a small percentage in the reduction of time to make up to say a max 10 or 15% time bonus. I would like to think that people that produce more of the same thing they would become specialised in that item or range of items.
- Quick create shopping lists
For example you pull up that T1 or T2 BPC to make something and Bam you are missing some of the components, to have an option (button to click) that puts the missing items and the number needed onto an ingame notepad so you can go to market and purchase those items.
- Enter more than the max number of jobs to determine purchases.
Tied in with option 2, I have say 10 T1 or T2 BPCs over the 10 BPCs I have 100 runs in total, i drag the 1st BPC onto the indy window and I am missing some items, so I will need to buy stuff for all 100 runs, therefore even though the max runs on the BPC is 10, I want to enter 100, then use the suggestion at #2 to create the shopping list.
All this exceptional, standard invention possibilities suggestions are amazingly bad I think, and should die a death before even being disucssed |
Barbara Nichole
Cryogenic Consultancy
649
|
Posted - 2014.10.10 16:00:01 -
[202] - Quote
Adding new skill really isn't going to be that easy without adding new types of play for industry... but I will try. Add more depth to manufacturing by adding usable alloys to the game as a creatable product necessary for production of parts (you have a good start on alloy already but it's kind of useless at the moment). Add fasteners and other simple but basic building parts to production to give something necessary but easy for the noobish indie to work on. Some alloy will be harder to create due to required skill level and scarcity of materials, other alloy not so hard. Add skills to the game for this type of production. There are a lot of basic elements that can be mixed and match in different ways to make entirely new stuff. Make metallurgy and field of study with some skill required create things needed to build.
It would be nice to have some more minerals in the game.. with new skills required to mine them.. (Ideally some added type of mining would be nice too) Sometime look up the number of real mineral we actually mine in the real world.. there are more than just 20.
I grow weary of rebalance and changes to the changes you've made to the UI and graphics.. It's time to start thinking of additional play with new lines of skilling. Dark matter mining, solar mining, comet mining, ... and new commodities for each. This in turn will spawn need for new types of ships and construction (which will also require new skills).
-á-á- remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not-á "afk" cloaking-á-
[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
6460
|
Posted - 2014.10.11 03:07:51 -
[203] - Quote
Barbara Nichole wrote:Adding new skill really isn't going to be that easy without adding new types of play for industry... but I will try. Add more depth to manufacturing by adding usable alloys to the game as a creatable product necessary for production of parts (you have a good start on alloy already but it's kind of useless at the moment). Add fasteners and other simple but basic building parts to production to give something necessary but easy for the noobish indie to work on. Some alloy will be harder to create due to required skill level and scarcity of materials, other alloy not so hard. Add skills to the game for this type of production. There are a lot of basic elements that can be mixed and match in different ways to make entirely new stuff. Make metallurgy and field of study with some skill required create things needed to build.
It would be nice to have some more minerals in the game.. with new skills required to mine them.. (Ideally some added type of mining would be nice too) Sometime look up the number of real mineral we actually mine in the real world.. there are more than just 20.
I grow weary of rebalance and changes to the changes you've made to the UI and graphics.. It's time to start thinking of additional play with new lines of skilling. Dark matter mining, solar mining, comet mining, ... and new commodities for each. This in turn will spawn need for new types of ships and construction (which will also require new skills). Yes, there's already something we could mine for this...
ring mining
Er, what happened to it?
^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears.
Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
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Major Trant
CTRL-Q Iron Oxide.
1248
|
Posted - 2014.10.16 09:26:51 -
[204] - Quote
Not really a skill, but would it be possible to remove the click button 'Deliver' step to a job?
You have paid for the job, supplied the mats, the factory knows were to shove the finished product and any remaining BPC/BPO, so why do you have to click a button to 'Deliver' it? Can it not be automatic?
CTRL-Q - Minmatar FW - Low Sec PvP - Euro TZ - New Player Friendly
Contact: Major Trant
In game channel: FeO Public
Recruitment thread: CTRL-Q
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Dyexz
Comrades in Construction
5
|
Posted - 2014.10.17 14:17:00 -
[205] - Quote
I don'k know if this idea has been mentioned before and I am sure that, I am not the only one who thinks that the limit (max 11) of simultaneous jobs is a bit too small. Especially when you take into account of how many Blueprints and how long each job can take in the game. Obviously it is of your own choice, but as it is today it just seems to be inadequate to be limited to 11 jobs at max skills across 3 types Research jobs (Research, Copying and Invention). While copying is not the most time consuming type of job it does take up a lot of your available slots.
You might say, why not just create multiple alts?, well to answer that question.. I do have multiple alts for exactly that purpose in mind. Although I do not have a very large pile of Blueprints at my disposal (maybe 75-100) but that is just a small fraction of what is available in New Eden.
So, I propose a slight change of the Skills:
- Laboratory Operations - Ability to run 2(+1) additional research job per skill level.
- Advanced Laboratory Operations - Ability to run 2(+1) additional research job per skill level.
and possibly also the skill:
- Mass Production - Ability to run 2(+1) additional manufacturing job per skill level.
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Dyexz
Comrades in Construction
5
|
Posted - 2014.10.17 14:17:54 -
[206] - Quote
I don'k know if this idea has been mentioned before and I am sure that, I am not the only one who thinks that the limit (max 11) of simultaneous jobs is a bit too small. Especially when you take into account of how many Blueprints and how long each job can take in the game. Obviously it is of your own choice, but as it is today it just seems to be inadequate to be limited to 11 jobs at max skills across 3 types Research jobs (Research, Copying and Invention). While copying is not the most time consuming type of job it does take up a lot of your available slots.
You might say, why not just create multiple alts?, well to answer that question.. I do have multiple alts for exactly that purpose in mind. Although I do not have a very large pile of Blueprints at my disposal (maybe 75-100) but that is just a small fraction of what is available in New Eden.
So, I propose a slight change of the Skills:
- Laboratory Operations - Ability to run 2(+1) additional research job per skill level.
- Advanced Laboratory Operations - Ability to run 2(+1) additional research job per skill level.
and possibly also the skill:
- Mass Production - Ability to run 2(+1) additional manufacturing job per skill level.
edited: In addition, it would be nice if the [Scientific Networking] skill was defined by the number of lightyears between job location and your current location. this should solve the annoyance of the skill as it currently is, let's say that you have the skill at level 4 which allows you to start jobs within 20 jumps from your location, yet the job you want to start is only 5 jumps away, but the region changes within those few jumps and it therefore becomes impossible for you to start the job. |
Arronicus
Bitter Lemons Brothers of Tangra
1186
|
Posted - 2014.10.21 07:47:01 -
[207] - Quote
It might not be completely defined as 'industry', but Industrial Reconfiguration (the skill required to run the industrial core) on the Rorqual is so lacking in value that training it beoynd level one is more of an aesthetic simply to not have a skill at one, than to give any practical use. Given how worthless heavy water is, and how a roughly 30 day train to go from 4 to 5 only saves you 50 heavy water, I think it's pretty clear that the skill rank for the skill is about 7 levels too high.
Tying a cycle time reduction into this skill would be of great benefit in the rorqual rethink, but increasing the bonus of the skill to something like 15 or 17.5% reduction per level would be far more meritous. Dropping heavy water consumption from 1000 to 850 or 800 isn't a worthwhile or noticable benefit, but going from 1000 down to 125 at level 5 would at least create a little less hassle, and over time amount to some notable degree of savings. |
Elegbara
White Wolf Enterprises Harmonious Ascent
580
|
Posted - 2014.10.24 12:47:30 -
[208] - Quote
Something more related to research: a skill that adds a probability of extra stuff being recovered when reprocessing named modules. That is - you not only get the materials everyone gets, but say a really low change of a decryptor. Or some additional mineral. Or whatever.
Similar skills for faction modules and ships. Here you have a high change of "getting back" one 1-run blueprint and also a small chance of getting a second one. The cost of wasted minerals should cover the cost of that new blueprint. |
Enya Sparhawk
Black Tea and Talons
20
|
Posted - 2014.11.02 05:25:06 -
[209] - Quote
Hmmm... how about an advanced skill that lets you choose a sort of manufacturing out side of the regular set of items on any outpost or station listing ie. ammo, cruisers, battleships, Tech II, Tech III (maybe in turn allowing you to use a new research team at that station/outpost to manufacture with)
Fíorghrá: Grá na fírinne
Déan gáire...Tiocfaidh ár lá
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Mhari Dson
Lazy Brothers Inc
122
|
Posted - 2014.11.05 09:27:34 -
[210] - Quote
Still need more science slots, multi-run is nice but falls far short. |
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Fenixis
The Concilium Enterprises Capital Punishment.
16
|
Posted - 2014.11.24 01:50:55 -
[211] - Quote
Fenixis wrote:Fenixis wrote:please make ice harvesting crystal to fit deep core miner II, so that the Prospect can harvest ice. allow usage at having ice processing 3 and t2 version at 4. also ice harvesting 1. something along those lines would be an interesting addition. just a thought. this could add new items to make use and buy boost sales/ usage of modulated deep core miner II The ship wouldnt have to mine as fast as the procurer, but a small fleet of them might be good for null sec and shattered wormholes. |
Vova Killer
A Simple Free Corporation
0
|
Posted - 2014.11.26 15:43:51 -
[212] - Quote
It will be intresting to add skills for making industry in planets, this skill must be connected to Planetary and Advanced Industries. My opinion that Planetary too simple and some industries on planets and over thing should be intresting to learn and build on planets. |
Kei Thoras
Fundation For Logistics and Collection Operations Slightly Sexual
0
|
Posted - 2014.12.03 19:07:20 -
[213] - Quote
Just realized there was a dedicated thread for the new industry skills. To prevent what would be considered as a spam, here is the link of the thread I've created earlier: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=389267 I read that implementing material efficiency skills has currently a low priority. At least it was the case a few months ago. If this is still the case, please read the thread mentioned above for the reasons why, in my opinion, it shouldn't. |
DaBetter
Quantum Machine
0
|
Posted - 2014.12.07 14:10:06 -
[214] - Quote
Expert Mass Production - Ability to run 2 additional manufacturing job per skill level. training multiplier 10x Master Mass Production - Ability to run 5 additional manufacturing job per skill level. training multiplier 15x
Expert Laboratory Operation - Ability to run 2 additional research job per skill level. training multiplier 10x Master Laboratory Operation - Ability to run 5 additional research job per skill level. training multiplier 15x
Invention Connections - Ability to increase invention outcome x% connected to the stations standings. training multiplier 10x Invention Recovery - Ability to improve the recovery of input material after a failure. training multiplier 9x
Team Project Management - The simultaneous use of 1 additional team per job with a maximum of 5. training multiplier 8x Team Remote Management - The use of teams x-jumps away up to region wide. training multiplier 12x |
Madeleine Lemmont
Divide et Impera DE
13
|
Posted - 2014.12.16 14:14:07 -
[215] - Quote
I would introduce Engineering . It will require Research and Science skills too. Moreover I kept in mind, the META-model will change a bit. Engineering should not result in META-modules! But I know, this idea requires a change of the item database in line to the ship database recently. You will not have a chance to get Engineering alive with a static item DB with an entry for every item and all of its attributes.
Standard-module -> META-1-module: several attributes changed
Standard-module -> Engineered module: 1 attribute changed per BPC-run in a small amount. (will usually work for T1 items only)
For engineering you have a choice to change 1 attribute per run from a dropdown list of changeable attributes. After a max run count of i.e. 5-8, another random attribute of the item would be changed in any disadvantageous way.
Every engineering BPC run will decrease the residual amount of runs.
If you decide to stop the engineering, you are allowed to name and color the item from an ingame palette of colors and names. (corp colors and names included). It's depending on the remaining BPC-runs, how many items you are able to create with the reached item attributes. -- More skills attached to AI could be "construction" skills for future player built structures, like stargates or stations. -- Additionally I think it could be reasonable to have "corporation industry" and "corporation PI" skills. In addition to an advanced rights management for corps, it should be become more useful to have corp industry managers. -- In advance of social skills a "Industrial Connections" skill could be attached. It allows to collect LP and/or corp standing for job installations. A standing above 5.0 should decrease installation costs slightly. -- So you could bring industry skills a bit mor in line with trading, reprocessing and so on. Industry agents should become possible too. Brings the system in line with career agents. |
Xeloh Cedwond
Wise Humans Corp
1
|
Posted - 2014.12.22 19:45:23 -
[216] - Quote
I would see additional skills set for : Planetary Industry. I found that planetary industry lack "Specialisation", anyone can be almost best in a very short time.
Following the idea here: PI: Grouping factories
- Planetary Grouping Allow to manage 3 more group per level (up to 18) To see more about "Groups", please follow the above link.
For all the below skills, it link with the idea of upgrading existing planetary facilities. Upgrading means: More CPU load More Power Usage A better performance
- Planetary Industry Network Management Allow to upgrade Factories by 1 level per tier (Level 5 give a -10% CPU usage oforfactories)
- Planetary Warehouse Management Allow to upgrade Storage facilities and Launchpad by 1 level per tier (Level 5 give a -10% Power usage for Storage facilities and Launchpad)
- Planetary Mining Operation Allow to upgrade Extractor Control Units by 1 level per tier (Level 5 give a +10% Extraction rate)
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TeddieBear
Turion Industries Dark Knights of Eden
0
|
Posted - 2014.12.23 14:30:42 -
[217] - Quote
Unless I have been gone from Eve too long, but was there ever an -
****Implant Manufacturing: Requires a cross over of science and industry***
Other ideas
Ship Design Architect: A skill for blue print coping, which allows for incorporating small ship modifications. (not enough to effect ship balancing thou). Perhaps a +/- system, example increase ship speed but decreases power out put. The more changes the longer to make the copy. The higher the skill produces a decrease in time requirements and allows for more complex changes. This would allow for variation in ship types. This might help various regions/play types to build ships more suited for them. Might also help reduce people from building like 500 crows and dumping them on the market. Im assuming a prefix/suffix would need to be added to the ship name for selling it on the market thou. |
Ronny Hugo
Dark Fusion Industries Limitless Redux
74
|
Posted - 2014.12.30 14:26:04 -
[218] - Quote
Well, speaking for myself, my industrial limitations are these: 1. Number of manufacturing/copying jobs I can have without using tons of alts. 2. Number of buy/sell orders I can have without using tons of alts. 3. Asset and buy/sell order administration without using automated software (I don't use any software, just excel sheets, tons and tons of sheets, not good for Eve Marketing).
Therefore: 1. Advanced manufacturing skill, adding more manufacturing jobs. 2. Advanced copying skill, adding more copying slots (possibly making them go faster? Maybe we can queue copying jobs so there's no downtime between them?). 3. Advanced tycoon, adding more buy/sell orders. 4. A more enlightening asset and buy/sell order visual interface. I haven't got a clue how it could be organized, but I'm sure people are willing to offer what would be useful to them. To me it would be useful if I could glance at a map and see what orders, where, needs resupply. So perhaps we'd have to be able to set a limit for our buy-orders before they begin giving us a notification on that map, so for example if we have 1 000 000 units for sale somewhere, then have 20% as our note limit, then when 800 000 are sold then it pops up on the map that it needs refilling with 800 000 units. Would also be nice to be able to click "what are all my buy+sell orders at this station/system/region" and have it pop up in the market window. 5. Also T2 seems to need a skill or three besides just maxing out lots of science skills. I don't do T2 yet though, so have no idea as to what would be nice to add. 6. Maybe this skill could be the prerequisite of whatever skill makes us able to make our own blueprints so that blueprints can be player made as well not just seeded? Would have to be tons of work involved, maybe some new resource source? |
Phantom Gritz
DND Industries
0
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Posted - 2015.01.07 17:04:27 -
[219] - Quote
Here's a thought on a new skill(s) thay may solve a few of the wants. (btw I have not read all the so I may be rehashing).
So these skills would be in the Corporation catagory however they would ultimately be intustry in focus.
Corporate Industrialist: Allows (3-5) corperate owned manufacturing jobs per level. (x5-7 modifier)
Rquitements: Corperate Management 3 Advanced Industry 5 Advanced Mass Prosuction 3 Industry 5
Corporate Level Research: Allows (3-5) corperate owned research/copy jobs per level. (again x5-7)
Requirements: Corperate Management 3 Advanced Industry 5 Advanced Laboratory Operation 3 Research 5
Limitations on use could be but decfinately not limited to the following: Pilot must have rights/roles within corporation that allows access to raw marerials, within high sec they can be run only from the headquarters office, low & null sec need only an office or POS, and as with contracts put a corporate wide, cumulative, maximum number of active jobs that the corporation can have.
This would leave those who hold these possitions within the coperation their personal slots open to use however they want should they so choose and still be productive memebers of the corporation. I realize this would entail a lot of work for our DEV folks but I think this would be a look if not a step in the right direction. |
knowsitall
Adeptus iNdustry and Logistics Silent Eviction
25
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Posted - 2015.01.08 16:04:40 -
[220] - Quote
I would like to see a skil that allow the user to set a different destination station/pos for the output for both invention and copying. Obviously this would not be allowed for manufactoring or TE/ME research as that is effectively moving goods for you. But invention and copying is creating somehting new. So what you would be able too to do is set the job to copy/invent in my lab station/POS and the output goes to my factory station/POS.
I don't believe this would be overpowered as these item are tiny, so hauling then is not much effort, it would be a human effort saver. Maybe a skill for each with each level increasing the number of jumps you set as the output station/POS much like scienific networking etc.
knowitall |
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knowsitall
Adeptus iNdustry and Logistics Silent Eviction
25
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Posted - 2015.01.18 15:18:15 -
[221] - Quote
Another skill I would like to see is a skill that increases the effectiveness of standing on corporation tax. The taxes I am talking about are broker fees and refining tax.
Note this is not changing which taxes having standing benefits, just allowing route to make those saving with less standing grind but at the expense of training time.
So at the moment there is a magic number of 6.67 (or thereabouts) for minimum tax in a NPC station. Could we have maybe 4 skills, one for each faction that means you can get that value to only needing 3 or something. You still need positive standing but as an industrial character you don't have to grind missions. You still can but you can also invest training to reduce that.
This has the benefit of allowing players to more easily move industrial bases. If they only need to a effective standing of 3 at a different station then that is less grind and after a while your faction standing may do it opening up entire empires as possible bases.
KIA |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
160
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Posted - 2015.01.18 21:46:15 -
[222] - Quote
knowsitall wrote:Another skill I would like to see is a skill that increases the effectiveness of standing on corporation tax. The taxes I am talking about are broker fees and refining tax.
Note this is not changing which taxes having standing benefits, just allowing route to make those saving with less standing grind but at the expense of training time.
So at the moment there is a magic number of 6.67 (or thereabouts) for minimum tax in a NPC station. Could we have maybe 4 skills, one for each faction that means you can get that value to only needing 3 or something. You still need positive standing but as an industrial character you don't have to grind missions. You still can but you can also invest training to reduce that.
This has the benefit of allowing players to more easily move industrial bases. If they only need to a effective standing of 3 at a different station then that is less grind and after a while your faction standing may do it opening up entire empires as possible bases.
KIA
https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Standings_mechanics
You train the skill connections to 5 and all you need is a 5.85(ish 5.9 gives 6.72 and 5.8 gives 6.64) standing instead of 6.67. So the skill already exists. The other skill is called social which increase how fast you gain standings. Also the way the skill work is that it gives a bigger bonus at lower standings lvls. |
Bob Niac
Joint Espionage and Defence Industries Preatoriani
54
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Posted - 2015.01.19 01:34:32 -
[223] - Quote
Corp Skill: Workflow Management & Adv Workflow Management
Corp management skills get a role bonus +n (static) corporation industry slots, proportionate to the skill. Empire control would get more then corp management.
Skill allows addt'l corp only jobs to be created. Jobs can only be launched for corp and skill tied directly to the CEO. This is a shared pool for all people with the role to use it.
Workflow is ~5% per lvl and Adv is ~15% per level. Mind you this is a pooled resource.
[u]I <3 Logistics:[/u] Pilot of all -áT2 logi and my shiny Archon [deceased.] Also a Chimera which may or may not be horrid.
I don't make games, I play them. I get that ppl are passionate about change. I post here to plant seeds. You see your idea as is? Holy **** you win! So let's post, and see what the DEVs and our peers use.
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knowsitall
Adeptus iNdustry and Logistics Silent Eviction
25
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Posted - 2015.01.19 14:56:00 -
[224] - Quote
Lady Rift wrote:knowsitall wrote:Another skill I would like to see is a skill that increases the effectiveness of standing on corporation tax. The taxes I am talking about are broker fees and refining tax.
Note this is not changing which taxes having standing benefits, just allowing route to make those saving with less standing grind but at the expense of training time.
So at the moment there is a magic number of 6.67 (or thereabouts) for minimum tax in a NPC station. Could we have maybe 4 skills, one for each faction that means you can get that value to only needing 3 or something. You still need positive standing but as an industrial character you don't have to grind missions. You still can but you can also invest training to reduce that.
This has the benefit of allowing players to more easily move industrial bases. If they only need to a effective standing of 3 at a different station then that is less grind and after a while your faction standing may do it opening up entire empires as possible bases.
KIA https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Standings_mechanics You train the skill connections to 5 and all you need is a 5.85(ish 5.9 gives 6.72 and 5.8 gives 6.64) standing instead of 6.67. So the skill already exists. The other skill is called social which increase how fast you gain standings. Also the way the skill work is that it gives a bigger bonus at lower standings lvls.
I knew all that, but for lots of training that is very small decrease, and still means trading toons have a standing grind. The idea was to have a skill that attacks the probelm from the other end. This is as with standing grinding it is very easy with lvl 4 missions, but most trading characters don't have the skills for lvl 4 missions. So getting to 5.8(ish) even with social lvl 5 is a massive grind. |
Lady Rift
What Shall We Call It
160
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Posted - 2015.01.19 19:12:06 -
[225] - Quote
knowsitall wrote:Lady Rift wrote:knowsitall wrote:Another skill I would like to see is a skill that increases the effectiveness of standing on corporation tax. The taxes I am talking about are broker fees and refining tax.
Note this is not changing which taxes having standing benefits, just allowing route to make those saving with less standing grind but at the expense of training time.
So at the moment there is a magic number of 6.67 (or thereabouts) for minimum tax in a NPC station. Could we have maybe 4 skills, one for each faction that means you can get that value to only needing 3 or something. You still need positive standing but as an industrial character you don't have to grind missions. You still can but you can also invest training to reduce that.
This has the benefit of allowing players to more easily move industrial bases. If they only need to a effective standing of 3 at a different station then that is less grind and after a while your faction standing may do it opening up entire empires as possible bases.
KIA https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Standings_mechanics You train the skill connections to 5 and all you need is a 5.85(ish 5.9 gives 6.72 and 5.8 gives 6.64) standing instead of 6.67. So the skill already exists. The other skill is called social which increase how fast you gain standings. Also the way the skill work is that it gives a bigger bonus at lower standings lvls. I knew all that, but for lots of training that is very small decrease, and still means trading toons have a standing grind. The idea was to have a skill that attacks the probelm from the other end. This is as with standing grinding it is very easy with lvl 4 missions, but most trading characters don't have the skills for lvl 4 missions. So getting to 5.8(ish) even with social lvl 5 is a massive grind.
grind lv3 has always been faster. and I would think any skill that makes it easier will be a a couple skill modifiers higher than connections skill is. |
Brutalis Furia
Hammer and Anvil Industries
14
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Posted - 2015.01.29 17:16:12 -
[226] - Quote
With the removal of Teams, I could see skills that would add those bonuses back in. |
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