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Discrodia
Gallente Blood Red Dawn
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Posted - 2009.06.08 12:33:00 -
[1]
So, as we all know, several of the ship classes in EVE lack T2 varients. Specifically I'm talking about Mining Frigates, Tier 2 Battlecruisers, and Tier 3 Battleships. I just made this thread to see if people had either A. Brought this up before or B. had any ideas what T2 varients of these ships could do.
Here are my ideas:
Mining Frigates -> Prospectors: They have very large cargoholds compared to other ships their size, and a bonus to agility and mining lasers. They would be intended for 0.0 and lowsec ninja mining.
Tier 2 BC's -> Voyagers: Have bonuses to scanning, and a CPU reduction for Expanded Probe Launchers. Would be intended as solo ships in Complexes and Wormholes.
Tier 3 Battleships -> Fleetbreakers: They would have bonuses to lock time and smartbombs / guns, and maybe have a new module only they can use, which when activated increases it's resistances by 5% per target that locks the ship. Would be intended as high-power counters to blob warfare.
Feel free to add or critize me to hell. |
Quantar Raalsken
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.08 12:40:00 -
[2]
+1 for concept...and maybe a different name for T2 Tier3 BS |
Rhinanna
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.06.08 12:42:00 -
[3]
Tier 2 BCs - The 'cane and the drake are basically pure combat boats so I don't think this is a good role for them.
I would suggest they get made 'Support Destroyers' or something similar. Fast or long ranged, not huge DPS but more made for attacking the enemy's logistic vessels. Perhaps a special module only they could use which would reduce the affect of remote repping on the target vessel (not self-repping)
There could be a less powerful ranged version and a more powerful close ranged version. This device wouldn't stack from multiple applications.
IE ' Shield polariser' This device remodulates the target's shield to prevent any effect from passing through it including shield, armour and cap repair affects.
Tier 3 Battleships -> Fleetbreakers: They would have bonuses to lock time and smartbombs / guns, and maybe have a new module only they can use, which when activated increases it's resistances by 5% per target that locks the ship. Would be intended as high-power counters to blob warfare.
Nice idea, but wouldn't enemies just NOT target these ships, till last at least?
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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire
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Posted - 2009.06.08 12:48:00 -
[4]
I'd like an inty that gets +1 WCS point per ship locking me But then we have the T3's which are pure win so no need.
But there could deffo be some new ships implemented for various specific tasks. |
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5pinDizzy
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Posted - 2009.06.08 12:55:00 -
[5]
Edited by: 5pinDizzy on 08/06/2009 12:56:25
Although I never posted it I thought similar things about a tech 2 mining frigate.
I was thinking something designed for escape purposes, to mine in place like lowsec.
I thought it was unrealistic to have a frigate with a massive cargohold, my idea was that it comes with its own detachable giant cargohold, a bit like a train carriage, that it can deploy in the field and fill up where if any baddies come it can run away and come back for it's can later which is anchored, password protected and has massive HP, where it can unanchor it, reconnect with the ship and warp back to station to offload.
I never mentioned it though as it would be a coding nightmare. |
Mish'Kala
Minmatar FarSight Location and Recovery Services
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Posted - 2009.06.08 13:02:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Discrodia
Mining Frigates -> Prospectors: They have very large cargoholds compared to other ships their size, and a bonus to agility and mining lasers. They would be intended for 0.0 and lowsec ninja mining.
Like this idea, very much
Originally by: Discrodia
Tier 2 BC's -> Voyagers: Have bonuses to scanning, and a CPU reduction for Expanded Probe Launchers. Would be intended as solo ships in Complexes and Wormholes.
i like this too, kind of like a mini marauder, without the tractor bonus. although that would work here
Originally by: Discrodia
Tier 3 Battleships -> Fleetbreakers: They would have bonuses to lock time and smartbombs / guns, and maybe have a new module only they can use, which when activated increases it's resistances by 5% per target that locks the ship. Would be intended as high-power counters to blob warfare.
This falls foul of what its trying to negate. if it gets a resist bonus for every ship that targets it, you need a blob to kill it The idea of a BS class ship that can inflict huge damage is appealing, but then everyone would bring them. A sub Cap 'Carrier' (drones and Remote Reppers) would negate the Logistics class. Im not sure what i would do for a T2 Teit3 BS to be honest.
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Benco97
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.06.08 13:27:00 -
[7]
Now not to rain on the parade but I have spoken to some peeps in CCP myself and for what they could tell me there are thus far NO plans for T2 variants of the mining frigates.
I was devastated, the Burst is my favourite ship and a T2 version would enhance my enjoyment of the game immensely but..C'est la vie..
Originally by: P'uck
You're a DUMBASS - bold italic underline at the VERY LEAST.
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Tekutep
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Posted - 2009.06.08 15:12:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Discrodia ...I'm talking about ... Tier 2 Battlecruisers,
Isn't that Command Ships?
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Tippia
Raddick Explorations Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2009.06.08 15:23:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Tekutep
Originally by: Discrodia ...I'm talking about ... Tier 2 Battlecruisers,
Isn't that Command Ships?
No. All the Command Ships are T2 variants of the Tier-1 BCs.
I suspect the confusion is between T1/T2 (where the "T" stands for "Tech") and Tier-1/2/3 (which roughly equates to the ship skill level required to fly the ship, eg Cruiser II for a Tier-2 cruiser). ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki |
Marcus Druallis
Quantum Industries RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.08 16:14:00 -
[10]
Why would the T2 of the mining frigates not be a dedicated salvager? |
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Obsidian Hawk
RONA Corporation
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Posted - 2009.06.08 16:18:00 -
[11]
in before moved to features and ideas forum.
plus i believe the flag ship idea for tier 3 bs is still out there. |
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CCP Firnor
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Posted - 2009.06.08 16:33:00 -
[12]
This really should be in "Features & Ideas Discussions", so that's where it goes to now. |
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AtheistOfDoom
Amarr The Athiest Syndicate Advocated Destruction
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Posted - 2009.06.08 17:08:00 -
[13]
Quote: Tier 2 BCs - The 'cane and the drake are basically pure combat boats so I don't think this is a good role for them.
I would suggest they get made 'Support Destroyers' or something similar. Fast or long ranged, not huge DPS but more made for attacking the enemy's logistic vessels. Perhaps a special module only they could use which would reduce the affect of remote repping on the target vessel (not self-repping) There could be a less powerful ranged version and a more powerful close ranged version. This device wouldn't stack from multiple applications.
there is already anti-support, theyre called "recon ships".
Quote:
Tier 3 Battleships -> Fleetbreakers: They would have bonuses to lock time and smartbombs / guns, and maybe have a new module only they can use, which when activated increases it's resistances by 5% per target that locks the ship. Would be intended as high-power counters to blob warfare.
No current mechanic exists where ship attributes change when youre locked. there should never be and that idea is terrible. And then, he killed the dog... |
Julius Lincinius
Minmatar Ex Coelis The Bantam Menace
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Posted - 2009.06.08 21:14:00 -
[14]
A corp mate and I have been discussing the thought of a T2 mining frigate being useful for gas harvesting, since none of the current t1 or t2 ships fill this niche.
While I'd really like the concept of a t2 drake, the NH already serves admirably and just lacks the proper model. See also Myrm-->Eos, etc.
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bandwidth
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Posted - 2009.06.08 22:34:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Rhinanna Tier 2 BCs - The 'cane and the drake are basically pure combat boats so I don't think this is a good role for them.
I would suggest they get made 'Support Destroyers' or something similar. Fast or long ranged, not huge DPS but more made for attacking the enemy's logistic vessels. Perhaps a special module only they could use which would reduce the affect of remote repping on the target vessel (not self-repping)
There could be a less powerful ranged version and a more powerful close ranged version. This device wouldn't stack from multiple applications.
IE ' Shield polariser' This device remodulates the target's shield to prevent any effect from passing through it including shield, armour and cap repair affects.
Tier 3 Battleships -> Fleetbreakers: They would have bonuses to lock time and smartbombs / guns, and maybe have a new module only they can use, which when activated increases it's resistances by 5% per target that locks the ship. Would be intended as high-power counters to blob warfare.
Nice idea, but wouldn't enemies just NOT target these ships, till last at least?
there is no reason a pure combat ship couldn't be retrofitted to scan down and solo sleeper fleets. a lot of what goes on in a wormhole requires being good at taking punishment and dealing it too.
on the fleetbreaker, a 5% bonus really isnt much. its a bit, but its not a lot. the enemy fleet would simply need to budget who locks the ship. i.e. only armageddons target that ship. a bunch of frigates and low-dps cruisers lock it and the tank suddenly kicks ass. follow me?
Originally by: Julius Lincinius A corp mate and I have been discussing the thought of a T2 mining frigate being useful for gas harvesting, since none of the current t1 or t2 ships fill this niche.
While I'd really like the concept of a t2 drake, the NH already serves admirably and just lacks the proper model. See also Myrm-->Eos, etc.
this, plus the op's post.
a set of t2 mining frigates that are dedicated to gas, salvaging, or ninja mining would be very awesome and very useful. |
Rhinanna
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.06.08 23:43:00 -
[16]
Quote: there is already anti-support, theyre called "recon ships".
This may surprise you, but don't you think that there is a possibility that RECON ships role is RECON not support killers........
The fact that recons are used to fill this role currently DOESN'T mean there can't be a ship dedicated to this role does it? The fact BCs are generally best against cruisers and most logistics ships are cruisers fits as well. The fact recons are currently been used for this role indicates that a specalist class of ship is in fact a GOOD idea not a bad one.
Its amazing when people don't think before they type! :)
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Spugg Galdon
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Posted - 2009.06.08 23:45:00 -
[17]
I was thinking more along the lines of Navy/Fleet issue battle cruisers. These ships would be focused purely around combat and would not be able to fit gang assist modules.
Amarr:- Navy Habinger... 8 turret slots higher armour resists 75 Mbit bandwidth
Caladari:- Navy Drake... 8 Launchers *Slightly* better resists. Bonus to ALL damage types
Gallante:- Navy Myrmidon... 7 Turret slots (*1 empty high slot* maybe) 125 Mbit bandwidth. Better armour resists and reduce shield recharge rate to remove the silly passive myrm.
Mimatar:- Fleet Hurricane... more speed and reduced MWD penalties (sig radius and cap penalties). 50 Mbit bandwidth
All other properties (other than a cool looking navy issue reskin) would remain the same.
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Dinamita Tona
Minmatar Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.16 07:59:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Dinamita Tona on 16/06/2009 08:00:24
Hmm, cane is atm one of best combat ships, so it would be a step back not to fortfy his combat role. I belive same goes for other t2 BC's. Drake is only ship that isnt very deadly, but its tanking role makes it othervise usefull. I think all should have T2 variants as formidable command ships with only task to spread death and fear among opponets. Also they should have big prerequisites, as they should not be piloted by newbs. Ill, elaborate this later.
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King Rothgar
Dissolution Of Eternity Event Horizon.
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Posted - 2009.06.16 11:33:00 -
[19]
T2 mining frigs for ninja mining would be a good thing I think. Would need to make mining a worthwhile profession while they're at it though. A dedicated gas harvesting ship would be a good addition too. T2 tier 2 BC's would be a good addition, however they must be distinguished from the current ones so we don't end up with them making the current command ships worthless. I like the idea of designing them to be solo/small gang ships for both pve and pvp. The expanded probe launcher bonus is a good idea. Maybe a tractor beam bonus too. Turn it into a mini-marauder with an expanded probe launcher or something. Perhaps remove the ability to fit gang links, make it an all out combat ship.
Not sure about tier 3 t2 BS's, I'd like to see a true t2 combat BS but giving a BS hac level resistances and a 20-25% damage bonus over the t1 model seems a bit much. Would end up with a BS that could solo a mothership or some crazy ****. -----------------------------------------------------
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Draahk Chimera
Caldari Priory Of The Lemon Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.16 12:00:00 -
[20]
Only actually the force recons are recon and support vessels. Combat recons and eas are anti-support in small gangs. Sniper hacs in large fleets. What they could do with the tier 2 bc's is to change the hulls (and subsequently input-material for production) on the field command ships.
Finding a role for a new t2 bs would be hard pressed indeed as CCP has clearly stated they will not give any tanking or damage bonuses to t2 bs since that would make them vastly overpowered. Some people suggest mini-dreads. Battleships that can fit capital weapons but lack siege mod. Why then would anyone train and fly them? The training time and cost of such a ship would be equal if not higher then a dread. This I fear is the nature of all t2 bs designs that gets proposed. Either they are overpowered or the cost/strength ratio becomes too tilted so that people opt not to use them (see black ops). |
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Dinamita Tona
Minmatar Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.17 18:39:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Dinamita Tona on 17/06/2009 18:40:08 So what I had in mind looks like this:
Thunderstorm (Faction commandship):
7 low slots / 4 mid slots / 8 high slots 8 turret slots / 2 launcher slots powergrid Output 1,650 MW CPU Output 585 tf Calibration 400 points Upgrade Hardpoints 2
Max Velocity 185 m/sec Inertia Modifier 0.615 Plasma Propulsion Strength 8 points Mass 9,600,000 kg Volume 200000 m3 Capacity 250 m3 Structure hit points : 750
Drone Capacity 75 m3 Drone Bandwidth 75 Mbit/sec
Recharge time 750.00 sec Capacitor Capacity 3000 Energy
Maximum Targeting Range 40 km Max Locked Targets 5 LADAR Sensor Strength 18 points Signature Radius Signature Radius 300 m Scan Resolution 200 mm Shield Capacity 4450 HP Shield Em Damage Resistance 75 % Shield Explosive Damage Resistance 50 % Shield Kinetic Damage Resistance 40 % Shield Thermal Damage Resistance 60 % Shield recharge time Shield recharge time 1,400.00 sec
Armor Hitpoints 5950 HP Armor Em Damage Resistance 90 % Armor Explosive Damage Resistance 10 % Armor Kinetic Damage Resistance 25 % Armor Thermal Damage Resistance 67,5 %
Required skills Primary Skill required Minmatar Cruiser V Spaceship Command V Minmatar Frigate V Minmatar Cruiser V
Secondary Skill required Command Ships V Battlecruisers V Spaceship Command V Leadership V Armored Warfare V Wing Command III
Tertiary Skill required Logistics Logistics IV Long Range TargetingLong Range Targeting V Electronics IV Thermic Armor Compensation V EM Armor Compensation V
Special requirements Minmatar pilot Minmatar Republic standing +7.00
Battlecruiser Skill Bonus: 5% increase in projectile weapons damage and Rate of Fire per level Command Ships Skill Bonus: 7.5% bonus to Medium Projectile Turret tracking speed and 5% increase in projectile weapons Rate of Fire per level
Role Bonus: % 25% EM and Thermic armor resistance bonus for fleet
Even in earliest designs, Thunderstorm was described as Amarrian killer. True to this task Boundless Creation combined Gallente knowledge to create ship for the most loyal Minmatar pilots. Low structure is only weak spot, but it reflects philosophyof elite minmatar pilots: "If you are in structure you are dead anyway." |
Pvt Public7
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.06.18 02:55:00 -
[22]
Tech 2 Tier 2 BCs: Covert Command Ship: Command Ships skill bonus: covops cloak + fleet overload bonus bonus. Role bonus: can use blackops portals.
Tactical Command Ship: CS bonus: racial weapon damage bonus + ???? (maybe BS weapons?) Role bonus: can fit Small Jump Portal generator (subcaps only).
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D'Artagnan
Bladerunners KIA Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.18 05:23:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Dinamita Tona Edited by: Dinamita Tona on 17/06/2009 18:40:08 So what I had in mind looks like this:
Thunderstorm (Faction commandship):
Special requirements Minmatar pilot (Stupid Idea) Minmatar Republic standing +7.00 (Good Idea)
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Dinamita Tona
Minmatar Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:41:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Pvt Public7 Tech 2 Tier 2 BCs: Covert Command Ship: Command Ships skill bonus: covops cloak + fleet overload bonus bonus. Role bonus: can use blackops portals. Tactical Command Ship: CS bonus: racial weapon damage bonus + ???? (maybe BS weapons?) Role bonus: can fit Small Jump Portal generator (subcaps only).
there is already inflation of covert ships, and why to waste good ship for such terrible task??? frig do that job better
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Dinamita Tona
Minmatar Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.06.19 19:43:00 -
[25]
Originally by: D'Artagnan
Originally by: Dinamita Tona Edited by: Dinamita Tona on 17/06/2009 18:40:08 So what I had in mind looks like this:
Thunderstorm (Faction commandship):
Special requirements Minmatar pilot (Stupid Idea) Minmatar Republic standing +7.00 (Good Idea)
for once it would be nice to have ship for 1 faction only, and as it is FW command ship it would be insane that amar/caldari pilot could fly it i would maybe accept
Special requirements Minmatar / Gallente pilot Minmatar Republic standing +8.00 |
Salpad
Caldari Carebears with Attitude
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Posted - 2009.06.20 03:02:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Discrodia
Mining Frigates -> Prospectors: They have very large cargoholds compared to other ships their size, and a bonus to agility and mining lasers. They would be intended for 0.0 and lowsec ninja mining.
Bonus to mining laser range would be acceptable. Bonus to mining laser yield: No! (Yes to increased cargo capacity.)
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N'tek alar
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Posted - 2009.06.20 07:59:00 -
[27]
Edited by: N''tek alar on 20/06/2009 07:59:25
Originally by: bandwidth
on the fleetbreaker, a 5% bonus really isnt much. its a bit, but its not a lot. the enemy fleet would simply need to budget who locks the ship. i.e. only armageddons target that ship. a bunch of frigates and low-dps cruisers lock it and the tank suddenly kicks ass. follow me?
So what stops people from bringing 8 of these fleetbreakers and locking each other to give everyone an additional 40% + another 5% per enemy who locks them and using remote reps to make the group unkillable?
Being in fleet with the target makes your locks not affect resistances? Fine, Warp to enemy, drop fleet in warp, problem solved.
Being in the same corp/alliance as target prevents it from affecting resists? Again, Fine, Leave corp for the duration of the op.
face it, the idea wouldn't work because it's either ineffective, or it's effective enough that conventional fleets can't fight them, At which point people start bringing blobs of fleetbreakers instead. |
Sturdy Girl
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Posted - 2009.06.20 12:15:00 -
[28]
I like the mining frigate idea.
I think the fleet breaker idea is too powerful, but I quite like the voyager idea. I think it would be more suited as a battleship however, as this is the more prevalent solo ship class in wh space, and higher level complexes.
For battlecruisers, I think they should have a T2 varient called the Escort. This should be designed to accompany weaker vessels, such a industrials, to in a sort of combined logistics/ewar style: Usual battlecruiser gang assist module. Limitted bonus to ewar. Limitted bonus to remote repair/shield transfer amount from the logistics ships. Strong tank. And to balance, it should probably have reduced bonus to racial weapons. |
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