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Should this be tolerated?

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BlackDragonShadow Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.20 04:48:00 - [1] Car companies can shut down your car if you don't make payments on it. That seems wrong to me. Especially if your work is far away and you have no means to get to it other than your car. What do you think? Touched by his noodly appendage. Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster
Super Whopper I can Has Cheeseburger	Posted - 2009.04.20 04:54:00 - [2] Do you think giving greedy companies with links to governments money for speculating on the markets to pay debts and employees and find out that the money has been used to pay for holidays and super bonusses? Welcome to corporate slavery.
Jacob Mei	Posted - 2009.04.20 05:24:00 - [3] I think no one will buy a brand new 2009 vehicle or be buying from a dealer who thinks this is a bad idea to the point that they want no part in it. I also will not be surprised if a black market situation emerges in which mechanics offer their services to disable these devices. As for the ethical nature.... dont sign a contract if you cant uphold your end of the bargin. -------------------------------- To borrow a phrase: Players who post are like stars, there are bright ones and those who are dim.
Bullageddon Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.20 06:01:00 - [4] Originally by: BlackDragonShadow Car companies can shut down your car if you don't make payments on it. That seems wrong to me. Especially if your work is far away and you have no means to get to it other than your car. What do you think? Pay your damn bill.. end of story. === This Space For Lease or Sale.
Gone'Postal Void Engineers	Posted - 2009.04.20 06:27:00 - [5] Don't drive something you can't afford Originally by: masternerdguy Officer mods arent spread out because the bpos are innacesible to 99% of eve.
Roymundo Caldari Manhattan Project Inc Sylph Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.20 06:31:00 - [6] Originally by: BlackDragonShadow Car companies can shut down your car if you don't make payments on it. That seems wrong to me. Especially if your work is far away and you have no means to get to it other than your car. What do you think? it's your own choice to go out and take a car loan you couldn't afford. your own fault really. if i lent my money to someone so they could buy something, and they stopped paying me back, they have no more rights to the remaining cash or the item bought with it. you owe me. period.
goodby4u Valor Inc.	Posted - 2009.04.20 07:07:00 - [7] If you dont like it stop buying new cars, simply buy old models. Tbh I am a bigger fan of older cars simply because they tend to be easier to work on, and they work fine aslong as you dont want a supercomputer onboard..... Now I will have a problem when they tell me I have to put that **** on in order to pass inspection or otherwise.... I dont care how one would rationalise such an action its my car and you cant tell me to put a"off button for police"on the damn thing.
Sanguis Sanies Amarr	Posted - 2009.04.20 07:16:00 - [8] In breaking news banks can reposes your house if you stop paying the mortgage When you take out a loan you need to have collateral, which will become property of the lender if the lendee cannot pay. depending on the type of collateral depends on the interest rate you get, houses (which historically always go up and are worth a lot of money) get the lowest interest rates, cars (which historically go down in value and are commonly destroyed by bad drivers, resulting in a loss of collateral) get a higher interest rate, and unsecured loans (with no collateral and massive risk) get the highest interest. The other thing you need to take into account is that until the debt (loan) is repaid in full the collateral (i.e. your car) is *NOT YOUR PROPERTY*
Reven Cordelle Caldari Yamainu-Mirai Heavy Industries	Posted - 2009.04.20 09:13:00 - [9] Originally by: goodby4u If you dont like it stop buying new cars, simply buy old models. Tbh I am a bigger fan of older cars simply because they tend to be easier to work on, and they work fine aslong as you dont want a supercomputer onboard..... Now I will have a problem when they tell me I have to put that **** on in order to pass inspection or otherwise.... I dont care how one would rationalise such an action its my car and you cant tell me to put a "off button for police" on the damn thing. This. Pop the hood on a new car and what are you presented with? A few caps for Oil and Water - and a huge plastic cover hiding everything else away. All governed by a little computer box somewhere in the car. Great.. until it goes wrong. Example - A short while ago some of the fuel in this area was contaminated with excess Silicone. Modern cars couldn't run on it - their sensors just bugged out. Older cars chewed up the fuel like they always did. Pop the hood on a '69 Chevelle and its all there, eager for your delicate tweaks to the Holley 4 Barrel Carb. Idling too fast? Tweak it down. Cam not rowdy enough? Rip it out and stick a slightly more radical one in there. Hell, on those old lumps you could do it in a weekend. Everything is obvious. Modern cars are indeed "Fly-by-wire". Nothing is directly connected. Hell, the steering rarely is. It'll only take an error with the onboard computer and all of a sudden the throttle is wide open and the car is busting through traffic with no brake pressure. No thanks. I'd rather be at least.. attached.. to the car. In the UK we're experimenting with "Pay as you go Insurance". Good idea right? Well, until they put this little GPS Tracking Box in your car and can log the speed you've been doing. Break the speed limit by more than 10% and crash? Oh, not covered. You were speeding. Safe to say, these PAYG insurance policies are NOT selling well.
Onus Mian Amarr Kingfisher Industries	Posted - 2009.04.20 09:15:00 - [10] If you're not living up to your side of the bargain then why should you still be able to use the item you were given on the understanding that you would pay for it? Show a bit of personal responsibility. ---- Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too? - Douglas Adams
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.04.20 10:00:00 - [11] Originally by: Bullageddon Originally by: BlackDragonShadow Car companies can shut down your car if you don't make payments on it. That seems wrong to me. Especially if your work is far away and you have no means to get to it other than your car. What do you think? Pay your damn bill.. end of story. Luckily, finance companies never make mistakes!
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2009.04.20 11:00:00 - [12] Edited by: Blane Xero on 20/04/2009 11:00:41 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Bullageddon Originally by: BlackDragonShadow Car companies can shut down your car if you don't make payments on it. That seems wrong to me. Especially if your work is far away and you have no means to get to it other than your car. What do you think? Pay your damn bill.. end of story. Luckily, finance companies never make mistakes! And should they ever make a mistake, you certainly wont have to go through months of paperwork to sort it, and you wont just get a written apology. Oh no sir. Eve's petitions at least get an answer, it can take months for an IRL petition to reach its verdict tbh. ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
TraininVain	Posted - 2009.04.20 11:22:00 - [13] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Bullageddon Originally by: BlackDragonShadow Car companies can shut down your car if you don't make payments on it. That seems wrong to me. Especially if your work is far away and you have no means to get to it other than your car. What do you think? Pay your damn bill.. end of story. Luckily, finance companies never make mistakes! And thankfully the economy is a well oiled machine (especially when the gubmint don't interfere with regulation and red tape. INVISIBLE HAND) that runs perfectly smoothly all the time so it's entirely possible to know well in advance if you'll have trouble paying a loan off with your perfectly stable employment. Aren't jobs for life great?
Abrazzar	Posted - 2009.04.20 12:06:00 - [14] Next step: Banks can forcibly remove non-vital organs as a down payment if you run behind in your rates. Also your children can be sold to slavery as can your wife and you yourself. Accept your shackles and wear them with pride. -------- Ideas for: Mining
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2009.04.20 12:23:00 - [15] Originally by: Abrazzar as can your wife and you yourself. Thats called marriage and there's nothing illegal bout it so long as you only have one marriage at any time ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Brea Lafail	Posted - 2009.04.20 12:58:00 - [16] Originally by: Onus Mian If you're not living up to your side of the bargain then why should you still be able to use the item you were given on the understanding that you would pay for it? Show a bit of personal responsibility. Article isn't about defaulting on the loan and having the car repossessed, it's about people being late on a payment and the car shuts off, no matter if you're in the middle of nowhere on your way to a business meeting so you can pay your late car loan. Hindering one's ability to work is a terrible way to get them to pay you. Also, I think there's going to be some lawsuits out of this. In before Ralara.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.04.20 13:21:00 - [17] Originally by: Brea Lafail Originally by: Onus Mian If you're not living up to your side of the bargain then why should you still be able to use the item you were given on the understanding that you would pay for it? Show a bit of personal responsibility. Article isn't about defaulting on the loan and having the car repossessed, it's about people being late on a payment and the car shuts off, no matter if you're in the middle of nowhere on your way to a business meeting so you can pay your late car loan. Hindering one's ability to work is a terrible way to get them to pay you. Also, I think there's going to be some lawsuits out of this. Car driving through mountains is stopped due to finance company error Good-looking daughter of wrongly accused debtor dies of cold as a result Finance company sued for approximately 1 jillion dollars....
Dirk Magnum Royal Hiigaran Navy SCUM.	Posted - 2009.04.20 13:33:00 - [18] Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 20/04/2009 13:38:06 Malcanis pretty much said it. As soon as one person gets in an accident because of these things I hope there's a massive public outcry. Even if you have to sign some kind of disclaimer when you get the car that the car company isn't responsible for what happens to you after they shut your vehicle off then some new government regulations preventing such disclaimers could easily fix the issue and prevent any more pointless deaths/injuries. I mean at some point a human factor has to come into play in business decisions if we want to retain our humanity, and I don't think I speak with hyperbole here. Pretty much all of us living in the West live in a post-self-reliance society. We rely on organized business to produce essentially everything we employ in order to survive. Completely unregulated free market business models are only as ethical as the people behind them, and the people behind them are usually only interested in the bottom line. They're the same people who shut off the heat in winter to apartments where the elderly occupants failed to make one energy bill payment. The question is how willing are we to allow this sort of thing to happen in the name of personal responsibility? What is a reasonable extent to which people should be punished for not having the money to afford the essentials - food, heat/cooling, transportation, and communication in the modern world?
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2009.04.20 13:35:00 - [19] Edited by: Blane Xero on 20/04/2009 13:35:30 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Brea Lafail Originally by: Onus Mian If you're not living up to your side of the bargain then why should you still be able to use the item you were given on the understanding that you would pay for it? Show a bit of personal responsibility. Article isn't about defaulting on the loan and having the car repossessed, it's about people being late on a payment and the car shuts off, no matter if you're in the middle of nowhere on your way to a business meeting so you can pay your late car loan. Hindering one's ability to work is a terrible way to get them to pay you. Also, I think there's going to be some lawsuits out of this. Car driving through mountains is stopped due to finance company error Good-looking daughter of wrongly accused debtor dies of cold as a result Finance company sued for approximately 1 jillion dollars.... Going along on a busy motorway at 65~mph, Car cuts out. 20-30 cars pile up in a trainwreck, car company goes bust to all the compensation claims. ______________________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008
Bullageddon Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.20 13:43:00 - [20] Originally by: Blane Xero Edited by: Blane Xero on 20/04/2009 13:35:30 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Brea Lafail Originally by: Onus Mian If you're not living up to your side of the bargain then why should you still be able to use the item you were given on the understanding that you would pay for it? Show a bit of personal responsibility. Article isn't about defaulting on the loan and having the car repossessed, it's about people being late on a payment and the car shuts off, no matter if you're in the middle of nowhere on your way to a business meeting so you can pay your late car loan. Hindering one's ability to work is a terrible way to get them to pay you. Also, I think there's going to be some lawsuits out of this. Car driving through mountains is stopped due to finance company error Good-looking daughter of wrongly accused debtor dies of cold as a result Finance company sued for approximately 1 jillion dollars.... Going along on a busy motorway at 65~mph, Car cuts out. 20-30 cars pile up in a trainwreck, car company goes bust to all the compensation claims. You do realize that these things are already in use, right? (read the article again) That's not how they work. === This Space For Lease or Sale.
Dirk Magnum Royal Hiigaran Navy SCUM.	Posted - 2009.04.20 13:44:00 - [21] Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 20/04/2009 13:46:36 meant to edit previous post not post a new one
Jacob Mei	Posted - 2009.04.20 13:45:00 - [22] Originally by: Blane Xero Originally by: Abrazzar as can your wife and you yourself. Thats called marriage and there's nothing illegal bout it so long as you only have one marriage at any time And only if you get found out to have multiple marriage partners as is the case in a certain part of the US. -------------------------------- To borrow a phrase: Players who post are like stars, there are bright ones and those who are dim.
Micheal Dietrich Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.20 15:27:00 - [23] As opposed to Repo men hijacking your vehicle at 2 am in the morning right?
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.04.20 18:58:00 - [24] Originally by: Micheal Dietrich As opposed to Repo men hijacking your vehicle at 2 am in the morning right? The life of a repo man is always intense
Micheal Dietrich Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.20 19:30:00 - [25] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Micheal Dietrich As opposed to Repo men hijacking your vehicle at 2 am in the morning right? The life of a repo man is always intense Yeah the only thing this really does is cut the repo man out of a paycheck with the newer vehicles. Sucks since they made it easier for repo men when they started putting a GPS in each vehicle.
Bullageddon Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.20 20:05:00 - [26] Originally by: Micheal Dietrich As opposed to Repo men hijacking your vehicle at 2 am in the morning right? If a repoman is taking your vehicle at 2am without your permission, that's grand theft auto. So.. it must not be your vehicle. === This Space For Lease or Sale.
Jago Kain Amarr Ramm's RDI	Posted - 2009.04.20 20:26:00 - [27] If you tolerate this, then your moped will be next. ___________________________________________________ The game will never be over, because we're keeping the meme alive.
Micheal Dietrich Caldari	Posted - 2009.04.20 20:30:00 - [28] Originally by: Bullageddon Originally by: Micheal Dietrich As opposed to Repo men hijacking your vehicle at 2 am in the morning right? If a repoman is taking your vehicle at 2am without your permission, that's grand theft auto. So.. it must not be your vehicle. Something tells me you misunderstood my statement. I was pointing out that the car company shutting your vehicle down remotely due to late payments is no different than repo men taking your vehicle now, except that your car now turns into a 2000 lbs roadblock in your driveway meaning the OP's wanting to raise a red flag is truly no different than what occurs now.
Xen Gin Solar Excavations Ultd. Black Sun Alliance	Posted - 2009.04.20 20:39:00 - [29] Originally by: Jago Kain If you tolerate this, then your moped will be next. I see what you did there!
Hesod Adee Dark-Rising	Posted - 2009.04.20 21:24:00 - [30] I can see some problems with this device: 1 - If someone makes a mistake, or has a grudge against you, your car could be shut down even though your payments are up to date. Then you lose your job because you were late to work and can't afford your next payment. 2 - If your car is shut down at the wrong time, there will be traffic accidents because of it. How long until this gets someone killed ? Sure, they say it won't shut down your car if the care is moving. But things can break. 3 - What happens if the device can't receive the signal from base ? If it stops the car, then you had better avoid parking in places with low signal reception. If it doesn't stop the car, then you can stop it disabling your car by blocking the signal. I'd suggest wrapping the receiver in tinfoil to get yourself a Faraday cage. 4 - How do they stop people hacking the system and shutting down cars because they feel like it ? 5 - Why can't those people with credit issues just buy a cheaper car ?

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