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Astra Solare
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Posted - 2009.02.25 09:30:00 -
[1]
I have question to devs.
I recently made pause in my EVE play and planed after return do 3 things: missionrunning on my Raven, learn skills for stealth bomber (since I like submarine style PvP) and a bit FW (this last will not be discused further in this topic but has seriouss problems on its own).
Now I came back and that what I saw:
1. Missionrunning is seriouslly damaged since frigs that I shoot with cruiser missiles got 98% damage reduction (my missle skills are 4-5 and cruiser missile specialisation 4). Also general damage is seriously less than previously.
2. I had not yet trained all skills neccessary for SB, but accordingly to what I read missle nerf made SB useless and unplayable.
So since I have not what to do in game atm, I have one simple question - is there any plans to fix broken missles. Please no propaganda, just clear short answer Yes/No (and if answer is Yes, then could you please tell when and what will be done to fix things)?
P.S. This is simple and polite question to devs ONLY (for those who like to troll: please go kill yourself on some POS in Delve... in game only of course )
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
Dara Cothrom
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Posted - 2009.02.25 09:36:00 -
[2]
(1) Fit a Target Painter
(2) Don't shoot cruise missiles at rats doing much more than a couple hundred m/s
(3) use drones to take out frigate rats (T2 drones dambit)
(4) Make sure target Navigation prediction is trained to level V. It's only Rank 2. Guided Missile Precision should be level IV.
My cruise missiles are, with the above, pretty much as effective for missions as they used to be before QR; it just requires a TP, decent missile support skills and a little more selectivity in what you're shooting at - add velocity to your overview columns and pay attention to it.
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Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
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Posted - 2009.02.25 09:38:00 -
[3]
No.
Don't fire anti-battleship missiles at frigates. Use light drones instead.
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ry ry
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Posted - 2009.02.25 09:42:00 -
[4]
Edited by: ry ry on 25/02/2009 09:42:50
fit eccm or fly a sniping rohk. oh. right.
what everybody else said.
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Emrys Ap'Morgravaine
Caldari
Caercamel Corporate Interdictions
The Black Alliance
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Posted - 2009.02.25 14:14:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Emrys Ap''Morgravaine on 25/02/2009 14:14:53
Mission boat tactics 101:
1: Arrive at mission area.
2: Get full aggro.
3: Release drones.
4: Start shooting BS's class with Cruise as T2 (Hob's or Warriors as preferred) start on the frigates.
5: Keep killing everything, working your way down to BC's/C's, meet your drones half way.
6: Salvage, loot, return to station.
7: Rinse and repeat ad nauseatus ad finitum.
Did I miss anything?
Em.
Edit: Or get an AFKDroneDomi, get full aggro, release drones, come back in 20 minutes.
-=-=-=-=-
Reformed Carebear.
Much bear, zero care.
-=-=-=-=- |
Brian Kith
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2009.02.25 14:50:00 -
[6]
Yep, Drones for Frigates and Cruisers.
Battlecruisers take pretty good damage from Cruise missiles, so feel free to blow them up yourself. Usually 2 salvo's from a Raven will toast a BC, and that's a pretty good return.
Any time you get dropped right on top an enemy BS, blow it up first before it gets to a range where it's defenders can screw with you.
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Astra Solare
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Posted - 2009.02.25 18:03:00 -
[7]
Thank you fellow players for your responses, but:
1. Since nobody said anything about stealth bombers I think we can safely assume that you all confirm fact that stealth bombers are broken and unplayable. Thank you. :)
2. Common statement in all your kind advices was "Use drones". IMO by that you obviouslly confirm also fact that missles are broken since:
* for caldari drones are not primary neither secondary weapons;
* Raven has small dronebay so relaying on drones is not completely correct
statement (as well other caldary ships due previouslly metioned fact);
* Not all who learned skills for missleboats has skills for drones
(I have not skill to use T2 drones);
* For drones there is drone boats (Gallente ships) and that is completely
different set of skills (ship skill, weapon skill, skill related to tanking
since they are armor tank not shiloed tanks, etc.)
* frigates and cruisers are more than 50% of mission so more than half of mission is not suited for ships main weapon
* considering fact that main combat ships of caldary are missleboats it is strange that it is invalid for PvP and now in about 50% cases invalid for PvE while main weapon of their enemies (Galente) is god for PvP and now ONLY weapon that is sufficient in PvE.
... there could be more written but to be honest I am to lazy and I think will be enough those statements that I wrote :)
So as I see you all confirm fact that missiles are broken.
Now back to point of topic.
I was asking question to you dear DEVELOPERS.
Are you going to fix broken missiles and stealth bomber? I am NOT asking you to do it, since obviously that is up to you and only you to decide to do it or not. I just asking you to TELL are you planing to fix those missiles. I think it is not much asked just to let to know some player about it.
Have a nice day and best wishes. :)
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Naomi Knight
Amarr
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.25 18:41:00 -
[8]
 Originally by: Malcanis
it just requires a TP, decent missile support skills and a little more selectivity in what you're shooting at - add velocity to your overview columns and pay attention to it.
Oh yes that im sure that equals to : "pretty much as effective for missions as they used to be before QR;" You just shouldnt do anything where it is less effective now. That is pretty simple^^
Or something is fishy here
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Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
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Posted - 2009.02.25 18:54:00 -
[9]
1. SBs were almost worthless before QR, and are still almost worthless after QR. Make of that what you will.
2a. No. Drones are a secondary weapon on all ships with a drone bay.
b. No. A Raven has 75 m3 drone bay. A flight of Hobgoblin IIs is 25 m3 and does up to 99 DPS. It has room for three flights of light drones, or one of Lights and another of Meds.
c. More fool them.
d. No point to reply to.
e. It depends on the mission. That's what drones are for. Counting ships is not meaningful, you need to count the HP and their distribution across rats in the mission. Hint, you'll find that by far the greatest amount of HP is in the BS/BC rats.
f. No on every count.
Point of topic already answered. No.
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Jin Entres
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
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Posted - 2009.02.25 19:10:00 -
[10]
You shouldn't expect one weapon type to be able to kill every size of opponent efficiently. If you tried a large gunboat for perspective, you would notice that it has serious problems landing any hits at all on frigs that are not stationary at distance. The missile system, while severely reduced in damage against smaller targets, at least hits them highly reliably. And not only that, you can use the optimal damage type which increases the effective damage dealt considerably. So, you can either refit some smaller launchers to deal with the frigs better ù at the cost of not dealing so well with the bigger targets ù or you can do what everyone else does and employ drones which do the job more than adequately.
On the subject of Stealth Bombers, however, I would agree that as a class it deserves to be looked at. However as far as ship and module balancing goes, I would prefer some other issues addressed first.
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Naomi Knight
Amarr
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.25 19:33:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Naomi Knight on 25/02/2009 19:33:40
Originally by: Jin Entres
You shouldn't expect one weapon type to be able to kill every size of opponent efficiently. If you tried a large gunboat for perspective, you would notice that it has serious problems landing any hits at all on frigs that are not stationary at distance. The missile system, while severely reduced in damage against smaller targets, at least hits them highly reliably. And not only that, you can use the optimal damage type which increases the effective damage dealt considerably. So, you can either refit some smaller launchers to deal with the frigs better ù at the cost of not dealing so well with the bigger targets ù or you can do what everyone else does and employ drones which do the job more than adequately.
On the subject of Stealth Bombers, however, I would agree that as a class it deserves to be looked at. However as far as ship and module balancing goes, I would prefer some other issues addressed first.
Realy? You cant be serious . My vargur has no problem with killing frigs they start at range and autocannons hit them for full dmg easily, 3-4 hit and frig is dead. Usually i need only 2 cycles from my guns to kill one ,and that is around 6 secs/frigs , all frigs are dead before they are withing the 20km safety zone. If one gets that close my drones can kill them easily. Oh and I hit cruiers allway ,if i dont count the misses becauese of falloff. So gunboats have much less problems than missile ships. Add that guns do insta dmg + no defender missiles and you will get a superiour weapon compared to missiles. I see no reason why anybody would use missiles over guns. And in pvp the difference is even greater. Oh and i can choose my dmg type+no cap use clip is enough for 2 npc bses.
Summary:
-you are a liar as anybody who says guns cant hit smaller class ships effectively
-guns are overpowered compared to missiles
- I should not expect weapon types to kill every size of opponent yes , but then missiles have problems even with the same class ships as the launcher itself
- refit smaller launchers ?? are you serious?? this must be a joke right?
-stealthbombers are crap ,I allways lol when i see one in pvp, they die in less than 20sec even if only i shoot them , usually there are no stealthbombers after the first minute in the fight and they usually do ****ty dmg before they die
-bombs are useless most of the time , ive only seen like 2 successfull bombing and in both times the stealthbomber pilot lost more isk wise
yeah i would address gun nerf first too , remember ships speed got slower guns tracking remained the same
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
Dara Cothrom
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Posted - 2009.02.25 20:23:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Naomi Knight
Originally by: Malcanis
it just requires a TP, decent missile support skills and a little more selectivity in what you're shooting at - add velocity to your overview columns and pay attention to it.
Oh yes that im sure that equals to : "pretty much as effective for missions as they used to be before QR;" You just shouldnt do anything where it is less effective now. That is pretty simple^^
Or something is fishy here
No, you're just a whiner.
By adding player skill and effort - ie: by doing what the gunners have had to do all this time - you can do missions just as fast as ever.
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Furb Killer
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.02.25 20:43:00 -
[13]
A raven can kill frigs orbitting it (slowly yes), a vargur will never kill them once they start orbit.
I got a navy mega with more expensive fitting and far better skills than my cnr. Still CNR is far better mission runner. If you group missiles you even do more dps often that before QR, especially some against serpentis.
Use drones, like everyone has to do. Or try flying a turret BS and then finding out that suddenly you have to do alot more than firing missiles and you are alot less effective, unless you are flying amarr bs.
---------------------------------------------
Originally by: Neth'Rae
Military experts are calling this a troll.
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Jin Entres
Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams
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Posted - 2009.02.25 20:51:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Naomi Knight
Edited by: Naomi Knight on 25/02/2009 19:33:40
Originally by: Jin Entres
You shouldn't expect one weapon type to be able to kill every size of opponent efficiently. If you tried a large gunboat for perspective, you would notice that it has serious problems landing any hits at all on frigs that are not stationary at distance. The missile system, while severely reduced in damage against smaller targets, at least hits them highly reliably. And not only that, you can use the optimal damage type which increases the effective damage dealt considerably. So, you can either refit some smaller launchers to deal with the frigs better ù at the cost of not dealing so well with the bigger targets ù or you can do what everyone else does and employ drones which do the job more than adequately.
On the subject of Stealth Bombers, however, I would agree that as a class it deserves to be looked at. However as far as ship and module balancing goes, I would prefer some other issues addressed first.
-you are a liar as anybody who says guns cant hit smaller class ships effectively
I bolded the part that you seemed to miss. Yes, guns can hit when the conditions are optimal for them. If the frigs are far away and have low transversal, the guns will hit. This is the conceptual difference between guns and missiles: guns require optimal conditions to shine while missiles are flexible but perform more consistently so that optimising conditions yields little extra benefit.
The fact that guns can instapop frigs where missiles can't is besides the point: it is neither the optimal way to do missions with guns nor is it a benefit which puts them ahead missiles. Drones deal with frigs on both kinds of ships so the guns' optimal use is on bigger targets (for which they are intended).
Originally by: Naomi Knight
-guns are overpowered compared to missiles
- I should not expect weapon types to kill every size of opponent yes , but then missiles have problems even with the same class ships as the launcher itself
If cruises and torps have a problem with battleships (or even battlecruisers), I'm not aware of it. They may have problems in PvP against ships that are specifically fitted to counter them with afterburners, which is only fair.
As for guns being overpowered compared to missiles. I'm assuming we're still talking PVE. And, no. Missiles cannot be tracking disrupted, they have great range, great damage type and their damage issue with different sizes is not as huge a problem as you make it out to be. Also note that target painters are much more useful for missiles than tracking comps are for guns.
Originally by: Naomi Knight
- refit smaller launchers ?? are you serious?? this must be a joke right?
Yes.
Originally by: Naomi Knight
-stealthbombers are crap ,I allways lol when i see one in pvp, they die in less than 20sec even if only i shoot them , usually there are no stealthbombers after the first minute in the fight and they usually do ****ty dmg before they die
-bombs are useless most of the time , ive only seen like 2 successfull bombing and in both times the stealthbomber pilot lost more isk wise
Agreed.
Originally by: Naomi Knight
yeah i would address gun nerf first too , remember ships speed got slower guns tracking remained the same
Remember that little web nerf? Well, it basically screwed up close range gun tracking a helluva lot. Remember when tracking computers were scripted? Or when tracking disruptors got a falloff modifier? Guns do indeed need to be addressed, but not in comparison to missiles, rather amongst eachother.
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Overseer Aliena
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.02.25 20:55:00 -
[15]
This is so cute watching you intentionally try to suck
Originally by: Astra Solare
Thank you fellow players for your responses, but:
Common statement in all your kind advices was "Use drones". IMO by that you obviouslly confirm also fact that missles are broken since:
* for caldari drones are not primary neither secondary weapons;
* Raven has small dronebay so relaying on drones is not completely correct statement (as well other caldari ships due previouslly metioned fact);
Yes they are dear. Your ship has a drone bay that can hold 5 medium and 5 light drones. I suggest not letting that space go to waste. And further more you do not even need T2 drones. 5 light drones can kill a frigate in under 5 seconds and mediums (like Hammerheads) can kill Cruisers very effectively.
Originally by: Astra Solare
* Not all who learned skills for missleboats has skills for drones
(I have not skill to use T2 drones);
If you need somebody to blame for that dear you need only to look in a mirror.
Originally by: Astra Solare
* For drones there is drone boats (Gallente ships) and that is completely different set of skills (ship skill, weapon skill, skill related to tanking since they are armor tank not shiloed tanks, etc.)
Like I said, your Pretty Raven has a drone bay and I highly recommend that you not waste that space. Being a drone boat merely means that they can have more drones but it does not imply that the skills are better. Also, Armor tanking and shield tanking mean nothing dear. People can and have armor tanked ravens, they can and have shield tank Domi's.
This is merely a wall your intentionally trying to put up to purposefully hinder yourself. Many Raven pilots have no problem targeting 1 frigate and letting the drones do the rest while they counter the larger ships. And for them that means they are now killing twice as many ships where you digress to the older slower way of playing.
Originally by: Astra Solare
* frigates and cruisers are more than 50% of mission so more than half of mission is not suited for ships main weapon
The is hardly true although I would like for you to link me where you got that statistic please.
Originally by: Astra Solare
* considering fact that main combat ships of caldary are missleboats it is strange that it is invalid for PvP and now in about 50% cases invalid for PvE while main weapon of their enemies (Galente) is god for PvP and now ONLY weapon that is sufficient in PvE.
It is only invalid if you allow it to be invalid. Pilots of each nation and any ship out there and make it a valid and lethal mission boat. Amarr lasers and boats work just as well, as do Minmater's style of fighting with auto guns and speed. and even now you can still see the steady stream of unhindered Ravens leaving the stations to fulfill their agents contracts.
Originally by: Astra Solare
... there could be more written but to be honest I am to lazy and I think will be enough those statements that I wrote :)
So as I see you all confirm fact that missiles are broken.
[\quote]
I honestly think if you put as much time into your mission training as you do with your creativity in these post's you may succeed in doing what so many do now. I shall even go as far as to offer advice to join an excellent mission running corporation and take all the advice they may give you and you will find that you will no longer have an issue with a cruise Raven.
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Stalina
Gallente
Deep Space Exploration Squad
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Posted - 2009.02.25 21:10:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Astra Solare
So since I have not what to do in game atm, I have one simple question - is there any plans to fix broken missles.
There is the problem, missiles are not broken.
1/10 for tolling, go to assembly hall or game dev forum if you want a dev response
_________________________________
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Naomi Knight
Amarr
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.25 21:13:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Furb Killer
A raven can kill frigs orbitting it (slowly yes), a vargur will never kill them once they start orbit.
I got a navy mega with more expensive fitting and far better skills than my cnr. Still CNR is far better mission runner. If you group missiles you even do more dps often that before QR, especially some against serpentis.
Use drones, like everyone has to do. Or try flying a turret BS and then finding out that suddenly you have to do alot more than firing missiles and you are alot less effective, unless you are flying amarr bs.
The frigs never get close to a vargur so there is no reason to talk about frigs orbiting the vargur less than 5km. Even if they get close the drones will take care of those frigs.
In the other hand the raven HAS TO use drones to kill frigs the vargur(or other gunships) can use their guns before the frigs got too close, it is a huge advantage.
Navy mega is not that good try out a different gun ships amarr or matar.
Ive flown both raven and the vargur ,but didnt find the vargur any harder to use, it is even much more fun than the raven. Especially as i usually salvage down the wrecks and the vargur bonuses+speed are far better for this than the ravens.
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Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa
Minmatar
The Perfect Harvesting Experience
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Posted - 2009.02.25 21:19:00 -
[18]
1. Target paint everything you are lobbing your missiles at and is below BS-size... in fact TP the BS aswell.
2. Fill the drone-bay with hobgoblins (15) launch 5 of them at a frigate or interceptor and when it dies, direct them to the next.
3. Win.
-----------------------------------------------
Originally by: Paper
Rock's fine, nerf Scissors
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Astra Solare
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Posted - 2009.02.25 21:22:00 -
[19]
Despite fact that some persones here are rude arrogant <censored> :) this thread in fact almost reached its goal - I went to assembly hall and found petition to remove missle nerf. Signed it. Thank you :)
Bye and best wishes to everybody (event those who are rude arrogant <censored>) 
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Naomi Knight
Amarr
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.25 21:42:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Jin Entres
I bolded the part that you seemed to miss. Yes, guns can hit when the conditions are optimal for them. If the frigs are far away and have low transversal, the guns will hit. This is the conceptual difference between guns and missiles: guns require optimal conditions to shine while missiles are flexible but perform more consistently so that optimising conditions yields little extra benefit.
You wrote "frigs that are not stationary at distance" for me it includes frigs which are apporoaching my ship with 0 transversal. Where your statement is false , guns hit most of the time in this situation. Whereas the missiles still have reduced dmg.
With the new missile nerf formula the missiles are not flexible by far. Torps have bigger sig than most battleships --> reduced dmg . Most bs without any speed module are faster than basic missile velocities , pls check cruise and torp explo velocity--> reduced dmg.
So even against the same class bs weapon vs bs if you dont apply anything on the target bs you will loose dmg most of the time. This is even true for cruiser weapons vs cruisers and frig weapons vs frigs. And if you try to shoot cruiser with bs missiles your dmg will be hugely reduced.
I wouldnt call this flexible. I call it underpowered. Add in the delay dmg and less dmg (except for trops) and you will see why i think missiles are subpar compared to guns.
Originally by: Jin Entres
The fact that guns can instapop frigs where missiles can't is besides the point: it is neither the optimal way to do missions with guns nor is it a benefit which puts them ahead missiles. Drones deal with frigs on both kinds of ships so the guns' optimal use is on bigger targets (for which they are intended).
Maybe but ,if i kill frigs with guns easily my drones are free to help me to kill enemy bs, arent they? And with guns+drones dmg bses will melt faster than only guns dmg --> less rep for the npc--> faster kill.
Originally by: Jin Entres
If cruises and torps have a problem with battleships (or even battlecruisers), I'm not aware of it. They may have problems in PvP against ships that are specifically fitted to counter them with afterburners, which is only fair.
As i said they have problems, oh and i haven't seen cruise bses in pvp for months by now. Check out killboards and see how many ravens are there compared to turret bses.
Originally by: Jin Entres
As for guns being overpowered compared to missiles. I'm assuming we're still talking PVE. And, no. Missiles cannot be tracking disrupted, they have great range, great damage type and their damage issue with different sizes is not as huge a problem as you make it out to be. Also note that target painters are much more useful for missiles than tracking comps are for guns.
I dont realy care for pve,but the dmg issue with diff. sizer are that huge.
However in pvp:
-tracking disrupting is rare
-damage type selection is neglectible
-painter have too low optimal for caldari to use ,and no tacklers usually dont fit tp-s :(
if you would try to ask them to fit one they would tell: bring gunship as everybody else
for the web nerf, i cannot see how you can miss hitting a webbed non ab bs. Remember you dont need to be closer than 1km.
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Endless Subversion
The Accursed
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Posted - 2009.02.25 21:55:00 -
[21]
Also the economy is going down the tubes, walks are uphill both ways and kids have no respect these days.
We're short moral guidance, the fabric of our society is coming apart at the seams and social security isn't going to be any help when I retire!!
Tl;dr
HAMs, HMLs, Torps and very likely AMLs and Standards are perfectly fine as PvP weapons. If anything, their greatest drawback is that there aren't enough platforms that use them.
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Gavin DeVries
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Posted - 2009.02.25 22:15:00 -
[22]
This is the missile damage formula I got from another thread:
Quote:
The formula for missiles is:
Damage = Base_Damage * MIN(MIN(sig/Er,1) , (Ev/Er * sig/vel)^(log(drf) / log(5.5)) )
When I started looking at my Raven design, I was trying to find out what the true in-game effectiveness of a target painter would be, and could not get a definite answer, so I ran this down and made a spreadsheet. If you look in the middle, you see the relationship between the missile attributes of explosion velocity and explosion radius, with the target attributes of signature radius and velocity. Divide the explosion velocity of the missile by the explosion radius of the missile, divide the signature radius of the target by its velocity at the time of impact, then multiply those together. It's a ratio comparison.
The fact that the target is moving faster than the explosion velocity isn't important; what is important is the ratio between the speed and signature radius of the target. Anytime the speed increases more than the signature radius increases the missile damage will go down.
This is what makes the support skills so important. Guided Missile Precision lowers the explosion radius, Target Navigation Prediction increases the explosion velocity, and target painters increase the signature radius of the target. All of these combine to raise the practical in-game applied damage of missiles until you reach the theoretical maximum.
And if anyone is wondering, according to my calculations, painting the target with a PWNAGE generally adds about 26% to the applied damage.
______________________________________________________
Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you? |
cpt Mark
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Posted - 2009.02.26 00:22:00 -
[23]
I have only a few SP in gunnery, most of my SP is in spaceship command, then missiles.
I also feel betrayed, since missiles are apparently useless.
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Malcanis
R.E.C.O.N.
Dara Cothrom
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Posted - 2009.02.26 07:34:00 -
[24]
Incidentally, it's only the "elite" rat frigates that cruise don't do much to. I can pretty much one-volley most of the normal frigates and destroyers, as long as they're target painted and not at speed >~ 300m/s
Battlecruisers die as easily as ever they did. Cruisers are about the same as they were before if TP'd, or take an extra volley if not.
As indicated above, I start firing missiles at the biggest stuff and work down in size, while directing my drones at the smallest stuff. A slight change of tactics, combined with a TP does the trick.
Possibly this is because I'm so awesome and all that ccp decided not to apply the nerf to my CNR, but I can't help wondering if there's a more likely explanation.
BONUS: A target painter is like a damage mod for medium drones shooting small targets. My Hammerhead IIs wtfbbq target-painted rat frigates.
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Astra Solare
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Posted - 2009.02.26 07:59:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Astra Solare on 26/02/2009 08:06:06
All good people of eve, please go sign petition against missle nerf 
Sign petition! Save missiles!
Edit: Link to petition against missiles nerf - Link to petition against missiles nerf (fixed wrong link)
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Misina Arlath
Amarr
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Posted - 2009.02.26 09:28:00 -
[26]
Fly a napoc with mega pulse and scorch.
Instapop all frigs at 70km, then eat the BS/BC's.
I rarely even use the drones.
Win.
Paladin soon enough too.
More win.
Thats what you get for laughing at Amarr and useless lasers for years. Now you can sit there with your 20th century missiles while we destroy stuff using high tech lasers!
Instead of a petition against missile nerf, you should rather petition to have CCP implement flak cannons for more 20th century stuff on your Faildari boats.
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"Every complex problem has a solution which is easy, neat and wrong!" |
Burn Mac
Minmatar
The Tuskers
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Posted - 2009.02.26 10:22:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Emrys Ap'Morgravaine
Edited by: Emrys Ap''Morgravaine on 25/02/2009 14:14:53
Mission boat tactics 101:
1: Arrive at mission area.
2: Get full aggro.
3: Release drones.
4: Start shooting BS's class with Cruise as T2 (Hob's or Warriors as preferred) start on the frigates.
5: Keep killing everything, working your way down to BC's/C's, meet your drones half way.
6: Salvage, loot, return to station.
7: Rinse and repeat ad nauseatus ad finitum.
Did I miss anything?
Em.
Edit: Or get an AFKDroneDomi, get full aggro, release drones, come back in 20 minutes.
Id say you missed these points:
8:????????
9:PROFIT!!!
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TimMc
Gallente
Extradition
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Posted - 2009.02.26 10:38:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Astra Solare
1. Since nobody said anything about stealth bombers I think we can safely assume that you all confirm fact that stealth bombers are broken and unplayable. Thank you. :)
Stealth bombers no longer instantly pop frigates in 1 shot, so people hate them now. For the most part they are still fun to fly though in wolfpacks.
Originally by: Astra Solare
2. Common statement in all your kind advices was "Use drones". IMO by that you obviouslly confirm also fact that missles are broken since:
* for caldari drones are not primary neither secondary weapons;
* Raven has small dronebay so relaying on drones is not completely correct
statement (as well other caldary ships due previouslly metioned fact);
* Not all who learned skills for missleboats has skills for drones
(I have not skill to use T2 drones);
* For drones there is drone boats (Gallente ships) and that is completely
different set of skills (ship skill, weapon skill, skill related to tanking
since they are armor tank not shiloed tanks, etc.)
* frigates and cruisers are more than 50% of mission so more than half of mission is not suited for ships main weapon
* considering fact that main combat ships of caldary are missleboats it is strange that it is invalid for PvP and now in about 50% cases invalid for PvE while main weapon of their enemies (Galente) is god for PvP and now ONLY weapon that is sufficient in PvE.
... there could be more written but to be honest I am to lazy and I think will be enough those statements that I wrote :)
So as I see you all confirm fact that missiles are broken.
Droneboats have huge dronebays of 300m3+, raven has 75m3 which is plenty for a set of medium drones. Medium drones can easily pop frigates and assist with close targets. Stop whining, everyone else has drone skills as they are extremely useful. Only different is Gallente use them on some ships as a primary weapon system.
Originally by: Astra Solare
Now back to point of topic.
I was asking question to you dear DEVELOPERS.
Are you going to fix broken missiles and stealth bomber? I am NOT asking you to do it, since obviously that is up to you and only you to decide to do it or not. I just asking you to TELL are you planing to fix those missiles. I think it is not much asked just to let to know some player about it.
Have a nice day and best wishes. :)
Developers are never going to answer you, this isnt an interesting topic. Missiles have been fixed. Missile were overpowered for mission running, as is obvious by the fact that you think drones are a waste of time when all gunnery pilots will be using guns and drones (all the races).
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Tchulen
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Posted - 2009.02.26 15:23:00 -
[29]
Before the Missile Nerf (as others call it) I used drones to take out frigates and cruise missiles to take out BS and BC and then drones & cruise missiles to take out cruisers.
After the Missile Nerf I, guess what, did exactly the same. Yes, cruise missiles aren't so good at non BS/BC PvP but hell, that's what I would have expected.
I fly missile boats exclusively and have absolutely no problems with the "nerf". On top of that I have a long way to go with my missile skills so, as someone mentioned previously, I'm looking forward to all that lovely extra damage. I can solo all lvl4s without problems.
If there is one piece of advice to the OP it is (as also previously mentioned) spend some time training light and medium drones. It won't take you long and will mean peace of mind from scramming frigates in missions.
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Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa
Minmatar
The Perfect Harvesting Experience
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Posted - 2009.02.26 15:38:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Burn Mac
Id say you missed these points:
8:????????
9:PROFIT!!!
I see what you did there...
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Originally by: Paper
Rock's fine, nerf Scissors
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