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[Proposal] remove local in 0.0 and/or in low sec

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Mr Pentex	Posted - 2009.08.26 13:17:00 - [1] My thoughts are something like this. Local should be a "service" provided only in high sec, why? Well high sec is Empire and Concord land. As i see it, these are the entities providing the use or means of the communication system known as local. For game feeling improvment it would be nice to get a more "I am leaving the secure space of high sec, to travle into the unknown". My resons are more for the game feeling than anything else, but there would certenly be alot of other issues with a change like this. In my oppinion, it would give more of a adrenalin rush not knowing how many or what is flying the space I just entered. If i am not all the way of the grid, most corps use their own chat channels while in low sec anyways, and local is mostly used to give greif or smack. Some players certenly use local to just chat with other players but i think it would be much better if you actually have to see or find other player to interact with them, the feeling of empty space would increase enormously. But what if, when you scaned down a ship and intercept it you would have to "hail" the pilot and deliver your demands or what ever, instead of just deliver them through locla. Wouldent that give a more rl feeling? This is just an idee, but i would like to vent it with other pod pilotes and hear thoughts and whats good or bad with the idee. Thx for the time Mr.Pentex I do apologize for my spelling disorder
Aniel Zaar Gallente Light of Orion	Posted - 2009.08.26 17:11:00 - [2] Originally by: Mr Pentex the feeling of empty space would increase enormously It already feels empty. -^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^ By the way, I am an Ishtar and T2 sentries fan. Fight to make the sentry damage rig work for all drones.
Gaelan Lionhardt Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2009.08.26 17:20:00 - [3] Un-supported Local is used by NPC's from time to time (Missions, Complexes etc) Your proposal can be made makeshift by any pilot at any time if they so choose by minimizing the local window, and using direct player conversations. Heavily benefits pirates and negatively affects everyone else. There are many other reasons to not do this but ill let someone else jump in
sukmanobov Minmatar Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.08.26 17:36:00 - [4] Originally by: Mr Pentex most corps use their own chat channels while in low sec anyways, and local is mostly used to give greif or smack. TRUE you scaned down a ship and intercept it you would have to "hail" the pilot and deliver your demands or what ever, instead of just deliver them through locla. Wouldent that give a more rl feeling? *You Can Do that already it called comms, although Hail would sound better "you are being hailed" (voice along with a message for thoes who don't use sound)** --------------------------------
bw8	Posted - 2009.08.26 17:54:00 - [5] would hugely, epically fail. especially with the nerfed directional scanner. can you imagine 2 huge fleets running around a huge system, which has been pos spammed with ships (so you don't know if anyone's really in local), and those 2 fleets not being able to find each other???
Ayla Ayla	Posted - 2009.08.30 11:43:00 - [6] Fix scanners ( or boost them ) nerf local = eve much better place
Andrest Disch Amarr Debitum Naturae	Posted - 2009.08.30 11:49:00 - [7] Unsupported after the changes to scanners. Now all there is is local to gather quick intel without alts.
Hrodgar Ortal	Posted - 2009.08.30 13:12:00 - [8] No. Local is the only tool for people doing either mining or other pve.
Santiago Fahahrri Galactic Geographic	Posted - 2009.08.30 13:32:00 - [9] Supported ~ Santiago Fahahrri Galactic Geographic
RansomList	Posted - 2009.08.30 14:26:00 - [10]
RedSplat Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.08.30 14:27:00 - [11] Originally by: bw8 would hugely, epically fail. especially with the nerfed directional scanner. can you imagine 2 huge fleets running around a huge system, which has been pos spammed with ships (so you don't know if anyone's really in local), and those 2 fleets not being able to find each other??? Hi there. Do you know what scan probes are for? Originally by: CCP Mitnal I don't sleep. I am always here. Watching. Waiting. Originally by: CCP Mitnal it does get progressively longer.
AtheistOfDoom Amarr The Athiest Syndicate Advocated Destruction	Posted - 2009.08.30 22:53:00 - [12] low sec... no. 0.0... don't care anyway. Pew Pew Lazorz!!!
JitaPriceChecker2	Posted - 2009.08.30 23:50:00 - [13] Theres new topic on this subject every two weeks or so. This forum sucks. Btw i support.
thoraxeb Gallente	Posted - 2009.09.17 16:20:00 - [14] And give carebears yet another reason to not go into low sec / 0.0? No. They have too many reasons to stay in high sec as it is.
Tiger's Spirit	Posted - 2009.09.17 17:04:00 - [15] Not supported, because think to me just an another cloaker idiotism, who don't want to see him on local. Firt we need a mechanism which enable catching of the cloakers with a specialised shipclass or module.
Johnster Caldari Resurrection Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2009.09.17 17:15:00 - [16] Oh my. What would the goons do without somewhere to spam? Heaven forbid that we not receive that garbage. You and your alliance will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile.
MatrixSkye Mk2 Minmatar	Posted - 2009.09.17 17:32:00 - [17] no. Scanner needs some serious fixing first.
Uronksur Suth Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate	Posted - 2009.09.17 19:50:00 - [18] Originally by: Aniel Zaar Originally by: Mr Pentex the feeling of empty space would increase enormously It already feels empty. no. This has been suggested many times, and is shot down every time.
Saralle Zhukov Minmatar Win Tech In 2 Deep	Posted - 2009.09.17 22:49:00 - [19] No, Nyet, Nein, Negative, Not on my Watch, etc. ----------------------------------- Kill them all God will know his own.
Brem Watson Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.18 11:49:00 - [20] The only reason I'd disagree is because it sounds like people are wanting this to get easy kills. Hell, if CCP decides to do this, I want my Orca back to the way it was. I don't need an ore bay.
Verys Burning Technologies Circle-Of-Two	Posted - 2009.09.18 14:48:00 - [21] Going to keep it short. No. Too much advantage for the enemy, too little for the defender. Covert ops cloak ships will be ftom forever. That about sums it up. -------------------- Need a signature or graphic for EVE? Go to EVE-GFX --------------------
Scatim Helicon GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.18 15:23:00 - [22] CCP want more people in 0.0, not less, and there's precious little reason to leave the Level 4 highsec hubs as it is without completely eliminating 0.0 PvE as a viable option. No.
Tiel Enim	Posted - 2009.09.18 16:55:00 - [23] Remove local and replace with constellation. /signed
chopper14	Posted - 2009.09.18 18:07:00 - [24] how about this? in low sec they show a number at the top for how many people are there...and replace individuals with corp logo's and tickers? so you can see how many people are afoot. and what corporations they "may" be from. and in o.o change it so you can just see corp logo's and tickers but no numbers at the top? this would let you know wheather or not the system was empty also would let you know if your wt's are hiding there but not which ones or how many. in WH space keep it like it is...blank unless you talk in it. and last but not least in high sec...group all members from the same corp together under their corp logo and tickers so with numbers at the top and listed on the ticker for each corp so when u left click it opens the corp and u see all the wt's i mean people from that corp grouped together and when you r click it gives you the corp info. this would clean up high sec local and make scanning local easier in say high traffic areas and on top of that it would be much better public exposure for corporations. comments?
chopper14	Posted - 2009.09.18 18:55:00 - [25] oh yeah also with this idea of mine when people talk in local the talker's char name would still show up in the chatbox same as it does now. just the listing on the right hand side would be affected by this change..we wouldnt want to make life hard on spammers and we dont want to ruin the actuall friendly interaction of people just trying to have friendly conversation's either ;) I think this idea would help everyone even the miners with or withought the scanner nerf. it's ussually somone with probes that you really need to worry about as for miners they will just rush the belts anyway...so alltogether cloakers get a bonus miners get to keep their run for the hillz local and fleets will know if their wt's are present. its local streamlined comments?
Scerolikk Teromni	Posted - 2009.09.19 05:11:00 - [26] No, no, and no. Local is a very much needed tool for anybody traveling through low/null-sec. By your logic, that local is a "CONCORD-provided service" or whatever, then CCP should also remove stargates from null-sec. No. If it's that important to you to make this a realistic internet spaceship experience, then imagine that the local chat system is integrated into the stargate network. If you want to go somewhere without local chat, go check out wormhole space. That place has no stargates. No communications network. No human-controlled infrastructure or connection to the settled regions of the universe whatsoever. It's also a place that's scary as hell to be in, especially when you launch your probes and find POSes all over the place. You never know if you're about to be hot dropped by a cap fleet just for the hell of it. Even null-sec is, while lawless, still a controlled area. Strongly oppose. So much so that if this plan is implemented, I will cancel my subscription.
chopper14	Posted - 2009.09.19 18:45:00 - [27] if the stargates are the ones provideing the information of who is in a system they must have great scanners, to know that a carrier fleet just jumped in. but i like the idea that they are bassically giant bean counters because the jumps are all acounted for in the starmap under jumps in last hour/24 hours etc..that being said soon the new soviernity comes out so the gates will be in control of the players. i think the players owning all the gates in their system should get to choose wether or not they have a local. comments?
Dirty Wizard	Posted - 2009.09.19 19:05:00 - [28] Originally by: Mr Pentex I do apologize for my spelling disorder Apparently you also have a failure disorder. How many of these threads have been made in the past? How many were successful? Yep, failure disorder.
ShadowMaster Gallente No Limit Productions	Posted - 2009.09.20 01:59:00 - [29] Not sure if this has been posted in another thread, but I did not see it here and since this discussion is on going with or with out me I may as well chime in. With the changes in Dominion remove local from 0.0 by default. Then when an alliance controls a system make it an upgrade, deploy something in system, gain access to the sensors from the stargates since you will apparently be paying for their upkeep anyways. If no one controls a system, no local, if some one does then they are the defender and can consider it an advantage. If the upgrade is free and requires no work/cost then every system will have it. But if it requires effort to get, and is something that can be destroyed by an attacking force then hey, cool. HAHAHA! Even better, only let the owning alliance talk i local, most one sided smack talk ever :P Something along these lines could really be considered though. Maybe only controlling alliance even has access to it, although that seems a tad bit unfair. Attacker wondering how many people in local while 200+ people assemble to kill his small 10 man gang. Anyways, just an idea. Some Eyes Demand Respect, Some Eyes Demand Fear, Mine ..... Mine earn it The Definition of an Upgrade: Take old bugs out, put new ones in. Cannot find REALITY.SYS. Universe halted. COFFEE.EXE Missing - Insert Cup and Press Any Key
Mistralt	Posted - 2009.09.20 08:57:00 - [30] Supported. It will help make low/null sec much more interesting (read: fun) for both pirates and non-pirates.
Casiella Truza Back Alley Trading Company	Posted - 2009.09.21 23:30:00 - [31] Great idea as long as (a) constellation chat replaces it, and (b) directional scanner is beefed up. -- EVE Blog EVE Twitter
Djana Libra Caldari Fallen Angel's Blade.	Posted - 2009.09.22 07:08:00 - [32] Remove it everywhere or dont remove it at all. Or at least change it to managed mode in empire. This will make wardecs more interesting <SIG> I bought the wife a toy Deimos to have fun with while i play eve! </SIG>
Anah Karah	Posted - 2009.09.23 16:54:00 - [33] no
Dav Varan	Posted - 2009.09.23 17:00:00 - [34] WS > more dangerous than > 0.0 > more dangerous than > low-sec > more dangerous than High-sec. I think things are better the way they are. removing local from 0 and null would hand to much power to cloaky recons. Going to the belts to mine/rat would be tantumount to suicide without local.
Saerynn Lone Star Joint Venture Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.09.23 20:54:00 - [35] Originally by: ShadowMaster With the changes in Dominion remove local from 0.0 by default. Then when an alliance controls a system make it an upgrade, deploy something in system, gain access to the sensors from the stargates since you will apparently be paying for their upkeep anyways. If no one controls a system, no local, if some one does then they are the defender and can consider it an advantage. I'd support something like this, but I'd expand it to include: ships entering a system by means other than a gate (WH, covert bridge) don't appear in local.
Yahrr The Tuskers	Posted - 2009.09.24 19:56:00 - [36] I think it's funny to see all the people crying carebear tears here. Both piwates and real bears keep crying about their low/null-sec going kaput. And all of them direct the starters and supporters of this topic towards the wormholes. You know where this idea started? Yup, down in the unknown. Even more funny is that in the wormholes you actually see both pirates and carebears, all doing their thing. And there, people are not running around like headless chickens, but are making coordinated moves together with friends. In the current low-sec people aren't even looking at their overview or scanner. They trust the info that local gives them: 2 scary pirates, 1 macro and 3 carebears in system... Only then they start scanning to link ship types to the names. I would like to see local chat removed indeed. It would make the game more fun, more interesting and definitely more scary. Whether a system is empty or not, you should fly through it with the same caution. That Raven you have on scan... You should not know if it's a pirate or a carebear until you're right next to it! Btw, the fact that a remove-local topic gets created almost every week says enough i think...
Dirty Wizard	Posted - 2009.09.24 21:32:00 - [37] Edited by: Dirty Wizard on 24/09/2009 21:37:37 How many of these fail threads will you people create before you get the hint? Local isn't going to be removed from low and null sec. Get used to it. Originally by: Yahrr Btw, the fact that a remove-local topic gets created almost every week says enough i think... Me and my corp could just as easily go out with alts and create daily threads that demand elves and magic be introduced into EvE. Would that make the argument valid? Does that mean it's what the general playerbase in EvE wants? The frequency of threads about one topic doesn't mean it's right.
Foolish Kate	Posted - 2009.09.25 08:39:00 - [38] Carebear> What, you mean that I won't be able to afk mine whilst at work, and I'll have to stop leading a solitary hermit-like existence in an inherently social game in order to organise a proper mining op with gate scouts?!? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! Supporting making (low/null)sec local like W-Space local. CCP had planned to do this anyway, and they backtracked, presumably because like all other crazy people the taste of carebear tears is something other than sweet nectar to them. Looking at the scanner thread though (50+ pages and thousands of supports and no meaningful response from the CSM other than to use probes... wtf) I have a horrible suspicion that only the interests of carebears are represented atm - which given the certainty (I hope) that the CSM are not all carebears, makes me a sad panda In any case, the CSM should be telling CCP to get of their bums and implement a feature they were talking about a year ago.
Argonis Valentio Caelum Custos Industries	Posted - 2009.09.25 11:11:00 - [39] Not supported, why? In anticipation of Dominion, major alliances are already retreating from their space to conserve costs. Costs? If you read the dev blogs one of the differences in the new expansion should be the introduction of a new sov ownership system, one in which YOU the player pay for all the benefits associated with a system. That includes the stargates that other players use! This means that the more stargates, the more you pay but not only that, resources will increase in systems where you pay for additional extras! What's this mean? Massively reduce your empire to say 30-50 people per system (including alts etc, time zones of the players) where as most of space currently is only populated by either; no one but with moon mining, 3-5 people with moon mining or the exception of 20-50 people in the system. Removing local from 0.0 is simply not worth looking at until after this new expansion...period.
Simeon Whiteheaven	Posted - 2009.09.25 14:37:00 - [40] No, local channel should stay as it is now.
xxxTRUSTxxx	Posted - 2009.09.25 16:22:00 - [41] well the way i see it is as follows. removing local would not be the threat a lot of pilots have stated in this thread. what would it really do if local was gone ? 1: we'd have to use the ships onboard scanner. (it's not as nerfed as some of you make out) 2: we'd have to use scouts. 3: covert op ships are finaly truly covert. 4: system wide scanning with probes would become the norm. 5: fleets/squads would have to improve teamwork and communications. 6: security patrols would be a must. 7: no more smack talk. i really don't see what the problem would be, shouldn't all fleets/squads be doing 1,2,4,5 & 6 anyway ? oh yea, i forgot to take into account the lazy pilots who want it all handed to them on a plate. change is a good thing, specialy if it improves gameplay like i believe removing local would. supported.
Lubomir Penev Dark Nexxus	Posted - 2009.09.25 17:11:00 - [42] Originally by: Gaelan Lionhardt Heavily benefits pirates and negatively affects everyone else. Yeah nothing like entering a system, seeing 30 ships on scan, and locating them all one by one empty at a POS... Hugely benefiting pirates here... -- 081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner blog
Mynxee Hellcats The Bastards.	Posted - 2009.09.26 01:33:00 - [43] Originally by: Casiella Truza Great idea as long as (a) constellation chat replaces it, and (b) directional scanner is beefed up. This. Local as is in high sec is fine. I can think of all kinds of logical reasons in the context of New Eden why it might exist and be maintained as a service there. No Local in null sec and delayed in low sec (like in wormholes) would be ideal. Having spent some time in wormholes, I LIKE the idea of having to use tools and skill to find out who else is there. Also, without all those server hits to populate Local chat data, maybe it would offset scanner hits by enough to give us our old d-scanner functionality back. Bump It! \| My Blog: Life in Low Sec
Kalissa Amok. Minor Threat.	Posted - 2009.09.26 09:53:00 - [44] Local in 0.0 needs to be changed yes, but it doesnt need to be removed. The main problem with local atm is it's used as the ultimate early warning system. I've done a hell of a lot of roaming in my time and I've seen it happen time and time again that the very MOMENT someone comes in local that people mining and ratting go cloaky cloaky or more often run to the pos in the system. Local does have a purpose, as someone said before if your system is under attack you need to know the numbers against you, but at the time time local should not be a tool for people to avoid the risks of 0.0. I'd say a fair compromise would be so lets say put a 60 second or so delay on local. Anyone who's ratting or NPC'ing who's doing it right and checking their scanner won't have a problem, but anyone who uses local to avoid the inherant dangers 0.0 is supposed to have will learn that surviving in 0.0 should take more than just looking at local and running to a pos the moment a neutral comes in the system.
Hun Jakuza 24th Imperial Guard	Posted - 2009.09.26 11:05:00 - [45] No thx. Or make scaneable cloaked ships too and end of 23/7 cloak if end of 23/7 intel too.
Mikayla Grey Gallente	Posted - 2009.09.26 11:57:00 - [46] Edited by: Mikayla Grey on 26/09/2009 11:58:06 No thanks. Would make cloaked ships incredibly overpowered and make ratting/mining a lot more boring. Go to wormholes if you want no local. High sec does not need this buff.
Maxsim Goratiev Gallente Imperial Tau Syndicate	Posted - 2009.09.26 12:08:00 - [47] Originally by: Argonis Valentio Not supported, why? In anticipation of Dominion, major alliances are already retreating from their space to conserve costs. Costs? If you read the dev blogs one of the differences in the new expansion should be the introduction of a new sov ownership system, one in which YOU the player pay for all the benefits associated with a system. That includes the stargates that other players use! This means that the more stargates, the more you pay but not only that, resources will increase in systems where you pay for additional extras! What's this mean? Massively reduce your empire to say 30-50 people per system (including alts etc, time zones of the players) where as most of space currently is only populated by either; no one but with moon mining, 3-5 people with moon mining or the exception of 20-50 people in the system. Removing local from 0.0 is simply not worth looking at until after this new expansion...period. i agree Fix Destroyers
QwaarJet Gallente hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.09.26 22:30:00 - [48] Not supported at all. I'm getting rather tired of this issue being brought up tbh.
Nefal Tiris	Posted - 2009.09.26 22:48:00 - [49] Edited by: Nefal Tiris on 26/09/2009 22:55:43 i do support this idea, ive been thinking about it myself, ive been trying out piracy, and ive really been discouraged and frustrated when jumping in to a lowsec, watching system being emptyed a few seconds later cause ive been spotted in local, it just frustrating, if you ask me, the eve universe is just waaaay too secure, the extend of concord is just bizarre

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