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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 12 post(s) |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
539

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Posted - 2012.04.25 20:12:00 -
[1] - Quote
I shall make this real simple: Do not mess with rookies in rookie systems in any way. They are still trying to figure out how to read the overview and how to right click; messing with them at that point in their career is something for bullies who have something to compensate for and only dare to pick on the smallest, weakest boy in kindergarten. Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
604

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Posted - 2012.04.26 20:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
Sephira Galamore wrote:Sentinel Smith wrote:Honestly.. I don't understand people who think knowing the rules is a bad thing.. Imagine if life was like that at home, school, and otherwise in the world..
"Don't speed on this road." "What's the speed limit ?" " Get on a different road." .. o_0 See, there are different kind of rules. The hard ones and the vague ones and each have a purpose. If you state a rule somewhat vague you purposefully leave a grey area. Within this area, it is up to the police/judge/GM to decide whether you broke the rule or not. The effect of this is a certain uncertainty, which may appear as a bad thing but often really isn't. Since the goal here is to avoid people walking the line, to push the limits, to find loopholes. On the other hand, it allows GM to show leniance, too. (Also, vague rules are used, when it's very difficult to actually define the limits objectively). And you have these kind of rules/laws in real life, too. "Don't drive in a way that recklessly endangers other traffic participants" - "Wait, what classifies as reckless driving?" - "Don't push it, man!" If you would define "recklessly" by setting limits for speed, acceleration, deviation from the road center, and whatsnot, you'd leave loopholes. Of course, hard rules have a purpose aswell, as they make it easy to deal with obvious cases and are less prone to subjective judgement. So back to topic: If you are in a rookie system and in a situation where you wonder "Is this a rookie now or not?", it should be clear that as soon as you have valid cause to even ask this question, the safe course of action is to leave it be. It's a about common sense, really. Of course you can still ask that question, answer it for yourself as good as you can, but when acting accordingly, you willingly accept the risk that goes along with that. Eve, consequences and stuff ;)
I cannot quote this person enough. Some rules are vague on purpose and they will remain vague. This is the 'reckless driving' equivalent. If I define the rules to the last dot someone will simply find a loop hole and use it. The rule is "do not mess with rookies", and if you are in doubt the answer is ALWAYS 'do not do it'. Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
604

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Posted - 2012.04.26 20:19:00 -
[3] - Quote
ian papabear wrote:okay so i get the "dont mess with the rookies period" point, but is pvp still allowed in the system? like for example can you pvp with someone who isnt a rookie in that system?
I dont pvp in rookie systems but when i would go to them i would see people pvping outside the staton who arent rookies
Yes, you can still PvP there. You cannot mess with the rookies there, what you do to other people is your own business. Note that dropping your property into space in a rookie system is not a bright idea. If a rookie gets curious ad takes from the can you had better not shoot him. You do not want a rookie to nab your stuff, do not drop the stuff in a rookie system. Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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CCP Phantom
C C P C C P Alliance
1243

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Posted - 2012.04.27 23:50:00 -
[4] - Quote
Off topic posts removed. Please stay on topic and constructive, thank you. CCP Phantom - German Community Coordinator |
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GM Zerat
Game Masters C C P Alliance
11

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Posted - 2012.05.02 07:17:00 -
[5] - Quote
There is currently a blanket ban on can baiting in rookie systems, I just wanted to bring that up as many players make this mistake.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Rookie_Systems Warning: Can Flipping in Rookie Systems is considered Griefing.
So if you are thinking about can baiting only older players in those systems, please do not. |
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ISD LoneLynx
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
28

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Posted - 2012.06.14 16:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
Some posts were deleted as inappropriate personal attacks or for being inconstructive (along with replies for such posts)
Keep your discussion with decent grade of respects to your colleagues. ISD LoneLynx Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
740

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Posted - 2012.06.14 18:36:00 -
[7] - Quote
Ok, this seems to be getting out of hand and our rulings are pulled out of context. So let me state this in the most simple terms possible.
1. New PLAYERS are protected by CCP in the systems listed here: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Rookie_Systems 2. No one is protected in systems outside of this list. 3. None but new PLAYERS are protected by CCP in any way. 4. If new PLAYERS keep getting harassed the list of systems may be expanded. 5. Players cannot see which characters are new PLAYERS and which are old players with new CHARACTERS; game masters CAN see this and we act accordingly. 6. It is impossible to define what a new PLAYER is in a way that is comprehensible, to the point and without loop holes, in addition to our players able to apply these rules to their fellow players around them. This means that we will not provide a hard definition to our player base, however game masters internally can apply these rules consistently and without bias. 7. In general do NOT mess around with new PLAYERS; anyone else is fair game.
The above guidelines are not up for discussion and they will not be further clarified. If you need further clarification you are probably doing something you should not be doing. Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
744

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Posted - 2012.06.14 18:50:00 -
[8] - Quote
Haulie Berry wrote:GM Homonoia wrote:Ok, this seems to be getting out of hand and our rulings are pulled out of context. So let me state this in the most simple terms possible. 1. New PLAYERS are protected by CCP in the systems listed here: http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Rookie_Systems2. No one is protected in systems outside of this list. 4. If new PLAYERS keep getting harassed the list of systems may be expanded. 7. In general do NOT mess around with new PLAYERS; anyone else is fair game. The above guidelines are not up for discussion and they will not be further clarified. If you need further clarification you are probably doing something you should not be doing. You just said in (2) that nobody is protected outside of rookie systems. Then you went on to say in (7), "Even though they're not protected outside of those systems, don't mess with them anywhere else, either " which, as a GM edict, could be interpreted as policy. So now you have two policy points that directly contradict each other, and (4) is the cherry on top - "or else". You couldn't make it through a brief synopsis of your position without contradicting both yourself and policy as it is currently known. This should probably be taken as an indication that you need to rethink things.
We do not want you to mess with them, that does not mean we come down with the ban hammer if you do so outside the mentioned systems. Not everything is black and white. These points do not conflict; 4 and 7 simply mean that if the situation OUTSIDE those systems gets too bad we will take further action. Thus INSIDE the systems it isn't allowed period, OUTSIDE those systems it is allowed, but we may evaluate if things get out of hand. Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
744

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Posted - 2012.06.14 18:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
EI Digin wrote:GM Homonoia wrote:EI Digin wrote:There are many many situations where a "new player", either a legitimate new player or a veteran with an axe to grind and a trial account, can exploit the system resulting in others becoming banned.
Off of the top of my head: - Using a 1 day player/alt in a frigate to fight wartargets in a rookie zone - Hauling overly expensive gear in a small frigate or industrial
Also you have situations where rookies who do not know what they are doing end up doing things like can flipping other rookies resulting in hilarious consequences and liberal use of the banhammer.
It's better to have people learn lessons the hard way than to coddle them through the game, because they will end up being griefed at one point or another. And if you're going to have player immunity, make it so that the rookies can't do any harm either, because you should know that eve players will take every advantage they can get to **** people off. If a "rookie" like that can take these actions he is obviously not a rookie and is thus not protected. Common sense; apply it. It's not out of line for a rookie to join a corporation that is wardecced or to haul something between stations for money. There are many other situations where a new player could legitimately enter a scenario where they could blow up or blow someone else up due to the hands of another player in EvE Online, a spaceship game designed around blowing other spaceships.
And this is why we will not define what a rookie is. Once again, common sense; a rookie involves himself in a war, perhaps not so rookie anymore. Now, stop coming up with hypothetical situations and apply some common sense. Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
744

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Posted - 2012.06.14 18:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote: Since nothing of much economic value happens in rookie systems, the only thing this really applies to is something like "are Hulks in rookie systems 'rookies'?"
Dear lord... Hulks are advanced T2 ships. I am not going to dignify this with a real answer.
Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
745

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Posted - 2012.06.14 19:05:00 -
[11] - Quote
Alright, instead of arguing this any further. Here one for you guys. I am sure that most of you understand our goals, now assuming you had ZERO development time, how would YOU word a policy that achieves these goals? Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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GM Homonoia
Game Masters C C P Alliance
753

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Posted - 2012.06.14 19:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote: b) continue short list of Exceptions, like initiating a suicide gank, or whatever. Take these from the publicly viewable information used in your in house Newbie definition
That right there is the problem. We can probably write a list the size of a dictionary. So we will stick to case by case basis. The only issue left is the wording of the evelopedia page. I will see if I can raise the discussion on that internally, but a new wording may take a while.
Senior GM Homonoia | Info Group | Senior Game Master |
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