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Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 17:17:00 - [1] Can defender missiles be used against stealth bomber bombs? If not what are the known counters to SB fleets if any? p.s. Is it me or do battleships keep falling further and further into the most vulnerable class of ships in the game?
Kirzath Blackwater Syndicate	Posted - 2009.09.21 17:20:00 - [2] Originally by: Leellu Multipass Defender missiles No. Originally by: Leellu Multipass If not what are the known counters to SB fleets if any? Locking them in less than 2 seconds and volleying them into oblivion. Also, other frigates. Originally by: Leellu Multipass p.s. Is it me or do battleships keep falling further and further into the most vulnerable class of ships in the game? Working as intended.
Terminus Vindictus Caldari	Posted - 2009.09.21 17:21:00 - [3] Originally by: Leellu Multipass Can defender missiles be used against stealth bomber bombs? No. Originally by: Leellu Multipass If not what are the known counters to SB fleets if any? Don't game-camp in a clump. Hello, I'm from the Government and I'm here to help.
Vall Kor Minmatar Stealthfield Clandestine.	Posted - 2009.09.21 17:22:00 - [4] What bombers finally have a use? Bow down to your new bomber overlords... Also use a frigate from time to time and maybe you can kill those pesky bombers. "By way of deception, thou shalt do war"
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 17:37:00 - [5] Originally by: Vall Kor What bombers finally have a use? Bow down to your new bomber overlords... Also use a frigate from time to time and maybe you can kill those pesky bombers. Or better yet I could use Stealth Bombers to kill Frigates together with everything else :P
Vall Kor Minmatar Stealthfield Clandestine.	Posted - 2009.09.21 18:11:00 - [6] Originally by: Leellu Multipass Originally by: Vall Kor What bombers finally have a use? Bow down to your new bomber overlords... Also use a frigate from time to time and maybe you can kill those pesky bombers. Or better yet I could use Stealth Bombers to kill Frigates together with everything else :P HAHA let me know where your SB is gonna be and I'll gladly meet you there with a frig and you can try and pop me before I kill you. "By way of deception, thou shalt do war"
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 18:33:00 - [7] Originally by: Vall Kor HAHA let me know where your SB is gonna be That's sort of a point of an SB isn't it? To be cloaked so you can't find it.
Terminus Vindictus Caldari	Posted - 2009.09.21 18:36:00 - [8] Originally by: Leellu Multipass Or better yet I could use Stealth Bombers to kill Frigates together with everything else :P The same mechanics apply to bombs as to missiles, so the small sig radius and high velocity of frigates keeps them safe unless they're painted or have their MWDs turned on. SB's are most effective against larger ships. Hello, I'm from the Government and I'm here to help.
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 18:42:00 - [9] Edited by: Leellu Multipass on 21/09/2009 18:43:38 Originally by: Terminus Vindictus Originally by: Leellu Multipass Or better yet I could use Stealth Bombers to kill Frigates together with everything else :P The same mechanics apply to bombs as to missiles, so the small sig radius and high velocity of frigates keeps them safe unless they're painted or have their MWDs turned on. SB's are most effective against larger ships. That was actually my point. A few SBs have no issues dealing with frigates. Because in order to catch SBs the Frigates have to enable MWD which spells doom for them.
Etho Demerzel Gallente Holy Clan of the Cone	Posted - 2009.09.21 18:47:00 - [10] Originally by: Leellu Multipass That was actually my point. A few SBs have no issues dealing with frigates. Because in order to catch SBs the Frigates have to enable MWD which spells doom for them. Fire your torps against a MWDing frig and check know how much damage you do, then come back here and apologize. ===== "If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs." - CCP kieron...
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 18:49:00 - [11] Originally by: Etho Demerzel Originally by: Leellu Multipass That was actually my point. A few SBs have no issues dealing with frigates. Because in order to catch SBs the Frigates have to enable MWD which spells doom for them. Fire your torps against a MWDing frig and check know how much damage you do, then come back here and apologize. Who mentioned torps?
Etho Demerzel Gallente Holy Clan of the Cone	Posted - 2009.09.21 18:52:00 - [12] Edited by: Etho Demerzel on 21/09/2009 18:53:00 Originally by: Leellu Multipass Who mentioned torps? If you manage to get yourself caught in a 15 seconds delayed bomb blast while flying a MWD frig you deserve to die. ===== "If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs." - CCP kieron...
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 19:04:00 - [13] Originally by: Etho Demerzel Edited by: Etho Demerzel on 21/09/2009 18:53:00 Originally by: Leellu Multipass Who mentioned torps? If you manage to get yourself caught in a 15 seconds delayed bomb blast while flying a MWD frig you deserve to die. It's 10 seconds, come back and apologize. Also you are reinforcing the point I made earlier. A frigate has very hard time preventing bombing runs, since you have to be suicidal to use MWDs to catch SBs.
Etho Demerzel Gallente Holy Clan of the Cone	Posted - 2009.09.21 19:35:00 - [14] Originally by: Leellu Multipass It's 10 seconds, come back and apologize. Also you are reinforcing the point I made earlier. A frigate has very hard time preventing bombing runs (or being a deterrence even), since you have to be suicidal to use MWDs to catch SBs. 1) Be it 10 seconds or 15 seconds it is still plenty of time to escape if you are in a frig and they happen to drop a bomb on themselves in the hope to catch you. 2) The Bomb damage is function of the sig radius AND speed of the target. Check the missile equation to understand how little damage a bomb would inflict upon a MWDing frig. You would need several bombs to kill a single frig unless it stops and decides to leave MWD turned on... 3) An interceptor with its bonus to sig radius bloom and high speed is all but invulnerable to bombs AND torps. No matter what a SB or even several SBs do they can't kill a moving interceptor, period. ===== "If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs." - CCP kieron...
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 20:16:00 - [15] Originally by: Etho Demerzel Edited by: Etho Demerzel on 21/09/2009 20:10:36 Originally by: Leellu Multipass It's 10 seconds, come back and apologize. Also you are reinforcing the point I made earlier. A frigate has very hard time preventing bombing runs (or being a deterrence even), since you have to be suicidal to use MWDs to catch SBs. 1) Be it 10 seconds or 15 seconds it is still plenty of time to escape if you are in a frig and they happen to drop a bomb on themselves in the hope to catch you. 2) An interceptor with its bonus to sig radius bloom and high speed is all but invulnerable to bombs AND torps. No matter what a SB or even several SBs do they can't kill a moving interceptor, period. O rly? http://www.ushrakhan.com/alliance/edk/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=74760
Vall Kor Minmatar Stealthfield Clandestine.	Posted - 2009.09.21 20:36:00 - [16] Edited by: Vall Kor on 21/09/2009 20:36:30 What do you bet Leellu is one of these lucky guys to get pwned by a SB gang http://killboard.atlas-alliance.com/?a=kill_related&kll_id=107362 . And is crying for a nerf of ship that is finally worth a damn... "By way of deception, thou shalt do war"
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 20:53:00 - [17] Originally by: Vall Kor Edited by: Vall Kor on 21/09/2009 20:36:30 What do you bet Leellu is one of these lucky guys to get pwned by a SB gang http://killboard.atlas-alliance.com/?a=kill_related&kll_id=107362 . And is crying for a nerf of ship that is finally worth a damn... A 20 mill isk ship anyone can fly that has no counter other than running away is not just "worth a damn".
Etho Demerzel Gallente Holy Clan of the Cone	Posted - 2009.09.21 21:06:00 - [18] Originally by: Leellu Multipass O rly? http://www.ushrakhan.com/alliance/edk/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=74760 Yes, rly! There is no counter for stupidity. Given the necessary amount of incompetence, anyone can die in any ship to something that SHOULDN'T be able to kill it. There is no way in hell a SB can kill a properly flown interceptor, or an AF, or even a damned Vigil. ===== "If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs." - CCP kieron...
Davinel Lulinvega	Posted - 2009.09.21 21:13:00 - [19] OP has an awesome name. That is all. Originally by: CCP Tuxford Now the op looks like a weirdo that can't read kekekeke! inb4 stealth edit
Forge Lag Jita Lag Preservation Fund	Posted - 2009.09.21 21:22:00 - [20] You do not have to run away. You can also run TOWARDS. Also, MWD does little to torpedo DPS (depending on inertia ofc). Also, not every grid has 250km bubble in it. And yes, battleships keep falling, as obviously inteded.
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 21:31:00 - [21] Originally by: Etho Demerzel Originally by: Leellu Multipass O rly? http://www.ushrakhan.com/alliance/edk/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=74760 Yes, rly! There is no counter for stupidity. Given the necessary amount of incompetence, anyone can die in any ship to something that SHOULDN'T be able to kill it. There is no way in hell a SB can kill a properly flown interceptor, or an AF, or even a damned Vigil. You actually said it was close to impossible because of the way bomb damage formula works. I provided proof that one SB can kill an interceptor with a single bomb completely disputing your original claim. Even if that interceptor is not up to your flying standards. The example shows the worst case scenario for the SB (single SB vs an interceptor). SBs are supposed to be in packs, preferably 5 of the same type. An interceptor or multiple interceptors stand no chance against 5 coordinated SBs. The only thing Interceptors can do is disengage. Any other class of ships is in an ever bigger predicament.
Etho Demerzel Gallente Holy Clan of the Cone	Posted - 2009.09.21 21:39:00 - [22] Edited by: Etho Demerzel on 21/09/2009 21:39:17 Originally by: Leellu Multipass You actually said it was close to impossible because of the way bomb damage formula works. I provided proof that one SB can kill an interceptor with a single bomb completely disputing your original claim. Even if that interceptor is not up to your flying standards. I said no such thing. I said it is invulnerable because of its speed and its low sig radius. Meaning torpedos can't damage them, and bombs can be easily evaded. Quote: The example shows the worst case scenario for the SB (single SB vs an interceptor). SBs are supposed to be in packs, preferably 5 of the same type. An interceptor or multiple interceptors stand no chance against 5 coordinated SBs. The only thing Interceptors can do is disengage. Any other class of ships is in an ever bigger predicament. You are insane. Do tell me what will 5 SBs do against an interceptor. Will they throw bombs on the top of THEMSELVES to kill it? If so here will be the results: 1) They won't throw said bombs against the main targets (there is a long reactivationd delay) 2) They will damage and possibly kill themselves 3) The interceptor will still evade the bombs ===== "If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs." - CCP kieron...
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.21 21:59:00 - [23] Wow, just wow
AstroPhobic Brutor tribe	Posted - 2009.09.21 22:02:00 - [24] I haven't personally used bombs outside of sisi but don't they have an explosion velocity and radius just like missiles? Unless I'm missing something, bombs shouldn't be very effective against frigs.
Etho Demerzel Gallente Holy Clan of the Cone	Posted - 2009.09.21 22:09:00 - [25] Originally by: AstroPhobic I haven't personally used bombs outside of sisi but don't they have an explosion velocity and radius just like missiles? Unless I'm missing something, bombs shouldn't be very effective against frigs. Explosion radius is used, explosion velocity isn't, they are even taking it from the attribute list in the next patch (it is in the patch notes). Frigs can easily evade bombs though as long as you know what you are doing, unlike the OP. ===== "If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs." - CCP kieron...
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.09.21 23:04:00 - [26] Originally by: Etho Demerzel Originally by: AstroPhobic I haven't personally used bombs outside of sisi but don't they have an explosion velocity and radius just like missiles? Unless I'm missing something, bombs shouldn't be very effective against frigs. Explosion radius is used, explosion velocity isn't, they are even taking it from the attribute list in the next patch (it is in the patch notes). Frigs can easily evade bombs though as long as you know what you are doing, unlike the OP. Mwd sig bloom ftw. Uncloak a fair distance from an aggressive mwd ship and let him charge you. Once he gets to within a certain distance depending on how fast he is going launch the bomb and warp to the ss or object you were alinged to. Watch as the ship turns into a pod on the d-scanner depending on its tank and hull class. Quote: [03:39:05] Emperor Salazar > HOLY **** ITS ZEBA [03:39:20] Emperor Salazar > NEVER STOP POASTING Zeba is the BEST! ~Mitnal
Xiozor Anonymous Alcoholics Wrath.	Posted - 2009.09.21 23:12:00 - [27] Killmail shows absolutely no details of what actually happened. Maybe he was sitting still. I have seen cruise SB's instapop non-moving interceptors before. Even a low skills interceptor pilot can break 5km/s and get there in about a second. The second you see stealth bombers uncloak you change velocity and unless those bombs are covering 50-80km in radius you will avoid it while the bombers would kill each other. And even if you don't outrun them, you will not die if you have Inty IV/V and are going near top-speed. ----------------------------------------------- Mr.Kippling just launched a nuclear holocaust at third world countries! ... But he does make exceedingly good cakes.
Etho Demerzel Gallente Holy Clan of the Cone	Posted - 2009.09.21 23:48:00 - [28] Originally by: Zeba Mwd sig bloom ftw. Uncloak a fair distance from an aggressive mwd ship and let him charge you. Once he gets to within a certain distance depending on how fast he is going launch the bomb and warp to the ss or object you were alinged to. Watch as the ship turns into a pod on the d-scanner depending on its tank and hull class. No matter how well you time it (and it is very very hard when your target is charging you at 5km/s or more), the fact remains that a MWD interceptor can leave the explosion radius in less than 3 seconds. That gives him about 7 seconds to realize there is a bomb and issue the command, not exactly a difficult thing to do... ===== "If a member of the EVE community finds he or she cannot accept our current level of transparency, we bid you good luck in finding a company that meets your needs." - CCP kieron...
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.09.22 00:09:00 - [29] Originally by: Etho Demerzel Originally by: Zeba Mwd sig bloom ftw. Uncloak a fair distance from an aggressive mwd ship and let him charge you. Once he gets to within a certain distance depending on how fast he is going launch the bomb and warp to the ss or object you were alinged to. Watch as the ship turns into a pod on the d-scanner depending on its tank and hull class. No matter how well you time it (and it is very very hard when your target is charging you at 5km/s or more), the fact remains that a MWD interceptor can leave the explosion radius in less than 3 seconds. That gives him about 7 seconds to realize there is a bomb and issue the command, not exactly a difficult thing to do... Whilst technically correct you fail to take into consideration that the vast majority of pilots are not so situational awareness oriented. I find that operating under the assumption that the opposing pilot is an idiot works rather well until they prove otherwise. Quote: [03:39:05] Emperor Salazar > HOLY **** ITS ZEBA [03:39:20] Emperor Salazar > NEVER STOP POASTING Zeba is the BEST! ~Mitnal
Leellu Multipass Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.09.22 00:09:00 - [30] Edited by: Leellu Multipass on 22/09/2009 00:11:39 Originally by: Etho Demerzel Originally by: Zeba Mwd sig bloom ftw. Uncloak a fair distance from an aggressive mwd ship and let him charge you. Once he gets to within a certain distance depending on how fast he is going launch the bomb and warp to the ss or object you were alinged to. Watch as the ship turns into a pod on the d-scanner depending on its tank and hull class. No matter how well you time it (and it is very very hard when your target is charging you at 5km/s or more), the fact remains that a MWD interceptor can leave the explosion radius in less than 3 seconds. That gives him about 7 seconds to realize there is a bomb and issue the command, not exactly a difficult thing to do... Originally by: Etho Demerzel Originally by: Zeba Mwd sig bloom ftw. Uncloak a fair distance from an aggressive mwd ship and let him charge you. Once he gets to within a certain distance depending on how fast he is going launch the bomb and warp to the ss or object you were alinged to. Watch as the ship turns into a pod on the d-scanner depending on its tank and hull class. No matter how well you time it (and it is very very hard when your target is charging you at 5km/s or more), the fact remains that a MWD interceptor can leave the explosion radius in less than 3 seconds. That gives him about 7 seconds to realize there is a bomb and issue the command, not exactly a difficult thing to do... Wrong. What Zeba is talking about is if you are in a SB. You decloack at ~60km from an interceptor. As soon as the interceptor starts charging you, you launch a bomb in the direction of the interceptor. If the radius of the explosion is 15km that means the interceptor has to fly 30km trough the diameter of the explosion (if he's still charging you), which takes 6 seconds to travel for a 5km/s interceptor. There is a very good chance the interceptor will get hit by explosion. Of course the interceptor has the option of running away, which brings us to the point I am making the entire time. And that is that there is no counter against SBs. When they are doing bombing runs. They can bomb all they want without impunity as there is no ship that can counter them. When launched, the bomb travels ~30Km before it detonates (base 3K/s speed of the bomb * 10 sec flight time). I have no idea where you get this multiple bombers blowing each other up theory (in your previous posts). I would hope any group of bombers would be coordinated enough not to shoot at each other. The bombs themselves have resistances against the same damage they do, and you can normally get 5 bombs of the same type to detonate at the same time without blowing each other up as well.

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