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A new war: the "personal vendetta"

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Jungle Jim	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:13:00 - [31] I like it, You would only really be annoyed with one person at a time so 1 vendettat slot? (Unless ur easily annoyed) The < 1 month old char thing would not stop dedicated ore thieves, they would just start over... JJ * Proud First Time Winner of the MLM Muppet Award *
Jungle Jim	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:13:00 - [32] I like it, You would only really be annoyed with one person at a time so 1 vendettat slot? (Unless ur easily annoyed) The < 1 month old char thing would not stop dedicated ore thieves, they would just start over... JJ * Proud First Time Winner of the MLM Muppet Award *
Sparhawk	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:21:00 - [33] Point of View: Personal vendettas are all fine and dandy, but what is to stop pirates from picking innocent pilots as an excuse to enter 0.5 -1.0 and pod. Suggestion: (1) Pilots who are not in a player corporation cannot set bountys, or vendettas. This will stop experienced players from hiding behind NPC Corps like cowards. If they would like to go after a player while in an NPC then they can hire a Merc corp. (2) Player corporations are limited to the total number of bountys that can be placed on pilots per month. (3) Security Officers within player corporations are the only players who can place a bounty on a player. (4) Players who have bountys placed on them can be tracked using the Map Feature. Perhaps there can be a skill called Bounty Hunter which allows those trained to track the bounty they have elected to pursue. Once a player collects a bounty it is listed in their profile.
Sparhawk	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:21:00 - [34] Point of View: Personal vendettas are all fine and dandy, but what is to stop pirates from picking innocent pilots as an excuse to enter 0.5 -1.0 and pod. Suggestion: (1) Pilots who are not in a player corporation cannot set bountys, or vendettas. This will stop experienced players from hiding behind NPC Corps like cowards. If they would like to go after a player while in an NPC then they can hire a Merc corp. (2) Player corporations are limited to the total number of bountys that can be placed on pilots per month. (3) Security Officers within player corporations are the only players who can place a bounty on a player. (4) Players who have bountys placed on them can be tracked using the Map Feature. Perhaps there can be a skill called Bounty Hunter which allows those trained to track the bounty they have elected to pursue. Once a player collects a bounty it is listed in their profile.
Shiakarma	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:28:00 - [35] Wow I've never seen so many people all agree with meowcat (j/k ) I'm all for this idea, sounds pretty good. If the number of vendettas was limited against a person it would protect the noobs (who could manage to avoid just a few people) and make it a little more difficult to bounty hunt anyone of any decent value in empire (otherwise pirates would all have 100's of personal vendettas and they'd only whine on the boards ). Computer games don't affect children. If PacMan had affected us as kids then we'd all be running around in dark rooms, munching pills and listening to repetitive music.
Shiakarma	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:28:00 - [36] Wow I've never seen so many people all agree with meowcat (j/k ) I'm all for this idea, sounds pretty good. If the number of vendettas was limited against a person it would protect the noobs (who could manage to avoid just a few people) and make it a little more difficult to bounty hunt anyone of any decent value in empire (otherwise pirates would all have 100's of personal vendettas and they'd only whine on the boards ). Computer games don't affect children. If PacMan had affected us as kids then we'd all be running around in dark rooms, munching pills and listening to repetitive music.
meowcat	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:30:00 - [37] Originally by: Sparhawk Point of View: Personal vendettas are all fine and dandy, but what is to stop pirates from picking innocent pilots as an excuse to enter 0.5 -1.0 and pod. Suggestion: (1) Pilots who are not in a player corporation cannot set bountys, or vendettas. This will stop experienced players from hiding behind NPC Corps like cowards. If they would like to go after a player while in an NPC then they can hire a Merc corp. (2) Player corporations are limited to the total number of bountys that can be placed on pilots per month. (3) Security Officers within player corporations are the only players who can place a bounty on a player. (4) Players who have bountys placed on them can be tracked using the Map Feature. Perhaps there can be a skill called Bounty Hunter which allows those trained to track the bounty they have elected to pursue. Once a player collects a bounty it is listed in their profile. i dont think this should effect the existing restrictions on personal sec status and system sec status (ie: if you're -10 you still wont be able to enter 1.0) same as a corp war really (1) i think anyone should be able to declare a vendetta. obviously the person you are declaring against can shoot back, regardless of what corp you/they are in (2) good idea... limits of various kinds are needed to reduce exploits (3) seems reasonable (4) this might make it too easy. agents can track people for you. Although this idea does help with the bounty hunting career, it shouldnt be viewed as such exclusively. Personal vendettas could be declared for all sorts of reasons: "you stole my ore", "you scammed me", "your face offends me" etc
meowcat	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:30:00 - [38] Originally by: Sparhawk Point of View: Personal vendettas are all fine and dandy, but what is to stop pirates from picking innocent pilots as an excuse to enter 0.5 -1.0 and pod. Suggestion: (1) Pilots who are not in a player corporation cannot set bountys, or vendettas. This will stop experienced players from hiding behind NPC Corps like cowards. If they would like to go after a player while in an NPC then they can hire a Merc corp. (2) Player corporations are limited to the total number of bountys that can be placed on pilots per month. (3) Security Officers within player corporations are the only players who can place a bounty on a player. (4) Players who have bountys placed on them can be tracked using the Map Feature. Perhaps there can be a skill called Bounty Hunter which allows those trained to track the bounty they have elected to pursue. Once a player collects a bounty it is listed in their profile. i dont think this should effect the existing restrictions on personal sec status and system sec status (ie: if you're -10 you still wont be able to enter 1.0) same as a corp war really (1) i think anyone should be able to declare a vendetta. obviously the person you are declaring against can shoot back, regardless of what corp you/they are in (2) good idea... limits of various kinds are needed to reduce exploits (3) seems reasonable (4) this might make it too easy. agents can track people for you. Although this idea does help with the bounty hunting career, it shouldnt be viewed as such exclusively. Personal vendettas could be declared for all sorts of reasons: "you stole my ore", "you scammed me", "your face offends me" etc
War Games	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:47:00 - [39] *Breaking News* Due to meowcat's suggestion involving some sort of logic... CCP mainframe has aquired a new bug. Please don't post things that involve logic or would make the game fun against such things as ore pests / n00b corp pirates.... this will only make matters worse.... CCP computers were reported in the usual computer voices of mumbling... "Logic... does not compute.... see irrational dev for help in logical manners... does not compute... must bug market.... must bug lag.... logic.... server node crash....." HEHE... btw... on topic... this is a good idea in my opinion... What Eve Dev's really think of you!
War Games	Posted - 2004.09.09 15:47:00 - [40] *Breaking News* Due to meowcat's suggestion involving some sort of logic... CCP mainframe has aquired a new bug. Please don't post things that involve logic or would make the game fun against such things as ore pests / n00b corp pirates.... this will only make matters worse.... CCP computers were reported in the usual computer voices of mumbling... "Logic... does not compute.... see irrational dev for help in logical manners... does not compute... must bug market.... must bug lag.... logic.... server node crash....." HEHE... btw... on topic... this is a good idea in my opinion... What Eve Dev's really think of you!
Vex Seraphim	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:01:00 - [41] Rethought the idea, sounds ok if: vendettas should be ONLY allowed on people who either have a bounty, a -sec status or both. ------------------- :: finite horizon :: killboard :: :: bio :: blog ::
Vex Seraphim	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:01:00 - [42] Rethought the idea, sounds ok if: vendettas should be ONLY allowed on people who either have a bounty, a -sec status or both. ------------------- :: finite horizon :: killboard :: :: bio :: blog ::
Scorpyn	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:04:00 - [43] 1. Select a target in a corp 2. Everybody goes to different corps, and then declares a personal vendetta against that person This will make it possible to declare war on a person by multiple ppl without being able to get the corp mates to defend the person, as there is no single corp to declare war on and they will be too many to declare a personal vendetta on every single person. The only valid reason I see for this is to be able to get ppl hiding in npc corps, but then it should only be possible against ppl in npc corps.
Scorpyn	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:04:00 - [44] 1. Select a target in a corp 2. Everybody goes to different corps, and then declares a personal vendetta against that person This will make it possible to declare war on a person by multiple ppl without being able to get the corp mates to defend the person, as there is no single corp to declare war on and they will be too many to declare a personal vendetta on every single person. The only valid reason I see for this is to be able to get ppl hiding in npc corps, but then it should only be possible against ppl in npc corps.
meowcat	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:13:00 - [45] Edited by: meowcat on 09/09/2004 16:16:51 Originally by: Scorpyn 1. Select a target in a corp 2. Everybody goes to different corps, and then declares a personal vendetta against that person This will make it possible to declare war on a person by multiple ppl without being able to get the corp mates to defend the person, as there is no single corp to declare war on and they will be too many to declare a personal vendetta on every single person. The only valid reason I see for this is to be able to get ppl hiding in npc corps, but then it should only be possible against ppl in npc corps. that would be a waste for 'vendetta' slots there are lots of good reasons for this idea, some of which have been spelt out quite clearly in this thread - it makes bounty hunting viable - it stops ppl hiding in noob corps - it allows junior corp members to act against their enemies without having to persuade the directors to use up a war slot - it allows other personal gripes to be resolved without dragging the whole corp into a personal issue - duelling!!! - it creates ACCOUNTABILITY yes, it's a raw idea, and it needs detailed work to make sure it isn't expoitable... but it's based on the existing corp war system. edit: the problems you identify could easily be countered by (a) limiting the number of declarations each person can issue and recieve at any given time, (b) charging ISK for each declaration.... also several other constraints already mentioned.
meowcat	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:13:00 - [46] Edited by: meowcat on 09/09/2004 16:16:51 Originally by: Scorpyn 1. Select a target in a corp 2. Everybody goes to different corps, and then declares a personal vendetta against that person This will make it possible to declare war on a person by multiple ppl without being able to get the corp mates to defend the person, as there is no single corp to declare war on and they will be too many to declare a personal vendetta on every single person. The only valid reason I see for this is to be able to get ppl hiding in npc corps, but then it should only be possible against ppl in npc corps. that would be a waste for 'vendetta' slots there are lots of good reasons for this idea, some of which have been spelt out quite clearly in this thread - it makes bounty hunting viable - it stops ppl hiding in noob corps - it allows junior corp members to act against their enemies without having to persuade the directors to use up a war slot - it allows other personal gripes to be resolved without dragging the whole corp into a personal issue - duelling!!! - it creates ACCOUNTABILITY yes, it's a raw idea, and it needs detailed work to make sure it isn't expoitable... but it's based on the existing corp war system. edit: the problems you identify could easily be countered by (a) limiting the number of declarations each person can issue and recieve at any given time, (b) charging ISK for each declaration.... also several other constraints already mentioned.
Thraxll	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:19:00 - [47] Originally by: Vex Seraphim Rethought the idea, sounds ok if: vendettas should be ONLY allowed on people who either have a bounty, a -sec status or both. I like the overall idea, but not the above suggestions. An ore thief (which I believe is primarily what this is about) isn't generally likely to have a -sec status. As for bounties, I don't get why more people don't understand that placing a bounty on an "enemy" is the same thing as giving them money. If I had a bounty on my head I'd have my other account pod myself and collect the free money. If I didn't have another account I'd ask a friend or corp mate to create an alt and have them pod me (and perhaps give them a slight commission payment from the free money I just earned.) Any idea that involves the "bounty" system is a no-go IMO. "The long and short of it is that this game, or any game, is either going to be a kindergarten where it's safe and cuddly and secure and you can play with plush tigers, or it will be a harsh place, harsh but interesting and interesting because harsh, where you must take risks to succeed and so must everyone, since victory is tasteless without danger." - Raivn Akhama
Thraxll	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:19:00 - [48] Originally by: Vex Seraphim Rethought the idea, sounds ok if: vendettas should be ONLY allowed on people who either have a bounty, a -sec status or both. I like the overall idea, but not the above suggestions. An ore thief (which I believe is primarily what this is about) isn't generally likely to have a -sec status. As for bounties, I don't get why more people don't understand that placing a bounty on an "enemy" is the same thing as giving them money. If I had a bounty on my head I'd have my other account pod myself and collect the free money. If I didn't have another account I'd ask a friend or corp mate to create an alt and have them pod me (and perhaps give them a slight commission payment from the free money I just earned.) Any idea that involves the "bounty" system is a no-go IMO. "The long and short of it is that this game, or any game, is either going to be a kindergarten where it's safe and cuddly and secure and you can play with plush tigers, or it will be a harsh place, harsh but interesting and interesting because harsh, where you must take risks to succeed and so must everyone, since victory is tasteless without danger." - Raivn Akhama
Sparhawk	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:45:00 - [49] i dont think this should effect the existing restrictions on personal sec status and system sec status (ie: if you're -10 you still wont be able to enter 1.0) same as a corp war really (1) i think anyone should be able to declare a vendetta. obviously the person you are declaring against can shoot back, regardless of what corp you/they are in (2) good idea... limits of various kinds are needed to reduce exploits (3) seems reasonable (4) this might make it too easy. agents can track people for you. Perhaps we could limit the view to the pilot who agreed to take the bounty contract. Although this idea does help with the bounty hunting career, it shouldnt be viewed as such exclusively. Personal vendettas could be declared for all sorts of reasons: "you stole my ore", "you scammed me", "your face offends me" etc I stand corrected. I would agree that my post is dealing with two different issues.
Sparhawk	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:45:00 - [50] i dont think this should effect the existing restrictions on personal sec status and system sec status (ie: if you're -10 you still wont be able to enter 1.0) same as a corp war really (1) i think anyone should be able to declare a vendetta. obviously the person you are declaring against can shoot back, regardless of what corp you/they are in (2) good idea... limits of various kinds are needed to reduce exploits (3) seems reasonable (4) this might make it too easy. agents can track people for you. Perhaps we could limit the view to the pilot who agreed to take the bounty contract. Although this idea does help with the bounty hunting career, it shouldnt be viewed as such exclusively. Personal vendettas could be declared for all sorts of reasons: "you stole my ore", "you scammed me", "your face offends me" etc I stand corrected. I would agree that my post is dealing with two different issues.
Cadman Weyland	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:46:00 - [51] I like. Spells death to Zeepo, Tech 2 Shoppe and their ilk. Ore thives and escrow scammers are dead if this comes in. Pity the $*&% that ripped me off for 65 mil never ever undocks from a station. Director of Empire Ops and Chief Carebear
Cadman Weyland	Posted - 2004.09.09 16:46:00 - [52] I like. Spells death to Zeepo, Tech 2 Shoppe and their ilk. Ore thives and escrow scammers are dead if this comes in. Pity the $*&% that ripped me off for 65 mil never ever undocks from a station. Director of Empire Ops and Chief Carebear
Raeff	Posted - 2004.09.09 17:59:00 - [53] just got 3 comments: A) YES B) YES!!! C) OH GOD YES!!! ..whew, i need a smoke now
Raeff	Posted - 2004.09.09 17:59:00 - [54] just got 3 comments: A) YES B) YES!!! C) OH GOD YES!!! ..whew, i need a smoke now
stinky fecker	Posted - 2004.09.09 20:42:00 - [55] bloody good idea
stinky fecker	Posted - 2004.09.09 20:42:00 - [56] bloody good idea
Kaillam	Posted - 2004.09.09 21:37:00 - [57] Originally by: Thraxll As for bounties, I don't get why more people don't understand that placing a bounty on an "enemy" is the same thing as giving them money. If I had a bounty on my head I'd have my other account pod myself and collect the free money. If I didn't have another account I'd ask a friend or corp mate to create an alt and have them pod me (and perhaps give them a slight commission payment from the free money I just earned.) Any idea that involves the "bounty" system is a no-go IMO. ...not if they have implants...
Kaillam	Posted - 2004.09.09 21:37:00 - [58] Originally by: Thraxll As for bounties, I don't get why more people don't understand that placing a bounty on an "enemy" is the same thing as giving them money. If I had a bounty on my head I'd have my other account pod myself and collect the free money. If I didn't have another account I'd ask a friend or corp mate to create an alt and have them pod me (and perhaps give them a slight commission payment from the free money I just earned.) Any idea that involves the "bounty" system is a no-go IMO. ...not if they have implants...
Thraxll	Posted - 2004.09.09 21:42:00 - [59] Originally by: Kaillam Originally by: Thraxll As for bounties, I don't get why more people don't understand that placing a bounty on an "enemy" is the same thing as giving them money. If I had a bounty on my head I'd have my other account pod myself and collect the free money. If I didn't have another account I'd ask a friend or corp mate to create an alt and have them pod me (and perhaps give them a slight commission payment from the free money I just earned.) Any idea that involves the "bounty" system is a no-go IMO. ...not if they have implants... Yeah, yeah, they lose their implants (if they even have any.) Just looking at the billboards I see some bounties that'd more than cover a decent (not top of the line, sure) set of implants. They STILL come out ahead. Not to mention the fact that there's no way to know if your target has implants, anyway. And besides, I'm sure that most hardcore PVP players (such as pirates that tend to get bounties on their heads) are running around without implants (or with only the cheap ones) as they tend to run a high risk of being podded on a regular basis. The bounty system is a joke, IMO. "The long and short of it is that this game, or any game, is either going to be a kindergarten where it's safe and cuddly and secure and you can play with plush tigers, or it will be a harsh place, harsh but interesting and interesting because harsh, where you must take risks to succeed and so must everyone, since victory is tasteless without danger." - Raivn Akhama
Thraxll	Posted - 2004.09.09 21:42:00 - [60] Originally by: Kaillam Originally by: Thraxll As for bounties, I don't get why more people don't understand that placing a bounty on an "enemy" is the same thing as giving them money. If I had a bounty on my head I'd have my other account pod myself and collect the free money. If I didn't have another account I'd ask a friend or corp mate to create an alt and have them pod me (and perhaps give them a slight commission payment from the free money I just earned.) Any idea that involves the "bounty" system is a no-go IMO. ...not if they have implants... Yeah, yeah, they lose their implants (if they even have any.) Just looking at the billboards I see some bounties that'd more than cover a decent (not top of the line, sure) set of implants. They STILL come out ahead. Not to mention the fact that there's no way to know if your target has implants, anyway. And besides, I'm sure that most hardcore PVP players (such as pirates that tend to get bounties on their heads) are running around without implants (or with only the cheap ones) as they tend to run a high risk of being podded on a regular basis. The bounty system is a joke, IMO. "The long and short of it is that this game, or any game, is either going to be a kindergarten where it's safe and cuddly and secure and you can play with plush tigers, or it will be a harsh place, harsh but interesting and interesting because harsh, where you must take risks to succeed and so must everyone, since victory is tasteless without danger." - Raivn Akhama

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