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MaximusDog Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 3	Posted - 2012.05.07 20:19:00 - [1] - Quote I was wondering what would it be the pros and cons of flying a Proteus vs a Tengu. I already have the skills for a Proteus but I have seen many people prefer the Tengu and very few the Proteus, why ? which would be better for PvP? cheers
SpaceSquirrels 278	Posted - 2012.05.07 21:12:00 - [2] - Quote Depends on what you're doing/who with. You can brick the hell out of a prot, also makes the best cloak gank ship. Also prots weren't really regarded all to well until the hybrid changes.
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Exhale. 236	Posted - 2012.05.07 21:15:00 - [3] - Quote Proteus is by far my fav T3 (ive flown them all). Tengu is better for many kspace fleets purely because of range but it's more boring than a drake to fly.
MaximusDog Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 3	Posted - 2012.05.07 21:46:00 - [4] - Quote I was thinking to use it for solo PVP....the Proteus.
Derath Ellecon Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal 190	Posted - 2012.05.08 00:19:00 - [5] - Quote I'd have to agree with Jack. I friggin love the Proteus. Thing about the Proteus, like most Gallente ships, is that you have to commit to teh fight. There's no pansy kiting "I'm not sure if I want to do this" about the Proteus. On the other hand, a Tengu can generally dicate range better (especially 100mn AB versions) and generally has a much better chance of getting away. If I were comparing them to say, Motorcycles, I'd put the proteus into the Ninja/Ducati camp while the Tengu is more in the BMW/Goldwing camp.
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Exhale. 236	Posted - 2012.05.08 00:36:00 - [6] - Quote Derath Ellecon wrote: Thing about the Proteus, like most Gallente ships, is that you have to commit to teh fight. There's no pansy kiting "I'm not sure if I want to do this" about the Proteus. this is very true. basically for solo it comes down to balls. if you have them, use a proteus. (if doing so, i would highly recommend a scout alt to go with and you really cant pull out of most fights in a proteus.) if youre a pansy, fly a 100mn tengu like everyone else.
Kaikka Carel White syndicate 43	Posted - 2012.05.08 02:32:00 - [7] - Quote Jack, while we are at it I remember you saying that proteus is the best T3 for WH pvp. I'd like to ask what kind of setups do you use? Any links or boosters? Tactics?
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Exhale. 237	Posted - 2012.05.08 03:02:00 - [8] - Quote Kaikka Carel wrote: Jack, while we are at it I remember you saying that proteus is the best T3 for WH pvp. I'd like to ask what kind of setups do you use? Any links or boosters? Tactics? yeah ive said that before and i'll stand by it. fits can be found quite easily by looking on the loss mails of large WH entities such as Exhale, Aharm ect. i personally like a ~2:1 prot/loki ratio for WH fleets with logi support and neut support. works extremely well. sadly, the scrubs always insist on bringing their legions
Roime Shiva Furnace 655	Posted - 2012.05.08 05:49:00 - [9] - Quote It's very simple, really. If you see Tengus on scan, they are ratting. If you see a shitload of Tengus, the Russians are blobbing. If you see Proteuses on scan, they will be on top of you in about a second. If you see a shitload of Proteuses, the big boys are having a goodfight. ~ Elite forum PvP ~
Jerick Ludhowe Wraiths of Abaddon 68	Posted - 2012.05.08 14:13:00 - [10] - Quote Derath Ellecon wrote: If I were comparing them to say, Motorcycles, I'd put the proteus into the Ninja/Ducati camp while the Tengu is more in the BMW/Goldwing camp. Did you really just compare fictional internet spaceships to real life street bikes? The nerd is strong in this one.
Daniel Plain Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 90	Posted - 2012.05.08 14:58:00 - [11] - Quote Jerick Ludhowe wrote: Derath Ellecon wrote: If I were comparing them to say, Motorcycles, I'd put the proteus into the Ninja/Ducati camp while the Tengu is more in the BMW/Goldwing camp. Did you really just compare fictional internet spaceships to real life street bikes? The nerd is strong in this one. at least he didn't compare them to anime characters. or ponies.
Prez21 V0LTA Verge of Collapse 6	Posted - 2012.05.08 15:21:00 - [12] - Quote Kaikka Carel wrote: Jack, while we are at it I remember you saying that proteus is the best T3 for WH pvp. I'd like to ask what kind of setups do you use? Any links or boosters? Tactics? Proteus is very popular in wh pvp, the gangs are smaller so dps projection isnt a problem especially with loki support and they fit a great buffer tank, along with lowish sig and great dps make them perfect for small gang pvp.
Kaikka Carel White syndicate 46	Posted - 2012.05.09 14:53:00 - [13] - Quote So noone but Russians blobs with Tengus? And is Legion so bad? I mean even in a HAM configuration?
Aesheera Malum Crusis 31	Posted - 2012.05.09 14:57:00 - [14] - Quote Solo use imo: HML Tengu. Faction disruptor, 100mn AB, active tank. Roll it. Any other pvp scenario: Proteus becomes just as viable. Blasters will remain to struggle with a short offensive range, hence me preferring Tengu when forced to choose a solo ship. Malum Crusis is recruiting! FREE Merc work offered* Details available via EVEmail or ingame convo.
Tanya Powers Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 1201	Posted - 2012.05.10 13:33:00 - [15] - Quote Roime wrote: It's very simple, really. If you see Tengus on scan, they are ratting. If you see a shitload of Tengus, the Russians are blobbing. If you see Proteuses on scan, they will be on top of you in about a second. If you see a shitload of Proteuses, the big boys are having a goodfight. While the first about Tengus is true, the second about Proteus is the 0.01% situation you might see to "dream" not existing in Eve
Roime Shiva Furnace 673	Posted - 2012.05.10 15:31:00 - [16] - Quote It's very true in wormholes, where Proteus is the dominant T3, and the dominant PVP ship. In the beginning high security space was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
Tanya Powers Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 1203	Posted - 2012.05.10 20:56:00 - [17] - Quote Roime wrote: It's very true in wormholes, where Proteus is the dominant T3, and the dominant PVP ship. You're probably right, I haven't returned in WH's for a while now, this said I can't see what proteus offers that I can't do better with another T3 in same situation except raw dps on top of the target's head. Neut it and can't even shoot and looses all it's EHP because hardeners (active) and hybrids (cap hungry), add a single rep and it's an easy kill. Has to run all over to get in range of target witch means poor dps in this situation. How many times the perfect situation where: you're at the top of your target, he's web 90%, scram, disrupt and you're solo doing all this? -none, in this yet another case every other T3 is as good and offers far more options than proteus. Not saying it's not the dominant in wh's, just saying the same numbers and composition with amarr for example, do the same thing and give you far more options of engagement.
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Exhale. 249	Posted - 2012.05.10 21:09:00 - [18] - Quote Kaikka Carel wrote: And is Legion so bad? I mean even in a HAM configuration? HAM legion is terrible because it used missiles TBH. it's only good for fighting BSs and caps. laser legion has **** DPS and meh tank, only situation it is better than a proteus is at over 18.5km with scorch. realistically youre rarely fighting that far away in WHs for anything more than 1 MWD pulse. only good legion is a neut legion IMO.
Roime Shiva Furnace Dead On Arrival Alliance 674	Posted - 2012.05.11 07:58:00 - [19] - Quote Tanya Powers wrote: Roime wrote: It's very true in wormholes, where Proteus is the dominant T3, and the dominant PVP ship. You're probably right, I haven't returned in WH's for a while now, this said I can't see what proteus offers that I can't do better with another T3 in same situation except raw dps on top of the target's head. WHs are different, and being on top of the target happens most of the time. You fight either on a wormhole, where people spawn in blaster optimals, you sneak up on people cloaked or get a warpin from cloaky scout. Bonused scram range means that it's very difficult to keep a Proteus out of it's range. Quote: Neut it and can't even shoot and looses all it's EHP because hardeners (active) and hybrids (cap hungry), add a single rep and it's an easy kill. My fit has a NOS and a fully passive 117K EHP tank against it's lowest resist (explosive). Quote: Has to run all over to get in range of target witch means poor dps in this situation How many times the perfect situation where: you're at the top of your target, he's web 90%, scram, disrupt and you're solo doing all this? -none, in this yet another case every other T3 is as good and offers far more options than proteus.. Like said, the perfect situation is the norm in whs. Also, you only need a scram or disruptor, not both. In cloaky config the Proteus simply has more tank and gank than the others, and those two stats mean a lot. All the T3s have their strengths, and complement each others nicely. In a small gang, I'd like to have them all, performing the tasks that suit them best. In the beginning high security space was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
Tarn Kugisa Space Mongolian Pinked 77	Posted - 2012.05.11 09:59:00 - [20] - Quote Proteus has mids for utility Tengu has lows for DPS Just like all Shield/Armor ships. I Endorse this Product and/or Service [url]https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=16580[/url]
Tobiaz Spacerats 395	Posted - 2012.05.11 11:43:00 - [21] - Quote Tarn Kugisa wrote: Proteus has mids for utility Tengu has lows for DPS Just like all Shield/Armor ships. Uhm... that doesn't seem right... Operation WRITE DOWN ALL THE THINGS!!!-á Check out the list at http://bit.ly/wdatt Collecting and compiling all fixes and ideas for EVE. Looking for more editors!
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Exhale. 250	Posted - 2012.05.11 12:29:00 - [22] - Quote Tarn Kugisa wrote: Proteus has mids for utility Tengu has lows for DPS Just like all Shield/Armor ships. confirming tengus do more dps than prots...
Jta Grl Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 2	Posted - 2012.05.11 13:34:00 - [23] - Quote The ONLY thing that can break a Tengu is the neut. No matter how buffed a Proteus is if ANY ship pins it ouside of blaster range (wich btw is not very big if I remember it right) it is dead. I dont have to mention how ******* strong the Tengu active tank is. Yeah, the Proteus is cool you gotta have balls to fly it (because its too easy to lose for a >500mi ship) and you can sneak upon your target. Im so excited about it wohoo. *queueing Caldari Cruiser skill
Tanya Powers Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 1204	Posted - 2012.05.11 14:15:00 - [24] - Quote Jack Miton wrote: Tarn Kugisa wrote: Proteus has mids for utility Tengu has lows for DPS Just like all Shield/Armor ships. confirming tengus do more dps than prots... Not more, just enough speed with AFTER BURNER while SCRAMED to keep distance and if 700+ dps is enough to kill almost everything. Proteus with mwd and regular fit no implants goes around 1400m/s, Tengu with regular fit arount 2+ to almost 4k speed with faction mods, pimp to 5k with cloack boost alts. Again, not saying Proteus can't be fun or can't succeed, just saying that there's no reason to suffer the pain of using such ship when you have far better fight options with other ships. Now in Wh's you'll find exploration Tengus for the most part, I'd like to see another video of a 3 billion Tengu in a wh kicking asses so that some people can see hos restrictive the game play with gallente hulls is. This is my point of view about Gallente despite latest updates, it's an extreme restrictive game play that offers nothing compared to others except maybe the feeling of elite uberness because success happens "some times".
MaximusDog Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 3	Posted - 2012.05.11 19:56:00 - [25] - Quote Roime wrote: It's very simple, really. If you see Tengus on scan, they are ratting. If you see a shitload of Tengus, the Russians are blobbing. If you see Proteuses on scan, they will be on top of you in about a second. If you see a shitload of Proteuses, the big boys are having a goodfight. I like this one Roime!
Roime Shiva Furnace Dead On Arrival Alliance 688	Posted - 2012.05.12 06:04:00 - [26] - Quote Tanya Powers wrote: [quote=Jack Miton] Not more, just enough speed with AFTER BURNER while SCRAMED to keep distance and if 700+ dps is enough to kill almost everything. Proteus with mwd and regular fit no implants goes around 1400m/s, Tengu with regular fit arount 2+ to almost 4k speed with faction mods, pimp to 5k with cloack boost alts. Again, not saying Proteus can't be fun or can't succeed, just saying that there's no reason to suffer the pain of using such ship when you have far better fight options with other ships. Now in Wh's you'll find exploration Tengus for the most part, I'd like to see another video of a 3 billion Tengu in a wh kicking asses so that some people can see hos restrictive the game play with gallente hulls is. This is my point of view about Gallente despite latest updates, it's an extreme restrictive game play that offers nothing compared to others except maybe the feeling of elite uberness because success happens "some times". "Speed doesn't kill ships, guns do" Check out wh corp killboards. Gallente isn't "restrictive", it's the preferred method of winning here. Tengus are used for PVE, because kiting just doesn't get you any kills here. The wh mechanics are better suited for brawlers, and people aren't as stupid as k-space folk. In the beginning high security space was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
Drakarin Omnitech Corporation Wonder Kids 6	Posted - 2012.05.12 07:53:00 - [27] - Quote Could someone elaborate for me why people fear 100mn Tengus so much? Yes, they are hard to kill, but they're like bugs. Very fast, hard to hit, but they barely even dent you. I can't seem to find a Tengu fit that does more than 650 dps at any sort of range without involving links and very expensive implants. You aren't going to kill anything with that sort of damage. Also, all fits are passive. I'm very much so used to active defense, I hate the idea of simply starting a counter to your death. What am I missing here? The proteus clearly wins, with DPS well over 1k easily and an even better buffer. Speaking on terms of 1v1 at least.
Qui Shon Capital Construction Research Pioneer Alliance 2	Posted - 2012.05.12 22:06:00 - [28] - Quote Tanya Powers wrote: I'd like to see another video of a 3 billion Tengu in a wh kicking asses Another? Where's the first one? Can you link it? I saw that Boppo guys excellent (top music) k-space tengu vid. Haven't seen a W-space one.
MaximusDog Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic 3	Posted - 2012.05.16 20:57:00 - [29] - Quote what would be a good fitting for a Proteus ? (PvP)
Pink Marshmellow Caucasian Culture Club Narwhals Ate My Duck 27	Posted - 2012.05.16 21:19:00 - [30] - Quote Confirming the Legion is pretty crap for a T3. If you want lasers and tank, You fly the absolution. HAM legion is something that mostly works in Kspace, it doesn't really bring much to the table for its costs. A t2 Fit absolution overall has better performance than a faction fit legion. I have flown legions and I have 2 differently configured legions, so I would know. The only thing I would really use legions is for vanguard incursions. I am a converted proteus pilot now.
Jta Grl Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 2	Posted - 2012.05.18 11:51:00 - [31] - Quote Drakarin wrote: Could someone elaborate for me why people fear 100mn Tengus so much? Yes, they are hard to kill, but they're like bugs. Very fast, hard to hit, but they barely even dent you. I can't seem to find a Tengu fit that does more than 650 dps at any sort of range without involving links and very expensive implants. You aren't going to kill anything with that sort of damage. Also, all fits are passive. I'm very much so used to active defense, I hate the idea of simply starting a counter to your death. What am I missing here? The proteus clearly wins, with DPS well over 1k easily and an even better buffer. Speaking on terms of 1v1 at least. I know the post is old (OMG, 1 week, why did you dig this???) but I posted on it and I'd like to comment. Besides you saying that 650 dps doenst kill anything wich they do easily with kin missiles, it's not just the 100mn Tengus. Active tanking tengus are WAY overpowered too. No other T3 can fit an active tank and run it 24/7 with both MWD and guns online. Try this on the Proteus. You either get to sacrifice DPS or defense. With the Tengu you can fit all lows with BCUs and still have a decent tank at 1.2km/s. I'm not even mentioning that if you go that fast with a Proteus you can't hit anything that doesnt have a 2000m sig radius (oops, I just did), wich adds even more to the Tengu tank without sacrificing damage (because missiles don't miss, you know?). Yeah, the Proteus clearly wins, on cov ops and thats all. It's simply not worth for what it cost. If you live in a WH and can build one its a great ship but not if you have to pay for it. It's a crippled ship compared to other T3's. It shouldn't be like that.
Mfume Apocal Origin. Black Legion. 447	Posted - 2012.05.18 13:44:00 - [32] - Quote Jta Grl wrote: No other T3 can fit an active tank and run it 24/7 with both MWD and guns online. 100MN Tengus use ABs. And a (PvP) Loki can perma-run a Gist large shield booster and MWD permanently, with the right choice of subs and rigs.
Eugene Kerner TunDraGon 29	Posted - 2012.05.18 13:51:00 - [33] - Quote Jta Grl wrote: The ONLY thing that can break a Tengu is the neut. No matter how buffed a Proteus is if ANY ship pins it ouside of blaster range (wich btw is not very big if I remember it right) it is dead. I dont have to mention how ******* strong the Tengu active tank is. Yeah, the Proteus is cool you gotta have balls to fly it (because its too easy to lose for a >500mi ship) and you can sneak upon your target. Im so excited about it wohoo. *queueing Caldari Cruiser skill You have got approx. 60 km point and approx. 20 km scram...you do not have to fit it with blasters.
Jta Grl Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 2	Posted - 2012.05.18 14:21:00 - [34] - Quote Mfume Apocal wrote: Jta Grl wrote: No other T3 can fit an active tank and run it 24/7 with both MWD and guns online. 100MN Tengus use ABs. And a (PvP) Loki can perma-run a Gist large shield booster and MWD permanently, with the right choice of subs and rigs. The Loki does much less DPS and miss a lot of shots with a high transversal speed. I haven't checked on the 100MN Tengus yet but I dont think they should have cap problems either, I was talking about the active tanking Tengu fit wich is OP as well. Eugene Kerner wrote: Jta Grl wrote: The ONLY thing that can break a Tengu is the neut. No matter how buffed a Proteus is if ANY ship pins it ouside of blaster range (wich btw is not very big if I remember it right) it is dead. I dont have to mention how ******* strong the Tengu active tank is. Yeah, the Proteus is cool you gotta have balls to fly it (because its too easy to lose for a >500mi ship) and you can sneak upon your target. Im so excited about it wohoo. *queueing Caldari Cruiser skill You have got approx. 60 km point and approx. 20 km scram...you do not have to fit it with blasters. Yeah, maybe an AC Proteus... but still awful DPS compared to the Tengu's. The problem I am pointing here is that Tengu shouldn't have such a high DPS. The Proteus dos have a great DPS but it also DOES have a drawback wich is optimal range. What is the drawback for that DPS wich is close to the Proteus on the Tengu? None.
Jta Grl Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 2	Posted - 2012.05.18 14:47:00 - [35] - Quote Meh, nvm. I dont want to flame this more than it is already. Playing with EFT I realized they are very different ships so theres little room for the poor comparison I made... the balance is much more complex. I guess the Tengu is just an easier ship to fit and fly after all. I won't poke on the 100MN AB discussion because I'm not much of a PvP'r myself. There may be indeed an inballance there but I can't make any comments on it. Heading back to the Black Pyramid now.

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