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S'Daria
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Posted - 2004.09.01 13:10:00 -
[1]
Edited by: S'Daria on 01/09/2004 17:29:21
Edited by: S'Daria on 01/09/2004 17:21:04
I was thinking of this. What about a mining barge would get you out of your Apoc? At least for me I would think something like the following:
8 high slots
3 mid slots (minimum)
5 low slots (minimum)
Special:
o +5% mining yield per skill level
o 10% less capacitor use for mining lasers per skill level
Skill requirement:
o Industrial III [EDIT]
o Astrogeology V
What do you guys think?
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S'Daria
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Posted - 2004.09.01 13:10:00 -
[2]
Edited by: S'Daria on 01/09/2004 17:29:21
Edited by: S'Daria on 01/09/2004 17:21:04
I was thinking of this. What about a mining barge would get you out of your Apoc? At least for me I would think something like the following:
8 high slots
3 mid slots (minimum)
5 low slots (minimum)
Special:
o +5% mining yield per skill level
o 10% less capacitor use for mining lasers per skill level
Skill requirement:
o Industrial III [EDIT]
o Astrogeology V
What do you guys think?
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Morikai Acler
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Posted - 2004.09.01 13:40:00 -
[3]
Ok, now lets make those skill reqs more realistic. Since they're going to be more for the industrial types, and not combat pilots who already have high BS skills.
Guessing since they're mining barges, it should be:
10-20% bonus yeild per skill level
10% less cap use or cpu per skill level
They aren't really elite ships, so I would put the skill requirements around the same as Industrials with a couple changes, depending on the size classes, since it looks like they're going to do one for each size.
Small
Frigate 3 or 4
Mining 4 or 5
And then have similar skill reqs for each size class. I wouldn't get over excited about slot layout, it will probably a lot of high slots with only very few low and mid. Or similar to the way indi's are with really high cpu and crap for PG.
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Morikai Acler
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Posted - 2004.09.01 13:40:00 -
[4]
Ok, now lets make those skill reqs more realistic. Since they're going to be more for the industrial types, and not combat pilots who already have high BS skills.
Guessing since they're mining barges, it should be:
10-20% bonus yeild per skill level
10% less cap use or cpu per skill level
They aren't really elite ships, so I would put the skill requirements around the same as Industrials with a couple changes, depending on the size classes, since it looks like they're going to do one for each size.
Small
Frigate 3 or 4
Mining 4 or 5
And then have similar skill reqs for each size class. I wouldn't get over excited about slot layout, it will probably a lot of high slots with only very few low and mid. Or similar to the way indi's are with really high cpu and crap for PG.
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Eyeshadow
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Posted - 2004.09.01 14:32:00 -
[5]
i should think they will have 2 or 3 high slots, for the special mining lasers, plus some insane bonus to mining yield. Putting 8 turrets on it is just gonna turn it into a possible fighting platform too. it wont be useful for anything except mining, just like an indy aint useful for anything except hauling.
I should think skill reqs will be
industrial lvl3 or 4
spaceship command 3
and probably mining or astrogeology at 4
Its not a tech2/elite ship so it shouldnt require any lvl5 skillz
Forums: Sharks - MC |
Eyeshadow
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Posted - 2004.09.01 14:32:00 -
[6]
i should think they will have 2 or 3 high slots, for the special mining lasers, plus some insane bonus to mining yield. Putting 8 turrets on it is just gonna turn it into a possible fighting platform too. it wont be useful for anything except mining, just like an indy aint useful for anything except hauling.
I should think skill reqs will be
industrial lvl3 or 4
spaceship command 3
and probably mining or astrogeology at 4
Its not a tech2/elite ship so it shouldnt require any lvl5 skillz
Forums: Sharks - MC |
Nafri
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Posted - 2004.09.01 14:38:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Eyeshadow
i should think they will have 2 or 3 high slots, for the special mining lasers, plus some insane bonus to mining yield. Putting 8 turrets on it is just gonna turn it into a possible fighting platform too. it wont be useful for anything except mining, just like an indy aint useful for anything except hauling.
I should think skill reqs will be
industrial lvl3 or 4
spaceship command 3
and probably mining or astrogeology at 4
Its not a tech2/elite ship so it shouldnt require any lvl5 skillz
nah thy are slow, have low powergrid and no medslots i guess
Wanna fly with me?
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Nafri
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Posted - 2004.09.01 14:38:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Eyeshadow
i should think they will have 2 or 3 high slots, for the special mining lasers, plus some insane bonus to mining yield. Putting 8 turrets on it is just gonna turn it into a possible fighting platform too. it wont be useful for anything except mining, just like an indy aint useful for anything except hauling.
I should think skill reqs will be
industrial lvl3 or 4
spaceship command 3
and probably mining or astrogeology at 4
Its not a tech2/elite ship so it shouldnt require any lvl5 skillz
nah thy are slow, have low powergrid and no medslots i guess
Wanna fly with me?
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Jemba'k Ko'cha
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Posted - 2004.09.01 14:48:00 -
[9]
i think if a proper mining barge is going to be introudced then some thing need tweeking first.
implement Miner ONLY hardpoints. like turret and missile HPs. other ships should be worked so that they have specific alotments for miners.
ship stats
8 hi slots - 8 Miner 1 missile
0 Medium
8 Low
VERY slow speed (around 100m/s)
large cargo, maybe 6000 stock
the reason for no med slots id to prevent ABs and MWDs. these are big fat arsed ships, nothing will get them moving faster than stock (other than skills) 8 low slots for Cargo expansion.
having 8 might seem like too many...people will use it as a hauler. no they wont. with a terrible speed and no med slots to stach repaires or shield boosters people are unlikly to swap it for an iteron 5.
it should be a dedicated mining ship, thats why the possibly hard restrictions should be in place. possibly also bringing in another ship skill...Mining Barge rank 4. also mining bonuses for each lvl.
ship should cost around the same as a BS. yes it will be able mine at a basterd rate, but it wont be able tomove fast, it cant tank, it has only one missile hp IF they use it.
once of these on a copr mine would need others to cover it and tank it...reducing the amount of people who can mine effectivly.
with proper thought to concequences a Mining Barge will be an invaluable introduction to Eve online
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Knowledge is the bomb |
Jemba'k Ko'cha
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Posted - 2004.09.01 14:48:00 -
[10]
i think if a proper mining barge is going to be introudced then some thing need tweeking first.
implement Miner ONLY hardpoints. like turret and missile HPs. other ships should be worked so that they have specific alotments for miners.
ship stats
8 hi slots - 8 Miner 1 missile
0 Medium
8 Low
VERY slow speed (around 100m/s)
large cargo, maybe 6000 stock
the reason for no med slots id to prevent ABs and MWDs. these are big fat arsed ships, nothing will get them moving faster than stock (other than skills) 8 low slots for Cargo expansion.
having 8 might seem like too many...people will use it as a hauler. no they wont. with a terrible speed and no med slots to stach repaires or shield boosters people are unlikly to swap it for an iteron 5.
it should be a dedicated mining ship, thats why the possibly hard restrictions should be in place. possibly also bringing in another ship skill...Mining Barge rank 4. also mining bonuses for each lvl.
ship should cost around the same as a BS. yes it will be able mine at a basterd rate, but it wont be able tomove fast, it cant tank, it has only one missile hp IF they use it.
once of these on a copr mine would need others to cover it and tank it...reducing the amount of people who can mine effectivly.
with proper thought to concequences a Mining Barge will be an invaluable introduction to Eve online
-------------------------------------------
Knowledge is the bomb |
ActiveX
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:06:00 -
[11]
With 8 lows, you can get a 100 m/s ship to 260 m/s before Nav skill is applied without losing any cargo.
So it could be an indy if it had to be.
I would say no lows or mids at all. You should be able to handle all the mining lasers already.
Give it Cruiser armor and hull and half a Raven's shield.
____________
Sex / Rank 9 / SP: 1280 of 2304000 
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ActiveX
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:06:00 -
[12]
With 8 lows, you can get a 100 m/s ship to 260 m/s before Nav skill is applied without losing any cargo.
So it could be an indy if it had to be.
I would say no lows or mids at all. You should be able to handle all the mining lasers already.
Give it Cruiser armor and hull and half a Raven's shield.
____________
Sex / Rank 9 / SP: 1280 of 2304000
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Darko1107
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:09:00 -
[13]
Have u seen the pictures? It looks to me that they just have 1 lazer, maybe its a really really powerful one or something?
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Darko1107
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:09:00 -
[14]
Have u seen the pictures? It looks to me that they just have 1 lazer, maybe its a really really powerful one or something?
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Shadowsword
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:09:00 -
[15]
Some real infos to stop wild speculations:
"Specialized Mining Barges
New specialized mining barges, better than even the mighty Apocalypse at mining have been developed by the ORE syndicate, but are much cheaper.
They are however not useful for anything else, their shield and armor is like a big frigate and they have the speed of a battleship."---Shiva features page.
According to the pictures they'll have very fews high slots, which very probably mean a HUGE bonus to mining wield. They'll also probably have a big cargo space: They're barges, after all...
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Shadowsword
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:09:00 -
[16]
Some real infos to stop wild speculations:
"Specialized Mining Barges
New specialized mining barges, better than even the mighty Apocalypse at mining have been developed by the ORE syndicate, but are much cheaper.
They are however not useful for anything else, their shield and armor is like a big frigate and they have the speed of a battleship."---Shiva features page.
According to the pictures they'll have very fews high slots, which very probably mean a HUGE bonus to mining wield. They'll also probably have a big cargo space: They're barges, after all...
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Kalok
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:27:00 -
[17]
Personaly I don't care what I should train to drive such a ship. It simply will be done. I am however very glad we get a special ship for mining. I allway's thought mining lasers fitted on battleships were a laugh. They are correcting one of the worst game design flaws imho.
What I would like to see is a very big cargo hold so I don't have to use expanders to stack a few cycles and marco mining won't be nescesarry for those people with real life rsi!
Greetz, Kalok.
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Kalok
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Posted - 2004.09.01 15:27:00 -
[18]
Personaly I don't care what I should train to drive such a ship. It simply will be done. I am however very glad we get a special ship for mining. I allway's thought mining lasers fitted on battleships were a laugh. They are correcting one of the worst game design flaws imho.
What I would like to see is a very big cargo hold so I don't have to use expanders to stack a few cycles and marco mining won't be nescesarry for those people with real life rsi!
Greetz, Kalok.
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Zopha
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Posted - 2004.09.01 16:12:00 -
[19]
The barges will be useing new tech 2 mining lasers using crystals like ordinary lasers to bump up mining yeild. If you look at the pictures of them you can see a strange round mining turret.
Looks like they'll have a very low number of low high slots, may be just one turret (on the small one and it looks like two on the medium barge) it might have more high slots, specialised ones for dust collectors and the like. If they're going to out mine Apoc's with just one or two lasers there must be a good mining bonus for those ships or the crystals that go in them.
As for the skill requirement of battleship 3,... eh no, how about industrial 3 or ship command 3 and then a mining barge skill. If CCP are going with more and more skills then a mining barge skill (or even ORE ship followed by mining barge aswell) is quite likely.
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Zopha
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Posted - 2004.09.01 16:12:00 -
[20]
The barges will be useing new tech 2 mining lasers using crystals like ordinary lasers to bump up mining yeild. If you look at the pictures of them you can see a strange round mining turret.
Looks like they'll have a very low number of low high slots, may be just one turret (on the small one and it looks like two on the medium barge) it might have more high slots, specialised ones for dust collectors and the like. If they're going to out mine Apoc's with just one or two lasers there must be a good mining bonus for those ships or the crystals that go in them.
As for the skill requirement of battleship 3,... eh no, how about industrial 3 or ship command 3 and then a mining barge skill. If CCP are going with more and more skills then a mining barge skill (or even ORE ship followed by mining barge aswell) is quite likely.
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IRONxRchxenson
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Posted - 2004.09.01 16:55:00 -
[21]
guys if you keep the core low and the CPU high then only miners will fit well on it, the core only matters for a few things other than turrets and launchers....
Give it a nice CPU and low powergrid, either that or limit the turrets to only mining turrets, but I don't know how hard that would be in game, if possible at all.
Also I would request that the requirements are higher that Miner 3-4 and frigate 3-4. This so low it's boarderline nuts.
Minimum of Mining 5 and Astro 5. This is the elite miner of the ships, not some hunky little mining frigate.
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IRONxRchxenson
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Posted - 2004.09.01 16:55:00 -
[22]
guys if you keep the core low and the CPU high then only miners will fit well on it, the core only matters for a few things other than turrets and launchers....
Give it a nice CPU and low powergrid, either that or limit the turrets to only mining turrets, but I don't know how hard that would be in game, if possible at all.
Also I would request that the requirements are higher that Miner 3-4 and frigate 3-4. This so low it's boarderline nuts.
Minimum of Mining 5 and Astro 5. This is the elite miner of the ships, not some hunky little mining frigate.
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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2004.09.01 17:16:00 -
[23]
Minimum reqs should be -
Mining lvl 5
Astrogeology lvl 5
Industry lvl 4
Mining Barge lvl 2
Leadership lvl 3
And possibly even more. This ship should only be available to those who have dedicated themselves to the mining CAREER. Not just any old carebear who wants to mine in luminaire.
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Nicholas Marshal
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Posted - 2004.09.01 17:16:00 -
[24]
Minimum reqs should be -
Mining lvl 5
Astrogeology lvl 5
Industry lvl 4
Mining Barge lvl 2
Leadership lvl 3
And possibly even more. This ship should only be available to those who have dedicated themselves to the mining CAREER. Not just any old carebear who wants to mine in luminaire.
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S'Daria
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Posted - 2004.09.01 17:24:00 -
[25]
8 Mining II lasers + 10 Harvesters + Astrogeology V + Mining Drone V is:
1,171.8 cubic meters of ore/min
Unless I see a 30% improvement in that I don't think I will hassal with this new mining barge (armor of a frigate, a fraction of an indy...yeah right).
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S'Daria
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Posted - 2004.09.01 17:24:00 -
[26]
8 Mining II lasers + 10 Harvesters + Astrogeology V + Mining Drone V is:
1,171.8 cubic meters of ore/min
Unless I see a 30% improvement in that I don't think I will hassal with this new mining barge (armor of a frigate, a fraction of an indy...yeah right).
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Rehpyk
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Posted - 2004.09.01 20:30:00 -
[27]
It is written somewhere that these new barges can/will be better than a mining apoc, i believe the skills needed should be set high enough so only dedicated miners can get to use these, this should be a specialization for people who focus mainly on mining.
At least:
Astrogeology-5
Mining-5
Indy-4
+ a few other level 3-4 skills
____________________________
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Rehpyk
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Posted - 2004.09.01 20:30:00 -
[28]
It is written somewhere that these new barges can/will be better than a mining apoc, i believe the skills needed should be set high enough so only dedicated miners can get to use these, this should be a specialization for people who focus mainly on mining.
At least:
Astrogeology-5
Mining-5
Indy-4
+ a few other level 3-4 skills
____________________________
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Griskin Thor
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Posted - 2004.09.01 21:21:00 -
[29]
So far the only hard into we have is that they 'mine better than an Apoc and cost much less'.
Informed speculation:
We've seen an S and an M. This implies at least an L to match the FF-CA-BB progression. With the addition of DDs and CAs to the mix, the progression could well be S-M-L-XL-XXL. Whatever it's designation, the largest of these is going to be the Apoc-killer. I'd say this is most likely not one of the ships we've seen already.
Price is also up in the air. 'cost much less' could mean 60 mil vs. the Apoc's 100+, or 25 mil, or a heavy-cruiser range 10 mil. I'm going to guess the small will be in the heavy frigate to light industrial range up to heavy cruiser range for whatever the Apoc-killer is. Blame my sense of nostalgia, but I'd like to see newbie miners working as hard to earn their first ORE-S as they used to to earn their first indy, then working their ORE-S to the bone to get an M, etc etc.
Fitting.. this is the tough one. We can clearly see 1 turret on the S and 2 on the M. Now, this doesn't prove that's how many turrets they actually have, but since they seem to have the turret hardpoints actually textured on the hull I think it's a good guess. Now, the biggest class is supposed to out-mine an Apoc. It stands to reason that the smallest would out-mine the best frigate miner and the medium would out-mine the best cruiser, etc. So while the S only mounts one turret, you'd only need to add 200% or so to mining yield to satisfy both. We could extrapolate an L/XXL barge with 4 miner slots for the Apoc-killer. This could either be purely a ship bonus, or a combination of ship and miner bonuses. If it's ship based, then the new miners will probably be standard equipment that you could mount on any ship. If it's a combination or purely equipment-based, then the new miners will be like the DCM II, with outrageous requirements that can only be met with special bonuses on the barges. As for what other slots they have, I don't think they're going to cripple them, though I expect they'll be on the low side for their comparative class. Ss will most likely have 1 med, 2 low, 1-2 med and 3-4 low on Ms, though I expect the Ls won't get much more. Just enough to mount survey scanners and other asst. hardware and allow some customization through hull mods.
Cargo is up in the air. They could go either way on this one. Given that they're calling them barges, it certainly makes sense for them to have large cargo holds. If they want to eliminate can mining I could see them going for 1-2k base for S, up to 5-10k for the L size. Then with a decent number of expanders they could be expected to hold about 15-20 minutes worth of mining, a very good amount for a solo miner and reasonable for a fast-mining group. On the other hand, if they're particularly fond of can mining, the devs could just give them cargo on the high side for their comparative class. I'm hoping the former, though.
For skills, it's anybody's guess, really. It would make sense for them to use Industrial and Mining as their prereqs. I disagree that they should require max Mining and Astrogeology so only the 1337 miners can use them, because the 1337 mining lasers will cover that. Sure you can mount stock Miner Is on your ORE-S, but you won't get nearly the benefit of a hard core miner who can fit Frequency Modulated Miner IIs.
Griskin Thor
Chief Operations Officer
>Lightwave Enterprises<
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"Oh yeah? Well, back in my day we had to mine omber with our teeth! And walk back to the station to sell it. Up the gravity well. Both ways!" |
Griskin Thor
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Posted - 2004.09.01 21:21:00 -
[30]
So far the only hard into we have is that they 'mine better than an Apoc and cost much less'.
Informed speculation:
We've seen an S and an M. This implies at least an L to match the FF-CA-BB progression. With the addition of DDs and CAs to the mix, the progression could well be S-M-L-XL-XXL. Whatever it's designation, the largest of these is going to be the Apoc-killer. I'd say this is most likely not one of the ships we've seen already.
Price is also up in the air. 'cost much less' could mean 60 mil vs. the Apoc's 100+, or 25 mil, or a heavy-cruiser range 10 mil. I'm going to guess the small will be in the heavy frigate to light industrial range up to heavy cruiser range for whatever the Apoc-killer is. Blame my sense of nostalgia, but I'd like to see newbie miners working as hard to earn their first ORE-S as they used to to earn their first indy, then working their ORE-S to the bone to get an M, etc etc.
Fitting.. this is the tough one. We can clearly see 1 turret on the S and 2 on the M. Now, this doesn't prove that's how many turrets they actually have, but since they seem to have the turret hardpoints actually textured on the hull I think it's a good guess. Now, the biggest class is supposed to out-mine an Apoc. It stands to reason that the smallest would out-mine the best frigate miner and the medium would out-mine the best cruiser, etc. So while the S only mounts one turret, you'd only need to add 200% or so to mining yield to satisfy both. We could extrapolate an L/XXL barge with 4 miner slots for the Apoc-killer. This could either be purely a ship bonus, or a combination of ship and miner bonuses. If it's ship based, then the new miners will probably be standard equipment that you could mount on any ship. If it's a combination or purely equipment-based, then the new miners will be like the DCM II, with outrageous requirements that can only be met with special bonuses on the barges. As for what other slots they have, I don't think they're going to cripple them, though I expect they'll be on the low side for their comparative class. Ss will most likely have 1 med, 2 low, 1-2 med and 3-4 low on Ms, though I expect the Ls won't get much more. Just enough to mount survey scanners and other asst. hardware and allow some customization through hull mods.
Cargo is up in the air. They could go either way on this one. Given that they're calling them barges, it certainly makes sense for them to have large cargo holds. If they want to eliminate can mining I could see them going for 1-2k base for S, up to 5-10k for the L size. Then with a decent number of expanders they could be expected to hold about 15-20 minutes worth of mining, a very good amount for a solo miner and reasonable for a fast-mining group. On the other hand, if they're particularly fond of can mining, the devs could just give them cargo on the high side for their comparative class. I'm hoping the former, though.
For skills, it's anybody's guess, really. It would make sense for them to use Industrial and Mining as their prereqs. I disagree that they should require max Mining and Astrogeology so only the 1337 miners can use them, because the 1337 mining lasers will cover that. Sure you can mount stock Miner Is on your ORE-S, but you won't get nearly the benefit of a hard core miner who can fit Frequency Modulated Miner IIs.
Griskin Thor
Chief Operations Officer
>Lightwave Enterprises<
-
"Oh yeah? Well, back in my day we had to mine omber with our teeth! And walk back to the station to sell it. Up the gravity well. Both ways!" |
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