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[Proposal] mechanism to raise standing with pirate factions

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Gramtar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.28 20:34:00 - [1] As many mission runners know, once you go below -5.0 standing with a faction it becomes impossible to run missions for them. The remedy for empire faction standing is simple - run missions for Sisters of Eve. For pirate factions, you can only raise faction standing by running missions for an allied faction. If you're -5.0 with those several factions, you will never be able to repair that standing. Coming from other MMOs with various npc faction systems, I'm completely opposed to designs that enable players to permanently damage standing. The system design for empire factions may be a tedious, long slog, but it's appropriately available as an option for those that want to do it. More to the point, under current pirate faction standings design, players with a second or third account have a tremendous advantage. They simply train a week's worth of social skills on a fresh alt, and can then actually run/complete missions using their main character. This proposal doesn't affect me, personally, as I have multiple accounts and have not yet irreparably damaged my standing with any faction. Still, I think it would be a good improvement to EVE. I suggest Sisters of Eve missions be modified to also give standings to pirate factions, or CCP create a new corporation which would work for pirate factions the way Sisters does for empire factions.
Zy'or Tealon DarkStar 1 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.28 20:43:00 - [2] Specially for people who've been running loads of missions in empire before heading out in 0.0 space. While beginning your eve career you won't have any idea that those missions will prevent you from ever doing pirate faction missions ever again. --------------- The new Bug Reporting process rules! Use it and help make EvE even better! Quote: Test your software or your users will!
Gramtar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.28 21:03:00 - [3] Edited by: Gramtar on 28/09/2009 21:05:03 A corp mate just made another alternative selection: Create certain agents in each home region of all factions that, for a price, reset your faction standing with ALL factions. The price would be a hefty 1 billion isk or similar, and have the benefit of serving as an isk sink while also having the drawback that it would reset all positive faction standings to 0 as well as negative ones. For role players, this could be explained as obtaining new identity documents. I'm, personally, pretty open on whatever the mechanism would be - isk sink, time sink, you name it. Whatever the solution, it should remain independent of security status, though. For example, you shouldn't have to run missions killing Concord/DED in order to raise pirate faction standing. There may be some that are, but I assume they would be rare and you could decline those.
Lord Griever	Posted - 2009.09.28 21:16:00 - [4] Edited by: Lord Griever on 28/09/2009 21:16:16 Edited by: Lord Griever on 28/09/2009 21:16:01 I support both these possibilities, there really needs to be a way back if you messed up when you started the game. I messed up my standings doing lvl4 missions for Caldari, witch kept me out of FW and from doing missions for pirate factions (yeah all of them) CCP make this happen one way or another.
Alexander Knott Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.28 21:26:00 - [5] Supported. Or add LP rewards that forgive some amount of negative standing with that faction.
darius mclever	Posted - 2009.09.28 21:36:00 - [6] just an idea: 1. get an alt? 2. let that alt grab missions for you? 3. ???? 4. Profit!
Mathias Skillius	Posted - 2009.09.28 21:45:00 - [7] He specifically mentioned that and stated it as a disadvantage to people without multiple accounts. Another idea: Run missions you can run and turn those LP items into standing for Pirate factions, i.e: I run Khanid Navy missions and purchase a Khanid Navy Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane. I smuggle this item into Delve and sell it to an agent there who trades me the item for standings. The agents will want specific items that are already attainable and some RP thing can be put in about their stocks running low or needing them to reverse engineer. Keep the idea of smuggling and black market trading to keep it interesting. This would keep CCP from having to program much more than a new agent into the game and the ability to increase standing that way. Also, While running missions, it might hurt your standings a bit, but they should be more than offset by the items. Could be tags too.
VENOM2k99 GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.28 23:41:00 - [8] I support this, even if I'm not impacted, but to make one part of the game better for a lot of players.
Draco Carollis Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2009.09.29 00:03:00 - [9] Full reset of all standings for hefty fee and long cooldown period? I like this. Provides replay prospects for characters and casual players. Prehaps put these agents in Low- and Null-sec to make it even harder on those who want to use it, and include a security status hit in the cost - CONCORD will not be amused with you bribing people wholescale like this (and CONCORD standings will not be affected - I think they're already tied to sec status).
Kayl Breinhar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.29 04:46:00 - [10] Edited by: Kayl Breinhar on 29/09/2009 04:47:17 Or charge 50m for each .5 (per alliance/faction) corrected up to a maximum of +2.00 so people can't simply buy their way up to ~9.99. Anything that broadens anyone's ability to play should be in CCP's best interests and I support it.
Hratli Smirks GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.09.29 08:09:00 - [11]
Cyberman Mastermind	Posted - 2009.09.29 09:23:00 - [12] Edited by: Cyberman Mastermind on 29/09/2009 09:23:09 Originally by: darius mclever just an idea: 1. get an alt? 2. let that alt grab missions for you? 3. ???? 4. Profit! How does that repair ruined standings? --- Something should be done, but no simple buy-back. No matter how much money, for some it will be too much, for others it'll be no problem at all. Instead I'd add bribable agents, who will allow you to run a mission for them ("overlooking" your bad standing), and refer you to storyline agents who'll help you improve your standing. Perhaps make the quality of the mission dependant on how much you pay him? Not much => garbage hauling, plenty => eliminate concord.
Mr Vor Killswitch Inc	Posted - 2009.09.29 11:59:00 - [13] Originally by: Alexander Knott Supported. Or add LP rewards that forgive some amount of negative standing with that faction. I like this idea. Could just be something as simple as some documents that you need to bring to an agent for the faction you want to increase your standings with. Like the high sec data centers. Set a cap at -1.99 or something, that way you will be able to run missions for that faction and start repairing it through missions. As you would need to bring them to 0.0 there is a bit of 'risk vs reward' in it too.
Fille Balle Ballbreakers R us	Posted - 2009.09.29 19:05:00 - [14] Yeah, anything is better than nothing.
Good Advice	Posted - 2009.09.29 20:17:00 - [15] Each faction should have a "corrupt" agent available in null-sec or low-sec. The agent would agree to allow people with negative standing to run missions and build up reputation, but in return, would claim all of a player's bounties, rewards, and LP in return for the service.
Drake Draconis Shadow Cadre REIGN Alliance	Posted - 2009.09.29 20:52:00 - [16] Edited by: Drake Draconis on 29/09/2009 20:54:29 I'm more inclined to add an additional mechanic that restricts such a use for 1 year (much like neural remapping). With the 1 billion ISK fee included of course. And faction warfare should be excluded as its a bit foolish to assume you can bribe your way back into opposed FW empire. You should leave the militia FIRST.... then reset. Naturally if you want to go back in... kiss your standings goodbye like wise. I'm a bit hesitant... so a cautious support here. Darius - (your alt mission running) This only works for agents... I've been doing it for a rather long time and if there's any standings boost.. its null or very small... not enough and too painful to even try it. Also to the OP about SOE solution? Only valid for 2 of the Empire Factions. Check the faction standings and you will see the only ones that get standings are the ones that like the faction. Example - SOE won't raise Amarr standings... but Ammatar Mandate will. ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com =========================
darius mclever	Posted - 2009.09.29 21:06:00 - [17] drake: well the smart part of the alt is ... i can keep my empire faction mission running standing, and my alt takes all the standing for the pirate faction. best of both worlds imho. better than trying to get standing over and over again if you move to a different region.
Drake Draconis Minmatar Shadow Cadre REIGN Alliance	Posted - 2009.09.29 21:08:00 - [18] Originally by: darius mclever drake: well the smart part of the alt is ... i can keep my empire faction mission running standing, and my alt takes all the standing for the pirate faction. best of both worlds imho. better than trying to get standing over and over again if you move to a different region. I Suppose so. :) ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com =========================
Xilor Dragoon	Posted - 2009.10.02 22:40:00 - [19]
Bene Amarr	Posted - 2009.10.03 09:34:00 - [20]
Hun Jakuza 24th Imperial Guard	Posted - 2009.10.04 11:27:00 - [21] Edited by: Hun Jakuza on 04/10/2009 11:28:08 Supported but... Need an idea how could be increase the negative standings toward NPC pirates. Maybe a solution for that: Cross standings toward other NPC pirate faction. like this: Drones/Sansha/Blood hate Angels/Serpentis/Guristas and vica versa (so if you shot Angels the standigs toward Angels decreased but Blood increased)
Arous Drephius	Posted - 2009.10.04 13:42:00 - [22] Originally by: Cyberman Mastermind Edited by: Cyberman Mastermind on 29/09/2009 09:23:09 Originally by: darius mclever just an idea: 1. get an alt? 2. let that alt grab missions for you? 3. ???? 4. Profit! How does that repair ruined standings? You fleet with the alt and then the alt hands the mission in for the fleet. However, it works fine for the corp standings, but IIRC you need to have a faction standing of above -2.00 to get missions yourself (and thus your own storylines). The alt's storyline missions won't give you any faction increases.
Kaito Haakkainen	Posted - 2009.10.04 16:40:00 - [23] Choices should have consequences, but in a dark universe such as EVE deciding to turn traitor to your faction really should be an option. Especially given that most of the pirate factions members likely originate from their opposing empire faction.
Reverend Book	Posted - 2009.10.05 20:35:00 - [24] There should definitely be an option similar to Sisters of Eve here. Another option that could be applied to all factions might be to take consumer goods like Antibiotics and Consumer Electronics and sell them at a lower price than the market demands, say 25%. The benefit to the player is getting bonus LPs or a faction standing increase as a reward for effectively subsidizing their corporation of choice. This would create a bit of a demand and lots of market activity for these objects, and might serve as a test case for using them as part of a planet economy some time in the future, as has been suggested for new sovereignity and might be used in infrastructure development. This is also an effective way to pull some isk out of the game, if there is an incentive to sell for less than the item is worth.
Gramtar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.10.05 22:10:00 - [25] Originally by: Hun Jakuza Need an idea how could be increase the negative standings toward NPC pirates. Maybe a solution for that: Cross standings toward other NPC pirate faction. like this: Drones/Sansha/Blood hate Angels/Serpentis/Guristas and vica versa (so if you shot Angels the standigs toward Angels decreased but Blood increased) This already exists after a fashion since some pirate factions will offer missions to kill others. For example, you can receive missions from Blood Raider agents to kill both Serpentis and Angels.
Hun Jakuza 24th Imperial Guard	Posted - 2009.10.06 09:07:00 - [26] Originally by: Gramtar Originally by: Hun Jakuza Need an idea how could be increase the negative standings toward NPC pirates. Maybe a solution for that: Cross standings toward other NPC pirate faction. like this: Drones/Sansha/Blood hate Angels/Serpentis/Guristas and vica versa (so if you shot Angels the standigs toward Angels decreased but Blood increased) This already exists after a fashion since some pirate factions will offer missions to kill others. For example, you can receive missions from Blood Raider agents to kill both Serpentis and Angels. Yes but i gave a thought to something else. That is mission, i thought for the belt and plex NPCs. And other thing 0.0 rats why give for players security standings ? No concord there. Not decreasing when someone shoting to someone, but increasing when shot the NPCs ? That's need to change to NPC pirate faction standing change.
darius mclever	Posted - 2009.10.06 11:37:00 - [27] Originally by: Arous Drephius Originally by: Cyberman Mastermind Edited by: Cyberman Mastermind on 29/09/2009 09:23:09 Originally by: darius mclever just an idea: 1. get an alt? 2. let that alt grab missions for you? 3. ???? 4. Profit! How does that repair ruined standings? You fleet with the alt and then the alt hands the mission in for the fleet. However, it works fine for the corp standings, but IIRC you need to have a faction standing of above -2.00 to get missions yourself (and thus your own storylines). The alt's storyline missions won't give you any faction increases. That is exactly the point! you shouldnt take those hits. you keep your empire faction standing to run missions there if you get kicked out of your region at some point.
Cick Lunt	Posted - 2009.10.06 12:51:00 - [28] Edited by: Cick Lunt on 06/10/2009 12:53:48 Its were u get your bounties for right? its were u get your lp's for right? Its why u earn 45m p/h right? No penalties for farming tons of isk in the safety of empire? If CCP implement this im going to quit eve with my 5 accounts. Not supported WOW --> way
Bomberlocks Icarus Prime	Posted - 2009.10.06 13:17:00 - [29] Yes
Raa Jin	Posted - 2009.10.06 14:44:00 - [30] Edited by: Raa Jin on 06/10/2009 14:44:27 Originally by: Cick Lunt Edited by: Cick Lunt on 06/10/2009 12:53:48 Its were u get your bounties for right? its were u get your lp's for right? Its why u earn 45m p/h right? No penalties for farming tons of isk in the safety of empire? If CCP implement this im going to quit eve with my 5 accounts. Not supported WOW --> way you realise this proposal is designd to allow people to move to 0.0 and mission out there but otherwise cant because they nerfed the hell out of there pie faction standings while living out in empire. also supported as missioning is slighly less boring than going round and round and round the belts in a trance when your skint or theres nothing going on and I cant run local mish because i nerfed my standing to hell while doing the empire thing lol
Dretzle Omega Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2009.10.06 15:33:00 - [31] Edited by: Dretzle Omega on 06/10/2009 15:35:38 Originally by: Kaito Haakkainen Choices should have consequences, but in a dark universe such as EVE deciding to turn traitor to your faction really should be an option. Especially given that most of the pirate factions members likely originate from their opposing empire faction. I agree with this sentiment. Buying your way with ISK I don't like, but some betrayal mechanic should exist to show the pirates you're really with them. Again, though, choices have consequences. This should do something like turn the +8 Caldari standings to -8, or something equally as drastic. If you're going to betray your faction, they won't like you. The pirates will also require that you've not run missions for their enemy or shot at any other their ships for at least a month. (How are they going to trust you if you're still shooting them down?) A negative sec rating could also be required, also to prove you are really a pirate. Something that will get you shot down if you go into high sec systems (at least 0.7 and above). There could be some ISK, as a bribe to the agent, but the above faction effects would be more worthwhile, as those standings take time. You could have more challenges (to prove your worth), such as taking on fleets of empire navy ships in a mission in low sec. But not a simple payout and cool off. If you really want those pirate standings, you can't be working for the empire any more. Also, you should know that the empire won't take you back, probably ever. Pirates betray people. Caldari, or your race, won't trust you again after you've betrayed them, though.
Hrin Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.10.06 21:14:00 - [32] I agree with these proposals. Who cares if you have to pay isk to bribe your way to neutral standing? That isk leaves the game and its actually RP appropriate.
yani dumyat Black Storm Cartel	Posted - 2009.10.07 18:03:00 - [33] Loads of good ideas in this thread and easy to implement too, should be a no brainer for the CSM to bring this up. _________________________________________________ Lifeboat ----> + Human
Zlake Kinky Killing Kleptomaniacs BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2009.10.14 16:09:00 - [34] I say remove sisters of eve and other ways to get tags up for empire factions or allow pirate faction to be raised like tags or running for sisters ect.
Nymblar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.10.14 18:04:00 - [35] I like this
Frankinator Kinky Killing Kleptomaniacs BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2009.10.16 01:00:00 - [36]
Future Mutant Republic Military School	Posted - 2009.10.16 07:04:00 - [37] Originally by: Cick Lunt Edited by: Cick Lunt on 06/10/2009 12:53:48 Its were u get your bounties for right? its were u get your lp's for right? Its why u earn 45m p/h right? No penalties for farming tons of isk in the safety of empire? If CCP implement this im going to quit eve with my 5 accounts. Not supported WOW --> way I support this guy quitting and going back to wow. Also, i like the standings idea. Kind of bites that you can permanently ruin your opportunity to mission for pirate factions when the rest of the game is so open ended. I think there should be some "grind", or at least a time frame (once per year?) built in. Shouldnt be something the rich can do at will. Your stuff iz mine through actions
Druuna Ewwith CHON	Posted - 2009.10.16 09:28:00 - [38]
Deldrac Ultrapolite Socialites GoonSwarm	Posted - 2009.10.16 16:21:00 - [39] Sisters of Pirate EVE Corrupt agents with minus 40 quality or whatever would work with -5 and below. Just some special agent with no standing requirement but whose missions are likely to give heavy standing hits for empire factions. Not a big fan of the 'just pay ISK' idea, but whatever. If missions are going to be the way CCP wants everyone to make ISK, they need to throw the 0.0 factions a bone on this.
Dierdra Vaal Caldari Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2009.10.17 14:15:00 - [40] according to the fanfest presentations, this is already going to happen. Director of Education :: EVE University Chairman of the CSM
Bunyip Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2009.10.17 15:28:00 - [41] The one billion ISK for a complete reset of standings would work well. I could see that as paying one of the pirate agents to hack the Concord database and reset the standings of the person. Obviously, the agent would not want to do it that often for fear of being caught in the hack, so the once per six-month period would make sense. I also like the idea of smuggling items to reset faction standings. It would give people a reason to buy stuff from the faction stores or market, then remove them from play to increase standings. Obviously, the standings boost would have to make it worth the cost of the LP, but not insanely high. Either way, something does need to be done. I support this thread. "May all your hits be crits." - Knights of the Dinner Table.

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