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Stasis webifier and SW-900 drones stacking penalty?

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Tiddz	Posted - 2009.04.03 14:04:00 - [1] Hi all, I'm trying to figure out some details regarding webbing abilities. The stasis webifier modules descriptions does not say that it gets stacking penalty. Is this correct? Is there stacking penalty for the SW-900 drones? For me it looks like the drones have stacking penalty, but can anyone confirm? If you use both stasis webifiers and SW-900 drones. How will it calculate the stacking penalty? Thanks
Okal Eldar	Posted - 2009.04.03 14:11:00 - [2] In a sense, they are stacking penalized, but only numerically. If you have 2 50% webs and put them on a person going 100m/s, the first 50% slows them to 50m/s, and the second takes them to 25m/s, both are a 50% decrease, but because of how they are applied you receive a "smaller" bonus for each additional web module.
Managalar Gallente The Mighty All Blacks TRE GAFFEL	Posted - 2009.04.03 14:17:00 - [3] It's all part of the need for speed, any speed modification has a stacking penalty. ===================== =====================
Tiddz	Posted - 2009.04.03 14:18:00 - [4] Originally by: Okal Eldar In a sense, they are stacking penalized, but only numerically. If you have 2 50% webs and put them on a person going 100m/s, the first 50% slows them to 50m/s, and the second takes them to 25m/s, both are a 50% decrease, but because of how they are applied you receive a "smaller" bonus for each additional web module. Yes, I didnt expect to get 0% speed from two webs :) hehe.. But I was thinking more like in the scenario 1 web + 5 SW-900 drones. Will that be effected by stacking penalty?
Managalar Gallente The Mighty All Blacks TRE GAFFEL	Posted - 2009.04.03 14:45:00 - [5] my math is rusty - and I'm not 100% sure about this, but here is what I would expect. normal speed 100 m/s 1 60% web = 60m/s 1st 20% drone = 48 m/s 2nd 20% drone = 38.4 m/s 3rd 20% drone = 30.72 m/s 4th 20% drone = 24.576 m/s 5th 20% drone = 19.6608 m/s So basically, you're doing 80% speed reduction with 1 web and 5 webber drones. Feel free to correct me on this, I haven't done a lot of testing. ===================== =====================
Tiddz	Posted - 2009.04.03 15:01:00 - [6] Originally by: Managalar my math is rusty - and I'm not 100% sure about this, but here is what I would expect. normal speed 100 m/s 1 60% web = 60m/s 1st 20% drone = 48 m/s 2nd 20% drone = 38.4 m/s 3rd 20% drone = 30.72 m/s 4th 20% drone = 24.576 m/s 5th 20% drone = 19.6608 m/s So basically, you're doing 80% speed reduction with 1 web and 5 webber drones. Feel free to correct me on this, I haven't done a lot of testing. First of all reducing speed with 60% gives gives you result speed 40 not 60 :) Nevermind.. I'll just check this out on TQ this evening :)
Gabriel Karade Gallente Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil	Posted - 2009.04.03 16:37:00 - [7] Edited by: Gabriel Karade on 03/04/2009 16:40:19 Yes, web drones have a stacking penalty, which is why they are pretty useless They were considering removing it, but due to whatever reason it never happened. Also the second reply is incorrect, webs (the module) have stacking penalty now too e.g. while you'd expect 2 webs to give you an 84% reduction (1-[0.4*0.4]), it's actually nearer to 80% -------------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Managalar Gallente The Mighty All Blacks TRE GAFFEL	Posted - 2009.04.03 17:14:00 - [8] Originally by: Tiddz normal speed 100 m/s 1 60% web = 60m/s First of all reducing speed with 60% gives gives you result speed 40 not 60 :) Nevermind.. I'll just check this out on TQ this evening :) doh, yeah. normal speed 100 m/s 1 60% web = 40m/s 1st 20% drone = 32 m/s 2nd 20% drone = 25.6 m/s 3rd 20% drone = 20.48 m/s 4th 20% drone = 16.38 m/s 5th 20% drone = 13.11 m/s so you have an 87 % web effect, and still not as good as the old fleeting web ===================== =====================
Gabriel Karade Gallente Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil	Posted - 2009.04.03 17:18:00 - [9] Originally by: Managalar Originally by: Tiddz normal speed 100 m/s 1 60% web = 60m/s First of all reducing speed with 60% gives gives you result speed 40 not 60 :) Nevermind.. I'll just check this out on TQ this evening :) doh, yeah. normal speed 100 m/s 1 60% web = 40m/s 1st 20% drone = 32 m/s 2nd 20% drone = 25.6 m/s 3rd 20% drone = 20.48 m/s 4th 20% drone = 16.38 m/s 5th 20% drone = 13.11 m/s so you have an 87 % web effect, and still not as good as the old fleeting web It doesn't work like that, there is a stacking penalty. Try it on real ships and you will the speed reduction is lower than your expected results, and, gets progressively worse the more webs you add. As I said, you'd expect two 60% webs to give you an 84% reduction, but it's actually around 80%. -------------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Tiddz	Posted - 2009.04.03 18:42:00 - [10] Originally by: Gabriel Karade It doesn't work like that, there is a stacking penalty. Try it on real ships and you will the speed reduction is lower than your expected results, and, gets progressively worse the more webs you add. As I said, you'd expect two 60% webs to give you an 84% reduction, but it's actually around 80%. Thanks for a good responce. I believe you are right about this. But do you know how much the modules and drones is getting stacking penalty. I would for instance be interessted to find out how much - say 20 webbing drones would slow down a target. Using existing stacking penalties from other modules I find that when adding more than 7-8 it doesnt make much difference anymore. Do the webbing drones and modules follow the same stacking penalty as the other modules?

Tiddz	Posted - 2009.04.03 19:48:00 - [11] For anyone who it might interest I did some measurements on SiSi: apocalypse normal max-speed 98.6km fleeting : 41.1 ( 98.6x = 41.1 => x = 0.4168 ) 1 drones : 35.9 ( 41.1x = 35.9 => x = 0.8734 ) 2 drones : 33.2 ( 35.9x = 33.2 => x = 0.9247 ) 3 drones : 32.1 ( 33.2x = 32.1 => x = 0.9668 ) 4 drones : 31.7 ( 32.1x = 31.7 => x = 0.9875 ) 5 drones : 31.6 ( 31.7x = 31.6 => x = 0.9968 ) apocalypse normal max-speed 98.6 1 drones : 82.2 ( 98.6x = 82.2 => x = 0.8336 ) 2 drones : 71.8 ( 82.2x = 71.8 => x = 0.8734 ) 3 drones : 66.4 ( 71.8x = 66.4 => x = 0.9247 ) 4 drones : 64.1 ( 66.4x = 64.1 => x = 0.9653 ) 5 drones : 63.3 ( 64.1x = 63.3 => x = 0.9875 ) x being the velocity multiplier when adding this effect. Did the measurements to try find a pattern, and discribe it mathematically. However, after measuring the results I didn't even bother:) hehe Short version: SW-900 sucks! fix it!
Gabriel Karade Gallente Celtic Anarchy Force Of Evil	Posted - 2009.04.04 08:29:00 - [12] Yeah, now you see why they are pointless It's basically the same stacking penalty as anything else, 'two of' is fine, 'three of' works ok and anything more is a waste. -------------- Video - 'War-Machine'
Tractory	Posted - 2009.04.06 09:35:00 - [13] Do they not have a range advantage over a traditional web though, which may be beneficial in some ways? Never really tried webber drones much, and i appreciate they are slow, but if you can use a standard web to let them get to your target, and then just leave them to it while you get your ship back out of web range?


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