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EWG Holdings - The end of Eternity

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Irata Skyfire Imperial Academy	Posted - 2009.06.07 02:38:00 - [31] Originally by: Devian 666 Selective scamming just means that more than one person benefits from from it. So everyone receiving money from this is now a scammer. Oh well, until some convincing facts force me to do otherwise, the way I prefer to see this is LRN/YGR grabbed the opportunity to get even with some of those who thought it would be a good idea to throw all kinds of dirt and insults at him, while he was holding their money - I don't know, but to me that sure sounds like he is playing eve online
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.06.07 02:43:00 - [32] Originally by: Irata Skyfire Originally by: Devian 666 Selective scamming just means that more than one person benefits from from it. So everyone receiving money from this is now a scammer. Oh well, until some convincing facts force me to do otherwise, the way I prefer to see this is LRN/YGR grabbed the opportunity to get even with some of those who thought it would be a good idea to throw all kinds of dirt and insults at him, while he was holding their money - I don't know, but to me that sure sounds like he is playing eve online Lets not let facts get in the way of any additional drama I could get from this. IGNE obeythekitten is eve related content. Stop being so antagonistic. YGR drama best drama.
Mephistocles Red Frog Investments Blue Sky Consortium	Posted - 2009.06.07 02:48:00 - [33] In other news Jeffrey Immelt decided to liquidate GE and only pay those investors who didn't question his motives. According to inside sources he was pushed into this action. He reportedly cleaned out his desk and loaded his car with his ill-gotten gains and was quoted as saying: "Screw you guys, I'm going home.".
Kazzac Elentria	Posted - 2009.06.07 02:57:00 - [34] Drama thread is drama
Thoraemond Minmatar Far Ranger	Posted - 2009.06.07 03:06:00 - [35] Originally by: Devian 666 Selective scamming just means that more than one person benefits from from it. So everyone receiving money from this is now a scammer. I now like YGR because you can make other people scammers by proxy. This is the evolution of a new type of scam which casts doubt on and implicates everyone who receives ISK. You haven't cast your net wide enough! If it were reasonable to trace ISK to label people as scammers, wouldn't you have to include anyone that the enterprise bought stuff from, anyone who bought stuff from the enterprise, material suppliers further up the supply chain, and so on? It appears that LRN / YouGotRipped was the sole 'controlling mind' responsible for the scam, such as it was.
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.06.07 03:11:00 - [36] Originally by: Thoraemond Originally by: Devian 666 Selective scamming just means that more than one person benefits from from it. So everyone receiving money from this is now a scammer. I now like YGR because you can make other people scammers by proxy. This is the evolution of a new type of scam which casts doubt on and implicates everyone who receives ISK. You haven't cast your net wide enough! If it were reasonable to trace ISK to label people as scammers, wouldn't you have to include anyone that the enterprise bought stuff from, anyone who bought stuff from the enterprise, material suppliers further up the supply chain, and so on? It appears that LRN / YouGotRipped was the sole 'controlling mind' responsible for the scam, such as it was. If we apply that approach and go all the way down the chain we will find macro farmers somwhere in the process. Then we would have sufficient grounds to ban the entire playerbase. IGNE obeythekitten is eve related content. Stop being so antagonistic. YGR drama best drama.
Krathos Morpheus Gallente Legion Infernal Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.06.07 03:20:00 - [37] Originally by: Devian 666 Originally by: Thoraemond Originally by: Devian 666 Selective scamming just means that more than one person benefits from from it. So everyone receiving money from this is now a scammer. I now like YGR because you can make other people scammers by proxy. This is the evolution of a new type of scam which casts doubt on and implicates everyone who receives ISK. You haven't cast your net wide enough! If it were reasonable to trace ISK to label people as scammers, wouldn't you have to include anyone that the enterprise bought stuff from, anyone who bought stuff from the enterprise, material suppliers further up the supply chain, and so on? It appears that LRN / YouGotRipped was the sole 'controlling mind' responsible for the scam, such as it was. If we apply that approach and go all the way down the chain we will find macro farmers somwhere in the process. Then we would have sufficient grounds to ban the entire playerbase. That's why your aproach to everyone not scammed is a scammer is wrong. EVE Knowledge
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.06.07 03:56:00 - [38] Originally by: Krathos Morpheus Originally by: Devian 666 Originally by: Thoraemond Originally by: Devian 666 Selective scamming just means that more than one person benefits from from it. So everyone receiving money from this is now a scammer. I now like YGR because you can make other people scammers by proxy. This is the evolution of a new type of scam which casts doubt on and implicates everyone who receives ISK. You haven't cast your net wide enough! If it were reasonable to trace ISK to label people as scammers, wouldn't you have to include anyone that the enterprise bought stuff from, anyone who bought stuff from the enterprise, material suppliers further up the supply chain, and so on? It appears that LRN / YouGotRipped was the sole 'controlling mind' responsible for the scam, such as it was. If we apply that approach and go all the way down the chain we will find macro farmers somwhere in the process. Then we would have sufficient grounds to ban the entire playerbase. That's why your aproach to everyone not scammed is a scammer is wrong. That's not a logical conclusion.
Dzil Caldari Waffles Reloaded	Posted - 2009.06.07 04:00:00 - [39] One could certainly opt to distrust everyone that YGR chose to pay back - could as well be his alts as anything else.
Krathos Morpheus Gallente Legion Infernal Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.06.07 04:55:00 - [40] Originally by: Devian 666 That's not a logical conclusion. I thought it is pretty obvious, but I'll put the whole reasoning here. You say that anyone receiving money from the venture is a scammer because there are others that are scammed. People receiving the money are receiving what is theirs, they put their own money there and are not receiving more than it is theirs. We could say as well that everyone who has invested in MD and has not being scammed is a scammer because they don't share the loses. That's not logic. Now, if you're going to blame anyone who benefited from the venture and were not scammed you should blame too the people mentioned by Thoraemond, since they were not scammed too. The same could be applied to macro-farmers, if anyone who benefits from a macrofarmer is a macrofarmer... well that have no sense, as you have implied, So i wold conclude that your aproach has no sense and it is wrong. Quote: One could certainly opt to distrust everyone that YGR chose to pay back - could as well be his alts as anything else. Sure you can, but really you don't need any reason to distrust anybody, just look at the comments YGR makes about distrusting other people in their threads. But there is a long path between distrusting someone because you suspect it could be an alt of someone and claiming someone is a scammer because he was not scammed by a scammer. By the very definition of scam, those people are not guilty because they didn't know the intention to scam and they have not benefited from the scam. Btw, I still have 5 shares I kept to remember this venture, I'm not sure if conserve them or try to cash them out to satisfy my curiosity on what list am I... Maybe I shouldn't try just in case I am forced to scam the other shareholders
Treelox Amarr Seppuku Warriors	Posted - 2009.06.07 07:13:00 - [41] Edited by: Treelox on 07/06/2009 07:13:55 Originally by: Dzil One could certainly opt to distrust everyone that YGR chose to pay back - could as well be his alts as anything else. Excellent, I guess this makes me potentially one of YGR's alts. I make(d) no judgements, without proof, and surprisingly I recieved all my principle(1bil) plus some intrest earlier today. ...or maybe not so surprisingly. Anyways call me what you will, I really do not care about your positive or negative perception of me. ---edit fixed a stupid typo --
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.06.07 08:21:00 - [42] Originally by: Azerath Original investment + dividends received, pleasure doing LEGITIMATE business with you LRN. To those still screaming scam.... well... you got your wish, you can now say "told you so" and lose your investments. To those of us that said "it's not, just give him some time" well, you may receive just that. Not that it's 100% right that some people are getting scammed, but you called it a scam for the last few weeks and got your wish, so I don't feel much pity tbh. Just my two cents Azerath are you ******ed? your an accomplice imo... LRN/YGR this have been a scam the whole time, a simple ponzi nothing fancy, he just couldnt keep the thing rolling anymore! ANYONE accepting money from him should return them to a single person, who could then redistribute out fairly amongst ALL the investors!
Raskor Crossflow Enterprises	Posted - 2009.06.07 08:46:00 - [43] Sure glad I stayed away from this. I still remember the drama from his very first offering and his response of basically "i wouldn't scam, it isn't enough". These comments how he was "pushed" to scam are rubbish. Either you are honest or you aren't. We see now clearly the type of person he is. That he chose to pay back some of the people doesn't change anything, either. He is forever nothing more than a two-bit thief.
Mme Pinkerton Caldari	Posted - 2009.06.07 09:16:00 - [44] principal + dividends received, although I bought my shares only after the vote (from another player). Personally I can't complain about doing business with LRN at all (it's not like he has been particularly secretive about the possible ways of action before/after the vote) and ofc I am looking forward to getting flamed for this sentence by those who lost their money^^ To me selective scamming seems like a novel & interesting way of creating drama and discord in MD... (looking forward to the next 5 pages of this thread) " Credit is the economic judgement on the morality of a man. "
Robacz Essence Trade Essence Enterprises	Posted - 2009.06.07 09:17:00 - [45] Originally by: LRN I hereby declare the EWG Holdings shares and all transactions involving EWG Holdings shares as being null and void. As for my investors, I have a surprise for you, one that I have carefully concealed in plain view: selective scamming. Based on the above, I'm currently returning the isk to a select few, the rest of you, I hope you can swim. TheyGotRipped.
Jackie Fisher Syrkos Technologies	Posted - 2009.06.07 09:26:00 - [46] How much did you get YGR?
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2009.06.07 09:29:00 - [47] Is this an "I scammed you because you didn't trust me" thread? WTS Tech II Component BPO Sets \| Auction Prowler
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.06.07 10:02:00 - [48] Originally by: Ray McCormack Is this an "I scammed you because you didn't trust me" thread? yea and an epic one at that.... i want my 1 million ISK now I GOT RIPED! Quote: "Lecherito on Market Discussion: Though I have to go down on the record as saying that I'm convinced the majority of the MD community is ******ed"
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.07 10:25:00 - [49] Originally by: Ji Sama yea and an epic one at that.... i want my 1 million ISK now I GOT RIPED! I know you have been inconvenienced and I'm prepared to compensate you. Shall we say one million American dollars? Very well, then two million! Black Sun Empire
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.06.07 10:32:00 - [50] oki 2 million US dollars will do... your forgiven then... want your 1 share back? its only fair! Quote: "Lecherito on Market Discussion: Though I have to go down on the record as saying that I'm convinced the majority of the MD community is ******ed"
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.07 10:39:00 - [51] Edited by: YouGotRipped on 07/06/2009 10:42:16 Originally by: Ray McCormack Is this an "I scammed you because you didn't trust me" thread? LOOK MAN! I'm in the PRIME OF MY LIFE! Got to live the way I got to! Gonna make me some money again and I'm gonna FIGHT! I got my turn to be the champ-ion of the world! JESUS! Black Sun Empire
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.07 10:55:00 - [52] Edited by: YouGotRipped on 07/06/2009 10:55:15 Originally by: Kazzac Elentria Drama thread is drama YaÆll mad at me, right? But thereÆs one thing you better know... and that is... I love all of yaÆll. Black Sun Empire
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.06.07 11:15:00 - [53] You let me violate you. IGNE obeythekitten is eve related content. Stop being so antagonistic. YGR drama best drama.
Sophia Truthspeaker Imperial Shipment	Posted - 2009.06.07 11:27:00 - [54] Originally by: LRN I hereby declare the EWG Holdings shares and all transactions involving EWG Holdings shares as being null and void. As for my investors, I have a surprise for you, one that I have carefully concealed in plain view: selective scamming. Based on the above, I'm currently returning the isk to a select few, the rest of you, I hope you can swim. That 'selective scamming' thing... nice touch. All that remains is a list of everyone who got the money back and a statement from you saying one of those is an alt of yours. Or perhaps rather a main... _________ The truth is out there
Dzil Caldari Waffles Reloaded	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:09:00 - [55] Edited by: Dzil on 07/06/2009 12:10:56 Originally by: Ji Sama ANYONE accepting money from him should return them to a single person, who could then redistribute out fairly amongst ALL the investors! Did I just somehow migrate off the EVE Online forums and back to WOW? Edit to fix quote
Lecherito	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:29:00 - [56] Edited by: Lecherito on 07/06/2009 12:29:54 I reckon that post about the eroding confidence in the secondary market should be changed to "extinct confidence in the secondary market". Failing at a publicly funded project and then running with what's left is not the stuff of legends. Yet every budding scammer gets to take their shot at a couple billion, succeeding far more often than they should. Why? Because we haven't ** for tools to actually enforce a secondary market. What we have are the delusional projections of those who believe in one day having a secondary market. We have a hand full of auditors whose word is God. Any budding entrepreneur is shot down out of fear he might scam. CEOs that manage to get a hold of public funds are free to walk away free of any consequences. LRN/AP/YGR is not unique. He copied a template previous scammers have proven to be effective, and thus, he will soon be forgotten. However, the that fact we continue to be victimized by tool after tool, despite our best strategies to weed out scammers and untrustworthies, speaks worlds about how feeble our "secondary market" actually is. Until we are given additional tools manage our publicly owned businesses and investments, and thus, requiring would be scammers to come up with an original scheme, I will no longer be investing in any publicly funded projects. It's just not feasible. LRN/AP/YGR, being the attention *** that he is, gets to have his 40 minutes of fame. Good for him. Shame on people who claim his actions are understandable and even justifiable, because he was "pushed" to scam. Shame on the people who defended him way back when I brought to light a slew of intelligibly articulated, reasonable concerns. And finally, shame to the various no namers who will copy this established and proven template, as LRN has done, in attempt at taking down a trivial amount of capital to fund your trivial schemes. The secondary market is dead. -L ps: Still waiting on ya Ricdic =P
Ray McCormack hirr	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:35:00 - [57] Originally by: Lecherito ps: Still waiting on ya Ricdic =P Stop trolling ricdic. You're a useless poster, really awful. WTS Tech II Component BPO Sets \| Auction Prowler
Lecherito	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:46:00 - [58] Originally by: Ray McCormack Originally by: Lecherito ps: Still waiting on ya Ricdic =P Stop trolling ricdic. You're a useless poster, really awful. And you, sir, are one of the godly elite, yes? -L
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:53:00 - [59] Edited by: YouGotRipped on 07/06/2009 12:53:53 Originally by: Lecherito ] And you, sir, are one of the godly elite, yes? -L Now, now, Lerchito, calm down... Ray is not interested in wasting his time arguing with disposable scammer alts and neither am I.
Lecherito	Posted - 2009.06.07 13:49:00 - [60] I see what you did there. -L

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