EVE Search - Torpedo damage on Abaddon moving 102km/s

All Channels

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Torpedo damage on Abaddon moving 102km/s

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.12 02:00:00 - [1] Raven vs. Abaddon Raven: unrigged, stationary firing T1 Mjolnir torpedos Abaddon: orbiting raven at 20km, 76% EM resists Torpedos: lvl 3 Warhead Upgrades: lvl 3 Target Navigation Prediction: lvl 3 Torpedo damage on stationary Abaddon:164.2 Torpedo damage on Abaddon moving 102km/s w/o AB, with TP164.4 Torpedo damage on Abaddon moving 102km/s w/o AB, w/o TP155.6 Torpedo damage on Abaddon moving 214km/s w AB, w TP100.2 Torpedo damage on Abaddon moving 214km/s w AB, w/o TP78.2 Results: 52.3% DPS loss to torpedo damage w/o target painter 38.8% DPS loss to torpedo damage w/ target painter Battleships speed tanking battleships The explosion velocity of larger missiles should be adjusted so that they hit the targets they were designed to kill (while running an afterburner) for full damage.
Balashler	Posted - 2009.04.12 02:49:00 - [2] Did you fight outside of a deadspace pocket? If so you can fly out to 160km or so with a microwarp drive(or afterburner if scrambled), warp to the abbadon then use a web or two. Would that have an effect on such a battle?
Grek Forto Malevolent Intentions Dark Solar Empire	Posted - 2009.04.12 03:31:00 - [3] 102 kilometers per sec. HOOOLY ** -------------------------------------------------- Originally by:** CCP Abraxas All major capsuleer ships have crews. Battleships are manned by thousands of people.
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.12 05:45:00 - [4] Originally by: Balashler Did you fight outside of a deadspace pocket? If so you can fly out to 160km or so with a microwarp drive(or afterburner if scrambled), warp to the abbadon then use a web or two. Would that have an effect on such a battle? Yeah a web would help, but you only have so many mids. It is pretty silly to have half your DPS vanish because the target BS flicked on his AB. I knew it was bad but I didn't know it was that bad.
cyno here Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.04.12 07:56:00 - [5] Originally by: Amberle Vale Originally by: Balashler Did you fight outside of a deadspace pocket? If so you can fly out to 160km or so with a microwarp drive(or afterburner if scrambled), warp to the abbadon then use a web or two. Would that have an effect on such a battle? Yeah a web would help, but you only have so many mids. It is pretty silly to have half your DPS vanish because the target BS flicked on his AB. I knew it was bad but I didn't know it was that bad. Then either get a support with a web or ogmygod sacrifice a midslot. Also wtb 160KM/s baddon.
hawtalt pr0nmistress	Posted - 2009.04.12 08:02:00 - [6] Edited by: hawtalt **mistress on 12/04/2009 08:02:26 Originally by: Amberle Vale Torpedo damage on Abaddon moving 214km/s w AB, w/o TP78.2 You mean m/s right????!??!? Also, that's pretty normal. You should train your skills better and you will be able to hit for more damage. Also, painter drones are your friend. IMO there is no longer any point using torps in pvp unless you have the support skills all very high indeed.
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2009.04.12 11:16:00 - [7] Missiles were balanced to deal full damage on stationary targets of the appropriate size. Once a target starts moving damage is reduced and you have to slow the ship (web), make target larger (paint) or use a smaller missile (cruise). This is as intended. There is a reason for the surge in Assault Launcher Caracals (and even Cerberus') running around, without the ability to web/paint on their own they reduce missile size to optimize damage on moving targets. All missile woes in PvP are solved by the cheapest most annoying frigate in game, the mighty Vigil. It is small as hell so speed tanks like mad, has midslots for web/painter, gets painting bonus .. the ultimate wingman ship for Raven pilots.
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.12 12:25:00 - [8] Originally by: cyno here Originally by: Amberle Vale Originally by: Balashler Did you fight outside of a deadspace pocket? If so you can fly out to 160km or so with a microwarp drive(or afterburner if scrambled), warp to the abbadon then use a web or two. Would that have an effect on such a battle? Yeah a web would help, but you only have so many mids. It is pretty silly to have half your DPS vanish because the target BS flicked on his AB. I knew it was bad but I didn't know it was that bad. Then either get a support with a web or ogmygod sacrifice a midslot. Also wtb 160KM/s baddon. You lose almost 40% of your DPS with a target painter. Appreciating what an Abaddon is, speed tanking any missile with it short of a citadel is just silly. Support or no support, this is a hundred million ton ship and it shouldn't be used like it's an interceptor against Caldari ships. Speaking of citadels, we see the same behavior with them. Only they are now incapable of hitting any moving capital for full damage, and I am reading about titans speed tanking them. Should you need target painters and a web to hit a titan with citadels for full damage? I know I'm being picky, adhering to the laws of physics and everything ;)
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.12 12:31:00 - [9] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Missiles were balanced to deal full damage on stationary targets of the appropriate size. Once a target starts moving damage is reduced and you have to slow the ship (web), make target larger (paint) or use a smaller missile (cruise). This is as intended. Sure, I read the dev blogs. It also makes perfect sense when you're talking about small, fast ships. CCP needs to revisit the mechanic for huge, slow ships, of the should-be-impossible-to-speed-tank variety.
cyno here Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.04.12 12:33:00 - [10] Then fit a web instead TP, problem solved. Try flying blaster ship w/o web on target and then complain that "ohgod i can't just omgwtfpwn, i have to web em to deal 100% dmg". And yes, citadels got dmg lowered against capitals that are not webbed, just like bs sized torps against bs. You should check things like that before posting coz you look silly right now.
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.12 12:45:00 - [11] Originally by: cyno here Then fit a web instead TP, problem solved. Problem not solved: - You should not have to web a battleship to hit it for full damage with another battleship. - You should not be required to have a support gang to hit a battleship for full damage with another battleship. This is not some elite frig going 5km/s.
Tarron Sarek Gallente Biotronics Inc. Alternative Realities	Posted - 2009.04.12 12:46:00 - [12] Erm.. so fitting an AB has some positive affect? And improving the missile skills actually does have quite some effect? That might be intended features.. Apart from that, people still tend to fit MWD or no propulsion module in most PvP situations. Would you mind adding the results for an MWD fitted Abaddon? ___________________________________ Balance is power, ~~guard~~ hide it well "Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam"
cyno here Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.04.12 12:48:00 - [13] Originally by: Amberle Vale Originally by: cyno here Then fit a web instead TP, problem solved. Problem not solved: - You should not have to web a battleship to hit it for full damage with another battleship. - You should not be required to have a support gang to hit a battleship for full damage with another battleship.. And your claims are based on [...] Fill - [...] because all battleships must fit web to actualy use shortrange dps weapons (be it blasters, pulses, autocannnons) why torps should be any differ ?
Aarin Wrath Caldari Quatidion Arkai Confederation	Posted - 2009.04.12 14:20:00 - [14] Originally by: Amberle Vale Problem not solved: - You should not have to web a battleship to hit it for full damage with another battleship. - You should not be required to have a support gang to hit a battleship for full damage with another battleship. This is not some elite frig going 5km/s. So your saying my Rail Guns should be able to hit another BS for full damage even if it is moving too fast for my guns to track? Sorry but your logic is flawed.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.04.12 15:12:00 - [15] Edited by: Gypsio III on 12/04/2009 15:14:08 Originally by: Amberle Vale lol 1. Train TNP. Your torps will then have explovel 133 m/s. Problem disappears. 2. lolafterburner. No problem to disappear. 3. lol BS 1v1. Meaningless.
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.12 15:28:00 - [16] Edited by: Amberle Vale on 12/04/2009 15:28:28 Originally by: Aarin Wrath Originally by: Amberle Vale Problem not solved: - You should not have to web a battleship to hit it for full damage with another battleship. - You should not be required to have a support gang to hit a battleship for full damage with another battleship. This is not some elite frig going 5km/s. So your saying my Rail Guns should be able to hit another BS for full damage even if it is moving too fast for my guns to track? Sorry but your logic is flawed. From the perspective of a pure missile user, I really can't comment on your rail guns, or the previous players blasters, or <insert weapon type> . However, if a battleship can reach velocities too great for your battleship-class weapons to track him, then there's a problem. Application of small ship mechanics to larger ship mechanics, it shouldn't be some linear transition where small ships can speed-tank light missiles, therefore battleships can speed tank torpedos, and capitals can speed tank citadel torpedos. Doesn't work, looks ridiculous in practice. CCP said in their QR patch notes that missiles will give full damage to targets "one class up." Does that mean that light missiles are meant for cruisers, heavy missiles are meant for battleships, and torpedos are meant for capitals. I haven't seen those setups on battleclinic.
rofflesausage	Posted - 2009.04.12 18:01:00 - [17] Originally by: cyno here Then fit a web instead TP, problem solved. Try flying blaster ship w/o web on target and then complain that "ohgod i can't just omgwtfpwn, i have to web em to deal 100% dmg". And yes, citadels got dmg lowered against capitals that are not webbed, just like bs sized torps against bs. You should check things like that before posting coz you look silly right now. But webs are designed for primarily for blaster / rail boats in the same way a TP was primarily designed for missile users. By suggesting that missile / torp users use webs, you're doing nothing but proving that TP's / torp damage is broken.
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2009.04.12 18:47:00 - [18] Originally by: Amberle Vale CCP said in their QR patch notes that missiles will give full damage to targets "one class up." Does that mean that light missiles are meant for cruisers, heavy missiles are meant for battleships, and torpedos are meant for capitals. I haven't seen those setups on battleclinic. This is exactly the point I tried making earlier, by downgrading weapon size you maximize damage on your "target ship class" without (in most cases) having to use another module. Afterburners are meant to be used as a limited counter to missiles, downgrading allows you to counter the counter. You see the same trend on Amarr BS where you almost always have use to DHP if going up against close range Blaster(non-neutron)/AC BS to make sure tracking works (No, MegaPulse cannot track another BS inside 1-2km). Please remember the distinction between guided and unguided missiles. ALL the unguided missiles (Rocket, HAM, Torpedo) require Web/TP to get close to their potential against their "target ship class". If the Abaddon fits an AB then he has effectively countered your Torpedoes .. MWD on top of him, apply web and neut and laugh as he gets spammed with missed messages while you pound him to dust. Think of the AB as a cap intensive TD to counter missiles.
Sagittarius Voidsoul Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.12 23:18:00 - [19] Edited by: Sagittarius Voidsoul on 12/04/2009 23:22:42 Originally by: cyno here Also wtb 160KM/s baddon. When did a 160km/s abbadon get mentioned? I merely meant 160km distance away from the abbadon, which would allow the ship to warp to the abbadon allowing the ship to web and scramble it's opponent. Originally by: rofflesausage But webs are designed for primarily for blaster / rail boats in the same way a TP was primarily designed for missile users. By suggesting that missile / torp users use webs, you're doing nothing but proving that TP's / torp damage is broken. Missile damage is also affected by the target's velocity,a web would slow them to a crawl thus increasing damage,more so with a target painter. I don't disagree with your statement however. ------------------------------------------------ "Memento Mori" Remember you are mortal.
Vrabac Zawa's Fan Club	Posted - 2009.04.13 00:31:00 - [20] Target navigation prediction lvl3 is awesome.
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.13 00:57:00 - [21] Edited by: Amberle Vale on 13/04/2009 01:06:31 edit: not worth much
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.13 01:01:00 - [22] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida This is exactly the point I tried making earlier, by downgrading weapon size you maximize damage on your "target ship class" without (in most cases) having to use another module. Afterburners are meant to be used as a limited counter to missiles, downgrading allows you to counter the counter. In this case, what's the merit of flying a raven over a drake?
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2009.04.13 08:55:00 - [23] Originally by: Amberle Vale In this case, what's the merit of flying a raven over a drake? Are you actually trying to troll? If so please take it upstairs to the General forum. Drake has less tank, less damage, less range and less spare slots compared to Raven. Cruise missile Raven gives you up to 500dps at ALL ranges (0-250km) and has lots of room for utility modules like Neuts, RR etc. Eve is about choice and requires us to think before going into combat, there is no iWin button anymore.
Suitonia Gallente interimo	Posted - 2009.04.13 09:01:00 - [24] I wish I could do Blaster DPS @ <28km Optimal without having to be in a gang, or sacrifice my own tank too. The Raven is a gang ship.
Lee Dalton Amarr THE FINAL STAND	Posted - 2009.04.13 10:06:00 - [25] Train all your missile support skills to a minimum of 4 and try again. *** It doesn't matter how many killmails you have. You're only as good as your last fight.
Nova Fox Gallente Novafox Shipyards	Posted - 2009.04.13 10:34:00 - [26] Fly a stealth bomber they get a bonus for hitting 'fast' battleships. Pre-order your Sisters of ≡v≡ Exploration ship today, Updated 6Apr09
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.13 13:08:00 - [27] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Originally by: Amberle Vale In this case, what's the merit of flying a raven over a drake? Are you actually trying to troll? If so please take it upstairs to the General forum. You're in my thread, not the other way around. Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Drake has less tank, less damage, less range and less spare slots compared to Raven. Cruise missile Raven gives you up to 500dps at ALL ranges (0-250km) and has lots of room for utility modules like Neuts, RR etc. A class-down from a battleship class weapon is a cruiser class weapon, cruise missiles do not qualify and yes, they suffer the same affliction we see in torpedos. Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Eve is about choice and requires us to think before going into combat, there is no iWin button anymore. That must be forum-speak. All that aside, an average-skilled torpedo pilot is losing almost half his damage to a monstrously large target in his class-range, with a target painter. Not sure how folks have been led to accept this nonsense, we are seeing situations in this game analogous to a Nimitz class aircraft carrier "speed tanking" skimmer missiles. I'm just not feeling the BS-as-interceptor thought process that's perpetuating itself around here.
Amberle Vale	Posted - 2009.04.13 13:12:00 - [28] Originally by: Tarron Sarek Erm.. so fitting an AB has some positive affect? And improving the missile skills actually does have quite some effect? That might be intended features.. Apart from that, people still tend to fit MWD or no propulsion module in most PvP situations. Would you mind adding the results for an MWD fitted Abaddon? Sure, I'm going to keep updating the first post as my skills improve, with torps and cruise. With my admittedly moderate skills I should still be seeing 60% of the bonuses applied to my T1 torps.
rofflesausage	Posted - 2009.04.14 02:55:00 - [29] Originally by: Sagittarius Voidsoul Missile damage is also affected by the target's velocity,a web would slow them to a crawl thus increasing damage,more so with a target painter. I don't disagree with your statement however. Absolutely. They just don't see the irony in the module (TP) not doing it's designed job. Lets not even get into the fact that TPs and Webs eat into the Caldari ships tank due to being mostly shield based. To be fair I'm trying to think of ideas of how it could be changed and I'm struggling. The first thing that comes to mind is that a TP should also reduce the factor of the targets speed by X percent in addition to sig radius, but this is going to be very difficult to balance. This should however be limited to the person that has the TP and not the fleet. It would have the effect of webbing in terms of damage, but without the slowdown on the other ship meaning they can still manoeuvre and get away / keep in range. Perhaps the TP could be scripted to change between them, with a script being available that's midway between the two shrug I don't envy the EvE devs
Zibu 81 ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.14 06:04:00 - [30] Edited by: Zibu 81 on 14/04/2009 06:08:19 Just one small question: How much DPS was said Abbadon (with similar lvl 3 skills) doing to AB Raven orbiting it at a 5-10km orbit compared to the stationary Raven? Edit: Also how much damage were following ships: Tempest (with T1 ammo so no barrage) Hyperion (also with T1 ammo) Rokh (same as above) doing to a Raven AB'ing at 20 KM with only 1 damage mod (after all those ships are armor tanking and can't sacrifice low slots for damage over tank). Once you answer those questions you'll see that it's quite fair for Raven to lose some DPS to moving ships.
CrestoftheStars Caldari Eternum Pariah	Posted - 2009.04.14 12:15:00 - [31] Originally by: Balashler Did you fight outside of a deadspace pocket? If so you can fly out to 160km or so with a microwarp drive(or afterburner if scrambled), warp to the abbadon then use a web or two. Would that have an effect on such a battle? did you ever pvp? how the f will you warp too him?. can't be done without having a cov up at him or being in his fleet. ___________________________________________ Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of himself without that law is both. For a wounded
CrestoftheStars Caldari Eternum Pariah	Posted - 2009.04.14 12:22:00 - [32] Originally by: Amberle Vale Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Missiles were balanced to deal full damage on stationary targets of the appropriate size. Once a target starts moving damage is reduced and you have to slow the ship (web), make target larger (paint) or use a smaller missile (cruise). This is as intended. Sure, I read the dev blogs. It also makes perfect sense when you're talking about small, fast ships. CCP needs to revisit the mechanic for huge, slow ships, of the should-be-impossible-to-speed-tank variety. hmm i think they need to review the dmg on all the missiles. fair enough that they don't give their max dmg without ew's and support, this is just like turrets (although other factors being importent here), but then the base dmg needs too be higher, the same as turrets, all missiles needs that boost (or at least all except torps and hm, maybe even these needs either the boost or to give their potential dps on ships same sized ___________________________________________ Whoever appeals to the law against his fellow man is either a fool or a coward. Whoever cannot take care of himself without that law is both. For a wounded
Sagittarius Voidsoul Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.15 02:42:00 - [33] Edited by: Sagittarius Voidsoul on 15/04/2009 02:44:36 Originally by: CrestoftheStars Originally by: Balashler Did you fight outside of a deadspace pocket? If so you can fly out to 160km or so with a microwarp drive(or afterburner if scrambled), warp to the abbadon then use a web or two. Would that have an effect on such a battle? did you ever pvp? how the f will you warp too him?. can't be done without having a cov up at him or being in his fleet. That statement was made with the assumption that you can visually see the opponent,i.e. you are right in front of him. You can click the Warp to 0 icon once you fly out to a distance of 160km or so, which will cause you to warp right next to him. It can be done if you are faster then the ship being fought whether it's done with a naturally faster ship,afterburner or MWB. Unless CCP took out the Warp to 0km option when pvping another player that's what can happen. ------------------------------------------------ "Memento Mori" Remember you are mortal.
FOl2TY8 Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2009.04.15 02:59:00 - [34] Screen shots are not necessary because you can't warp to anybody that is not in your fleet. Also I'm agreeing with the other guys that are recommending training your missile skills up and then report back. ---------- This post brought to you by the worst PVP'er in Eve
Sagittarius Voidsoul Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.15 03:40:00 - [35] Edited by: Sagittarius Voidsoul on 15/04/2009 03:41:03 Originally by: FOl2TY8 Screen shots are not necessary because you can't warp to anybody that is not in your fleet. Also I'm agreeing with the other guys that are recommending training your missile skills up and then report back. I see, I was unaware of that, my apologies. ------------------------------------------------ "Memento Mori" Remember you are mortal.

Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.