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Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.10 14:23:00 - [1] Is there no honourable person left in eve? I build IntyÆs quite often and sell them for decent prices considering I have to go round get the components and bpcs for them.... IÆm sick to death of people buying them and jacking the price up and chuckin them back on the market or on escrowàthis is one builder whoÆs never ever going to build any more intyÆs at all except for friends.
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.10 14:23:00 - [2] Is there no honourable person left in eve? I build IntyÆs quite often and sell them for decent prices considering I have to go round get the components and bpcs for them.... IÆm sick to death of people buying them and jacking the price up and chuckin them back on the market or on escrowàthis is one builder whoÆs never ever going to build any more intyÆs at all except for friends.
Barth3zzzNL	Posted - 2004.09.10 16:11:00 - [3] Whine...You make money by building them. Other people make money by buying crap and selling it for a higher price... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Barth3zzzNL	Posted - 2004.09.10 16:11:00 - [4] Whine...You make money by building them. Other people make money by buying crap and selling it for a higher price... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Shamad Conde	Posted - 2004.09.10 16:32:00 - [5] Increase the price of your products to resolve the problem. If the demand is high, I am surprised that you have not figured out that it would be happening this way. What do you think people like NAGA corp are suffering from. Same thing. People praise their prices, buy their products and then re-sell for double the price.
Shamad Conde	Posted - 2004.09.10 16:32:00 - [6] Increase the price of your products to resolve the problem. If the demand is high, I am surprised that you have not figured out that it would be happening this way. What do you think people like NAGA corp are suffering from. Same thing. People praise their prices, buy their products and then re-sell for double the price.
Genghis Eagles	Posted - 2004.09.10 21:42:00 - [7] Do you do Crows? I'll have one before you retire if your prices are as good as you suggest. Black Dot Corp - Idiots with Missiles
Genghis Eagles	Posted - 2004.09.10 21:42:00 - [8] Do you do Crows? I'll have one before you retire if your prices are as good as you suggest. Black Dot Corp - Idiots with Missiles
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.10 22:59:00 - [9] i sold crows/taranis/crusaders/maledictions....got some crusaders and maledictions left which ill get rid off and then thats it. Is not worth the effort of getting the components and bpcs, crow bpcs are so damn hard to come by ud think no1 has a bpo of it, even if do find a bpc some1 wants like 5mil a run for it I think my prices were good. I sold at these prices considering i have no ceptor bpos and only bpcs. Crow 11mil Taranis 10mil Crusader 9mil Malediction 9mil anyways never building anymore for sale to general public
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.10 22:59:00 - [10] i sold crows/taranis/crusaders/maledictions....got some crusaders and maledictions left which ill get rid off and then thats it. Is not worth the effort of getting the components and bpcs, crow bpcs are so damn hard to come by ud think no1 has a bpo of it, even if do find a bpc some1 wants like 5mil a run for it I think my prices were good. I sold at these prices considering i have no ceptor bpos and only bpcs. Crow 11mil Taranis 10mil Crusader 9mil Malediction 9mil anyways never building anymore for sale to general public
WhiteTiger	Posted - 2004.09.10 23:41:00 - [11] Not really sure what your problem is. If people where buying your products and reselling them at a higher price this means you selling them below the market value. This should be a hint that you can increase the prices. If you where happy with the amount of profit you where making why quit? Although the people buying your products maybe unhappy that you quit, anyone competing with you will be more than happy that you have removed yourself from the market, allowing them to collect the isk you don't seem to want. People seem to have a misconception that the market value of an item is based on the cost of production. Items in high demand have a market value much greater than the parts they are made of. On the other hand there are items with no demand, that will be unlikely to ever sell for the price of their parts. If ccp doesn't fix some the items to make them useful I would guess there will be more complaints as people get offered wonderful tech2 blueprints such as Damage Control 2, Reinforced Bulkheads 2, and other prints for items nobody uses. These prints will be basically useless since the cost of producing the item will be many times what anyone would pay for one, assuming they would buy one at all.
WhiteTiger	Posted - 2004.09.10 23:41:00 - [12] Not really sure what your problem is. If people where buying your products and reselling them at a higher price this means you selling them below the market value. This should be a hint that you can increase the prices. If you where happy with the amount of profit you where making why quit? Although the people buying your products maybe unhappy that you quit, anyone competing with you will be more than happy that you have removed yourself from the market, allowing them to collect the isk you don't seem to want. People seem to have a misconception that the market value of an item is based on the cost of production. Items in high demand have a market value much greater than the parts they are made of. On the other hand there are items with no demand, that will be unlikely to ever sell for the price of their parts. If ccp doesn't fix some the items to make them useful I would guess there will be more complaints as people get offered wonderful tech2 blueprints such as Damage Control 2, Reinforced Bulkheads 2, and other prints for items nobody uses. These prints will be basically useless since the cost of producing the item will be many times what anyone would pay for one, assuming they would buy one at all.
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.11 00:48:00 - [13] um i build for people who really need the ship and shouldnt have to pay a stupidly high price considering they cant get enough back to replace it....jeez man its a freckin game not RL. If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... I luv the ol Supply n Demand arguement....more like supply and rip off If i had the bpos i could do em even cheaper
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.11 00:48:00 - [14] um i build for people who really need the ship and shouldnt have to pay a stupidly high price considering they cant get enough back to replace it....jeez man its a freckin game not RL. If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... I luv the ol Supply n Demand arguement....more like supply and rip off If i had the bpos i could do em even cheaper
Qutsemnie	Posted - 2004.09.11 02:02:00 - [15] haha you got passion on your side ill give you that. Im sure if you want to build just to help people play the game that you could find a private venue. If you go to the public market you should expect it to behave like a public market. Besides those people that mark things up do the economy a service. They are making sure they get to the right person (ie that person willing to pay more) If everything cost 1-isk and nobody could mark anything up then if you had billions of isk it wouldnt matter.
Qutsemnie	Posted - 2004.09.11 02:02:00 - [16] haha you got passion on your side ill give you that. Im sure if you want to build just to help people play the game that you could find a private venue. If you go to the public market you should expect it to behave like a public market. Besides those people that mark things up do the economy a service. They are making sure they get to the right person (ie that person willing to pay more) If everything cost 1-isk and nobody could mark anything up then if you had billions of isk it wouldnt matter.
Astinius	Posted - 2004.09.11 02:35:00 - [17] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... soooo you prefer being a azz in RL instead of being one in a game?
Astinius	Posted - 2004.09.11 02:35:00 - [18] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... soooo you prefer being a azz in RL instead of being one in a game?
Tech2 Shoppe	Posted - 2004.09.11 02:48:00 - [19] Originally by: Astinius Originally by: Alexis Fontaine If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... soooo you prefer being a azz in RL instead of being one in a game? Yep,I was thinking the same thing! Hehe, but what a ridiculous position, he's complaining because his ships are selling too fast? There's only one solution, BUILD MORE.
Tech2 Shoppe	Posted - 2004.09.11 02:48:00 - [20] Originally by: Astinius Originally by: Alexis Fontaine If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... soooo you prefer being a azz in RL instead of being one in a game? Yep,I was thinking the same thing! Hehe, but what a ridiculous position, he's complaining because his ships are selling too fast? There's only one solution, BUILD MORE.
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.11 03:36:00 - [21] Edited by: Alexis Fontaine on 11/09/2004 03:40:31 Originally by: Tech2 Shoppe Yep,I was thinking the same thing! Hehe, but what a ridiculous position, he's complaining because his ships are selling too fast? There's only one solution, BUILD MORE. if u actually read what i wrote you'd find out that what annoys me, Is people buying them and putting the price up and re-selling them, I couldnt give a toss if they sold in minutes or weeks.... learn to read it helps m8 im dyslexic but even i can read
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.11 03:36:00 - [22] Edited by: Alexis Fontaine on 11/09/2004 03:40:31 Originally by: Tech2 Shoppe Yep,I was thinking the same thing! Hehe, but what a ridiculous position, he's complaining because his ships are selling too fast? There's only one solution, BUILD MORE. if u actually read what i wrote you'd find out that what annoys me, Is people buying them and putting the price up and re-selling them, I couldnt give a toss if they sold in minutes or weeks.... learn to read it helps m8 im dyslexic but even i can read
Shakul	Posted - 2004.09.11 04:05:00 - [23] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine um i build for people who really need the ship and shouldnt have to pay a stupidly high price considering they cant get enough back to replace it....jeez man its a freckin game not RL. If you want to sell to people who "need" the ships (noobs?) then escrow it to individuals who you think deserve it. Don't use the open market or the open escrow. Manufacturers don't charge "stupidly high prices." most of them sell a markup of only 5-10% on t1 items (t2 is diffent because of monopolies/oligopolies). also, insurance covers replacement on everything but t2 ships (unless they changed it recently). Originally by: Alexis Fontaine If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... I'm missing the point... Originally by: Alexis Fontaine I luv the ol Supply n Demand arguement....more like supply and rip off supply and rip off? whos being ripped off? the buyer? why do they buy the item at all then? why doesnt someone else sell for a lower price? Originally by: Alexis Fontaine Is there no honourable person left in eve? ... IÆm sick to death of people buying them and jacking the price up and chuckin them back on the market or on escrowàthis is one builder whoÆs never ever going to build any more intyÆs at all except for friends. I really don't see what buying ships has to do with honor. You are selling for the gratest price you think you can get, they are buying for the lowest price they think they can get. Wheres the dishonor? What do you care what they do with their indy? You made your sale, you made your profit. Obviously, your indys must be selling well, so keep making them. Auction your items for isk, works sort of like ebay.
Shakul	Posted - 2004.09.11 04:05:00 - [24] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine um i build for people who really need the ship and shouldnt have to pay a stupidly high price considering they cant get enough back to replace it....jeez man its a freckin game not RL. If you want to sell to people who "need" the ships (noobs?) then escrow it to individuals who you think deserve it. Don't use the open market or the open escrow. Manufacturers don't charge "stupidly high prices." most of them sell a markup of only 5-10% on t1 items (t2 is diffent because of monopolies/oligopolies). also, insurance covers replacement on everything but t2 ships (unless they changed it recently). Originally by: Alexis Fontaine If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... I'm missing the point... Originally by: Alexis Fontaine I luv the ol Supply n Demand arguement....more like supply and rip off supply and rip off? whos being ripped off? the buyer? why do they buy the item at all then? why doesnt someone else sell for a lower price? Originally by: Alexis Fontaine Is there no honourable person left in eve? ... IÆm sick to death of people buying them and jacking the price up and chuckin them back on the market or on escrowàthis is one builder whoÆs never ever going to build any more intyÆs at all except for friends. I really don't see what buying ships has to do with honor. You are selling for the gratest price you think you can get, they are buying for the lowest price they think they can get. Wheres the dishonor? What do you care what they do with their indy? You made your sale, you made your profit. Obviously, your indys must be selling well, so keep making them. Auction your items for isk, works sort of like ebay.
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.11 12:37:00 - [25] your missing the point my friend, and when uve grown some balls you can post with a character who isnt a alt.... Anyways im ranting, surprised the thread hasnt been locked yet
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.11 12:37:00 - [26] your missing the point my friend, and when uve grown some balls you can post with a character who isnt a alt.... Anyways im ranting, surprised the thread hasnt been locked yet
J'Maybe Keens	Posted - 2004.09.11 12:54:00 - [27] I suspect the thread has not been locked because everyone else is making valid points. You are selling at the price you wish to, which is below what the market can stand. Other people (lets call them middlemen) are taking your stock and re-selling at a higher price. You should really be pleased and make some contracts with these people, its a ready market for you at the price you want to sell at. If you wish to reduce the number of middlemen you can: 1. increase your prices, improve your profit and reduce their profit margins. 2. Sell directly to your customers through advertising, in which case you will have no items for sale on the open market for the middlemen to take advantage of. As to the ranting elements of your original post and subsequent remarks, those are clear for all too see, but rather than flame and rant the community has proved there are more than enough honorable and sensible people by actually trying to help you out. ******** AUTHOR of the COMPLETE mineral and ore Price guide, updated weekly, see Eve Guardian for details
J'Maybe Keens	Posted - 2004.09.11 12:54:00 - [28] I suspect the thread has not been locked because everyone else is making valid points. You are selling at the price you wish to, which is below what the market can stand. Other people (lets call them middlemen) are taking your stock and re-selling at a higher price. You should really be pleased and make some contracts with these people, its a ready market for you at the price you want to sell at. If you wish to reduce the number of middlemen you can: 1. increase your prices, improve your profit and reduce their profit margins. 2. Sell directly to your customers through advertising, in which case you will have no items for sale on the open market for the middlemen to take advantage of. As to the ranting elements of your original post and subsequent remarks, those are clear for all too see, but rather than flame and rant the community has proved there are more than enough honorable and sensible people by actually trying to help you out. ******** AUTHOR of the COMPLETE mineral and ore Price guide, updated weekly, see Eve Guardian for details
Ghoest	Posted - 2004.09.11 15:50:00 - [29] Sell direct in the trade channel.
Ghoest	Posted - 2004.09.11 15:50:00 - [30] Sell direct in the trade channel.
Shamad Conde	Posted - 2004.09.12 13:47:00 - [31] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine um i build for people who really need the ship and shouldnt have to pay a stupidly high price considering they cant get enough back to replace it....jeez man its a freckin game not RL. If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... I luv the ol Supply n Demand arguement....more like supply and rip off If i had the bpos i could do em even cheaper It's a game, eh? So why are you whining?
Shamad Conde	Posted - 2004.09.12 13:47:00 - [32] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine um i build for people who really need the ship and shouldnt have to pay a stupidly high price considering they cant get enough back to replace it....jeez man its a freckin game not RL. If it was RL and i was selling something i'd rip you off without a 2nd thought.......but its a game.... I luv the ol Supply n Demand arguement....more like supply and rip off If i had the bpos i could do em even cheaper It's a game, eh? So why are you whining?
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.12 14:08:00 - [33] Edited by: Alexis Fontaine on 12/09/2004 14:11:56 im not whining, im ranting! also i did sell direct in the trade channel, a guy wanted the 2 crows and 4 taranis that i had, I asked what he needed so many for he said him and his mates use quite a few so i thought ok, sold them to him and he put them straight on the market for 17mil each and left the system...
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.12 14:08:00 - [34] Edited by: Alexis Fontaine on 12/09/2004 14:11:56 im not whining, im ranting! also i did sell direct in the trade channel, a guy wanted the 2 crows and 4 taranis that i had, I asked what he needed so many for he said him and his mates use quite a few so i thought ok, sold them to him and he put them straight on the market for 17mil each and left the system...
Steel Optik	Posted - 2004.09.12 16:00:00 - [35] Edited by: Steel Optik on 12/09/2004 16:25:51 Well the easiest way to solve you some grief is do a BYOC component deal + Isk only if you are a good builder like this old deal Old Crow BYOC deal or like this one old claw deal This would solve some of of your tech 2 dealer reselling problems not all
Steel Optik	Posted - 2004.09.12 16:00:00 - [36] Edited by: Steel Optik on 12/09/2004 16:25:51 Well the easiest way to solve you some grief is do a BYOC component deal + Isk only if you are a good builder like this old deal Old Crow BYOC deal or like this one old claw deal This would solve some of of your tech 2 dealer reselling problems not all
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.12 17:39:00 - [37] yere well if i had a bpo i'd do that but i dont and crow bpc are so hard to get for decent price i did have a good contact but he left eve for a few months
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.12 17:39:00 - [38] yere well if i had a bpo i'd do that but i dont and crow bpc are so hard to get for decent price i did have a good contact but he left eve for a few months
Kurenin	Posted - 2004.09.12 19:34:00 - [39] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine yere well if i had a bpo i'd do that but i dont and crow bpc are so hard to get for decent price i did have a good contact but he left eve for a few months Your character looks nice. ----- [22:02] <Kurenin> anyhow, on a more serious note, what did you think of those ideas? [22:02] <Hammerhead> we can't do anything that requires programming Inactivity wins you.
Kurenin	Posted - 2004.09.12 19:34:00 - [40] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine yere well if i had a bpo i'd do that but i dont and crow bpc are so hard to get for decent price i did have a good contact but he left eve for a few months Your character looks nice. ----- [22:02] <Kurenin> anyhow, on a more serious note, what did you think of those ideas? [22:02] <Hammerhead> we can't do anything that requires programming Inactivity wins you.
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.12 19:58:00 - [41] Originally by: Kurenin Originally by: Alexis Fontaine yere well if i had a bpo i'd do that but i dont and crow bpc are so hard to get for decent price i did have a good contact but he left eve for a few months Your character looks nice. Thx
Alexis Fontaine	Posted - 2004.09.12 19:58:00 - [42] Originally by: Kurenin Originally by: Alexis Fontaine yere well if i had a bpo i'd do that but i dont and crow bpc are so hard to get for decent price i did have a good contact but he left eve for a few months Your character looks nice. Thx
Droidster	Posted - 2004.09.13 04:57:00 - [43] I don't get this post. If you sold your goods you should be happy. What's your problem? Someone else is making a profit too? You know envy is a sin. Seriously the demand for Taranis went up to 12M+ so if you were selling for 10 then it is no surprise ship dealers are buying your output and reselling it. If you want sell it at retail 12-14M and you will not get dealer interest. Your ships will sell more slowly but you will make more profit. It's up to you. In any case, get a clue. If you sell something at a bargain price other people are going to flip your goods. Duh. _____________________________________________ I am motivated by various things, mostly ISK.
Droidster	Posted - 2004.09.13 04:57:00 - [44] I don't get this post. If you sold your goods you should be happy. What's your problem? Someone else is making a profit too? You know envy is a sin. Seriously the demand for Taranis went up to 12M+ so if you were selling for 10 then it is no surprise ship dealers are buying your output and reselling it. If you want sell it at retail 12-14M and you will not get dealer interest. Your ships will sell more slowly but you will make more profit. It's up to you. In any case, get a clue. If you sell something at a bargain price other people are going to flip your goods. Duh. _____________________________________________ I am motivated by various things, mostly ISK.
Feta Solamnia	Posted - 2004.09.14 04:22:00 - [45] Well, the equasion is pretty simple: Sale price affects how fast you sell them ships, just make sure that you sell 10 ships in about the same time it takes to build 10 of them. If your name is known, sell in a central system or have good PR, then you can sell faster => sell for more. This way you make sure that you make the max isk you can and noone can just buy you out and resell (without moving them somewhere else, which is pretty much legit, it's called trading ) I'll hate me for saying this: the moral of this post is "time=money" Omg, I need to run to a few anticapitalistic demonstrations to wash out all this piggie-ness off me
Feta Solamnia	Posted - 2004.09.14 04:22:00 - [46] Well, the equasion is pretty simple: Sale price affects how fast you sell them ships, just make sure that you sell 10 ships in about the same time it takes to build 10 of them. If your name is known, sell in a central system or have good PR, then you can sell faster => sell for more. This way you make sure that you make the max isk you can and noone can just buy you out and resell (without moving them somewhere else, which is pretty much legit, it's called trading ) I'll hate me for saying this: the moral of this post is "time=money" Omg, I need to run to a few anticapitalistic demonstrations to wash out all this piggie-ness off me
Jodrell	Posted - 2004.09.16 12:41:00 - [47] Alexis, Why not ration them then. I ship per person?
Jodrell	Posted - 2004.09.16 12:41:00 - [48] Alexis, Why not ration them then. I ship per person?
Jonathan Wark	Posted - 2004.09.16 19:18:00 - [49] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine Edited by: Alexis Fontaine on 12/09/2004 14:11:56 im not whining, im ranting! also i did sell direct in the trade channel, a guy wanted the 2 crows and 4 taranis that i had, I asked what he needed so many for he said him and his mates use quite a few so i thought ok, sold them to him and he put them straight on the market for 17mil each and left the system... Well your rant would have made a lot more sense if you were simply ranting about this guy from the start. I can understand being angry if you thought you were helping someone out who needed ships for him and friends only to have them turn right around and sell the ships at a profit. If you had known that this guy was going to resell them I would guess you wouldnÆt have bothered to take the time to make them. But look at it this way if you are selling interceptors you KNOW you are not selling to newbs, because true newbs wouldnÆt have the skills to use them. You want to help out newbs I suggest making and selling frigs or tier I cruisers. If you have anyone to rant at it should be yourself for being na´ve.
Jonathan Wark	Posted - 2004.09.16 19:18:00 - [50] Originally by: Alexis Fontaine Edited by: Alexis Fontaine on 12/09/2004 14:11:56 im not whining, im ranting! also i did sell direct in the trade channel, a guy wanted the 2 crows and 4 taranis that i had, I asked what he needed so many for he said him and his mates use quite a few so i thought ok, sold them to him and he put them straight on the market for 17mil each and left the system... Well your rant would have made a lot more sense if you were simply ranting about this guy from the start. I can understand being angry if you thought you were helping someone out who needed ships for him and friends only to have them turn right around and sell the ships at a profit. If you had known that this guy was going to resell them I would guess you wouldnÆt have bothered to take the time to make them. But look at it this way if you are selling interceptors you KNOW you are not selling to newbs, because true newbs wouldnÆt have the skills to use them. You want to help out newbs I suggest making and selling frigs or tier I cruisers. If you have anyone to rant at it should be yourself for being na´ve.
Aeyo'Wulf	Posted - 2004.09.19 23:44:00 - [51] Actually the sell on situation can work out quite sweet. My last character was building Mallers. and selling them to a dealer for 6.5 million, about 1.5million less then the avarage market price, and what he was re-selling them for. The thing is. That suited me. I was still making about 2 mil profite on each sale, and had the convienience of an instant sale with no risk of a price war. While he earned his money by shifting them about to get the best price and market spots without to much undercutting by others. The business/Industry relationship go hand in hand, but they are also two very different games. If you don't want to get involved in one side or the other , get involved with somebody who does or accept that you won't be making as much profite as you can. And remember. When you sell something. It's the new owners right to do whatever the hell they want to with it, and if they can make a profite out of it, then good luck to them
Aeyo'Wulf	Posted - 2004.09.19 23:44:00 - [52] Actually the sell on situation can work out quite sweet. My last character was building Mallers. and selling them to a dealer for 6.5 million, about 1.5million less then the avarage market price, and what he was re-selling them for. The thing is. That suited me. I was still making about 2 mil profite on each sale, and had the convienience of an instant sale with no risk of a price war. While he earned his money by shifting them about to get the best price and market spots without to much undercutting by others. The business/Industry relationship go hand in hand, but they are also two very different games. If you don't want to get involved in one side or the other , get involved with somebody who does or accept that you won't be making as much profite as you can. And remember. When you sell something. It's the new owners right to do whatever the hell they want to with it, and if they can make a profite out of it, then good luck to them
Ki Shodan	Posted - 2004.09.20 15:52:00 - [53] i do not get your point, if you sell over trade channel you sell anonymously, you never know who is buying your products and what he/she is doing with it. have you ever thought of that the inties you sell could be used to kill harmless miners or to gank helpless freighter captains? you sell deadly weapons, mate. you still can sleep well? if the guy can afford to let his isk sleep, while waiting that the overpriced inties sell, it is his problem. your problem is: you have to choose your customers more carefully! i make my money in selling missles and stuff above "average" at highways, a "nOOb" that want to buy his cruisemissles for his "frigate" below production cost can easily jump 2 or 3 systems further and gets a lucky pack of 25 CM at price where a producer would cut his own throat. if someone wants to buy an whole freighterload of CM for his corp direct from the highway, i am pleased to meet this demand. the downside at this: it is my "over"-price. but if you look at the service, i supply my price isn't overpriced anymore. I must buy the minerals i need at market price, which isn't exactly "under"-priced, you know. and sometimes i even do those ppl, who undercut prices a favour and buy their wholr batch and add it to my own sales, since there are a lot of people are out there, who are looking for volume not for price. so everyone has hir place, if you want to do humanitarian sales ask the needy in your corp, get known to the locals in your areas and play santa claus there or just pick one random nOOb every day and give him an inty which he can fly in 3 or 4 month. about this one guy reselling your stuff. if that has hit your ego that hard, just pod him once or a few times, this helps occasionaly. as long as there are people like the average caldari, who sells hir grandma for a piece of cake, as long as there are ppl, who do not honor the freedom of their fellow humans, we are all doomed and there is no real freedom nor there is solidarity. get used to it or fight it.
Ki Shodan	Posted - 2004.09.20 15:52:00 - [54] i do not get your point, if you sell over trade channel you sell anonymously, you never know who is buying your products and what he/she is doing with it. have you ever thought of that the inties you sell could be used to kill harmless miners or to gank helpless freighter captains? you sell deadly weapons, mate. you still can sleep well? if the guy can afford to let his isk sleep, while waiting that the overpriced inties sell, it is his problem. your problem is: you have to choose your customers more carefully! i make my money in selling missles and stuff above "average" at highways, a "nOOb" that want to buy his cruisemissles for his "frigate" below production cost can easily jump 2 or 3 systems further and gets a lucky pack of 25 CM at price where a producer would cut his own throat. if someone wants to buy an whole freighterload of CM for his corp direct from the highway, i am pleased to meet this demand. the downside at this: it is my "over"-price. but if you look at the service, i supply my price isn't overpriced anymore. I must buy the minerals i need at market price, which isn't exactly "under"-priced, you know. and sometimes i even do those ppl, who undercut prices a favour and buy their wholr batch and add it to my own sales, since there are a lot of people are out there, who are looking for volume not for price. so everyone has hir place, if you want to do humanitarian sales ask the needy in your corp, get known to the locals in your areas and play santa claus there or just pick one random nOOb every day and give him an inty which he can fly in 3 or 4 month. about this one guy reselling your stuff. if that has hit your ego that hard, just pod him once or a few times, this helps occasionaly. as long as there are people like the average caldari, who sells hir grandma for a piece of cake, as long as there are ppl, who do not honor the freedom of their fellow humans, we are all doomed and there is no real freedom nor there is solidarity. get used to it or fight it.
Pick Me	Posted - 2004.09.21 17:18:00 - [55] That's the problem with the fine and pretty well tuned tech 2 building process, peoples are still getting BPC and they are even ranting about it... Is it so hard to think that the market will regulate itself?!? You know, long time ago, I stop production on many small items because they were sold at below mineral cost in many case. It seem I was not the only one stopping, because I noticed recently that all theses little items are sold to the noob for 10 or 20 times their cost? Now what would you say? Damn, they are ripping them off? Or you should just buy the bpo and build some of theses items and sell them for less? then, competition will make other sell them for less..... Tech 2 is not for noob btw, was never meant too. There is no 'Fair prices' in a real economy, there is only selling-prices, if you don't sell, you lower, if you sell, you raise, if you don't, someone else will do it for you (and service the economy by creating movement!) As you just experienced. Don't curse them, they are doing what they feel they should be doing. Prepare for the new waves! -Everyone got components bpo, but ****, only 'thoses' have POS around the best moons types (grrrrr, grrrrr, grrrrr) -Tech 3 only in deep space? That's unfair for thoses not in alliance bla bla. Adapt or die. The animals kingdoms has been doing it for bil of years, and life is still there...
Pick Me	Posted - 2004.09.21 17:18:00 - [56] That's the problem with the fine and pretty well tuned tech 2 building process, peoples are still getting BPC and they are even ranting about it... Is it so hard to think that the market will regulate itself?!? You know, long time ago, I stop production on many small items because they were sold at below mineral cost in many case. It seem I was not the only one stopping, because I noticed recently that all theses little items are sold to the noob for 10 or 20 times their cost? Now what would you say? Damn, they are ripping them off? Or you should just buy the bpo and build some of theses items and sell them for less? then, competition will make other sell them for less..... Tech 2 is not for noob btw, was never meant too. There is no 'Fair prices' in a real economy, there is only selling-prices, if you don't sell, you lower, if you sell, you raise, if you don't, someone else will do it for you (and service the economy by creating movement!) As you just experienced. Don't curse them, they are doing what they feel they should be doing. Prepare for the new waves! -Everyone got components bpo, but ****, only 'thoses' have POS around the best moons types (grrrrr, grrrrr, grrrrr) -Tech 3 only in deep space? That's unfair for thoses not in alliance bla bla. Adapt or die. The animals kingdoms has been doing it for bil of years, and life is still there...
Griskin Thor	Posted - 2004.09.23 23:23:00 - [57] On the one hand, I can see the point of wanting to make ships for the 'needy' at 'fair' prices. And as you said, this is a game.. But it's not that kind of game. As the box says it's a game of warfare, both real and economic, with powerful megacorporations vying for control of valuable resources and markets. You have to consider that your good intentions are fighting against very good simulations of the very forces that make 'nice guys' so rare in RL. If that ship isn't worth paying market price for to the guy you give it to, then it's probably not worth the difference between what you charged and what the market will pay for it, and the smart answer is for him to turn around and sell the thing on the market and use the spare cash he just made off you for something worthwhile. How exactly do you determine if someone 'needs' an elite frigate anyway? It's not exactly like giving a couple bucks to that homeless vet on the corner, y'know? We're talking someone who has several million points invested in combat skills, and probably a pretty badass tier 2 combat cruiser (if not a battleship) of his own already. If he hasn't got his own personal battleship by now he's not 'needy', he's a slacker. You haven't helped that vet, you've been had by a professional panhandler who probably makes more a week on handouts than you do working your fingers to the bone at a 40+/week job. Honestly, anybody who's got the skills to fly an elite tech 2 frigate should have the skills to afford one at market prices if they really want it. If they don't, then they shouldn't be flying one anyway because all they're going to do is go get it blown up by someone who knows how to fly their ship. Griskin Thor Chief Operations Officer >Lightwave Enterprises< - "Oh yeah? Well, back in my day we had to mine omber with our teeth! And walk back to the station to sell it. Up the gravity well. Both ways!"
Griskin Thor	Posted - 2004.09.23 23:23:00 - [58] On the one hand, I can see the point of wanting to make ships for the 'needy' at 'fair' prices. And as you said, this is a game.. But it's not that kind of game. As the box says it's a game of warfare, both real and economic, with powerful megacorporations vying for control of valuable resources and markets. You have to consider that your good intentions are fighting against very good simulations of the very forces that make 'nice guys' so rare in RL. If that ship isn't worth paying market price for to the guy you give it to, then it's probably not worth the difference between what you charged and what the market will pay for it, and the smart answer is for him to turn around and sell the thing on the market and use the spare cash he just made off you for something worthwhile. How exactly do you determine if someone 'needs' an elite frigate anyway? It's not exactly like giving a couple bucks to that homeless vet on the corner, y'know? We're talking someone who has several million points invested in combat skills, and probably a pretty badass tier 2 combat cruiser (if not a battleship) of his own already. If he hasn't got his own personal battleship by now he's not 'needy', he's a slacker. You haven't helped that vet, you've been had by a professional panhandler who probably makes more a week on handouts than you do working your fingers to the bone at a 40+/week job. Honestly, anybody who's got the skills to fly an elite tech 2 frigate should have the skills to afford one at market prices if they really want it. If they don't, then they shouldn't be flying one anyway because all they're going to do is go get it blown up by someone who knows how to fly their ship. Griskin Thor Chief Operations Officer >Lightwave Enterprises< - "Oh yeah? Well, back in my day we had to mine omber with our teeth! And walk back to the station to sell it. Up the gravity well. Both ways!"
JaiMaster	Posted - 2004.09.23 23:44:00 - [59] I like that. You sell a premium ship to people who "need" it but cant afford to pay true market values. People who "need" a frigate that badly should fly a friggin Rifter, Punisher, Merlin or whatever. Ints, Spec ops, Ass frigs, support cruisers and all t2 is nothing but toys for rich players to get something out of having more isk than everyone else. Take advantage of it, take their isk and be happy. ------- Skill points. ISK. Ships, rare equipment. Its all just a means to an end... Your end.
JaiMaster	Posted - 2004.09.23 23:44:00 - [60] I like that. You sell a premium ship to people who "need" it but cant afford to pay true market values. People who "need" a frigate that badly should fly a friggin Rifter, Punisher, Merlin or whatever. Ints, Spec ops, Ass frigs, support cruisers and all t2 is nothing but toys for rich players to get something out of having more isk than everyone else. Take advantage of it, take their isk and be happy. ------- Skill points. ISK. Ships, rare equipment. Its all just a means to an end... Your end.
Badshah	Posted - 2004.10.19 20:09:00 - [61] Ok, I start by admitting I did not read the entire thread. I skimmed it and read most of Alexis comments. What I glean from this is that she is trying to perform a service to others by providing reasonably priced ships for those that need them. In turn, people have mis-represented themselves and turned a profit due to her largesse. So good, I understand the problem. I do not know what the solution is. It is nice to help others; it's just a shame kindness isn't always appreciated. This is like getting some famous ball-player to sign 10 baseballs so you can sell them at 1000 isk per each! It just stinks. Alexis I am sorry it worked out for you this way. I'd like to say, don't let them change you. You came to EVE with high ideals, keep them. My 2 isk worth. Just me, Bad
Badshah	Posted - 2004.10.19 20:09:00 - [62] Ok, I start by admitting I did not read the entire thread. I skimmed it and read most of Alexis comments. What I glean from this is that she is trying to perform a service to others by providing reasonably priced ships for those that need them. In turn, people have mis-represented themselves and turned a profit due to her largesse. So good, I understand the problem. I do not know what the solution is. It is nice to help others; it's just a shame kindness isn't always appreciated. This is like getting some famous ball-player to sign 10 baseballs so you can sell them at 1000 isk per each! It just stinks. Alexis I am sorry it worked out for you this way. I'd like to say, don't let them change you. You came to EVE with high ideals, keep them. My 2 isk worth. Just me, Bad
Ricdic	Posted - 2004.10.21 09:09:00 - [63] This post is old Move along people, nothin to see here
Ricdic	Posted - 2004.10.21 09:09:00 - [64] This post is old Move along people, nothin to see here

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