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Please don't show people in Local and "Pilots in Space" in 0.0

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Harry Voyager	Posted - 2004.09.27 07:42:00 - [31] Originally by: Infinity Ziona Lorth, its going to be hard to miss a massive fleet if you have the ability to system scan which will be coming in shiva. [...] If Merely because they say it may be out with Shiva, which may be out before next year does not mean that it will. Remember, weren't PoS supposed to be out with retail? Where are the last of our Tech II blueprints? Shoot, where are the last of our Tech I blueprints? Harry Voyager
Harry Voyager	Posted - 2004.09.27 07:42:00 - [32] Originally by: Infinity Ziona Lorth, its going to be hard to miss a massive fleet if you have the ability to system scan which will be coming in shiva. [...] If Merely because they say it may be out with Shiva, which may be out before next year does not mean that it will. Remember, weren't PoS supposed to be out with retail? Where are the last of our Tech II blueprints? Shoot, where are the last of our Tech I blueprints? Harry Voyager
Fuse	Posted - 2004.09.27 09:21:00 - [33] Originally by: Astinius Originally by: Fuse There was a poll and people said no. IBTL The poll result was 50/50 not no. Half wanted it in, half said remove it. It was not split half down the middle. Large fleets moving around undetected would reduce the game to the level of Risk the board game. I just gather the most numbers and run around using spies and dominating. It would change the way the game is played for the worse. 0.o It's not you... no wait it is you.
Fuse	Posted - 2004.09.27 09:21:00 - [34] Originally by: Astinius Originally by: Fuse There was a poll and people said no. IBTL The poll result was 50/50 not no. Half wanted it in, half said remove it. It was not split half down the middle. Large fleets moving around undetected would reduce the game to the level of Risk the board game. I just gather the most numbers and run around using spies and dominating. It would change the way the game is played for the worse. 0.o It's not you... no wait it is you.
fairimear	Posted - 2004.09.27 09:30:00 - [35] the poll had a outcome of no but even if it didt there was to many nos to put it in and not extreamly upset people. only cloaked ships should leave local. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
fairimear	Posted - 2004.09.27 09:30:00 - [36] the poll had a outcome of no but even if it didt there was to many nos to put it in and not extreamly upset people. only cloaked ships should leave local. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
dabster	Posted - 2004.09.27 09:33:00 - [37] ffs give it up with all these topics already, or at the very least use existing ones. ___________________________ Chicks dig Brutor's
dabster	Posted - 2004.09.27 09:33:00 - [38] ffs give it up with all these topics already, or at the very least use existing ones. ___________________________ Chicks dig Brutor's
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 10:31:00 - [39] Originally by: fairimear the poll had a outcome of no but even if it didt there was to many nos to put it in and not extreamly upset people. only cloaked ships should leave local. I believe the poll that you speak of is no longer valid because of the new System Scanners that will be available in Shiva. Perhaps a new poll should be taken a month after Shiva has been out and everyone that used to hide gets killed or camped?
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 10:31:00 - [40] Originally by: fairimear the poll had a outcome of no but even if it didt there was to many nos to put it in and not extreamly upset people. only cloaked ships should leave local. I believe the poll that you speak of is no longer valid because of the new System Scanners that will be available in Shiva. Perhaps a new poll should be taken a month after Shiva has been out and everyone that used to hide gets killed or camped?
Xavier Arron	Posted - 2004.09.27 10:50:00 - [41] Originally by: S'Daria With the advent of system scanning in Shiva I propose the following to change the dynamics of 0.0 space travel: Don't show people in Local (but people can still talk in it) Remove "Pilots in Space" information Add "Pilot in Space" information to corps/alliances that own a station in that system Add Probes that would relay scanner information Probes are special drones that relay scanner information that can be sent though a gate. Pirates on the other side can jam or destroy them before they have a chance to relay information. A corp / alliance that owns a station in a system would get the "Pilots in Space" information as they do today. If a corp/alliance does not own a station in a system itÆs a "blind-spot" that can be exploited by unwelcome visitors requiring PC pirates to patrol these systems. Unwelcomed visitors can just keep their system scanners running continuously and see the PC pilot and react accordingly. I agree totally with Daria. The show all pilots in space option has to go. I proposed similar ideas in another thread on this. The fact that you cant hide, even out in 0.0 and in effect have basically a huge homing beacon attached to ya ass is just stupid. Originally by: Lorth I think itÆs a silly idea. You would never ever ever be able to find anyone. Scouting would be impossible with it. For all you know there could be a Massive enemy fleet waiting at a planet and your scout would simply warp through from gate to gate, never seeing anyone, and never knowing that they were there. ThatÆs not true, even with current scanner it wouldnÆt take long to fly to each major cluster of planets in a system and scan on max range (about 14 AuÆs). With the new Shiva system scanning it is supposed to be possible to scan the entire system. In effect a scout would warp in, scan the system and then warp on. By hiding people in local chat, the locals wouldnÆt know an enemy scout had even entered the system unless they were constantly scanning also, but if the scout was cloaked as well then they wouldnÆt know they had even been found. A large fleet could then be sent, and they may actually have a chance at taking them by surprise for a change, rather than the current situation where peeps just look at show all pilots in space on the map and see a fleet coming from x region 20 jumps away. By the time the fleet gets there they have packed up the mining op / blockade, whatever and either safe spotted / docked / or run. ItÆs not possible to catch an enemy by surprise with the current system. All we have now is the current blob wars which are just crap. Originally by: Lorth How would you begin to guess where an alliance had their POS without the show pilots in space option? You could even spend you entire day looking through every system, at every moon, and it would take months to even come close to finding where it is. No local to help you, no show pilots in space, to show you the way nothing but you own dumb luck of warping into the right moon. POS seem to be the 'thing' in Shiva and will become the ultimate for every alliance. You can bet that everyone and their brother will want one and that everyone will want to kill their enemies. Again you wouldnÆt have to search every moon, even with the current scanner, at most each planet, but typically far less than that (3 scans) due to the way planets and moon are bunched. Removing the show all players in space option is going to have to be done soon anyway, otherwise come Shiva player owned stations will be useless except for those that can manage 24/7 protection (not many). The greatest weapon one has is secrecy, and being able to hide player facilities in 0.0 will allow smaller corps the chance to own POS and prosper. This is good for everyone including pirates who will be able to mount raids against these player owned stations and factories when they find them. Just imagine stealing a Tech 3 bpo from a hidden research station deep in 0.0 or a production run of Tech 3 Tachyon Laser cannons :) To this end; players need more ways of "hunting" other players down and / or following them covertly back to their hideout. For example having a ship that is cloaked, combined with a module that allows ships warp trails to be followed (peeps who played Elite 2 will know what I mean û the hyperspace analyser). This added with the option to hide in local chat channel and with the removal of ôshow all pilots in spaceö option from the map would allow players to effectively stalk players and follow them back to there hidden player owned stations in 0.0 / mining ops. Imho it would be pretty cool if scanning was occluded by planets. This would allow fleets to hide behind planets and perhaps not be noticed by a scout who just warped in and done a quick scan from the direction of the gate. Again opening up the possibility for more tactics.
Xavier Arron	Posted - 2004.09.27 10:50:00 - [42] Originally by: S'Daria With the advent of system scanning in Shiva I propose the following to change the dynamics of 0.0 space travel: Don't show people in Local (but people can still talk in it) Remove "Pilots in Space" information Add "Pilot in Space" information to corps/alliances that own a station in that system Add Probes that would relay scanner information Probes are special drones that relay scanner information that can be sent though a gate. Pirates on the other side can jam or destroy them before they have a chance to relay information. A corp / alliance that owns a station in a system would get the "Pilots in Space" information as they do today. If a corp/alliance does not own a station in a system itÆs a "blind-spot" that can be exploited by unwelcome visitors requiring PC pirates to patrol these systems. Unwelcomed visitors can just keep their system scanners running continuously and see the PC pilot and react accordingly. I agree totally with Daria. The show all pilots in space option has to go. I proposed similar ideas in another thread on this. The fact that you cant hide, even out in 0.0 and in effect have basically a huge homing beacon attached to ya ass is just stupid. Originally by: Lorth I think itÆs a silly idea. You would never ever ever be able to find anyone. Scouting would be impossible with it. For all you know there could be a Massive enemy fleet waiting at a planet and your scout would simply warp through from gate to gate, never seeing anyone, and never knowing that they were there. ThatÆs not true, even with current scanner it wouldnÆt take long to fly to each major cluster of planets in a system and scan on max range (about 14 AuÆs). With the new Shiva system scanning it is supposed to be possible to scan the entire system. In effect a scout would warp in, scan the system and then warp on. By hiding people in local chat, the locals wouldnÆt know an enemy scout had even entered the system unless they were constantly scanning also, but if the scout was cloaked as well then they wouldnÆt know they had even been found. A large fleet could then be sent, and they may actually have a chance at taking them by surprise for a change, rather than the current situation where peeps just look at show all pilots in space on the map and see a fleet coming from x region 20 jumps away. By the time the fleet gets there they have packed up the mining op / blockade, whatever and either safe spotted / docked / or run. ItÆs not possible to catch an enemy by surprise with the current system. All we have now is the current blob wars which are just crap. Originally by: Lorth How would you begin to guess where an alliance had their POS without the show pilots in space option? You could even spend you entire day looking through every system, at every moon, and it would take months to even come close to finding where it is. No local to help you, no show pilots in space, to show you the way nothing but you own dumb luck of warping into the right moon. POS seem to be the 'thing' in Shiva and will become the ultimate for every alliance. You can bet that everyone and their brother will want one and that everyone will want to kill their enemies. Again you wouldnÆt have to search every moon, even with the current scanner, at most each planet, but typically far less than that (3 scans) due to the way planets and moon are bunched. Removing the show all players in space option is going to have to be done soon anyway, otherwise come Shiva player owned stations will be useless except for those that can manage 24/7 protection (not many). The greatest weapon one has is secrecy, and being able to hide player facilities in 0.0 will allow smaller corps the chance to own POS and prosper. This is good for everyone including pirates who will be able to mount raids against these player owned stations and factories when they find them. Just imagine stealing a Tech 3 bpo from a hidden research station deep in 0.0 or a production run of Tech 3 Tachyon Laser cannons :) To this end; players need more ways of "hunting" other players down and / or following them covertly back to their hideout. For example having a ship that is cloaked, combined with a module that allows ships warp trails to be followed (peeps who played Elite 2 will know what I mean û the hyperspace analyser). This added with the option to hide in local chat channel and with the removal of ôshow all pilots in spaceö option from the map would allow players to effectively stalk players and follow them back to there hidden player owned stations in 0.0 / mining ops. Imho it would be pretty cool if scanning was occluded by planets. This would allow fleets to hide behind planets and perhaps not be noticed by a scout who just warped in and done a quick scan from the direction of the gate. Again opening up the possibility for more tactics.
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 11:01:00 - [43] I couldn't had said it more elequently myself Xavier. Originally by: Xavier Arron Imho it would be pretty cool if scanning was occluded by planets. This would allow fleets to hide behind planets and perhaps not be noticed by a scout who just warped in and done a quick scan from the direction of the gate. Again opening up the possibility for more tactics. I would like that very much and I'm sure people will be suggesting it come Shiva. I'll post this in the EVE Idea forum for ya.
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 11:01:00 - [44] I couldn't had said it more elequently myself Xavier. Originally by: Xavier Arron Imho it would be pretty cool if scanning was occluded by planets. This would allow fleets to hide behind planets and perhaps not be noticed by a scout who just warped in and done a quick scan from the direction of the gate. Again opening up the possibility for more tactics. I would like that very much and I'm sure people will be suggesting it come Shiva. I'll post this in the EVE Idea forum for ya.
TheMiner	Posted - 2004.09.27 11:09:00 - [45] By each persons request ad ideas it is obvious who is a pk and who is not. lol
TheMiner	Posted - 2004.09.27 11:09:00 - [46] By each persons request ad ideas it is obvious who is a pk and who is not. lol
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 11:21:00 - [47] Originally by: TheMiner By each persons request ad ideas it is obvious who is a pk and who is not. lol I would like this feature so I can mine/NPC hunt in 0.0 in an corner system that is unlikely to have scouts or an alliance/corp station. I think, with the changes suggested here, that I could sneak into 0.0 and not worry, necessarily, that my blip on the F10 map will be instantly seen. With the System Scanner in place I can immediately know where a pirate is (and he will know where I am as well). The speed at which I can warp will now be an even MORE important feature in my ship (might want to get those Inertia Stabilizer modules), since he'll be able to follow me wherever I go (no more Safe spots in Shiva). Even if I log out, supposedly, a pirate will be able to see my warp signature and know where I logged out...which means if I don't get away or confront the pirate he'll probably camp my login point. I don't think people who currently use safe spots realize that they will be useless if a pirate has a System Scanner - which will become standard equipment in every pirate group. Additionally, small groups of pirates can enter alliance space and have fun, instead of instantly being seen on "Pilots in Space" and have a fleet of 20 chase them. Hit and run tactics, hiding in off-shoot systems, basically more fun. However, I think alliance/corps should be able to install a System Scanner in a station they own and get the "Pilots in Space" information for THAT system. Fleet combat will become very interesting since intelligence and scouting will become a very important component to the battle. Example: Fleet A enters enemy's territory. Fleet B had a station at their border and saw the 'blob' enter their territory. Fleet B prepared to fight. Fleet C is in a system off the side that Fleet A forgot to scan/scout. Now Fleet B and C converge onto Fleet A and block Fleet A's escape. Carnage ensues, mayham and little children screaming everywhere . But I digress. The game will become more fun in the end for EVERYONE.
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 11:21:00 - [48] Originally by: TheMiner By each persons request ad ideas it is obvious who is a pk and who is not. lol I would like this feature so I can mine/NPC hunt in 0.0 in an corner system that is unlikely to have scouts or an alliance/corp station. I think, with the changes suggested here, that I could sneak into 0.0 and not worry, necessarily, that my blip on the F10 map will be instantly seen. With the System Scanner in place I can immediately know where a pirate is (and he will know where I am as well). The speed at which I can warp will now be an even MORE important feature in my ship (might want to get those Inertia Stabilizer modules), since he'll be able to follow me wherever I go (no more Safe spots in Shiva). Even if I log out, supposedly, a pirate will be able to see my warp signature and know where I logged out...which means if I don't get away or confront the pirate he'll probably camp my login point. I don't think people who currently use safe spots realize that they will be useless if a pirate has a System Scanner - which will become standard equipment in every pirate group. Additionally, small groups of pirates can enter alliance space and have fun, instead of instantly being seen on "Pilots in Space" and have a fleet of 20 chase them. Hit and run tactics, hiding in off-shoot systems, basically more fun. However, I think alliance/corps should be able to install a System Scanner in a station they own and get the "Pilots in Space" information for THAT system. Fleet combat will become very interesting since intelligence and scouting will become a very important component to the battle. Example: Fleet A enters enemy's territory. Fleet B had a station at their border and saw the 'blob' enter their territory. Fleet B prepared to fight. Fleet C is in a system off the side that Fleet A forgot to scan/scout. Now Fleet B and C converge onto Fleet A and block Fleet A's escape. Carnage ensues, mayham and little children screaming everywhere . But I digress. The game will become more fun in the end for EVERYONE.
cashman	Posted - 2004.09.27 12:10:00 - [49] No. No no no. Now go away carebear. ____________________________________ »»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»
cashman	Posted - 2004.09.27 12:10:00 - [50] No. No no no. Now go away carebear. ____________________________________ »»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»»
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 21:01:00 - [51] Originally by: cashman No. No no no. Now go away carebear. Who's the carebear? If anything these changes will make 0.0 more FUN and enjoyable to everyone.
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 21:01:00 - [52] Originally by: cashman No. No no no. Now go away carebear. Who's the carebear? If anything these changes will make 0.0 more FUN and enjoyable to everyone.
Earthan	Posted - 2004.09.27 21:37:00 - [53] Agreed S'daria ,100 % agreed and we have much more dynamic and fun Eve Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
Earthan	Posted - 2004.09.27 21:37:00 - [54] Agreed S'daria ,100 % agreed and we have much more dynamic and fun Eve Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
Earthan	Posted - 2004.09.27 21:40:00 - [55] no more boring to death stupid blob wars or at least much less, with war of scouts before. Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
Earthan	Posted - 2004.09.27 21:40:00 - [56] no more boring to death stupid blob wars or at least much less, with war of scouts before. Stars, stars like dust, all around me....
Ronyo Dae'Loki	Posted - 2004.09.27 22:05:00 - [57] I'm sure there are some other dead horses you can beat, this one is 6 feet under by now. ------------- My salsa makes all the pretty girls want to dance and take off their underpants. I <3 ( . Y . )
Ronyo Dae'Loki	Posted - 2004.09.27 22:05:00 - [58] I'm sure there are some other dead horses you can beat, this one is 6 feet under by now. ------------- My salsa makes all the pretty girls want to dance and take off their underpants. I <3 ( . Y . )
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 22:49:00 - [59] Originally by: Ronyo Dae'Loki I'm sure there are some other dead horses you can beat, this one is 6 feet under by now. Then why are people still posting? I think with the advent of System Scanners(tm) that more and more people will consider these changes. We'll see, I'm sure because of these changes: 1. System Scanners(tm), no more safe spots 2. Pirates can still see you in Local chat 3. Pirates can still see you in "Pilots in Space" 80 jumps away safely in a station 4. They are increasing the logout timer from 2 minutes to 3 minutes Happy Hunting.
S'Daria	Posted - 2004.09.27 22:49:00 - [60] Originally by: Ronyo Dae'Loki I'm sure there are some other dead horses you can beat, this one is 6 feet under by now. Then why are people still posting? I think with the advent of System Scanners(tm) that more and more people will consider these changes. We'll see, I'm sure because of these changes: 1. System Scanners(tm), no more safe spots 2. Pirates can still see you in Local chat 3. Pirates can still see you in "Pilots in Space" 80 jumps away safely in a station 4. They are increasing the logout timer from 2 minutes to 3 minutes Happy Hunting.

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