|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 61 post(s) |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
16
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 04:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
Nethras wrote:That is... a lot of emails that you seem to be getting no reply on. Perhaps you should double check where you're sending them and that it is in fact an email address CCP actually reads.
It was the official email used by the team as confirmed by Loxy.
All emails sent to the address from us were completely ignored and the only response we got from an official CCP entity was the response from the Senior GM. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
16
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 04:57:00 -
[2] - Quote
Michael Harari wrote:Intigo wrote:Nethras wrote:That is... a lot of emails that you seem to be getting no reply on. Perhaps you should double check where you're sending them and that it is in fact an email address CCP actually reads. It was the official email used by the team as confirmed by Loxy. All emails sent to the address from us were completely ignored and the only response we got from an official CCP entity was the response from the Senior GM. Its almost as if the AT team wanted you to get banned
That much is obvious. I guess our leadership made the mistake of thinking they could cooperate with CCP when it came to things like this. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
18
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 06:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
Stewwhich wrote:CCP Soundwave wrote:spookydonut wrote:Maybe you should have taken their warnings seriously and only entered one team. Solid advice right there. You know what would be sound advice? Trying to bring some consistency to CCP. For example, CCP pretty much said that they worked with excutors of RvB in order to facilitate the Alliance Tournament entry for them. Why did you not provide the same courtesy to Hydra and Outbreak? Did you even send correspondence to them asking them to stop combined training? Considering that you already set precedence with RvB and that one of your own employees answered Hydra's petition regarding unified training you should rescind the ban and work out the issue with executors of Hydra / Outbreak. Otherwise you look like petulant children stomping their feet and saying "But I don't wanna have them in ATX, they gave me a booboo last year".
This is a good post. I'm still amazed that every single email sent to the tournament team was completely ignored and the only official response we got (a Senior GM out of touch with the tournament team) was deemed invalid. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
18
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 07:11:00 -
[4] - Quote
Kadesh Priestess wrote:Intigo wrote:This is a good post. I'm still amazed that every single email sent to the tournament team was completely ignored and the only official response we got (a Senior GM out of touch with the tournament team) was deemed invalid. Let me quote myself, post from the other thread: Kadesh Priestess wrote:Tyrrax Thorrk wrote:Pretty sure it was the tournament team that banned you (sreegs) and they didn't even know about what the GM said to you until it was posted in the thread, ergo they hadn't read any of your correspondence. I asked CCP Spitfire if particularly that GM is allowed to reply such questions. He assured that GMs won't reply questions concerning AT without asking proper people & said that this GM is really competent guy and his words might be relied on. I really doubt Senior GM with such credit would post random answer about things he has no clue about.
Oh, I didn't see that.
So that's another CCP member telling us that the Senior GM can be trusted and that his word is given either from knowing what he's talking about or from asking the people responsible for the tournament itself what should be done in this case.
Yet the tournament team dismisses what he said entirely when it is the only response given from CCP to us on the entire matter when our emails were ignored?
It's a bit sad that CCP would ignore all communication and ban us from the tournament 30 minutes before the auctions open. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
19
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 07:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Rear Infiltration wrote:Maybe if you didn't make a joke of the finals in the previous year, this wouldn't be happening?
Have you read Duncans post from last year? Last years final was a massive mistake and was not intended to go down that way. Everyone involved with that sincerely regrets how it went down and would love for nothing else than to have shown a true, fun brawl for everyone involved (that means, the viewers) to enjoy to the fullest. Mistakes were made and many apologies were made on the forums last year.
Do the rules apply differently to us because of what happened last year? Is it fair to punish 2 teams for a genuine mistake (that was in every way unintentional) that happened a year prior by ignoring any attempt at communication (emails) and invalidating the statements from 2 CCP members (the Senior GM in question and CCP Spitfire).
I don't think you could find anyone more apologetic about how the finals went down last year than Duncan. We love to watch, follow and compete in the tournament as much as everyone else. We are fans like everyone else and it should be obvious how bad Duncan felt about the way the tournament ended. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
20
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 09:05:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dubez wrote:Quote:This is a good post. I'm still amazed that every single email sent to the tournament team was completely ignored and the only official response we got (a Senior GM out of touch with the tournament team) was deemed invalid. Yeah, because you know, everyone who works at CCP is entitled to make decisions for a group completely unrelated to them. Oh yeah, and they are robots and never make mistakes ever. You say you sent countless mails. Lets see them. Own up or shut up imo. I find it difficult to take anything seriously from a group of people senseless enough to slither around what is considered good form. You ****** up, own up. You humiliated not only CCP but the entire EVE community by pulling that bull **** at Fanfest. Why can't you play fair like everyone else? Sure Goonswarm and TEST team up, but they aren't sharing their ****. At least the have some dignity in that respect. You guys on the other hand; no, not worth my time, CCPs time, or the player bases' time. Goodbye and good riddance.
Fanfest?! The tournament at Fanfest was won by HYDRA fair and square - it was a 3v3 with Haart, Leeloo and Leeloo's friend flying. This has nothing to do with the Fanfest tournament.
And the mails sent to the Tournament team (that were all ignored and not answered) are in Garmons original post on this matter:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1356717#post1356717
Also, on the subject of testing together - CVA and 4th was considering (or have done) testing together too and you have no idea of what is shared or not shared between TEST / GSF. Nor do you realize what HYDRA & Outbreak are hiding from each other to bring out in case we met each other in the tournament.
Are you really arguing these things? Your points make no sense and have no basis in logic. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
24
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 15:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
Pallidum Treponema wrote:Raqn Paudeen wrote:Michael Harari wrote:I pretty much imagine the way this went down is the AT team giggling as they got each email from Garmon, passing it around the office and giggling some more.
This is clearly revenge for last year's finals, even though the metagaming antics of HYDRA made the entire tournament awesome to watch and think about. My question to the AT team is this. If you have been paying so much attention to HYDRA and what they have been doing, how did you overlook all the messages they sent to you? The whole thing seems a bit.. fishy, and honestly its a **** start to the AT.
|

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
27
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 15:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
If the GM response was the only attempt at getting information out of the tournament team that would be relevant, but it was not. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
31
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 15:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
It's ok - CCP has started deleting posts now. Excellent work. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
31
|
Posted - 2012.05.25 16:54:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Jimmy Luv wrote:A lack of communication on they're part should not consitute a problem on Outbreak/Hydras. It is when Outbreak/Hydra are the ones not communicating properlyGǪ
...what did we do wrong when we emailed the official Alliance Tournament address twice?
Zero reply. |
|

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
41
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 14:22:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:Suleiman Shouaa wrote:CCP still mad due to AT IX Final (despite the semi-finals being better than most finals). CCP staff who are dedicated to the AT chose not to respond to Hydra's emails, despite responding to other emails from other teams. CCP bans 0utbreak/Genos, despite them having all the time in the world to tell them to knock it off if they actually wanted them in the tournament (ie. greater good for all the viewers). CCP starts deleting posts on forums related to this
:shocker: If you're going to post a timeline insert facts. Don't misrepresent me or the team purposely. That doesn't look like a request because it isn't.
What facts did he miss?
The part where a Senior GM concluded it was ok to practice together?
The part where other teams practiced together?
The part where CVA was confused about the rules as well and had to ask for clarification because HYDRA & Outbreak were instantly banned?
The part where you left the rules intentionally vague so you could ban teams that you had a grudge against even though they had already attempted to get clarification from the Alliance Tournament team? |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
41
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 14:31:00 -
[12] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:Intigo wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:Suleiman Shouaa wrote:CCP still mad due to AT IX Final (despite the semi-finals being better than most finals). CCP staff who are dedicated to the AT chose not to respond to Hydra's emails, despite responding to other emails from other teams. CCP bans 0utbreak/Genos, despite them having all the time in the world to tell them to knock it off if they actually wanted them in the tournament (ie. greater good for all the viewers). CCP starts deleting posts on forums related to this
:shocker: If you're going to post a timeline insert facts. Don't misrepresent me or the team purposely. That doesn't look like a request because it isn't. What facts did he miss? The part where a Senior GM concluded it was ok to practice together? The part where other teams practiced together? The part where CVA was confused about the rules as well and had to ask for clarification because HYDRA & Outbreak were instantly banned? The part where you left the rules intentionally vague so you could ban teams that you had a grudge against even though they had already attempted to get clarification from the Alliance Tournament team? You can keep pretending you were banned for "practicing together" as much as you want. That was never the case. If I wanted you out you'd never have entered. Stop being obtuse.
That may very well be, but the rules under which HYDRA & Outbreak were banned were so vague that anyone who practiced together could have been banned under them.
You clarified them after banning HYDRA & Outbreak that joining a single corp is the basis for which you are officially "ban-worthy"
Did you read the post by the CVA member yet? They were considering doing the very same thing because your rules were so vague that was impossible to tell if that was legal or not.
You have no way of saying "HYDRA & Outbreak should have seen this coming" when other teams considered doing the very same thing.
How can you justify banning HYDRA & Outbreak without any warning, without responding to any attempts at communication when other teams had considered doing the very same thing that HYDRA & Outbreak did in order to make wormhole practicing ENDURABLE?!
This goes for YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT as well. Because the rule was so vague they had no way of knowing they were breaking them - this is not exclusive to HYDRA & Outbreak's situation, it goes for every team in the tournament.
If you had seen CVA & 4th doing the same thing we did prior to banning HYDRA & Outbreak would you have banned both their teams too? |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
41
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 14:36:00 -
[13] - Quote
Tappits wrote:IamBeastx wrote:Kadesh Priestess wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:None of those teams had a history of cheating using the exact same methods they were using again this year. Were we not to have to enforce these new rules a conversation with PL or RvB wouldn't have been necessary because those teams would have been in. PL had a b-team in AT9 and probably even earlier. They didn't **** up with finals, but it doesn't mean they were not 'cheating'. Until ATX secondary teams was not a rule breaker. B team also tested 100% separately from the main team. it had its own fits and tactics. it never merged 2 teams/corps/alliances into one corp and hid in a worm hole.
It's a good thing that CCP clarified that joining the same corp was not allowed, but practicing together is.
The fact that the rule is so vague is the very reason that CVA & 4th were confused. They had considered doing the very same thing before HYDRA & Outbreak were banned.
Do you think Sreegs would have instantly banned their teams too? |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
41
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 14:37:00 -
[14] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:Keep grasping buddy eventually you'll find something that sticks and we'll let you back in. Honest.
How am I grasping? I presented some questions to you that you chose to ignore (a fairly common trend, with the Alliance Tournament team, it would appear).
How can you justify banning HYDRA & Outbreak without any warning, without responding to any attempts at communication when other teams had considered doing the very same thing that HYDRA & Outbreak did in order to make wormhole practicing ENDURABLE?!
Did you read the CVA thread yet? |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
47
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 14:59:00 -
[15] - Quote
Reiterating "read the stickies" does not explain anything at all. CVA & 4th considered doing the very same thing we did without being aware at all that it was not allowed because your rules were so vague that you can suit any ruling to fit your needs.
Does the fact that they had the same plan initially not give you a hint at how vague your ruleset is and how silly it is for the entire Alliance Tournament team to ignore all attempts at communication from Garmon?
And yet you instantly ban 3 teams taking all those things into consideration.
It's impressive. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
53
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 15:22:00 -
[16] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:No but what I do know is what they did last year and it won't be happening again now. You're welcome.
That's a great way to run a tournament. Ban teams this year based on what they did last year when the ruleset was entirely different.
The more you reply the more obvious it gets that banning HYDRA & Outbreak is entirely because of a grudge held by CCP. The Alliance Tournament team ignores all emails sent to them and you create a ruleset so vague that you can fit it to your needs as you go.
CVA & 4th intended to do the very same thing that HYDRA & Outbreak did because they were practicing in a wormhole too - you still have yet to address that at all. The fact that CVA & 4th felt that this was within the rules (just as we did) is a testimony to how insane it is that you ban HYDRA & Outbreak over doing it. |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
53
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 15:35:00 -
[17] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:Intigo wrote:CCP Sreegs wrote:No but what I do know is what they did last year and it won't be happening again now. You're welcome. That's a great way to run a tournament. Ban teams this year based on what they did last year when the ruleset was entirely different. The more you reply the more obvious it gets that banning HYDRA & Outbreak is entirely because of a grudge held by CCP. The Alliance Tournament team ignores all emails sent to them and you create a ruleset so vague that you can fit it to your needs as you go. CVA & 4th intended to do the very same thing that HYDRA & Outbreak did because they were practicing in a wormhole too - you still have yet to address that at all. The fact that CVA & 4th felt that this was within the rules (just as we did) is a testimony to how insane it is that you ban HYDRA & Outbreak over doing it. I know it suits your desire to be martyrs to keep pretending there's some grudge but as I said you have yourself, well really your leaders to blame and absolutely nobody else. I'm sorry accepting responsibility for your own actions that we didn't make you do is so difficult but at some point you're going to have to come to grips with you.
And again you completely ignore the point. You have yet to address that CVA & 4th considered doing the very same thing just prior to HYDRA & Outbreak getting banned. How is that NOT proof that your ruleset is insanely vague and a pretty good indication that banning 2 teams outright over it is unjustly harsh? HYDRA & Outbreak were not trying to hide that we practiced together in a single corporation because we thought it was well within the rules just like CVA would have thought.
Why should I blame the HYDRA leaders that asked the Alliance Tournament team for clarification (and were ignored multiple times) and thought they were acting within the rules?
How can you not see that the fact that 2 other teams considered doing the very same thing well within the rules is an indication of how terribly vague that rule is? And that banning 2 teams over it is insane when you have made no attempts to COMMUNICATE, CLARIFY or WARN them prior to it happening.
This could have happened to CVA & 4th (if, of course, you are consistent about rules being applied to all teams) just as well as HYDRA & Outbreak if they had just done it a bit earlier.
Or would the rules have been applied differently because they didn't **** you off during AT IX? |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
54
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 15:40:00 -
[18] - Quote
Suleiman Shouaa wrote:Can you just state why the CCP Alliance Tournament team chose not to respond to them, but responded to other emails.
I would love to know this too.
And the fact that he has yet to address anything about CVA considering to do the very same thing we did and thinking it was well within the rules (as we did). |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
57
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 15:48:00 -
[19] - Quote
How am I spamming, Sreegs? I am just asking questions. If I am breaking any forum rules then please remind me which rules I am breaking and I will cease to do so.
And again, you ignored the part about other teams considering doing the very same thing.
And the unanswered emails.
Time Funnel wrote:Intigo wrote:Suleiman Shouaa wrote:Can you just state why the CCP Alliance Tournament team chose not to respond to them, but responded to other emails. I would love to know this too. And the fact that he has yet to address anything about CVA considering to do the very same thing we did and thinking it was well within the rules (as we did). CVA should be banned! They did what we did! We were banned! THIS IS SO TERRIBLY UNFAIR. WHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAA
I don't want CVA banned, they are awesome guys. I am using them as an example, simply. You should be able to see how silly it is that 2 teams get instantly banned over something that 2 entirely different entities had considered doing thinking it was well within the rules - just as HYDRA & Outbreak thought.
And this being after any attempts at clarification were completely ignored by the Alliance Tournament team.
This is the part in question:
Quote:-4th and CVA decided to train against each other, testing setups. We would dicsuss failures, wins, errors made etc, but in the end we would never make a deal, just train together. -We discussed forming 1 (ONE) corporation to make these training in wormholes possible; if we wouldnt merge, 4th would have been forced to spend days and days to setup their own pos, to do this.
|

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
59
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 16:05:00 -
[20] - Quote
CCP Sreegs wrote:penifSMASH wrote:Sreegs, I think you are doing a great job handling ATX and responding to these myriad of troll questions. Keep up the good work. I'm demanding overtime!
You still haven't responded at all to the example I presented in regards to CVA & 4th. They were not mentioned in the stickies - I checked.
Time Funnel wrote:Intigo wrote: I don't want CVA banned, they are awesome guys. I am using them as an example, simply. You should be able to see how silly it is that 2 teams get instantly banned over something that 2 entirely different entities had considered doing thinking it was well within the rules.
If you think that you are under the microscope because you were a large part of the reason that the rules against collusion got put in place you are probably right. What do you really expect to happen? I mean seriously. Sure you are good at this game and at tournaments. in fact you were the primary archetype that I used when putting together a team for this year, examining your setups, methods, and whatnot. But you made a tactical mistake. And someone hit you with the rulebook. Overall it sucks, but they needed to stomp out collusion. It gives people an unfair advantage in a tournament format. If you thought for a minute one guy on "Team Liquid" in Starcraft was soft playing his senior member on the same team during a final, there would be fan outrage. That is not fair, balanced, or good for anyone involved. When a rule changes there is inertia. I believe this is the inertia. Sorry you were made an example of. Move on.
I am not saying we are "under the microscope" - that is perfectly fair if we were. What I am arguing is that other teams considered doing the EXACT same thing we did because they thought it was well within the rules (just as we did).
That is an excellent example of the fact that the rules are incredibly vague and that banning 2 separate teams over it after ignoring ALL attempts at clarification/communication and giving no warning is ludicrous.
The ruling here was based off what happened in AT IX - there is no way you can justify it based entirely off what happened in AT X. And that is just sad. "We discussed forming 1 (ONE) corporation to make these training in wormholes possible; if we wouldnt merge, 4th would have been forced to spend days and days to setup their own pos, to do this." 2 separate teams considered doing the same thing HYDRA & Outbreak did - how can you justify banning 2 teams who thought it was within the rules? |
|

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
61
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 16:08:00 -
[21] - Quote
Michael Harari wrote:Suleiman Shouaa wrote:Can you just state why the CCP Alliance Tournament team chose not to respond to them, but responded to other emails. I think we all know why.
I wish I knew. If Sreegs would reply we could all rest easy because we'd have an official response! "We discussed forming 1 (ONE) corporation to make these training in wormholes possible; if we wouldnt merge, 4th would have been forced to spend days and days to setup their own pos, to do this." 2 separate teams considered doing the same thing HYDRA & Outbreak did - how can you justify banning 2 teams who thought it was within the rules? |

Intigo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
64
|
Posted - 2012.05.26 16:20:00 -
[22] - Quote
CCP Soundwave wrote:Sahjahn wrote:Apparantly you're not allowed to state how useless you feel certain members of CCP staff are.
Strange you'd think as paying customers you would be entitled to such opinions and able to air them. You think that's strange? I'm not really familiar with any games that would let people abuse staff members just because they're customers.
Hi Soundwave, one of my many Danish brethren!
Do you know why all emails sent in an attempt to communicate and get clarification from the Alliance Tournament team by Garmon were completely ignored while the RvB ones were handled without issue and a compromise was made?
Alternatively, what do you think about the fact that HYDRA & Outbreak were banned over something that 2 other teams considered doing thinking it was well within the rules (just as HYDRA & Outbreak did)? "We discussed forming 1 (ONE) corporation to make these training in wormholes possible; if we wouldnt merge, 4th would have been forced to spend days and days to setup their own pos, to do this." 2 separate teams considered doing the same thing HYDRA & Outbreak did - how can you justify banning 2 teams who thought it was within the rules? |
|
|
|