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TotensBurntCorpse	Posted - 2004.10.24 23:11:00 - [181] Powermind thanks for the 10 Mil ISKs. Your a gentle being of honour! TotensBurntCorpse Likes EVE, Starfleet Command Series, Earth & Beyond, Anything Battlefield, MOHAA, Call of Duty. Dislikes Not much.
TotensBurntCorpse	Posted - 2004.10.24 23:11:00 - [182] Powermind thanks for the 10 Mil ISKs. Your a gentle being of honour! TotensBurntCorpse Likes EVE, Starfleet Command Series, Earth & Beyond, Anything Battlefield, MOHAA, Call of Duty. Dislikes Not much.
Rezarael	Posted - 2004.10.25 01:21:00 - [183] Edited by: Rezarael on 25/10/2004 01:26:07 Hmm... when you make a new character you get 1000 isk for free, and then give it to a friend and make another new character and give that character's money to him and so on... haha i've figured out how to cheat the system... slowly... a few thousand isk every 20 hours or so... but in the end, i'll be a thousandaire and the economy will bend to my will! Does that count?
Rezarael	Posted - 2004.10.25 01:21:00 - [184] Edited by: Rezarael on 25/10/2004 01:26:07 Hmm... when you make a new character you get 1000 isk for free, and then give it to a friend and make another new character and give that character's money to him and so on... haha i've figured out how to cheat the system... slowly... a few thousand isk every 20 hours or so... but in the end, i'll be a thousandaire and the economy will bend to my will! Does that count?
Kerosene	Posted - 2004.10.26 03:52:00 - [185] 1 Player to Player transaction that doesn't involve NPC's but can generate isk into the system. I'm in Yulai. TomB logs in. TomB clicks his little buttons and I'm 1bil isk richer. TomB logs out.
Kerosene	Posted - 2004.10.26 03:52:00 - [186] 1 Player to Player transaction that doesn't involve NPC's but can generate isk into the system. I'm in Yulai. TomB logs in. TomB clicks his little buttons and I'm 1bil isk richer. TomB logs out.
Woetra	Posted - 2004.10.26 18:30:00 - [187] Edited by: Woetra on 26/10/2004 18:54:35 player1 convoes player2, costs 100isk = 10 mil please Disclaimer: I didn't read any other replies EDIT: Disclaimer, I didn't read the question properly either Sig Thief
Woetra	Posted - 2004.10.26 18:30:00 - [188] Edited by: Woetra on 26/10/2004 18:54:35 player1 convoes player2, costs 100isk = 10 mil please Disclaimer: I didn't read any other replies EDIT: Disclaimer, I didn't read the question properly either Sig Thief
Shakul	Posted - 2004.10.26 23:02:00 - [189] Originally by: Rezarael Edited by: Rezarael on 25/10/2004 01:26:07 Hmm... when you make a new character you get 1000 isk for free, and then give it to a friend and make another new character and give that character's money to him and so on... haha i've figured out how to cheat the system... slowly... a few thousand isk every 20 hours or so... but in the end, i'll be a thousandaire and the economy will bend to my will! Does that count? no. if you look at the transactions info on your wallet, the 1000isk appears as an inheritance from an NPC corp. Auction your items for isk, works sort of like ebay.
Shakul	Posted - 2004.10.26 23:02:00 - [190] Originally by: Rezarael Edited by: Rezarael on 25/10/2004 01:26:07 Hmm... when you make a new character you get 1000 isk for free, and then give it to a friend and make another new character and give that character's money to him and so on... haha i've figured out how to cheat the system... slowly... a few thousand isk every 20 hours or so... but in the end, i'll be a thousandaire and the economy will bend to my will! Does that count? no. if you look at the transactions info on your wallet, the 1000isk appears as an inheritance from an NPC corp. Auction your items for isk, works sort of like ebay.
Oracle Animus	Posted - 2004.10.27 09:05:00 - [191] There is no need to argue on this subject, because as from the economic view, NPC is an entity that is present there to create Isk, and thus all the interactions with it will do so. Players do not own an Isk printing press, thus they are not able to print the Isk out. To take in the account all the basics of the economics, I can only say that Players are only mediums in distributing Isk from one each other, not creating it. If there is a way to prove you wrong, then it will be in only one rediculous way, and it would be like this (EVEN THOUGH I DO HATE THIS NONSENSE THAT I WILL SAY RIGHT NOW): The only way the player can and is able to introduce isk into the economy is if the player is given powers of a game master, who can either create money on spot, or instead of mining minerals, is able to extract pure Isk from the asteroids. As to another way of thinking (which is could be a bane of me) I might say that without a player, there would be no introduction of Isk into the system at all. If there is no player in the economy (aka distributor) there is no creation of aditional Isk, thus Npc is not the ones to create Isk, but they are our printing presses, which, lets say require inc (imputs) to be able to produce Isk. Tha is all I can say, these points are valid and I do not think that they can be also proven wrong, as to argument, I did disprove it, but I do not intend to disagree with you, because as an inteligent person I say that NPC is creating Isk, while we players don't. Thus, the only way to say this is that NPC are our tools that we use to create Isk, rather then an entity that we socialy interact with. Alrighty, I rest my case, and you can butcher my points however you wish. I do not disagree with your argument, but for the sake of 10 mil, I had to seek philosophical counteragrument for this matter. (If I made misstypes or any other mistakes, I say Oh Well, it doesnt make world fall apart). Everything Has Its Meaning!
Oracle Animus	Posted - 2004.10.27 09:05:00 - [192] There is no need to argue on this subject, because as from the economic view, NPC is an entity that is present there to create Isk, and thus all the interactions with it will do so. Players do not own an Isk printing press, thus they are not able to print the Isk out. To take in the account all the basics of the economics, I can only say that Players are only mediums in distributing Isk from one each other, not creating it. If there is a way to prove you wrong, then it will be in only one rediculous way, and it would be like this (EVEN THOUGH I DO HATE THIS NONSENSE THAT I WILL SAY RIGHT NOW): The only way the player can and is able to introduce isk into the economy is if the player is given powers of a game master, who can either create money on spot, or instead of mining minerals, is able to extract pure Isk from the asteroids. As to another way of thinking (which is could be a bane of me) I might say that without a player, there would be no introduction of Isk into the system at all. If there is no player in the economy (aka distributor) there is no creation of aditional Isk, thus Npc is not the ones to create Isk, but they are our printing presses, which, lets say require inc (imputs) to be able to produce Isk. Tha is all I can say, these points are valid and I do not think that they can be also proven wrong, as to argument, I did disprove it, but I do not intend to disagree with you, because as an inteligent person I say that NPC is creating Isk, while we players don't. Thus, the only way to say this is that NPC are our tools that we use to create Isk, rather then an entity that we socialy interact with. Alrighty, I rest my case, and you can butcher my points however you wish. I do not disagree with your argument, but for the sake of 10 mil, I had to seek philosophical counteragrument for this matter. (If I made misstypes or any other mistakes, I say Oh Well, it doesnt make world fall apart). Everything Has Its Meaning!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.27 12:45:00 - [193] Edited by: qrac on 27/10/2004 12:55:10 here comes qrac.. for the win! i have 2 credits sitting in my hangar. i trade these 2 credits to a fellow player that trades me 1 trit. this player then drags the credits to his wallet and insert magic here 2 isk is added into his wallet and the visible isk world of eve. i then sell my 1 trit for 2 isk. we're now both 2 isk richer (while him having 1 trit less and me having 2 credits less). now gimme my 10 mill. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.27 12:45:00 - [194] Edited by: qrac on 27/10/2004 12:55:10 here comes qrac.. for the win! i have 2 credits sitting in my hangar. i trade these 2 credits to a fellow player that trades me 1 trit. this player then drags the credits to his wallet and insert magic here 2 isk is added into his wallet and the visible isk world of eve. i then sell my 1 trit for 2 isk. we're now both 2 isk richer (while him having 1 trit less and me having 2 credits less). now gimme my 10 mill. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.27 15:12:00 - [195] btw.... Quote: Failed sending email :: PHP :: DEBUG MODE Line : 234 File : /hsphere/local/home/hellowor/eveguardian.net/phpBB2/includes/emailer.php ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.27 15:12:00 - [196] btw.... Quote: Failed sending email :: PHP :: DEBUG MODE Line : 234 File : /hsphere/local/home/hellowor/eveguardian.net/phpBB2/includes/emailer.php ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
Oracle Animus	Posted - 2004.10.27 19:36:00 - [197] Sorry Qrac, but distribution of isk isn't the same as introduction of currency. Everything Has Its Meaning!
Oracle Animus	Posted - 2004.10.27 19:36:00 - [198] Sorry Qrac, but distribution of isk isn't the same as introduction of currency. Everything Has Its Meaning!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.27 21:26:00 - [199] Originally by: Oracle Animus Sorry Qrac, but distribution of isk isn't the same as introduction of currency. i'm sorry but credits are not the same as isk whether u wish it or not and 1 credit is actually "worth" more than 1 isk. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.27 21:26:00 - [200] Originally by: Oracle Animus Sorry Qrac, but distribution of isk isn't the same as introduction of currency. i'm sorry but credits are not the same as isk whether u wish it or not and 1 credit is actually "worth" more than 1 isk. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
Lorth	Posted - 2004.10.28 01:33:00 - [201] Who wants to bet the Rytor is still fumming about not getting the 10 mill isk. Very nice post BTW
Lorth	Posted - 2004.10.28 01:33:00 - [202] Who wants to bet the Rytor is still fumming about not getting the 10 mill isk. Very nice post BTW
Vaughn Zoran	Posted - 2004.10.28 03:39:00 - [203] Sorry I didn't go into a great deal of reading the posts after the 2-3rd page BUT I wanted to chime in and agree in the Economic model and it's theories J'Maybe has proposed.. I agree with the model and also that a player cannot `create` isk but rather deal with NPC corps to manifest an already existing element (ore, ships, mods etc) into what we as players call ISK. There is one way, however, a player can create isk though not by traditional game mechanic means but there is a way to create it and ultimately throw the entire economic balance off -- duping. Duping has been apparent and documented in MOST MMOG's and for some it's meant perm-ban for those individuals who have side-stepped the fragile economic model the developers have created for balance and equality. Just as in real life there are those who introduce, as much as 20%, of the current game mechanic economic model into these games via duping -- if it's found to work. In real life counterfeiters produce an inbalance in the worlds economy by producing fake currencies and introduce them into the general population thus potentially diluting the overall value of said currencies. Not that this applies as J'Maybe was speaking in a `perfect` world but alas as in real life nothing is perfect and given the right motivators, chance and determination ANY economic model can be disproven by the introduction of illegally produced flows
Vaughn Zoran	Posted - 2004.10.28 03:39:00 - [204] Sorry I didn't go into a great deal of reading the posts after the 2-3rd page BUT I wanted to chime in and agree in the Economic model and it's theories J'Maybe has proposed.. I agree with the model and also that a player cannot `create` isk but rather deal with NPC corps to manifest an already existing element (ore, ships, mods etc) into what we as players call ISK. There is one way, however, a player can create isk though not by traditional game mechanic means but there is a way to create it and ultimately throw the entire economic balance off -- duping. Duping has been apparent and documented in MOST MMOG's and for some it's meant perm-ban for those individuals who have side-stepped the fragile economic model the developers have created for balance and equality. Just as in real life there are those who introduce, as much as 20%, of the current game mechanic economic model into these games via duping -- if it's found to work. In real life counterfeiters produce an inbalance in the worlds economy by producing fake currencies and introduce them into the general population thus potentially diluting the overall value of said currencies. Not that this applies as J'Maybe was speaking in a `perfect` world but alas as in real life nothing is perfect and given the right motivators, chance and determination ANY economic model can be disproven by the introduction of illegally produced flows
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.28 07:29:00 - [205] Originally by: Vaughn Zoran Sorry I didn't go into a great deal of reading the posts after the 2-3rd page BUT I wanted to chime in and agree in the Economic model and it's theories J'Maybe has proposed.. I agree with the model and also that a player cannot `create` isk but rather deal with NPC corps to manifest an already existing element (ore, ships, mods etc) into what we as players call ISK. There is one way, however, a player can create isk though not by traditional game mechanic means but there is a way to create it and ultimately throw the entire economic balance off -- duping. Duping has been apparent and documented in MOST MMOG's and for some it's meant perm-ban for those individuals who have side-stepped the fragile economic model the developers have created for balance and equality. Just as in real life there are those who introduce, as much as 20%, of the current game mechanic economic model into these games via duping -- if it's found to work. In real life counterfeiters produce an inbalance in the worlds economy by producing fake currencies and introduce them into the general population thus potentially diluting the overall value of said currencies. Not that this applies as J'Maybe was speaking in a `perfect` world but alas as in real life nothing is perfect and given the right motivators, chance and determination ANY economic model can be disproven by the introduction of illegally produced flows a player can actually create isk. there's a thing called credits that aren't in the game anymore but lots of ppl still have them. drag them into your wallet and u have created isk. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.28 07:29:00 - [206] Originally by: Vaughn Zoran Sorry I didn't go into a great deal of reading the posts after the 2-3rd page BUT I wanted to chime in and agree in the Economic model and it's theories J'Maybe has proposed.. I agree with the model and also that a player cannot `create` isk but rather deal with NPC corps to manifest an already existing element (ore, ships, mods etc) into what we as players call ISK. There is one way, however, a player can create isk though not by traditional game mechanic means but there is a way to create it and ultimately throw the entire economic balance off -- duping. Duping has been apparent and documented in MOST MMOG's and for some it's meant perm-ban for those individuals who have side-stepped the fragile economic model the developers have created for balance and equality. Just as in real life there are those who introduce, as much as 20%, of the current game mechanic economic model into these games via duping -- if it's found to work. In real life counterfeiters produce an inbalance in the worlds economy by producing fake currencies and introduce them into the general population thus potentially diluting the overall value of said currencies. Not that this applies as J'Maybe was speaking in a `perfect` world but alas as in real life nothing is perfect and given the right motivators, chance and determination ANY economic model can be disproven by the introduction of illegally produced flows a player can actually create isk. there's a thing called credits that aren't in the game anymore but lots of ppl still have them. drag them into your wallet and u have created isk. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
Oracle Animus	Posted - 2004.10.28 13:14:00 - [207] YOu might be correct, but I haven't heard of them, but I do not deny your position, still credits were acquired how? I bet they were acquired through killing an NPC or doing a mission for NPC :). Withbest regards from Oracle. Everything Has Its Meaning!
Oracle Animus	Posted - 2004.10.28 13:14:00 - [208] YOu might be correct, but I haven't heard of them, but I do not deny your position, still credits were acquired how? I bet they were acquired through killing an NPC or doing a mission for NPC :). Withbest regards from Oracle. Everything Has Its Meaning!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.28 14:26:00 - [209] Originally by: Oracle Animus YOu might be correct, but I haven't heard of them, but I do not deny your position, still credits were acquired how? I bet they were acquired through killing an NPC or doing a mission for NPC :). Withbest regards from Oracle. they were made out of isk. one could argue that they're isk but they're an item while isk is not. i still have some in my hangar. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!
qrac	Posted - 2004.10.28 14:26:00 - [210] Originally by: Oracle Animus YOu might be correct, but I haven't heard of them, but I do not deny your position, still credits were acquired how? I bet they were acquired through killing an NPC or doing a mission for NPC :). Withbest regards from Oracle. they were made out of isk. one could argue that they're isk but they're an item while isk is not. i still have some in my hangar. ------------------------------------------- Insanes numquam moriuntur!

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