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Fuse
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:36:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Fuse on 05/09/2004 11:38:13
 Originally by: Jazz Bo
If the BPO was available from NPC corps, the item would sell for more or less it's mineral value, maybe even less.
Wrong! Even Tech one manufacturers make good isk. Just take a look at the cruise missiles and so on. Give me a break people make that lame comment over and over again it doesn't have any base to it. Cruise missiles take 20,000 to make (with market bought minerals) they sell for 32,000 and that is just one example.
0.o It's not you... no wait it is you. |
Fuse
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:36:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Fuse on 05/09/2004 11:38:13
Originally by: Jazz Bo
If the BPO was available from NPC corps, the item would sell for more or less it's mineral value, maybe even less.
Wrong! Even Tech one manufacturers make good isk. Just take a look at the cruise missiles and so on. Give me a break people make that lame comment over and over again it doesn't have any base to it. Cruise missiles take 20,000 to make (with market bought minerals) they sell for 32,000 and that is just one example.
0.o It's not you... no wait it is you. |
cashman
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:57:00 -
[33]
The people holding those Blueprints (Eg. CRIIs) deservers a good kick in the face. Greedy ****s.
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cashman
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Posted - 2004.09.05 11:57:00 -
[34]
The people holding those Blueprints (Eg. CRIIs) deservers a good kick in the face. Greedy ****s.
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Asmodia
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Posted - 2004.09.05 12:10:00 -
[35]
18 millions for a crow is not normal. I remmeber i bought Cap rec II for 1m each. but thats a long time ago.
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CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance
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Asmodia
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Posted - 2004.09.05 12:10:00 -
[36]
18 millions for a crow is not normal. I remmeber i bought Cap rec II for 1m each. but thats a long time ago.
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CEO of Spectre Syndicate - Curse Alliance
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Anice
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Posted - 2004.09.05 12:21:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Anice on 05/09/2004 12:23:14
Looks like most of the corps that have the bpo are crap and unable to produce them 24/7, either that or there is a cartel that keeps the prices high.
"Show me a sane man and I will cure him for you" - Carl Gustav Jung |
Anice
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Posted - 2004.09.05 12:21:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Anice on 05/09/2004 12:23:14
Looks like most of the corps that have the bpo are crap and unable to produce them 24/7, either that or there is a cartel that keeps the prices high.
"Show me a sane man and I will cure him for you" - Carl Gustav Jung |
Rha
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Posted - 2004.09.05 16:18:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:23:05
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:21:30
I would just like to say that it is not true that an alliance holds all the bpos, I got a cap charger 2 bpo with a char on another account and gave it to a corp mate to use, we still have it and he has made alot of money with it. 95% of the ones that were sold early on were sold for 2 mil isk. However at this price they are ALL bought immeddiately and put back on the market at greatlly increased prices. However you try to sell them at this price, demand far outstrips production and they are simply bought and sold on.
We are not a mega rich corp and I do not understand why people think we should sell these at reduced prices when all that will happen is they will be sold on. We make and sell for 2 mil and somone else buys and sells for 6-8 mil we do the work, they make the money, hardly fair. The outcome is the same, the price reamins the same.
The bottom line is this, this game is about succeeding at making money and obtaining items.
We have two options:
1. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 200 million
2. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 600-800 million.
Well thats a toughie, which do we choose ?.
The price will drop when people stop paying the high prices.
If the extra 2-3% cap charge rate is not worth 6-8 mil for you then do not pay it. For alot it is and they are paying it.
Nobody sells stuff for less than the maximum price they can get while still selling all the stock they can make.
End of story
I do not agree that releasing more cap 2 charger bpos is the answer, I think the answer is to release other bpos that dont seem to be materialising. Having alot of all bps makes everything worthless as was shown with tech 1 and stuff being sold at barely mineral prices. Haveing lots of different groups owning different bps will encourage trade and the economy etc.
We may charge what you consider alot for the tech 2 cap chargers, but we still pay alot or all the other tech 2 thigs we need, and pay ALOT for the massively inflated construction items we need to build them.
I personally have made less than 100 mil from the BPO I obtained so before you flame me because I have one, THAT is not the reason for my argument. I got very bored for along time before tech 2 was released because everything was too accesable. Eve as a whole has benefited from having things that are now difficult/ expensive to obtain and I personally like the universe alot more for it. Even if I did have to pay 9 mil for a frigate which cant now fire more than light missiles, LOL.
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Rha
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Posted - 2004.09.05 16:18:00 -
[40]
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:23:05
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:21:30
I would just like to say that it is not true that an alliance holds all the bpos, I got a cap charger 2 bpo with a char on another account and gave it to a corp mate to use, we still have it and he has made alot of money with it. 95% of the ones that were sold early on were sold for 2 mil isk. However at this price they are ALL bought immeddiately and put back on the market at greatlly increased prices. However you try to sell them at this price, demand far outstrips production and they are simply bought and sold on.
We are not a mega rich corp and I do not understand why people think we should sell these at reduced prices when all that will happen is they will be sold on. We make and sell for 2 mil and somone else buys and sells for 6-8 mil we do the work, they make the money, hardly fair. The outcome is the same, the price reamins the same.
The bottom line is this, this game is about succeeding at making money and obtaining items.
We have two options:
1. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 200 million
2. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 600-800 million.
Well thats a toughie, which do we choose ?.
The price will drop when people stop paying the high prices.
If the extra 2-3% cap charge rate is not worth 6-8 mil for you then do not pay it. For alot it is and they are paying it.
Nobody sells stuff for less than the maximum price they can get while still selling all the stock they can make.
End of story
I do not agree that releasing more cap 2 charger bpos is the answer, I think the answer is to release other bpos that dont seem to be materialising. Having alot of all bps makes everything worthless as was shown with tech 1 and stuff being sold at barely mineral prices. Haveing lots of different groups owning different bps will encourage trade and the economy etc.
We may charge what you consider alot for the tech 2 cap chargers, but we still pay alot or all the other tech 2 thigs we need, and pay ALOT for the massively inflated construction items we need to build them.
I personally have made less than 100 mil from the BPO I obtained so before you flame me because I have one, THAT is not the reason for my argument. I got very bored for along time before tech 2 was released because everything was too accesable. Eve as a whole has benefited from having things that are now difficult/ expensive to obtain and I personally like the universe alot more for it. Even if I did have to pay 9 mil for a frigate which cant now fire more than light missiles, LOL.
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.09.05 16:42:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:45:27
Exactly, the consumer drives the market. Too expensive? Dont use em.
Personally, I think its great. But blueprint copies for tech 2 need to go. And then maybe we can add a few more BPOs of them.
One thing that sucks, though, is that there is little or no customer loyalty on the EVE market. Once you get a customer, he doesnt even know or care who he bought from. There needs to be corporation differentiation on products sold.
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Selim
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Posted - 2004.09.05 16:42:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Selim on 05/09/2004 16:45:27
Exactly, the consumer drives the market. Too expensive? Dont use em.
Personally, I think its great. But blueprint copies for tech 2 need to go. And then maybe we can add a few more BPOs of them.
One thing that sucks, though, is that there is little or no customer loyalty on the EVE market. Once you get a customer, he doesnt even know or care who he bought from. There needs to be corporation differentiation on products sold.
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skitszo
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Posted - 2004.09.05 19:39:00 -
[43]
The patch that changed cap relays moved the cap recharger 2's to one of the most favorite energy modules and the supply dwindled and the prices went up and i remeber them being as high as 14 mill. Now they are 8 mill with a very High supply and no compitition. if the output out supplies the demand then perhaps the prices can edge down a tad as peeps in the monopoly try to liquidate for cash. as was mentioned would have to be gradual as the others will just buy them and resale.
There's a fine line on monopoly and market glut and no real profit trying to be a manufacturer. would be nice if CCP would ocassionally reveiw the BPO distribution and try to get little market compition going. Also i think BPC's of tech 2 should drop from agent missiosn and or rats or new content not yet seen. That way some of the production monopoly is diversified yat the owners of the BPO's aren't left out in the cold in their investments.
Cargo expander 1's i've never seen anyone ever sell a BPC to. I'm assuming this is a very exclusive club and not enough were released. OR they spawn on market in limited numbers and are bought up and resold forming a (i'm sure theres some proper name for it  ) invested capital monopoly. But its different with Miner2's. I see limited BPC's of those quite often and i think its rather nice service. the bpo owners still make money and the peeps buy them can manufactur the item in spots more convenient like 0.0 space.
Guess CCP doesn't intend to release the auto targeting module BPO.
still don't see the shield amp BPO. occassionally you can get bpc's of this and it really does cost the price you pay in market tp produce lol.
CCP apparently has no plans for the improved miner drones till post shiva release.
where the heck is the hull repairer large at ? 
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skitszo
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Posted - 2004.09.05 19:39:00 -
[44]
The patch that changed cap relays moved the cap recharger 2's to one of the most favorite energy modules and the supply dwindled and the prices went up and i remeber them being as high as 14 mill. Now they are 8 mill with a very High supply and no compitition. if the output out supplies the demand then perhaps the prices can edge down a tad as peeps in the monopoly try to liquidate for cash. as was mentioned would have to be gradual as the others will just buy them and resale.
There's a fine line on monopoly and market glut and no real profit trying to be a manufacturer. would be nice if CCP would ocassionally reveiw the BPO distribution and try to get little market compition going. Also i think BPC's of tech 2 should drop from agent missiosn and or rats or new content not yet seen. That way some of the production monopoly is diversified yat the owners of the BPO's aren't left out in the cold in their investments.
Cargo expander 1's i've never seen anyone ever sell a BPC to. I'm assuming this is a very exclusive club and not enough were released. OR they spawn on market in limited numbers and are bought up and resold forming a (i'm sure theres some proper name for it ) invested capital monopoly. But its different with Miner2's. I see limited BPC's of those quite often and i think its rather nice service. the bpo owners still make money and the peeps buy them can manufactur the item in spots more convenient like 0.0 space.
Guess CCP doesn't intend to release the auto targeting module BPO.
still don't see the shield amp BPO. occassionally you can get bpc's of this and it really does cost the price you pay in market tp produce lol.
CCP apparently has no plans for the improved miner drones till post shiva release.
where the heck is the hull repairer large at ?
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.09.05 20:30:00 -
[45]
The whole tech 2 lottery, while nice in theory in that it gives individuals / small corps a chance to get hold of the big tech 2 bpos, in effect stifles competition, due to the limited no of bpos made available, which allows many sellers to in effect price fix certain popular modules.
The bpos sell for extortionate prices, and the popular ones are hard to come buy for sale even if u do have the money. Hence if you want to be a manufacturer of tech 2 large hybrid guns for instance (coming soon), forget it since you canĘt unless you win one of the bpos in the lottery or you can out bid the mega corps.
IMHO - the tech 2 bpos should be made available on the market as well as in the agent lottery.
The whole market needs a big overhaul aswell.
Currently there is no way for one seller / manufacturer to distinguish their products from anotherĘs. Corp branding is needed, along with a way to improve products, e.g. improve attributes through research etc... and allow sellers to compete on more than price. Manufacturing items needs to be made more specialised also, since many corps just make all their own stuff. (I have posted at length on this somewhere)
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Xavier Arron
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Posted - 2004.09.05 20:30:00 -
[46]
The whole tech 2 lottery, while nice in theory in that it gives individuals / small corps a chance to get hold of the big tech 2 bpos, in effect stifles competition, due to the limited no of bpos made available, which allows many sellers to in effect price fix certain popular modules.
The bpos sell for extortionate prices, and the popular ones are hard to come buy for sale even if u do have the money. Hence if you want to be a manufacturer of tech 2 large hybrid guns for instance (coming soon), forget it since you canĘt unless you win one of the bpos in the lottery or you can out bid the mega corps.
IMHO - the tech 2 bpos should be made available on the market as well as in the agent lottery.
The whole market needs a big overhaul aswell.
Currently there is no way for one seller / manufacturer to distinguish their products from anotherĘs. Corp branding is needed, along with a way to improve products, e.g. improve attributes through research etc... and allow sellers to compete on more than price. Manufacturing items needs to be made more specialised also, since many corps just make all their own stuff. (I have posted at length on this somewhere)
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Qore
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Posted - 2004.09.05 21:24:00 -
[47]
Totally Agree with Xavier,
Originally all tech 1 BP's were available on the market, and some people were getting them as rewards from agents as well as the rare occurance you'd find one in a Rat loot can.
Miner2's was the first tech2 to come out, but at least that was fun... those that had to lose all those ships to the jove's and managed to come away with the bpc.
Now since eve tends to burn a whole in your heads about uniformity in the gaming design, why are NPC corp's having there agents give away tech2 bpo's to Joe schmoe here just cause has carried the appropriate amount of toxic waste back and forth to hangars.
Why aren't they selling them on the market? What real corp wouldn't?
Now for agent runners, getting a tech2 bpo is a big deal, its a free BPO. heck yeah whoopie!!
Well its ridiculious now, get the right tech2 BPO you just became Trump of EVE. Insurance and market research will never catch up to the extremely inflated costs.
I personally believe that some bigwig at dev HQ, was upset to find out after retail no one wanted to do his boring agent missions. So instead of making them fun or even somewhat interesting they placed the very lifeblood of future eve markets solely in the hands of agents.
How will this affect the market when the next tech level comes out, originally the plan was for ccp to bring us all the way up to tech 5 gear.
I guess when that happens we'll all have to run agent missions in new ships as long as its in safe space since insurance won't cover the price of anything you have.
Or you can blow the dust of the original tech 1 ships, and get slaughtered by training drones. But at least they're insured.
Bah, spread the wealth ccp.... cause a monopoly was all that castor was about... I pray Shiva will be different.
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Qore
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Posted - 2004.09.05 21:24:00 -
[48]
Totally Agree with Xavier,
Originally all tech 1 BP's were available on the market, and some people were getting them as rewards from agents as well as the rare occurance you'd find one in a Rat loot can.
Miner2's was the first tech2 to come out, but at least that was fun... those that had to lose all those ships to the jove's and managed to come away with the bpc.
Now since eve tends to burn a whole in your heads about uniformity in the gaming design, why are NPC corp's having there agents give away tech2 bpo's to Joe schmoe here just cause has carried the appropriate amount of toxic waste back and forth to hangars.
Why aren't they selling them on the market? What real corp wouldn't?
Now for agent runners, getting a tech2 bpo is a big deal, its a free BPO. heck yeah whoopie!!
Well its ridiculious now, get the right tech2 BPO you just became Trump of EVE. Insurance and market research will never catch up to the extremely inflated costs.
I personally believe that some bigwig at dev HQ, was upset to find out after retail no one wanted to do his boring agent missions. So instead of making them fun or even somewhat interesting they placed the very lifeblood of future eve markets solely in the hands of agents.
How will this affect the market when the next tech level comes out, originally the plan was for ccp to bring us all the way up to tech 5 gear.
I guess when that happens we'll all have to run agent missions in new ships as long as its in safe space since insurance won't cover the price of anything you have.
Or you can blow the dust of the original tech 1 ships, and get slaughtered by training drones. But at least they're insured.
Bah, spread the wealth ccp.... cause a monopoly was all that castor was about... I pray Shiva will be different.
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Dave10
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Posted - 2004.09.06 17:06:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Rha
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:23:05
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:21:30
We have two options:
1. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 200 million
2. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 600-800 million.
all well and good, but something you have to factor in. wether 100 cap recharger 2s at 6-8mil would actually sell. I can imagine a lot of people looking at them prices, and thinking **** off...as i did. however, 100 cap recharger 2s at 2mil each would sell like hot cakes (i would certainly buy some), meaning you just have to make more but could get more money faster.
sorry for bringing this thread back up btw 
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Dave10
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Posted - 2004.09.06 17:06:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Rha
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:23:05
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:21:30
We have two options:
1. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 200 million
2. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 600-800 million.
all well and good, but something you have to factor in. wether 100 cap recharger 2s at 6-8mil would actually sell. I can imagine a lot of people looking at them prices, and thinking **** off...as i did. however, 100 cap recharger 2s at 2mil each would sell like hot cakes (i would certainly buy some), meaning you just have to make more but could get more money faster.
sorry for bringing this thread back up btw
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El Yatta
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Posted - 2005.05.30 17:22:00 -
[51]
Edited by: El Yatta on 30/05/2005 17:23:16
Originally by: Dave10
Originally by: Rha
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:23:05
Edited by: Rha on 05/09/2004 16:21:30
We have two options:
1. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 200 million
2. Make 100 cap 2 chargers and sell for 600-800 million.
all well and good, but something you have to factor in. wether 100 cap recharger 2s at 6-8mil would actually sell. I can imagine a lot of people looking at them prices, and thinking **** off...as i did. however, 100 cap recharger 2s at 2mil each would sell like hot cakes (i would certainly buy some), meaning you just have to make more but could get more money faster.
sorry for bringing this thread back up btw
EDIT: accidental bump, lock please.
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Kade Shaderow
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Posted - 2005.05.30 17:45:00 -
[52]
Edited by: Kade Shaderow on 30/05/2005 17:45:22
Bumping for irony.
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Exarch
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Posted - 2005.05.30 19:17:00 -
[53]
Another day another group of people crying about T2. If you could buy it on the market it would be worthless, and t2 comps would quadruple in price overnight. Not to mention destroy what many players have invested billions in.
Lets add faction ships and commander mods to the market while we're at it, or just give everybody one of everything.. because if you can't have everything it ruins your game, you poor poor people. 
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Grosvenor Corama
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Posted - 2005.05.30 19:22:00 -
[54]
The thread commanded me to tell you that "I just want to be left alone, and sleep, I'm 7 months old, that's way past the experation date of a thread"
~{Forum Rules}~ ♥ ~{contact us}~ |
Wild Rho
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Posted - 2005.05.30 19:23:00 -
[55]
To help prevent the formation of tech 2 cartels without making tech 2 items too common research agents could release a set number of npcs for each item related to their field using the lottery system atm.
A tech 2 bpcs stats (such as ME/PE etc) could be slightly randomized and base on the players research skills and the agent quality and level.
This means that there is room for temporary competition on the markets for tech 2 items and tech 2 bpcs helping reduce the price of tech 2 items or at least help prevent cartels becoming established to dictate prices.
I have the body of a supermodel. I just can't remember where I left it... |
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