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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 27 post(s) |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
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Posted - 2012.04.26 14:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:spookydonut wrote:Hey can you give us an updated count of false positives?
At fanfest sreegs said it was only 1 false positive.
I know for a fact that it's at least 15 now, and maybe as high as 50. That is untrue and as I elaborated in every single case we've found where someone was flagged for RMT who shouldn't have been, they were doing something else they shouldn't have been. Not so much a false positive as a positive for the wrong activity. It may be mincing words a bit but there's a very big difference from my perspective as these aren't really innocents getting caught in the crossfire.
If this proves to be true in some of your ongoing investigations (I have a friend who is still banned who only just received any sort of reply from you guys after almost a month of hearing absolutely nothing...) will you come out and admit it? |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 14:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:corestwo wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:spookydonut wrote:Hey can you give us an updated count of false positives?
At fanfest sreegs said it was only 1 false positive.
I know for a fact that it's at least 15 now, and maybe as high as 50. That is untrue and as I elaborated in every single case we've found where someone was flagged for RMT who shouldn't have been, they were doing something else they shouldn't have been. Not so much a false positive as a positive for the wrong activity. It may be mincing words a bit but there's a very big difference from my perspective as these aren't really innocents getting caught in the crossfire. If this proves to be true in some of your ongoing investigations (I have a friend who is still banned who only just received any sort of reply from you guys after almost a month of hearing absolutely nothing...) will you come out and admit it? In all fairness, if your internet "friend" actually was doing something in violation of the EULA (botting, RMT, or otherwise) are you really sure they would admit it to you...
Edited some clarification in; he was running a bond in the alliance. It'd have been all too easy for him to get false flagged. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
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Posted - 2012.04.26 14:54:00 -
[3] - Quote
Denidil wrote:corestwo wrote:
Edited some clarification in; he was running a bond in the alliance. It'd have been all too easy for him to get false flagged.
and just as easy for him to try to be hiding his illicit activities under the legal ones.
While I'll be the first to admit that goons were probably as riddled with RMTers as any other nullsec alliance, he's also one of the last people I'd expect to have been RMTing. And the fact that every goon wasn't involved in RMT is just as obvious as your bias towards thinking we were.
@CCPSreegs: I'll hold you to that, then, once you guys finish. Given how long it took him to get one reply, I suppose I'll be reporting back sometime in 2013. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
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Posted - 2012.04.26 15:21:00 -
[4] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:One thing to keep in mind if it takes that long to get a response other than "Goodbye" it could very well mean they are taking the time to be thorough, which in my mind is preferable a fast and probably negative outcome. At least one case in which CCP decided that the player was, shall we say, partially guilty (unbanned, minus some cash), the player in question was unbanned on all of his multiple accounts in less than a week. I'm sure kazanir can provide more examples of swift turnaround times. So, you can see why we're kind of upset about a month without so much as a "we're looking into it". |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
196
|
Posted - 2012.04.26 15:38:00 -
[5] - Quote
Ranger 1 wrote:corestwo wrote:Ranger 1 wrote:One thing to keep in mind if it takes that long to get a response other than "Goodbye" it could very well mean they are taking the time to be thorough, which in my mind is preferable a fast and probably negative outcome. At least one case in which CCP decided that the player was, shall we say, partially guilty (unbanned, minus some cash), the player in question was unbanned on all of his multiple accounts in less than a week. I'm sure kazanir can provide more examples of swift turnaround times. So, you can see why we're kind of upset about a month without so much as a "we're looking into it". I fully understand that, I'm not trying to say your concern is not valid. But if this situation involved a lot of ISK transactions/transfers it's going to take a much longer period of time to trace the income from all those sources. That being said, I'm just applying common sense (that I think you can agree with). It could also just as easily be that the case you are concerned about slipped through the cracks somehow. It's unlikely, but they are only human so it is possible. It's also possible that some RMT monies were in the mix that your friend was unaware of, which would complicate things a great deal. You are doing what you should do, check back on the situation periodically for progress. Just don't lose sight of the fact that many of the details about any of these cases really can't be released (which makes it hard to keep in perspective when it's a long time aquaintance involved). That, and my original point still holds. You can know someone for years in this game, and yet still be surprised by them dabbling in activities like this... often out of curiosity or a non-reoccuring need. Embarrassment keeps them from fessing up right away, which is understandable too. You know what I'm saying... and that I'm not trying to throw stones directly at you or your friend.
Taking a good long while to properly investigate is fine and we'd be okay with that, if not for the whole lack of any contact at all. A month without so much as a "We're looking at it and will keep you updated."
And your original point is still invalidated by Kazanir's API access. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
197
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Posted - 2012.04.26 17:44:00 -
[6] - Quote
These two words...they do not mean the same thing. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
197
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Posted - 2012.04.26 17:53:00 -
[7] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:corestwo wrote:These two words...they do not mean the same thing. I can type what I want
Drinking during the alliance panel at fanfest was hilarious, drinking at work is not. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
198
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Posted - 2012.04.26 18:40:00 -
[8] - Quote
Except as he already stated those items shouldn't belong in the game anyway as they were often times obtained through extensive botting and so why would they sell them? |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
204
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Posted - 2012.04.26 20:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Mikk36 wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:Toawa wrote:Sorry, but I have an irresistible compulsion to be pedantic here.
RMT ISK sales are not "illegal." They do not meet any countries' legal definition of a crime (AFAIK). They are against the EULA, but breaking the EULA is not illegal (despite certain protestations by certain US federal courts and politicians whenever it happens suits their PR interests). The EULA has language specifically dealing with EULA violations, specifying cancellation of the account.
A more correct term would be "unauthorized."
I feel that I have to point this out precisely because of the aforementioned US federal courts and politicians (especially politicians!) who go out of their way to cast everything they don't happen to like as being a crime; the fact that you don't like something does not make it criminal.
(Of course, fraudulently breaking into an account may, depending upon the circumstances, meet the legal definition of a crime, but that's not what this devblog was about.)
Selling something that doesn't belong to you against the agreements you've agreed to an the will of hte rightful owner seems pretty illegal to me but you're free to use whatever words make you the most happy. :) To my understanding, if it were illegal, you could sue people for RMT'ing or botting the game, but you can't, so all you can do is terminate their accounts and stop providing them the service.
No one cares about the semantics. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
204
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Posted - 2012.04.26 22:08:00 -
[10] - Quote
Toawa wrote:Danny Centauri wrote: As EVE online ISK and other EVE assets are copyrighted then get in touch with Google and make a Digital Millennium Copyright Act request to Google complaining about the copyrighted materials appearing on these ISK selling websites. This will then either force the site into removing these assets or if they donGÇÖt then Google will delist them not only from the regular SERPs but also from PPC.
This would be an abuse of the DMCA. ISK as a word cannot be copyrighted, because you can't copyright a word. You'd have a hard time making any copyright claim to "ISK" or "EVE Online ISK" under copyright law. Now, if they're taking images from CCP's sites, that's another matter. And copyright law doesn't even begin to cover actions taken within the game to transfer ISK from one party to another. That being said, I'd imagine there are avenues open under Trademark law. (Far, far too many people confuse Copyright law, Trademark law, and Patent law. The more we can do to end that confusion, the better.) (Standard IANAL disclaimer.)
Not to mention that ISK is also the currency code for Iceland's kr+¦na... |
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