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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 02:50:00 -
[1]
Dont know bout the rest of you but it'll be a sad thing if POS show up in empire space
I'm assume they can only be deployed in sectors with no npc stations and possible a sec rating of lower than 0.4 , me hoping they can only be deployed in 0.0.
we might finally see a max exodus of players into 0.0 space wanting to stake thier claim, which would be hella fun since EVE would erupt into a huge turf war  .
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 02:50:00 -
[2]
Dont know bout the rest of you but it'll be a sad thing if POS show up in empire space
I'm assume they can only be deployed in sectors with no npc stations and possible a sec rating of lower than 0.4 , me hoping they can only be deployed in 0.0.
we might finally see a max exodus of players into 0.0 space wanting to stake thier claim, which would be hella fun since EVE would erupt into a huge turf war .
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Seto Mazzarotto
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Posted - 2004.08.31 04:18:00 -
[3]
Well, I sincerely doubt they'd allow them to be built in Yulai.
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Fighting for the ideals of freespace, posthuman ethics, and rock & roll. |
Seto Mazzarotto
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Posted - 2004.08.31 04:18:00 -
[4]
Well, I sincerely doubt they'd allow them to be built in Yulai.
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Fighting for the ideals of freespace, posthuman ethics, and rock & roll. |
Siddy
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Posted - 2004.08.31 04:53:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Siddy on 31/08/2004 04:54:43
only deployable in 0.0 (not empire)
its because they are elegal at some part - for example the poluting factorys
and no - hardcore pasifist carebear CAN youse them, its only question abaut can he defend them ? 
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Siddy
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Posted - 2004.08.31 04:53:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Siddy on 31/08/2004 04:54:43
only deployable in 0.0 (not empire)
its because they are elegal at some part - for example the poluting factorys
and no - hardcore pasifist carebear CAN youse them, its only question abaut can he defend them ?
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:08:00 -
[7]
nice just what i was hoping for, 0.0 mayhem
wonder if any of the carebear will have the balls to ask that POS can be built in empire.
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:08:00 -
[8]
nice just what i was hoping for, 0.0 mayhem
wonder if any of the carebear will have the balls to ask that POS can be built in empire.
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Kel Shek
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:20:00 -
[9]
of course, deprive those who don't want to be greifed, of some really cool big chunks of the game, 
now come on. theres no reason to keep POS out of .4-.1
now, I can see the reasoning in not wanting it in .5+... but I'm not entirely sure I agree.
I think maybe something relating to the faction standing of the owner/builder, should matter. like say... if for construction, you have -1.0 standing with that faction, you can't build it in their space at all. if you have say... 4.0+ standing you can build in .5... if you have 5+ standing you can build in .6... ect, or something. maybe only apply that for .5-.7, and leave .8+ POS free, or requiring 9.5 standing or something. (and have heavy pentaltys if the owner (if transferred after construction) does not have high enough standing for that structure to be in that space.
I would not expect, and would not WANT them to be able to be built in .9 or 1.0, without some HUGE prereqs... extremely high standing, it have extra costs... and extra risks, ect.
I think it should be able to be built in low sec empire, maybe with some limitations though, that you can only have X modules, where you could build a setup with everything in 0.0.
high sec empire... I'm not sure there would be much point, even if it could. but I think it should be possible. low sec empire, I expect it will be possible, and arguably worthwhile.
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
Kel Shek
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:20:00 -
[10]
of course, deprive those who don't want to be greifed, of some really cool big chunks of the game,
now come on. theres no reason to keep POS out of .4-.1
now, I can see the reasoning in not wanting it in .5+... but I'm not entirely sure I agree.
I think maybe something relating to the faction standing of the owner/builder, should matter. like say... if for construction, you have -1.0 standing with that faction, you can't build it in their space at all. if you have say... 4.0+ standing you can build in .5... if you have 5+ standing you can build in .6... ect, or something. maybe only apply that for .5-.7, and leave .8+ POS free, or requiring 9.5 standing or something. (and have heavy pentaltys if the owner (if transferred after construction) does not have high enough standing for that structure to be in that space.
I would not expect, and would not WANT them to be able to be built in .9 or 1.0, without some HUGE prereqs... extremely high standing, it have extra costs... and extra risks, ect.
I think it should be able to be built in low sec empire, maybe with some limitations though, that you can only have X modules, where you could build a setup with everything in 0.0.
high sec empire... I'm not sure there would be much point, even if it could. but I think it should be possible. low sec empire, I expect it will be possible, and arguably worthwhile.
~~~~~
To see a World in a Grain of Sand
And Heaven in a Wild Flower
Hold Infinity in the palm of your hand
And Eternity in an hour
~~William Blake |
Qutsemnie
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:32:00 -
[11]
declare war?
Nothing safe about empire space if there is something valuable there to fight over. Right now empire space has nothing to fight over. Corp wars are arguably a stupid underutilized poorly conceptualized feature.
Putting stuff of value in empire space then consolidating corps into alliances and making it cheap to declare war doesnt feed the "carebear" it turns the game into one big corporate armegedon.
Without valuable stuff in empire space corp war is just a footnote to the stuff in 0.0 and underutilized as a dynamic feature.
Your picturing a "carebear" putting a station on a good moon in empire and getting low risk gain. However have you thought how they are going to hold such a station when its got their name on it and we assumed for argument its valuable?
Thats a bullseye.
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Qutsemnie
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:32:00 -
[12]
declare war?
Nothing safe about empire space if there is something valuable there to fight over. Right now empire space has nothing to fight over. Corp wars are arguably a stupid underutilized poorly conceptualized feature.
Putting stuff of value in empire space then consolidating corps into alliances and making it cheap to declare war doesnt feed the "carebear" it turns the game into one big corporate armegedon.
Without valuable stuff in empire space corp war is just a footnote to the stuff in 0.0 and underutilized as a dynamic feature.
Your picturing a "carebear" putting a station on a good moon in empire and getting low risk gain. However have you thought how they are going to hold such a station when its got their name on it and we assumed for argument its valuable?
Thats a bullseye.
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Directive
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:42:00 -
[13]
Sure, let them put POS in high sec - just increase the maintenance to 10x for 1.0, 9x for 0.9 and so on 
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Directive
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:42:00 -
[14]
Sure, let them put POS in high sec - just increase the maintenance to 10x for 1.0, 9x for 0.9 and so on
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:45:00 -
[15]
Game cant afford to ahve stations in system above 0.0
why stations provide you with a source of income from the moon its attached to.
having them in secure space means that corps now have cash cows invunerbale to attack, as if high sec mining was enough of a cash cow already.
as quoted in the shiva pages its about "the territory, not the structures" player onwed structures are a means for corps to stake thier claim in unreglated space not to cramp up npc colonised systems (why again would an npc corp let u build in there system just becuse they like you ?)
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:45:00 -
[16]
Game cant afford to ahve stations in system above 0.0
why stations provide you with a source of income from the moon its attached to.
having them in secure space means that corps now have cash cows invunerbale to attack, as if high sec mining was enough of a cash cow already.
as quoted in the shiva pages its about "the territory, not the structures" player onwed structures are a means for corps to stake thier claim in unreglated space not to cramp up npc colonised systems (why again would an npc corp let u build in there system just becuse they like you ?)
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TheNecromancer
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:49:00 -
[17]
All I see here..is pirates just wishing for players to enter 0.4-
I really hope there will be no restriction where these think can be deployed. I do agree that maybe the best moons should be in 0.0..but no restriction please.
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TheNecromancer
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:49:00 -
[18]
All I see here..is pirates just wishing for players to enter 0.4-
I really hope there will be no restriction where these think can be deployed. I do agree that maybe the best moons should be in 0.0..but no restriction please.
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:50:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Phasics on 31/08/2004 05:54:58
I'm also reluctant to put faith in the new war/alliance system till I see it
if all is good then EVE can happily implode into a gant free for all with pirate corps comming into hi sec space to war and take the nice new stations the carebears are building .
come to think of it this could acutally end the benefits of high sec space which menas any corp that wants to build a station is basically condemming itself to a life of 0.0 since the have-nots will attack them purly to capture their stations.
hehehe hrmmm mabe we should let u guys build in 1.0 space , so we can come and scoop the station out from under you once there complete heheheh.
Funny thing is I'm not even a pirate , but war is so good for driving an economy and guess who gets rich ..... the producers 
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:50:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Phasics on 31/08/2004 05:54:58
I'm also reluctant to put faith in the new war/alliance system till I see it
if all is good then EVE can happily implode into a gant free for all with pirate corps comming into hi sec space to war and take the nice new stations the carebears are building .
come to think of it this could acutally end the benefits of high sec space which menas any corp that wants to build a station is basically condemming itself to a life of 0.0 since the have-nots will attack them purly to capture their stations.
hehehe hrmmm mabe we should let u guys build in 1.0 space , so we can come and scoop the station out from under you once there complete heheheh.
Funny thing is I'm not even a pirate , but war is so good for driving an economy and guess who gets rich ..... the producers
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Qutsemnie
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:52:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Qutsemnie on 31/08/2004 05:55:12
invulnerable to attack?
You guys actually picture someone holding a yulai station without violent daily conflicts? You do realize your corp name is on the station right?
If thats your theory more power to ya. I hope you get a yulai station then report back on how nobody ever trys to take it away from ya =0 Im ya right.
I predict that if your allowed to take a valuable yulai moon base 10 corps will declare war on you within the first 24 hours. Any takers on that bet? Still think this will be risk free income?
In general if you want to bust up the carebear mindset dont turn empire into a desert. That just makes it so nobody fights there and the carebear corp never gets into a conflict. Put alot of resources in empire. Corp wars will have an objective and get utilized. The more corp wars there are in empire the more carebears are intruduced incidently to combat at their corps try their hand at holding bases.
Trust me. A yulai moonbase will be the antithesis to "risk free income". Heck they would kill you for your research slot in yulai if they could. Let alone an entire moon base.
Note: THATS WITHOUT CHANGES TO THE WAR SYSTEM.
Seriously. War system as it is now. Picture your corp putting a flag on a player ownable in yulai. Are you seriously believing it wont be the biggest source of conflict in your average day including your 0.0 systems?
You will not hold yulai unless you are a corp that can brawl.
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Qutsemnie
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:52:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Qutsemnie on 31/08/2004 05:55:12
invulnerable to attack?
You guys actually picture someone holding a yulai station without violent daily conflicts? You do realize your corp name is on the station right?
If thats your theory more power to ya. I hope you get a yulai station then report back on how nobody ever trys to take it away from ya =0 Im ya right.
I predict that if your allowed to take a valuable yulai moon base 10 corps will declare war on you within the first 24 hours. Any takers on that bet? Still think this will be risk free income?
In general if you want to bust up the carebear mindset dont turn empire into a desert. That just makes it so nobody fights there and the carebear corp never gets into a conflict. Put alot of resources in empire. Corp wars will have an objective and get utilized. The more corp wars there are in empire the more carebears are intruduced incidently to combat at their corps try their hand at holding bases.
Trust me. A yulai moonbase will be the antithesis to "risk free income". Heck they would kill you for your research slot in yulai if they could. Let alone an entire moon base.
Note: THATS WITHOUT CHANGES TO THE WAR SYSTEM.
Seriously. War system as it is now. Picture your corp putting a flag on a player ownable in yulai. Are you seriously believing it wont be the biggest source of conflict in your average day including your 0.0 systems?
You will not hold yulai unless you are a corp that can brawl.
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The Reverend
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:56:00 -
[23]
I believe from reading the Shiva stuff that you can place a station anywhere. The thing you have to remember is that to keep a station running you need to use resources. 0.0 system moons have the richest resources where as above 0.0 moon are poor in resources.
m0ovie links |
The Reverend
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Posted - 2004.08.31 05:56:00 -
[24]
I believe from reading the Shiva stuff that you can place a station anywhere. The thing you have to remember is that to keep a station running you need to use resources. 0.0 system moons have the richest resources where as above 0.0 moon are poor in resources.
m0ovie links |
JP Beauregard
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:08:00 -
[25]
The latest dev interview indicated that POS will be "most profitable when used in 0.0 space".
To my mind, that indicates that they will be less profitable elsewhere. Elsewhere? Not much "else" left but empire space.
There is no reason not to allow them in empire space systems from .4 to .0 (rounded) provided that there are no NPC stations and provided that the cost is higher by a decent factor (not sure if multiplication by system rating +1 isn't too high).
Bottom line: Risk vs. reward is fine. Excluding players from content because of their playing style isn't smart. CCP couldn't be that dumb. Not even CCP 
JP Beauregard
=== The Pilkington Guides to EVE === |
JP Beauregard
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:08:00 -
[26]
The latest dev interview indicated that POS will be "most profitable when used in 0.0 space".
To my mind, that indicates that they will be less profitable elsewhere. Elsewhere? Not much "else" left but empire space.
There is no reason not to allow them in empire space systems from .4 to .0 (rounded) provided that there are no NPC stations and provided that the cost is higher by a decent factor (not sure if multiplication by system rating +1 isn't too high).
Bottom line: Risk vs. reward is fine. Excluding players from content because of their playing style isn't smart. CCP couldn't be that dumb. Not even CCP
JP Beauregard
=== The Pilkington Guides to EVE === |
Watson
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:36:00 -
[27]
One thing I'd like to know is whether or not they will show up in the galactic map if you filter on number of stations. I really hope they don't... otherwise no point to trying to have a secret base |
Watson
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:36:00 -
[28]
One thing I'd like to know is whether or not they will show up in the galactic map if you filter on number of stations. I really hope they don't... otherwise no point to trying to have a secret base |
Anndy
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:53:00 -
[29]
if you read the shiva forum you'll see they said they doubt it will be 0.5-0.7 and prob will be 0.1-0.4 and ofcourse 0.0
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Anndy
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:53:00 -
[30]
if you read the shiva forum you'll see they said they doubt it will be 0.5-0.7 and prob will be 0.1-0.4 and ofcourse 0.0
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:54:00 -
[31]
 Originally by: Watson
One thing I'd like to know is whether or not they will show up in the galactic map if you filter on number of stations. I really hope they don't... otherwise no point to trying to have a secret base
Don't worry pilots in space/docked will give it away anyway
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.08.31 06:54:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Watson
One thing I'd like to know is whether or not they will show up in the galactic map if you filter on number of stations. I really hope they don't... otherwise no point to trying to have a secret base
Don't worry pilots in space/docked will give it away anyway
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Xtro 2
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Posted - 2004.08.31 11:36:00 -
[33]
P.O.S's should be 0.0 only, however this makes them accessible only to large corps/alliances, making joe average/small corp unable to use them, if usable in higher sec, this makes a mockery of the whole idea, esp with the massive sec hits pirates/combatants/alliances would suffer, it woul djust be another move of making everything safe with no risk with all the gains.
__________________________________________
Hell is nothing more than an office with fluorecent lights. |
Xtro 2
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Posted - 2004.08.31 11:36:00 -
[34]
P.O.S's should be 0.0 only, however this makes them accessible only to large corps/alliances, making joe average/small corp unable to use them, if usable in higher sec, this makes a mockery of the whole idea, esp with the massive sec hits pirates/combatants/alliances would suffer, it woul djust be another move of making everything safe with no risk with all the gains.
__________________________________________
Hell is nothing more than an office with fluorecent lights. |
Tharrn
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:01:00 -
[35]
Still going through that 13 pages thread regarding POS, but this is what Oveur said somewhere on page five in June :P
Quote:
At the moment, POS will not be allowed in 1.0-0.8, might get allowed in 0.7-0.5, will likely be allowed in 0.1-0.4 and of course allowed in 0.0
I'll edit if it has changed on page 8-13 :P
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Tharrn
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:01:00 -
[36]
Still going through that 13 pages thread regarding POS, but this is what Oveur said somewhere on page five in June :P
Quote:
At the moment, POS will not be allowed in 1.0-0.8, might get allowed in 0.7-0.5, will likely be allowed in 0.1-0.4 and of course allowed in 0.0
I'll edit if it has changed on page 8-13 :P
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Riddari
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:20:00 -
[37]
There is plenty of low security systems out there without a station, nevermind a refinery station.
I see nothing wrong with players setting up refineries of their own there, the yield is much worse but then the extra skilled refiners become more valuable.
¼©¼
a history |
Riddari
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:20:00 -
[38]
There is plenty of low security systems out there without a station, nevermind a refinery station.
I see nothing wrong with players setting up refineries of their own there, the yield is much worse but then the extra skilled refiners become more valuable.
¼©¼
a history |
Rustbucket
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:29:00 -
[39]
Owning a POS should mean you own the area around the moon or even the system etc, Maybe one Corp/Aliance to one system. Having Empire space Allow POS would mean you own empire space? If someone shoots the POS inside 0.0 do you take a secutiy hit and do concord start attacking you? If a corp manages to take a station will it then be accpted by concord that the new owenership is valid? Maybe you have to be at war to attack a station?
Freedom Confederation
Fighting For Free Space |
Rustbucket
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:29:00 -
[40]
Owning a POS should mean you own the area around the moon or even the system etc, Maybe one Corp/Aliance to one system. Having Empire space Allow POS would mean you own empire space? If someone shoots the POS inside 0.0 do you take a secutiy hit and do concord start attacking you? If a corp manages to take a station will it then be accpted by concord that the new owenership is valid? Maybe you have to be at war to attack a station?
Freedom Confederation
Fighting For Free Space |
Yakoza
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:36:00 -
[41]
If you follow what is said in the Shiva page and what is in the game now the "carebears" will have access to them. I'm sorry but what most PVP players don't understand is that the "carebears" pay the bills. They are just another player like everyone else. Just because you can OMGWTFPWN them doesn't make you a better person or a better player. It's makes you in game at least a viloent psychopath. Then again if you RP that aspect that's cool as well .
At the moment you can only anchor deployables in 0.7 or lower. So logically if you can deploy any item in those security systems. If you read the Shiva page which some of you haven't (sorry but by some of these posts it's painfully obvious) it requires consumables like water, coolant, air, reactor fuel, ect. A good location would supply all of these, simply put you won't find one in higher sec empire that supply all of these.
What will this mean? An empire base will be very small, or very costly. A fringe base however will be extensive an easy to maintain, however will require constant defence. The benifit of having a base in fringe space is that there are not many if any stations and you now hold a refinery, silo, storage locker, and spacedock for your corp only; maby for your allies if you/CCP allow it .
In the end what does it matter if Carebears have POS. It sound more like your trying to subugate a portion of the playerbase and that my friend is called racisim, but that goes both ways. If you want everyone but your crew to be unbeatable I hear there's this card game called "I always win". Besides if carebears are these large defenceless idiots you make them out to be, declare war then take their assets, I mean jeeze.
---------------------------------------------
The opinions posted here are mine, and do not necessarily reflect the goals or opinions of my corperation or affiliates.
"BS > Cruiser | Cruiser > Frigate | Frigate(s) > BS" -Vlad Hazzard
"'You wreck Asteroid (Scordite) for 215 m3 of ore'" -Pandora Panda
"It seems that some people think that by aquiring a battleship they are entitled to some kind of invulnerability-switch -Marc Wiatt |
Yakoza
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:36:00 -
[42]
If you follow what is said in the Shiva page and what is in the game now the "carebears" will have access to them. I'm sorry but what most PVP players don't understand is that the "carebears" pay the bills. They are just another player like everyone else. Just because you can OMGWTFPWN them doesn't make you a better person or a better player. It's makes you in game at least a viloent psychopath. Then again if you RP that aspect that's cool as well .
At the moment you can only anchor deployables in 0.7 or lower. So logically if you can deploy any item in those security systems. If you read the Shiva page which some of you haven't (sorry but by some of these posts it's painfully obvious) it requires consumables like water, coolant, air, reactor fuel, ect. A good location would supply all of these, simply put you won't find one in higher sec empire that supply all of these.
What will this mean? An empire base will be very small, or very costly. A fringe base however will be extensive an easy to maintain, however will require constant defence. The benifit of having a base in fringe space is that there are not many if any stations and you now hold a refinery, silo, storage locker, and spacedock for your corp only; maby for your allies if you/CCP allow it .
In the end what does it matter if Carebears have POS. It sound more like your trying to subugate a portion of the playerbase and that my friend is called racisim, but that goes both ways. If you want everyone but your crew to be unbeatable I hear there's this card game called "I always win". Besides if carebears are these large defenceless idiots you make them out to be, declare war then take their assets, I mean jeeze.
---------------------------------------------
The opinions posted here are mine, and do not necessarily reflect the goals or opinions of my corperation or affiliates.
"BS > Cruiser | Cruiser > Frigate | Frigate(s) > BS" -Vlad Hazzard
"'You wreck Asteroid (Scordite) for 215 m3 of ore'" -Pandora Panda
"It seems that some people think that by aquiring a battleship they are entitled to some kind of invulnerability-switch -Marc Wiatt |
Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:55:00 -
[43]
It seems we have come to a convergence as both sides of the argument acutally want and will get the same thing
POS will prob be built in 0.0-0.7
The really good POS and moons will be hot property and corps will go to war over them be it in 0.7 or lower so the sec hit is no longer a factor for safe high sec bases.
so it seems this discussion has about coe to a close
Carebear will get stations in 0.7 and below but they will still be vunverable to losing them via a war, while the more profitable station 0.0 will be better but can be attacked by any man and his dog.
So the risk vs reward will still hold for POS and perhaps will even make hi sec space a little less safe to thoes that want to utilise the POS
all in all probably a good thing for EVE
Carebear will get to use stations, but at the price of having to defend them against rival corps that declare war
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Phasics
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Posted - 2004.08.31 12:55:00 -
[44]
It seems we have come to a convergence as both sides of the argument acutally want and will get the same thing
POS will prob be built in 0.0-0.7
The really good POS and moons will be hot property and corps will go to war over them be it in 0.7 or lower so the sec hit is no longer a factor for safe high sec bases.
so it seems this discussion has about coe to a close
Carebear will get stations in 0.7 and below but they will still be vunverable to losing them via a war, while the more profitable station 0.0 will be better but can be attacked by any man and his dog.
So the risk vs reward will still hold for POS and perhaps will even make hi sec space a little less safe to thoes that want to utilise the POS
all in all probably a good thing for EVE
Carebear will get to use stations, but at the price of having to defend them against rival corps that declare war
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Einheriar Ulrich
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:16:00 -
[45]
Edited by: Einheriar Ulrich on 31/08/2004 13:27:06
well if POS is going to be allowed in 0.1 till 0.7 then better be prepared for alliances or megacorps to come after you. If you cannot defend it it would be foolish to build it, unless you have lots of billions to throw out the window, either way, its gonna be fun, blowing them up
Everyone have the opportunity to build those, the main question is in aPvP game, can you defend it.
So Say I. Einheriar Ulrich of the Bloodline of Einheriar.
****Minion Of VOTF****
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Einheriar Ulrich
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:16:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Einheriar Ulrich on 31/08/2004 13:27:06
well if POS is going to be allowed in 0.1 till 0.7 then better be prepared for alliances or megacorps to come after you. If you cannot defend it it would be foolish to build it, unless you have lots of billions to throw out the window, either way, its gonna be fun, blowing them up
Everyone have the opportunity to build those, the main question is in aPvP game, can you defend it.
So Say I. Einheriar Ulrich of the Bloodline of Einheriar.
****Minion Of VOTF****
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Oosel
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:39:00 -
[47]
if you have to build pos at a moon and cannot build out in deep space why would you wanna build one of these in the first place. all you are doing is painting a big bullseye on you and ure corp for every ganker in the known eve galaxy.....if you are a medium to small sized corp you would just get blasted back into the stoneage just because you wanted to have a home of your own in empire or 0.0 space. its not a question of risk-v-reward as everybody knows as soon as its built you will have somebody wanting to destroy it just for their own fun and entertainment.................i wonder if you could cloak a station then maybe its worth ploughing your year and a halfs toil into building one otherwise ill keep on using stations that you know will be there no matter what
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Oosel
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:39:00 -
[48]
if you have to build pos at a moon and cannot build out in deep space why would you wanna build one of these in the first place. all you are doing is painting a big bullseye on you and ure corp for every ganker in the known eve galaxy.....if you are a medium to small sized corp you would just get blasted back into the stoneage just because you wanted to have a home of your own in empire or 0.0 space. its not a question of risk-v-reward as everybody knows as soon as its built you will have somebody wanting to destroy it just for their own fun and entertainment.................i wonder if you could cloak a station then maybe its worth ploughing your year and a halfs toil into building one otherwise ill keep on using stations that you know will be there no matter what
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Riddari
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:46:00 -
[49]
Attention all readers:
Player owned structure does not equal Player owned station
The refinery structures will probably be not THAT expensive so losing it occasionally is hardly a crippling blow.
Player Owned Stations is somewhere in the distant future I believe. They will be HUGELY expensive I guess.
¼©¼
a history |
Riddari
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:46:00 -
[50]
Attention all readers:
Player owned structure does not equal Player owned station
The refinery structures will probably be not THAT expensive so losing it occasionally is hardly a crippling blow.
Player Owned Stations is somewhere in the distant future I believe. They will be HUGELY expensive I guess.
¼©¼
a history |
Eddie Gordo
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:56:00 -
[51]
from what I gather the control tower will cost roughly the same as a battleship, with the other elements costing less. Not cripling, but certainly expensive enough to **** you off if it gets taken/blown up.
Instas??
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Eddie Gordo
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Posted - 2004.08.31 13:56:00 -
[52]
from what I gather the control tower will cost roughly the same as a battleship, with the other elements costing less. Not cripling, but certainly expensive enough to **** you off if it gets taken/blown up.
Instas??
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Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.08.31 14:04:00 -
[53]
Just remember that when you build they will come. If you come you cant be in two places at once! The space Alliances will hold will be much smaller. The price to own wont be much compared to the minerals you gather. I dont see PoS for Veld but for more exotic ores. I bet they are going to be 15% refines! You probally could buy better refine stations upto 50% but that might cost you!!!
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.08.31 14:04:00 -
[54]
Just remember that when you build they will come. If you come you cant be in two places at once! The space Alliances will hold will be much smaller. The price to own wont be much compared to the minerals you gather. I dont see PoS for Veld but for more exotic ores. I bet they are going to be 15% refines! You probally could buy better refine stations upto 50% but that might cost you!!!
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
Fester Addams
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Posted - 2004.08.31 14:10:00 -
[55]
I would say player owned stations should be deployable in any system where there currently are no stations and yes that meens empire space too.
As for the more savory dealings POS can do that would be easilly fixed as you could make certain POS modules illegal in empire.
The great return from a station will however mainly be in 0.0 space protected by a multitude of sentry guns and 24/7 player patrol as, yes, if you build it people will come to kill it.
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Fester Addams
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Posted - 2004.08.31 14:10:00 -
[56]
I would say player owned stations should be deployable in any system where there currently are no stations and yes that meens empire space too.
As for the more savory dealings POS can do that would be easilly fixed as you could make certain POS modules illegal in empire.
The great return from a station will however mainly be in 0.0 space protected by a multitude of sentry guns and 24/7 player patrol as, yes, if you build it people will come to kill it.
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2004.08.31 15:50:00 -
[57]
If you're labelled a carebear by the PvP clique you need not bother if you can't hide it well, they'll come to blow it up wherever it is located just because, no matter if it's defended 10 times better than other PvP peoples bases.
CCP must come up with a way to hide in 0.0 or Shiva is a bust.
Convert Stations
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Danton Marcellus
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Posted - 2004.08.31 15:50:00 -
[58]
If you're labelled a carebear by the PvP clique you need not bother if you can't hide it well, they'll come to blow it up wherever it is located just because, no matter if it's defended 10 times better than other PvP peoples bases.
CCP must come up with a way to hide in 0.0 or Shiva is a bust.
Convert Stations
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Griskin Thor
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Posted - 2004.08.31 16:44:00 -
[59]
What I don't understand is why people are equating structure in space = owning the whole system, especially in empire space. Most empire systems have at least a couple of different corps' stations in them. Minmatar Mining Corporation has no problems sharing a system with Leisure Group, or even Thukker Mix refineries. Why should any of them have issues sharing the system with an even smaller corporation's clearly inferior collection of anchored components.. it's not even a real station!
What you need to look at is whether it will be worth the trouble to set one of these up in higher sec space. As stated on the Shiva page, these things are 'not expensive to build, but costly to own'. 'Not expensive' in this case is referred to as a cost in the cruiser to battleship range *for each component*. So if you're looking at spending several hundred million just to set up a basic refining and manufacturing plant, what does 'costly to own' cost you?
They key to affording one of these things is supposed to be finding a moon that's profitable enough to support the structures, and presumably in 0.5+ space all the profitable moons are already taken. So if you're planning on running an outpost in 0.5+ space, you're going to be running it at a loss. And I can't see enough advantages to running one in heavily populated space for it to really be an issue.
Griskin Thor
Chief Operations Officer
>Lightwave Enterprises<
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"Oh yeah? Well, back in my day we had to mine omber with our teeth! And walk back to the station to sell it. Up the gravity well. Both ways!" |
Griskin Thor
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Posted - 2004.08.31 16:44:00 -
[60]
What I don't understand is why people are equating structure in space = owning the whole system, especially in empire space. Most empire systems have at least a couple of different corps' stations in them. Minmatar Mining Corporation has no problems sharing a system with Leisure Group, or even Thukker Mix refineries. Why should any of them have issues sharing the system with an even smaller corporation's clearly inferior collection of anchored components.. it's not even a real station!
What you need to look at is whether it will be worth the trouble to set one of these up in higher sec space. As stated on the Shiva page, these things are 'not expensive to build, but costly to own'. 'Not expensive' in this case is referred to as a cost in the cruiser to battleship range *for each component*. So if you're looking at spending several hundred million just to set up a basic refining and manufacturing plant, what does 'costly to own' cost you?
They key to affording one of these things is supposed to be finding a moon that's profitable enough to support the structures, and presumably in 0.5+ space all the profitable moons are already taken. So if you're planning on running an outpost in 0.5+ space, you're going to be running it at a loss. And I can't see enough advantages to running one in heavily populated space for it to really be an issue.
Griskin Thor
Chief Operations Officer
>Lightwave Enterprises<
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"Oh yeah? Well, back in my day we had to mine omber with our teeth! And walk back to the station to sell it. Up the gravity well. Both ways!" |
Kulath
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Posted - 2004.08.31 16:45:00 -
[61]
Try reading the Dev blogs. They will more then likely be able to be deployed in .6 and lower space. Man this has been brought up for close to 6 months now. Find the other threads next time.
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Kulath
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Posted - 2004.08.31 16:45:00 -
[62]
Try reading the Dev blogs. They will more then likely be able to be deployed in .6 and lower space. Man this has been brought up for close to 6 months now. Find the other threads next time.
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.08.31 17:39:00 -
[63]
Edited by: Xavier Arron on 31/08/2004 17:41:46
Originally by: Griskin Thor
What you need to look at is whether it will be worth the trouble to set one of these up in higher sec space. As stated on the Shiva page, these things are 'not expensive to build, but costly to own'. 'Not expensive' in this case is referred to as a cost in the cruiser to battleship range *for each component*. So if you're looking at spending several hundred million just to set up a basic refining and manufacturing plant, what does 'costly to own' cost you?
They key to affording one of these things is supposed to be finding a moon that's profitable enough to support the structures, and presumably in 0.5+ space all the profitable moons are already taken. So if you're planning on running an outpost in 0.5+ space, you're going to be running it at a loss. And I can't see enough advantages to running one in heavily populated space for it to really be an issue.
Aye - thatĘs exactly the point. It doesnĘt matter if you let players set them up in empire space; they are only worth setting up if they can provide a service you canĘt already get.
For example being able to deploy a research station in empire maybe be a worth while effort with the current lab slot fiasco, however only if its possible to hide the station in space, despite the heavy cost of running it. However no one is going to risk putting 100's of millions of bpo's into POS research stations if you can only deploy them at moons.
Other structures may be more useful like the mobile refineries. If the structures are re-deployable, then stations can be set up temporally while a mining op is on, and then re-packaged and hauled back to a station or safe spot.
In 0.0 POS will be worth there weight in gold, and it will be possible for corps to move more of their operations out there.
Hopefully with the new alliance system and POS, it will be possible for alliances to stake a claim for territory with the map updating with this data dynamically, showing the boarders of alliance territories ū now that would be cool
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.08.31 17:39:00 -
[64]
Edited by: Xavier Arron on 31/08/2004 17:41:46
Originally by: Griskin Thor
What you need to look at is whether it will be worth the trouble to set one of these up in higher sec space. As stated on the Shiva page, these things are 'not expensive to build, but costly to own'. 'Not expensive' in this case is referred to as a cost in the cruiser to battleship range *for each component*. So if you're looking at spending several hundred million just to set up a basic refining and manufacturing plant, what does 'costly to own' cost you?
They key to affording one of these things is supposed to be finding a moon that's profitable enough to support the structures, and presumably in 0.5+ space all the profitable moons are already taken. So if you're planning on running an outpost in 0.5+ space, you're going to be running it at a loss. And I can't see enough advantages to running one in heavily populated space for it to really be an issue.
Aye - thatĘs exactly the point. It doesnĘt matter if you let players set them up in empire space; they are only worth setting up if they can provide a service you canĘt already get.
For example being able to deploy a research station in empire maybe be a worth while effort with the current lab slot fiasco, however only if its possible to hide the station in space, despite the heavy cost of running it. However no one is going to risk putting 100's of millions of bpo's into POS research stations if you can only deploy them at moons.
Other structures may be more useful like the mobile refineries. If the structures are re-deployable, then stations can be set up temporally while a mining op is on, and then re-packaged and hauled back to a station or safe spot.
In 0.0 POS will be worth there weight in gold, and it will be possible for corps to move more of their operations out there.
Hopefully with the new alliance system and POS, it will be possible for alliances to stake a claim for territory with the map updating with this data dynamically, showing the boarders of alliance territories ū now that would be cool
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flummox
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Posted - 2004.08.31 17:41:00 -
[65]
Originally by: TheNecromancer
All I see here..is pirates just wishing for players to enter 0.4-
I really hope there will be no restriction where these think can be deployed. I do agree that maybe the best moons should be in 0.0..but no restriction please.
yes, please. i sure do hope there are no restrictions on where these can be placed. that would really mess up a HUGE aspect of the game that a lot of people have been waiting for... and a long time at that, too.
if restrictions are put into place with 0.5+, then i hope they are at least standing based. also, if i cannot place something in space because of Faction Control, then let me either change their mind of me (missions), or let me change the Faction for that system (overtake)...
0.0 space already had it's gift of extra gates and Conquerable Stations. don't continue to ignore Empire space and it's citizens...
there is a fine, but dissasterous line between a fart and a shart. i suggest you make sure which side you want to be on... |
flummox
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Posted - 2004.08.31 17:41:00 -
[66]
Originally by: TheNecromancer
All I see here..is pirates just wishing for players to enter 0.4-
I really hope there will be no restriction where these think can be deployed. I do agree that maybe the best moons should be in 0.0..but no restriction please.
yes, please. i sure do hope there are no restrictions on where these can be placed. that would really mess up a HUGE aspect of the game that a lot of people have been waiting for... and a long time at that, too.
if restrictions are put into place with 0.5+, then i hope they are at least standing based. also, if i cannot place something in space because of Faction Control, then let me either change their mind of me (missions), or let me change the Faction for that system (overtake)...
0.0 space already had it's gift of extra gates and Conquerable Stations. don't continue to ignore Empire space and it's citizens...
there is a fine, but dissasterous line between a fart and a shart. i suggest you make sure which side you want to be on... |
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