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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 10 post(s) |
Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.02.18 15:17:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Pottsey on 18/02/2009 15:24:03 CCP Fear said "And you fail at humor! My point is that it's a skill that is irrelevant to a new player." No its not, the point of the game is to work in groups and that skills gives you a reason to work in a group. All those years back when I was a new player it was one of the first skills I took to lvl 5. If two or more friends start together its useful.
The Devs seem to be getting more and more detached from the player base recently which is very bad. The current NPE did not feel very good at all. The new intro means the new players don't have the background for the game. The new character creation removes some background and differences between the races. The NPE once in game feels cheaply done with poorly drawn white boxes and unexciting training missions.The NPE has made things far to generic and generic for new players is boring. The removable of the old new player sounds further makes the NPE worse.
For many people the NPE has taken a massive step backwards not improved based on what's currently on the test server. You simplified things so far it's not interesting and that's not what a new player needs.
____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.02.18 16:41:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Pottsey on 18/02/2009 16:43:27 Gamer4liff said "The idea is so that they make informed choices in the gameworld rather than abstract uninformed choices in a character creation menu. If CCP does it correctly the overall SP will be the exact same as it was before, over a long enough time period." But that will cause fewer players to make it to the x week period where they match the exact same SP as the old system. The first few weeks are much worse for new players with this NPE and the first few weeks are the most important as if you're not hooked into the game by then you're going quit. Fewer players well make it past the first few weeks as the game is now so boring with the new NPE.
Making the first few weeks more boring is not an enhancement for NPE. When I did the training mission one part wanted me to sit around for 30+mins waiting for a basic skill to train so it could show me how to fit a module. The old system would let me fit that module right away no sitting around bored. Asking new playres to wait 30mins is not good.
____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.02.19 18:33:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Pottsey on 19/02/2009 18:44:55 CCP Fear said "The purpose of the intro movie was firstly to replace the old one. It was old, favoring one race over the other etc. We wanted to "spiffy" it. It gives a little insight into what is going to happen in the game, but doesn't go very deep into it. The movies in character sheet is to give more flare, give more info, do it in a movie, make it awesome etc. But my question remains; are the movies good?" No they are not good and they are not more spiffy. The new movie is generic and uninteresting and worse of all lacks alot of the background info you get from the old movie. Not only that but the quality of the new movie looks like a pre 2000 FMV introduction it's that poor.
CCP Fear said "Would you like to see more?" I would like to see more of the background lore not less, more of the history of Eve. An intro should tell you how the game setting got to where it is now. A new player should watch the intro then know the basics of the background and history of the game setting. The new intro removes the history of Eve and how the game setting got to where it is now and doesn't really tell you anything much about the current setting. The new intro as it stands leaves player lost. There is nothing about the Eve gate, nothing explaining the strange galaxy without Earth, nothing about the differences between the races. Its more like a short advert.
I would like to see a more unique intro. The style of the current intro is brilliant and different. The new movie just looks like a short trailer you see on any website. The movie should be like the current one that tells you about Eve and the background of Eve. Not some generic advert that so low quality its shocking pixelated.
CCP Fear said "There is also new text in character creation to reflect changes in RP since long time ago. So there is quite alot of RP in there, the movies are there to enhance that in a different format. I'm perhaps biased in that, but I think they are cool." The idea is cool but the way its implanted is not. The vids seem to contain a lot less information over the old system. It has been a long time since I used the old system but I am sure it had far more RP info in it.
EDIT: I like the idea of learning skills. It gives people a choice of get a payoff now or later.
____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.02.19 20:45:00 -
[4]
delor said " The real question is: what do learning skills add to the gameplay experience?" They let you adapt to new situations faster. They let you experience new unexpected things faster than if you didn't have them.
____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.02.19 21:24:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Pottsey on 19/02/2009 21:26:36 delor said "Compared to not having them and re-normalizing attributes as if they were all trained to the maximum value? Quite the opposite." I don't like that re-normalizing idea; I don't think boosting everyone's minimum training speed is a good idea. That idea punishes those that trained the skills. It's not fair for someone to spend over a month training those skills then another player gets those month+ worth of skills for free. It also takes away the option of payoff now or payoff later. I like the idea of the player gets to choose if they invest in learning and learn faster later or skip learning and go right into something else. Your removing the choice of payoff something now or payoff something later.
EDIT: Goumindong said "Make an argument as to why it makes the game better, you know, the actual part where you get into your spaceship and fly around and do stuff? Make an argument as to why learning skills make that better." I already did. You get to adapt faster. You get to do new unexpected stuff faster. You get to experience some things faster than you could without them.
____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.02.19 21:52:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Pottsey on 19/02/2009 21:54:00 Haniblecter Teg said "First, insinuating that a dev thought seige warfare was used for seiging is just laughable. The frickin skill is called seiging and any new player would automatically think that, at least that's the angle that's most apparent to me." Pretty sure a long time ago that skill wasn't called siege warfare but instead got renamed to that. Anyway the dev was insinuating that the skill was useless to new players and that makes the dev look like he has no idea what he is talking about as its a pretty usefull skill to new players. His comment is wrong and not funny.
Haniblecter Teg said "In addition, saying that the dev's are drifting away from the player base because they take away a leadership skill from beginners is seriously moronic." That's not what I said/meant. The devs feel like they are drifting away from the player base due to the silly changes that have been made. The new worse introduction, the new worse NPE, T3 which most players seem to hate although I dont think T3 is that bad. Making drones and drone ships useless in wormhole space and suggesting they will become useless for missions when they get the same AI and the list goes on.
delor said "It doesn't punish you at all. It just benefits new players and not you." So you think its perfectly acceptable for player A train 2 months on skills and spend millions on those skills then Player B gets those skills for free both in price and training time!!
How would you feel if you just spent millions of isk and months of time then there is an announcement you just wasted months of time and wasted lots of cash as everyone's getting it for free? Why should new players get to earn a lot more SP in one year then older players could in one year? Why should new players get millions of skill points worth millions of isk for free?
delor said " From an in-game perspective training the learning skills early is always the right choice. From" No its not. Its only the right choice if you cannot max out you skill plan in x amount of time or if your going to play for longer then X amount of time. Training learning skills early is not always the right choice.
delor said "Except nobody's proposing to remove them and not buff the attributes to compensate, so your entire premise is flawed." You like saying that don't you. It's not flawed I already explained why buffing up the attributes to compensate is bad. One reason is it boosts the minimum training speed by a large amount which I dont think is good. You said " they could always just give everyone who did train them bonus SP to compensate like they did when they upped the starting player skills in the first place." and look how bad that turned out. Just how could they give bonus SP in a fair way. There is no fair way at least no fair way that wouldn't take an ungodly amount of work to do.
____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.02.19 22:13:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Pottsey on 19/02/2009 22:15:19 delor said " I think almost all of the proponents of the "maxed learning skills" have said they'd be fine with compensating players who had already trained them with a matching SP bonus. So, given that, what exactly are you still upset about?" I don't see a fair way to compensate players with matching SP bonuses. Well not a way that would practical to implant. I don't think boosting the minimum training speed of new players is good either. Making everyone train x3 faster or whatever number it is, is bad. You way has little character progression in that you remove the main way you can make your character progression go faster. Many of us like the feeling of getting better and training faster as our character gets better. Starting off at almost peak training takes away the progression of getting your character better at progression. Starting noobs off at the Elite end of training progression is bad. What makes Eve good is differences not making character more similar. Removing a way to make your character better and raising the bar so everyone starts at a higher level by default is very bad in my mind.
delor said "Unless you quit the game, your "skill plan" is endless." No it is not. Some people only train up to max in what they do. Others train alts with each alt only doing a select amount of things. I have a few characters whose skill plans are done and will not train anymore and I am sure others are the same.
____ Telltale sign of their presence is non-linear teleportation (www.eve-online.com/races/theodicy/Theodicy_All.pdf)
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