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Kayna Eelai
Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2009.07.21 10:08:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Kayna Eelai on 21/07/2009 10:08:48 so, this might have been discussed to no end on this forums, but i can't find any decent post about this right now.
from the eve wiki: Quote:
Salvaging Proficiency at salvaging ship wrecks. Required skill for the use of salvager modules. 5% increase in chance of salvage retrieval per level.
Quote:
(Hint: Every level of hacking increases the per-cycle chance of a successful hack on the container, so the higher it is the better. If you are hacking 0.0 hacking sites, there are some containers that you will not be able to hack unless you have at least a certain minimum level of the hacking skill. Most pilots recommend training the skill to lvl4 in order to be able to open all containers. Training the Skill to lvl5 only gives you another 5% chance, and does not unlock any higher level containers.)
in my opinion, this text is a bit ambiguos and i have been discussing this with a corp mate, but none of use managed to convince the other.
so, the question is: a) does higher salvaging/analizing/hacking skills just make the result faster (as in %5 better chance of success per cycle)
OR
b) does higher salvaging/analizing/hacking skills increase your chance of getting something (as in, with low skills you get many empty cans, with high skills you'll nearly always get something in the cans)
if any1 can provide link to further info about this, much appretiated.
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Leeham
Gallente Dissonance Corp Libertas Fidelitas
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Posted - 2009.07.21 10:13:00 -
[2]
It makes the result faster. the salvage on a wreck is predetermined when the wreck is created.
The proof is in the behaviour of all these modules to deactivate on the first cycle if the salvage would be too large for your cargo bay such as with metal scrap filled npc Battleships
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2009.07.21 10:31:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Leeham It makes the result faster. the salvage on a wreck is predetermined when the wreck is created.
The proof is in the behaviour of all these modules to deactivate on the first cycle if the salvage would be too large for your cargo bay such as with metal scrap filled npc Battleships
and you're sure it works exactly the same for codebreakers and analyzers?
fixed to 23.15 kB (23710 bytes) |
DNightmare
Caldari The Gosimer and Scarab
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Posted - 2009.07.21 10:50:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Kayna Eelai
Originally by: Leeham It makes the result faster. the salvage on a wreck is predetermined when the wreck is created.
The proof is in the behaviour of all these modules to deactivate on the first cycle if the salvage would be too large for your cargo bay such as with metal scrap filled npc Battleships
and you're sure it works exactly the same for codebreakers and analyzers?
I am! It works the same for all 3 moduletypes and other loot-related functions in EvE. What's inside is predetermined when the entity is spawned, not when it is accessed. Somewhere around the forums is a dev-post about that issue, which I stumbled upon some weeks ago, but I can't seem to find it atm :/
cheers DNightmare
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Bezariel
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Posted - 2009.07.21 11:15:00 -
[5]
The percentages on the module used for "opening" (analyzer, codebreaker, salvager) determine what chance you have of accessing the predetermined content of the spawn container or wreck on any given try.
T1 modules: 5% per skill level, i.e. 5-10-15-20-25% respectively T2 modules: 7% per skill level, i.e. 7-14-21-28-35% respectively
Spawn containers come in four tiers, each with a different open chance modifier, additive to the numbers listed above. These modifiers are: +30, +10, 0, -10
(database dumps show some with +20, and some needing hacking skill at level 4 regardless of the modifier. Also some might work entirely differently, one can never be sure - good example are the wormhole systems' cans, there is no indication to their workings in the database on chrukers)
So a first tier can (+30) with a lvl 3 codebreaker (15) would have a total 45% (+30+15) of open chance, a fourth tier can with the same codebreaker totals to 5% (-10+15)
Rigs modify the modules' percentage values (not additively though) - i.e. a max skilled codebreaker (25%) with a T1 memetic algorithm bank rig (+20%) will total to 25*1,2=30%
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Arrs Grazznic
Pawn Sauce
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Posted - 2009.07.21 11:54:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Bezariel The percentages on the module used for "opening" (analyzer, codebreaker, salvager) determine what chance you have of accessing the predetermined content of the spawn container or wreck on any given try.
T1 modules: 5% per skill level, i.e. 5-10-15-20-25% respectively T2 modules: 7% per skill level, i.e. 7-14-21-28-35% respectively
Spawn containers come in four tiers, each with a different open chance modifier, additive to the numbers listed above. These modifiers are: +30, +10, 0, -10
(database dumps show some with +20, and some needing hacking skill at level 4 regardless of the modifier. Also some might work entirely differently, one can never be sure - good example are the wormhole systems' cans, there is no indication to their workings in the database on chrukers)
So a first tier can (+30) with a lvl 3 codebreaker (15) would have a total 45% (+30+15) of open chance, a fourth tier can with the same codebreaker totals to 5% (-10+15)
Rigs modify the modules' percentage values (not additively though) - i.e. a max skilled codebreaker (25%) with a T1 memetic algorithm bank rig (+20%) will total to 25*1,2=30%
Thank you -- this was one of the most useful posts I've seen on the baords for a long time!
Cheers, Arrs
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2009.07.21 12:01:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Bezariel The percentages on the module used for "opening" (analyzer, codebreaker, salvager) determine what chance you have of accessing the predetermined content of the spawn container or wreck on any given try.
T1 modules: 5% per skill level, i.e. 5-10-15-20-25% respectively T2 modules: 7% per skill level, i.e. 7-14-21-28-35% respectively
Spawn containers come in four tiers, each with a different open chance modifier, additive to the numbers listed above. These modifiers are: +30, +10, 0, -10
(database dumps show some with +20, and some needing hacking skill at level 4 regardless of the modifier. Also some might work entirely differently, one can never be sure - good example are the wormhole systems' cans, there is no indication to their workings in the database on chrukers)
So a first tier can (+30) with a lvl 3 codebreaker (15) would have a total 45% (+30+15) of open chance, a fourth tier can with the same codebreaker totals to 5% (-10+15)
Rigs modify the modules' percentage values (not additively though) - i.e. a max skilled codebreaker (25%) with a T1 memetic algorithm bank rig (+20%) will total to 25*1,2=30%
nice post indeed. but it all comes down to the fact that you will be able to open a can even if you have a total of 1% chance and that the CONTENT of the can is not affected by any of the numbers and modifiers posted so far. right?
fixed to 23.15 kB (23710 bytes) |
Jagga Spikes
Minmatar Sebiestor tribe
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Posted - 2009.07.21 12:01:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Bezariel ...
Rigs modify the modules' percentage values (not additively though) - i.e. a max skilled codebreaker (25%) with a T1 memetic algorithm bank rig (+20%) will total to 25*1,2=30%
this is intriguing. tackle rig gives additive bonus to salvaging chance. odd that modules that are the same in the way of operation, apply bonus differently.
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voidvim
Minmatar Genco Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2009.07.21 12:33:00 -
[9]
cheers - your repliy is quite useful Salvaging guide:moon materials guide |
Bezariel
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Posted - 2009.07.21 14:11:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Kayna Eelai
Originally by: Bezariel [...]
nice post indeed. but it all comes down to the fact that you will be able to open a can even if you have a total of 1% chance and that the CONTENT of the can is not affected by any of the numbers and modifiers posted so far. right?
Yes, right. The percentages only determine what chance you have of accessing the contents (however slim a chance that might be).
You can not influence at all what those contents will be, negatively or positively, as that is determined by the spawn container itself (i.e. the wreck, takmahl can, etc)
Originally by: Jagga Spikes
Originally by: Bezariel ...
Rigs modify the modules' percentage values (not additively though) - i.e. a max skilled codebreaker (25%) with a T1 memetic algorithm bank rig (+20%) will total to 25*1,2=30%
this is intriguing. tackle rig gives additive bonus to salvaging chance. odd that modules that are the same in the way of operation, apply bonus differently.
I was not aware of this distinction, as I havent used salvaging rigs much - what I wrote was based on my personal experience with archaeology rigs.
I read up on it though, and I concur. Note how the bonus descriptions on the rigs differ: Arch / Hack rig: "accessdifficultybonus +20%" Salvage rig: "accessdifficultybonus +10"
So to summarize: arch / hack rig bonuses are multiplicative, salvage rig bonus is additive.
This makes rigged salvaging easier than rigged hacking / analyzing. [insert envy]
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente Paxton Industries Paxton Federation
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Posted - 2009.07.22 06:37:00 -
[11]
Originally by: DNightmare Somewhere around the forums is a dev-post about that issue, which I stumbled upon some weeks ago, but I can't seem to find it atm :/
would be nice to find that dev post, as i can't seem to convince my corp mate that he might be wrong
fixed to 23.15 kB (23710 bytes) |
Nyphur
Pillowsoft Total Comfort
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Posted - 2009.07.22 07:03:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Jagga Spikes this is intriguing. tackle rig gives additive bonus to salvaging chance. odd that modules that are the same in the way of operation, apply bonus differently.
An interesting side-effect of this is that the advanced sleeper BS that need level 5 to salvage can be salvaged with level 4 and salvage tackle rigs. Or at least that's what the wiki says ^^;.
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Melissa Brown
Marquie-X Corp
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Posted - 2009.07.22 14:37:00 -
[13]
Originally by: DNightmare
Originally by: Kayna Eelai
and you're sure it works exactly the same for codebreakers and analyzers?
I am! It works the same for all 3 moduletypes and other loot-related functions in EvE. What's inside is predetermined when the entity is spawned, not when it is accessed. Somewhere around the forums is a dev-post about that issue, which I stumbled upon some weeks ago, but I can't seem to find it atm :/
cheers DNightmare
As exploration has been introduced to the game it was possible to cargoscan the spawncontainers. Later on this has been disabled by CCP. The cargoscan resulted in a broad selection of items being displayed, but succesully hacking the container only got you a few of these. Maybe the cargoscan showed the loottable of the container? I suppose the reuslt of hacking has not been predetermined at that time.
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Kentares Kodiak
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Posted - 2009.07.22 14:44:00 -
[14]
Is there any Exploration guide (made by Dnightmare maybe) updated to current data ?
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