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Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.09 04:01:00 -
[1]
1. Supporting a HAC/BC Roaming gang:
2. Supporting a Battleship gang:
3. Supporting a stealth bomber gang:
4. Ganking solo ships solo:
5. Your overall favorite:
Discuss  By Force Recon I mean Arazu, Falcon, Pilgrim, Rapier
I don't fly any of them but would like to train one.
They seem to be very fascinating ships but I don't understand too well how they differ in role and niche.
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr
Corp 1 Allstars
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Posted - 2009.07.09 04:08:00 -
[2]
Edited by: Grarr Dexx on 09/07/2009 04:08:56
Number one needs a Curse.
Number two needs a Falcon.
Number three needs a Rapier.
Number four needs a Curse.
Number five is the Curse.
Pilgrim is a horrible ship.
Please resize your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels with a maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Zymurgist |
Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.09 04:15:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Grarr Dexx
Pilgrim is a horrible ship.
something to do with low neut range i am guessing?
tks for comments and views. keep em coming. its interesting.
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr
Corp 1 Allstars
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Posted - 2009.07.09 04:18:00 -
[4]
Pretty much.
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abrasive soap
Caldari Corporation 12345
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Posted - 2009.07.09 05:15:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Grarr Dexx
Edited by: Grarr Dexx on 09/07/2009 04:08:56
Number one needs a Curse.
Number two needs at least two Guardians.
Number three needs a Rapier.
Number four needs a Curse.
Number five is the Curse.
Pilgrim is a horrible ship.
fyp
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Sakos Vartrow
Rapscallions
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Posted - 2009.07.09 08:32:00 -
[6]
Laser pilgrim is okay if you really need the covops cloak for some reason (or need to jump through a black ops portal) and cant bring a curse or a better laser ship like a navy omen, phantasm, harbinger or zealot (for non solo).
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Vasily Zhukov
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.07.09 08:35:00 -
[7]
Am I the only one who noticed the Curse isn't a Force Recon ship, but a Combat Recon? -.-
OP asked for Force Recon.
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Riddick Richard
Caldari Corporation 12345
Minor Threat.
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Posted - 2009.07.09 08:41:00 -
[8]
1) Rapier
2) Falcon
3) Rapier
4) Rapier 
5) Rapier
Shield buffer rapier all the way 
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Tippia
Raddick Explorations
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2009.07.09 09:05:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Vasily Zhukov
Am I the only one who noticed the Curse isn't a Force Recon ship, but a Combat Recon? -.-
OP asked for Force Recon.
I think that was the point…
———
“If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡…
you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.”
— Karath Piki |
Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.09 09:31:00 -
[10]
It is true I am mainly considering training Force Recon for the warp cloaked convenience, especially when there are many hostiles about. However, for solo ganking I would also consider the Curse if it was so much better that it outweighed the Pilgrim's warp cloaked advantage.
Things I am rather curious about actually:
-Pilgrim/Curse: Why do some people prefer the Curse for solo in enemy territory even though it is much harder to get past gate camps than the Pilgrim? Is the Pilgrim that bad? And can either Curse or Pilgrim kill ratting Ravens (immune to TDs and neuts)?
-Falcon: Can Falcon function well in a tackling role? Or is it mainly confined to force multiplier/ gang EWAR role only.
-Rapier/Arazu: Is the Rapier or Arazu now the better tackler after the speed/web nerf and MWD being shut off by scramblers? Which is the better solo ganker? Can either kill decently fitted Ravens and Drakes?
Well basically those are the distinctions between Force Recons I am trying to understand. Thanks in advance for sharing your wisdom folks.
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EFT Warrior
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Posted - 2009.07.09 09:32:00 -
[11]
1. Falcon
2. Falcon
3. Falcon
4. Pilgrim
5. Falcon
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Lugalzagezi666
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Posted - 2009.07.09 10:22:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Darthewok
...
- pilgrim/curse ... its range - you can neut from 40km and it shines with faction point, with pilgrim you are most of the time forced to fight in scram range /and you still dont have enough dps to "gank" target before help comes/. Imo both ships are capable of killing "ratting" ravens but pilgrim is more suited to do that /stealth/.
- falcon as tackler? it would be waste i think, ecm is still best type of ewar /jamming logistics or enemy falcon can win battle for you/
- rapier/arazu - i think arazu is now better, longe range scram and disruptor are golden for low sec, where you cant use bubbles /hint: fit 1 scram, 1 disruptor, tank it and remote sensor boost it.../. Sologanker? Problably blarazu, but i dont think either can kill "decently" fitted ravens /they will just neut you to hell or deagress and jump/ and drakes /drakes will just **** you if you dont run/.
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Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.09 10:44:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Lugalzagezi666
...
Thanks for the well-thought-out responses everyone. Nice to see people have different favorite recons.
Hmm.. so only Pilgrim and Blarazu have sufficient DPS to solo gank ravens and other BS then.
I saw a fascinating laser Pilgrim fit by Merin Ryskin in another thread (think this is the laser Pilgrim mentioned earlier?).
Oh well, I guess there is no Recon that does everything well.
Yech.. have to learn multiple racial cruiser V and T2 medium weapons to fly multiple recons.
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Hanso Sparxx
Deep Penetration Inc.
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Posted - 2009.07.09 15:11:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Rid**** Richard
1) Rapier
2) Falcon and Rapier
3) Rapier
4) Rapier
5) Rapier
Shield buffer rapier all the way
fixed. =p
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Go Deep! |
Professor Perplex
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Posted - 2009.07.09 15:19:00 -
[15]
3. arazu to acctually hold anything down.
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Wannabehero
Absolutely No Retreat
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Posted - 2009.07.09 16:35:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Professor Perplex
3. arazu to acctually hold anything down.
This, arazu makes a great support ship for SB gangs. Coupled with a rapier, you are money.
---
≡√≡ Don't harsh my mellow |
Emperor Ryan
Amarr
Imperial Syndicate Forces
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Posted - 2009.07.09 16:51:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Grarr Dexx
Edited by: Grarr Dexx on 09/07/2009 04:08:56
Number one needs a Curse.
Number two needs a Falcon.
Number three needs a Rapier.
Number four needs a Curse.
Number five is the Curse.
Pilgrim is a horrible ship.
Hey Garrrrr, Im very temped to come kill you in my pilgrim of doom, just make sure you let me get in range Plox
- Emperor
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Footoo Rama
Gallente
Caldari Illuminati
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Posted - 2009.07.09 20:16:00 -
[18]
3,4,5
I say arazu... Although for 3 pretty much any force recon with cov ops cloak will work.
4. The arazu really shines no other force recon can point and damp from 40km and pick off the target with drones or guns from that range, while taking 0 damage. You can take BC and smaller down, if things go pear shaped IE a friend warps in you can cloak and run.
-------
"Because the Dominix is the Chuck Norris of Eve!" |
Regat Kozovv
Caldari
Alcothology
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Posted - 2009.07.09 20:50:00 -
[19]
So just wondering, is the Rook now the bastard child of EVE or so, or is the cloaking device just that useful?
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Mysteriax
Scoopex
Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2009.07.09 23:46:00 -
[20]
I love how people say rapier. But the rapier isnt good at anything anymore.
Tackling and webbing leave it to the interceptors.
A rapier can only slow down 1 ship at a time (you need 2 webs on it atleast to slow it down) while a falcon can take 4 ships out of combat at a longer range.
Dont say rapier uses a buffer so it lives longer, because the rapier still dies within seconds.
The only reason why a rapier lives longer is because noone cares there is a rapier on the field and kills other more important recons/ships first. They just laugh at the rapier since its useless.
Quite sad really but the webnerf killed the rapier, hell I used to fly one.
But wait the rapier has a Target painter bonus which noone uses because its useless.
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr
Corp 1 Allstars
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Posted - 2009.07.10 00:04:00 -
[21]
He did ask the most useful ship for a Stealth bomber gang, and even without a TP, you're best off flying the rapier (Huginn isn't worth it, with an SB gang you already have massive dps, it's best to keep your recons alive at all costs).
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Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.10 00:20:00 -
[22]
WTB:  Arfalcpilpier with 10x midslots for sensor dampeners, ECM, distance scrambler and web. woot
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RuleoftheBone
Minmatar
THE C0RP
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Posted - 2009.07.10 00:49:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Darthewok
Originally by: Grarr Dexx
Pilgrim is a horrible ship.
something to do with low neut range i am guessing?
tks for comments and views. keep em coming. its interesting.
If you are operating solo/maybe a wingman in hisec/losec a Pilgrim with Recon V, solid supports, and a bit of pimp with a probe launcher is utterly devastating in a patient pilot's hands. Target selection is somewhat important...best to avoid annoying passive-tanked Drakes or any target that may have backup nearby.
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Grarr Dexx
Amarr
Corp 1 Allstars
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Posted - 2009.07.10 00:51:00 -
[24]
Rook is a strong solo boat, with a couple of hams, scram and a few multispecs you're bound to kill a target with little to no resistance. Huginn has decent DPS and same range/power on webs than rapier but lacks the covert cloaking, Curse is a cap-sucking monstrosity that feels like you're flying a leaf of paper, and the Lachesis... well, it can point really far? :P
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.07.10 00:52:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Durzel on 10/07/2009 00:53:44
Pilgrim fits generally always use AB (MWD is possible but it means having to orbit at speeds where your TD(s) might not be so effective). Because of this once you're committed to a fight if the other guy has a scram as well you're likely to be there until one of you dies. If he has friends nearby you're dead, if you get hotdropped you're dead.
Curse on the other hand fights at range and uses an MWD. Maybe it's just me but I feel a lot more vulnerable in my Pilgrim than I do the Curse, even with the cloak.
Pilgrim = picking fights is the key, once you're committed it's you or them.
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Darthewok
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.07.10 09:18:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Darthewok on 10/07/2009 09:20:32
The Rook sounds intriguing because, with the new changes, it is more of an unknown wild card than the established and well-known Curse/Pilgrim.
Regarding Falcon/Rook, when is it best to use a Falcon and when to use a Rook (in relations to situations 1-5)?
And how does Rook compare to Curse as a solo ganker (in terms of size of ships it can kill, and ability to get away)?
On one hand the thought of being able to ECM jam anyone at will and get away is appealing.
On the other hand, the free "Primary me me me!" T-shirt you get upon the purchase of a Rook is scary.
Especially since it cannot warp cloaked.
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Rordan D'Kherr
Amarr
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Posted - 2009.07.10 09:59:00 -
[27]
1. Supporting a HAC/BC Roaming gang: Rapier
2. Supporting a Battleship gang: Rapier
3. Supporting a stealth bomber gang: Rapier
4. Ganking solo ships solo: Curse
5. Your overall favorite: Rapier
Reason for Rapier: Good damage output and great tackling abilities. All others are worse.
Pilgrim: Useless NOS bonus
Falcon: Primary instapopper
Arazu: Useless dampner bonus
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Mystafyre
Caldari
Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.07.10 10:01:00 -
[28]
Arazu is the best there is for tackler.
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Hiroshima Jita
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Posted - 2009.07.10 10:43:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Hiroshima Jita on 10/07/2009 10:44:08
#1 Curse has it. Nanod, ranged, you shouldn't need to cloak because your fc shouldnt be taking you anywhere non cloaky cruisers like vagas and ishtars can't go anyway. Nuets and td provide the best ewar for you. Nuets cripple tanks, give energy intensive weapons fits. TDs make most bs struggle to connect with your cruisers.
#2 Falcon. BS come with heavy nuets already. TD doesnt help them avoid much damage at all. TP and Sensor damps are outright inferior. On the other hand a direct jamn is the only way to stop RR. And jamming an enemy battleship takes alot more damage out of the fight than jamming a cruiser. Also enemy battleships are alot less likely to nano out, point you and kill you. They'll just shoot at you and force you to warp off.
#3 Arazu and/or Rapier. Stealth bomber gangs are all about ganking solo targets in crappy places. The recon's job is to be survivable and get tackle. Both work well. They work well together too.
#4 Rapier kills frigs well. The curse is nastier but easier to catch. Pilgrim can select target and take on some tougher ships. These are the ships that make legitimate solo boats.
#5 Arazu or curse. Considering the effects of scram vs webs the arazu does the rapier's job better. And as for the curse, nuets are awesome. Unfortunately I can only fly the rapier.
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King Rothgar
Death of Virtue
MeatSausage EXPRESS
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Posted - 2009.07.10 13:12:00 -
[30]
For solo, I like the pilgrim/curse best. As said, the curse is great nano'd and fighting at range. It's a very safe ship as you can outrun just about anything since few ships go 1600m/s when their MWD shuts off due to a lack of cap . It's certainly the ideal ship for slaughtering frigate gangs due to that, even 8 vs 1 is just fine if your in a curse.
The pilgrim is a close up fighter, there is no GTFO potential with it, every fight is to the bitter end. However, it's got a fairly respectable tank and between the tracking disruptor and neuts, it can dispatch most ships at close range. I have more kills with the curse but I have a much higher k/d ratio with the pilgrim. It's a ship that demands patience and highly developed hunting skills, if you've got those, the pilgrim will reward you greatly. Those who say the pilgrim sucks, suck at flying pilgrims.
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