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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.05.21 17:44:00 -
[1]
So that's the Nagalfar looked at, i notice the Blackops thread is unstickied and the agility thread has outlived its usefulness (as has the Ngalfar thread really)
Perhaps its time for a Dev. to open discussion on other issues identified by the players as needing re-balancing?
Such as Projectiles, POS warfare/Sov, Blasters, and the imbalance of risk vs. reward in Highsec (and to Lowsec)?
I would quote an excellent post in the general balance thread listing the most raised topics in the first 20 or so pages, sadly i cannot find it.
 Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep.
I am always here.
Watching.
Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
it does get progressively longer.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari
State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.21 17:57:00 -
[2]
Missiles need to be looked at badly. Their only "pro" right now is that you can switch ammo type. But with all the nerfs it doesn't matter anymore. And the fact that caldari ships mostly just have bonus to 1 type is laughable. They need to be rethought and redone  .
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Ahz
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Posted - 2009.05.21 18:09:00 -
[3]
Missiles and projectiles should knock their targets around in addition to doing damage.
Not only is this consistent with the underlying physics, it would add something really cool to the game play.
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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.05.21 18:16:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Matrix Skye
Missiles need to be looked at badly. Their only "pro" right now is that you can switch ammo type. But with all the nerfs it doesn't matter anymore. And the fact that caldari ships mostly just have bonus to 1 type is laughable. They need to be rethought and redone .
I see the biggest issues with Torps and Cit. Torps, to a lesser extent mediums- specifically the nature of the damage reduction due to speed. Light missiles are fine as they are.
With missiles and missile boats i find that people are overwhelmingly making use of terrible fits. Perhaps this is a hang-on from the multitude of Caldari Mission runners, perhaps not.
I cannot remember the last time is saw a Carracal fit intelligently, nor a Raven pilot sacrificing some of his tank to make himself effective in a gang.
Regardless the issue is compounded by people not using Missiles to their strengths nor the ships bonus'd for them: which you are correct in thinking need looking at again, having dmg boni to racial damage types alone is a poor sop towards 'flavour' and gimps missile boats in ways turrets dont have to take into account.
Be that as it is, missiles always hit targets in range; excepting some interceptors.
A point to make: Torps were overpowered before the speed and missile nerfs and the cries that missiles were gimped were raised by people that didn't know how to fly or fit outside of missions running into the meatgrinder against people whom did
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep.
I am always here.
Watching.
Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
it does get progressively longer.
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RedSplat
Heretic Army
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Posted - 2009.05.21 18:17:00 -
[5]
Edited by: RedSplat on 21/05/2009 18:17:44
Cursed Doublepost
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
I don't sleep.
I am always here.
Watching.
Waiting.
Originally by: CCP Mitnal
it does get progressively longer.
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Halycon Gamma
Caldari
The Flying Tigers
United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.21 20:03:00 -
[6]
I'd like to point out, that on this list there are only two missile modules listed in the top 20 for getting kills.
http://eve-kill.net/?a=top20&type=fotmweapons
And you still think missiles are balanced?
Lets forget missiles though. How about rockets. Just fix rockets.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari
State War Academy
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Posted - 2009.05.21 20:29:00 -
[7]
I'm sure there are fits out there that do no justice to Caldari ships. We can say the same about all races. But fact still remains that missiles have become second class to guns. Rockets and cruise especially are in dire need of a buff. Caldari are slowly sinking to the bottom.
And yes, they are a popular race no doubt. But it's mostly because of background story and looks. I chose Caldari years ago because I liked their storyline the best. And nerf after nerf I adapt. But it's getting ridiculous now.
And yes, Caldari is a support race. But it's getting to the point where it doesn't make a difference if you're in fleet or not. Outcome is still the same and you're not really needed on a missile boat.
And after the "torp buff" it's arguable if Caldari still hold the crown in PVE. There are some really good ships out there that compete well with missile ships on level 4. But I agree that heavy missiles are still decent (atleast for now and until the nerf bat swings again).
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.05.22 06:02:00 -
[8]
Originally by: RedSplat
Regardless the issue is compounded by people not using Missiles to their strengths nor the ships bonus'd for them: which you are correct in thinking need looking at again, having dmg boni to racial damage types alone is a poor sop towards 'flavour' and gimps missile boats in ways turrets dont have to take into account.
For Hybrids and Laser the limitation to 2 kind of damage is integral in the weapon, so they are gimped in that regard.
Artillery has his own set of problems.
Missiles have some problem (mostly rockets and other unguided missiles) but they don't are so overwhelming as some people claim.
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Halycon Gamma
Caldari
The Flying Tigers
United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.22 06:58:00 -
[9]
I dunno. The only thing I'm certain of, is that I'm tired of the nerfbat. Whatever CCP does, if they swing it again I'm gunna be upset.
There seems to be a massive disconnect between everyone in this game and reality, on something of rather large importance. There are two prevailing opinions about training skills in Eve, that for the most part everyone seems to agree with in one form or another, but are also mutually exclusive. They are as follows.
1. Don't specialize because sooner or later what you specialize in is going to be nerfed, do a bit of everything.
2. New players can compete with older players if they specialize.
Anyone see the problem here? Anyone?
Its an endless damn cycle, and I'm tired of it. Train for one thing trying to compete, its nerfed, train for another, its nerfed. Again and again. For me it doesn't matter too much. But I'm really tired of sitting down with new players and trying to explain to them that while "This, That, and The Other are awesome, you don't wanna do them because chances are one of them won't be awesome by the time you get to it. I don't know which one, but one will.".
So please, pretty please, no matter what you do... can we have just one patch in which under utilized systems are boosted, instead of over utilized systems being nerfed.
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Allen Ramses
Caldari
Typo Corp
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Posted - 2009.05.22 07:04:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Missiles have some problem (mostly rockets and other unguided missiles) but they don't are so overwhelming as some people claim.
Hardly.
While heavy missiles and HAMs are nearly perfect as they are (with a few faults), the other weapons are DEFINITELY overwhelming. There are issues with terribad damage reduction based on horribad tracking mechanics, the absolute damage reduction based on sig radius alone, the absurdly impractical long range, the deplorable DPS of rockets, light missiles, and cruise missiles, the Guided Missile Precision skill only affecting half the missiles, the ability for frigates to literally outrun the missile velocity...
the list goes on and on.
____________________
CCP: Catering to the cowards of a cold, harsh universe since November, 2006. |
Roemy Schneider
BINFORD
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Posted - 2009.05.22 11:20:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Halycon Gamma
I'd like to point out, that on this list there are only two missile modules listed in the top 20 for getting kills.
http://eve-kill.net/?a=top20&type=fotmweapons
And you still think missiles are balanced?
Lets forget missiles though. How about rockets. Just fix rockets.
i'm inclined to say that that's due to missiles sometimes appearing on the killmail as "havy missle launcher II" or "Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile" - or any other damage type for that matter
despite all that, HML is still #1 -.-
-
putting the gist back into logistics |
Halycon Gamma
Caldari
The Flying Tigers
United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.23 04:47:00 -
[12]
Doesn't matter if Heavy Missiles are number one. There are 142,139 kills listed there, from April 22, to May 22.
Missiles Account for 19,922 of them. Or 14%.
So lets do a quick run through...
Missiles - 19,922 - 14%
Projectiles - 50,288 - 35%
Lasers - 39,689 - 27%
Hybrid - 31,190 - 22%
And somewhere I missed a grand worth of kills in my quick adding so... +/-1%.
You can further break those down if you want to long range and short range. But the gist of the list is this. Projectiles, no matter if people yell about them being under powered or not.. get the lions share of the kills out of the 4 highslot weapons systems in the game. Lasers and Hybrids are about where they should be. And missiles are trailing way down in last place, even though I could easily argue more people have missile skills than any any other weapons platform in eve.
So something, somewhere, is obviously off from this data list. It could be that its not an inclusive enough list, and the data set would show something completely different if there was one big all inclusive eve kill board. But I kinda doubt the picture would change all that much if you started adding in different killboards to it.
And at this point, you can't really argue that its because of old skill points blurring the data set. At this point everyone has had more than enough time to spec into different weapons platforms since the last big nerf.
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Zurrar
Gallente
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2009.05.23 07:52:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Zurrar on 23/05/2009 07:53:36
i dunno, my drake does some pretty insane dps with heavy missiles ^_^
i pvp in drake, ppl call me noob for it, but i like my drake, i use nighthawk for pve and drake for pvp...
besides, the drake puts out some good dps with a good buffer (or decent active) tank, as to where the harb for example has crap for tank with good dps or crap dps for a semi ok tank.
myrm i like cause you can get a decent active tank out of it, and i like drones aswell... altho i dont see many use guns on myrm.
[yellow]Sig removed, only one graphic per sig please. If you would like further details please [url="http://support.eve-onl |
Zurrar
Gallente
Epiphyte Mining and Exploration
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2009.05.23 07:56:00 -
[14]
Originally by: RedSplat
I see the biggest issues with Torps and Cit. Torps,
torps are fine, a while back i was always primed by the pirates that would raid our space because my raven did so much dps (torp spec 4)
cits need to be changed-
rof increased on citadel torpedoes, range reduced ALOT... make them like the standard bs torps, lotsa dps no range.
add citadel cruise launchers, long range, medium rof, high alpha, like the current cits are.
that gives nag and phoenix the option- range or close range, nag can fit arty and cit cruises and be effective. make cit cruises considerably fast as well and give them the range current cits are at.
[yellow]Sig removed, only one graphic per sig please. If you would like further details please [url="http://support.eve-onl |
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