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ECCM - lowers chance of being scanned out

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Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 12:20:00 - [1] Edited by: Spurty on 05/05/2009 12:20:22 Sounds like a big nasty screw up type bug to me: ECCM description: Originally by: "description" A secondary electronic array that provides a significant boost to sensor strength for a short time. Penalty: Using more than one type of this module or similar modules that affect the same attribute on the ship will be penalized. Nothing here about reducing your ships signature radius. So, either this module is buggy and needs fixing or, the people saying ECCM has a use outside of trying to up the odds in your favor vs an ECM ship are smoking something. Which is it? Uncertain which forum to post to, please move it this is the wrong one. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 13:58:00 - [2] Originally by: Lumy To clarify: Signal strength of scanned ship is function of its sensor strength and signature radius. Higher sensor strength or lower signature radius => lower signal strength => harder to find. Working as intended. Signal Strength = would be defined by the object. Whatever it leaks, i.e. some signal such as radiation or a reflection from radar Sensor strength = your ships ability to tune in to signals, higher the strength you have, the weaker the signal you can pick up. Signature radius = affect on an object, of leaking data to help someone 'focus' in on you as a target. ECCM allows you to boost your ability to 'tune in' ONLY for a 'short time' (i.e. when its active). ECCM on should be leaking like freaking crazy! If anything, ECCM on should make you incredibly easy to find as you have increased the power your sensors are putting out. So although what you are saying is how this is working (I suppose), its broken, upside and and backwards. :-0 Well, as long as we all understand this is what CCP wants done. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 14:12:00 - [3] Oh and CCP, add this to the description, bonuses not being clearly labeled isn't nice. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 14:59:00 - [4] Originally by: Lumy <rp> ECCM allows you to filter distortions from input of your sensor arrays, so ECM will not overload your targeting systems. Under normal conditions, it helps you reduce distortions caused by natural sources. Effectively allowing you to use your active sensors at lower strength. Thus reducing your active profile. </rp> Where are you pulling this from? Its certainly not from the module description, which is my issue. How are people supposed to KNOW this if its not in the description? Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 15:04:00 - [5] Originally by: Bronson Hughes Most stuff in EvE isn't clearly labelled, yet most of us have figured it out anyways. EvE isn't about making things easy for people. Yes, thats 100% true, remember nano-fibres gave all three bonuses (Mass reduction, speed increase and inertia buff)? Oh yah, I recall what happened there, it got 'fixed'. But seriously, why put in a description for anything if you want people to learn by trial and error? How did ANYONE figure out this side affect ? Surely it was just 'noticed' accidentally or a dev told some people. If its intended, it should be in the description. Pretty simple really. No, I don't want ECCM to lose this bonus, it really needed a second use ;) Yes, I want it listed in the description. Why? When I need to know what module it is that does this when I have a relapse of memory and can't recall but need it so I can undock in the next 20 seconds when there is a free window of opportunity ;0 Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 15:40:00 - [6] Originally by: Esmenet Originally by: Spurty How did ANYONE figure out this side affect ? I cant find it now but in the old scanning guide there was a formula for calculating your ships signal strength. And its sig radius divided by sensor strenght. And eccm as you know increases sensor strength. Not really hard to figure out once you know the scanning mechanics. Er ... how is the targets sensor strength any part of that calculation???? Its the person scannings skill that affects that calculation. The target only opposes this with their radius. Really, doesn't make any sense at all the way you are saying it. I really need to see that formula if thats the case, seems like more 'weird science'. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 22:04:00 - [7] The attributes page, says nothing at all (Zilch) about whatever it is you are talking about, only that your strength goes up when this module is turned on. I can't accept what is so far, only opinions. All I do is I demand facts :0 Get the facts to me, not your opinions and I will study them. I am able to read formula as sadly, I am a comp sci graduate and advanced math and electronics was one of my fav modules (I find numbers and mathematics fascinating). Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 22:33:00 - [8] well sherlocks, I have done so and saw no difference, hence the need for clarification. When I see the math presented, I can see what the reduction value is and see just how much it helps. Apparently, no it doesn't in my limited testing Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 22:40:00 - [9] I'll retest again tonight and take print screens so its clear what I see. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.05 23:01:00 - [10] my attitude is born of frustration. I believe, the emperor has new cloths with this one. My limited testing attests to it. The proof isn't in the pudding for me .. but I'm not perfectly spec'ed as a prober, hence questioning of this entire 'undocumented' mechanic. Apparently, no one else has anything 'solid' to offer. I'm far from 'clever', but I do have plenty of common sense. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.

Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.06 00:14:00 - [11] Well, here's the (completed) answer in full: The full formula to calculate Signal Strength is: Signal Strength = (Probe Sensor Strength * (1 + Level of Astrometric Triangulation * 0.05) / 100) * (1 û (0.65 ((Target Range / Max Range) ^ 1.5))) * (Target Signature Radius / Target Sensor Strength) sorry for bothering you all, only took me 10 mins to find this once I realized it wasn't common knowledge (see some of the replies in this thread) and googled ;0 Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.06 00:46:00 - [12] I won't bother you with the code used, last time I did it got moderated anyway, but its pretty linear in that you 1/2 the chance of being probed with eccm. Using my character to seed: $ ./sigstr.pl Signal Str for unfitted tempest will be 1.50315789473684 @ 10AU Signal Str for ECCM fitted tempest will be 0.766917293233083 @ 10AU Now, if this is the formula, I haven't reproduced it lol. Also, do what with the ( $tsr / $tss ) part? tl;dr : I believe you that its part of the formula, I find the formula lacking in sense, I'm not seeing the difference myself (don't understand why), but its not my game ;0 Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.06 00:48:00 - [13] Originally by: Trimutius III I should say that me and my friend tested one interesting thing. Rook + Fleet Command Ship + Covert Ops. They are hanging at the same point Rook has ECCM and Projected ECCM and ECCMs itself and projects ECCM on CS, and then Cov Ops launches probes and tried to scan down Rook or Command Ship, and it was impossible and probes were placed idealy around CS and Rook. So we just get invulnerable Command Ship that gives bonuses to gang and sits on a spot with Rook. Excellent use of the mechanic. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.
Spurty Caldari Summer Summer Summer Fun	Posted - 2009.05.06 10:23:00 - [14] I didn't know where to look as the description doesn't mention this bonus (It really should, this is a HUGE reason to fit this module, its actually better than the primary reason). That was why I argued, I expected better from you guys, you usually hit the nail on the head ;0 No one else did either mind you and look at some of the looney arsed replies :) Thanks anyway for keeping it on my mind so I actually got the answer. Originally by: Infinity Ziona Thus I AM BETTER THAN YOU.

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