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Old Nimrod
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Posted - 2009.10.02 18:51:00 -
[1]
TL:DR Version at the end.
A proposed Solution to the Issue of Titan Proliferation/ Liberal Use of Doomsdays.
Doomsday devices work exactly like they are meant to: An anti-blob weapon. But when alliances or groups of them have reached the point where they can doomsday a capital fleets we have to accept that it has gotten out of hand. However eliminating Doomsdays is a bad idea: There will be little to discourage conventional blobs. Turning into a focused fire mega-weapon (and youÆd likely have to in order to make titans worth it) will most likely have the opposed effect: it will encourage Titan blobbing. So really, changing DD mechanics is trying to get around the real issue: the proliferation of Titans or rather the liberal use of the Doomsday Devices.
There are some poor ways of dealing with this that have no doubt been thought of and discarded:
A limit on the number of titans an alliance can have or a highly exponential titan maintenance fee sound initially good but thereÆs the obvious get around: Create Titan Holder alliances. When a titan costs dozens of billions to build, 1 bill for a holder alliance is pocket change.
Some ultra rare DD fuel. But then youÆd have a similar problem as you have with moons now: few valuable resources means the more powerful alliances will fight over control of them and youÆll have very thin chances of the Little guys being able to get in the fight; or the cost will simply go up so only the very rich alliances can afford it, having the same effect of leaving the little guy out.
IÆd like to propose a new idea: Limit the amount of active titans in a system, or the amount of DDÆs that can be fired in a time period: when it reaches a peak blow up a random titan (or throw it in a random w-space system) and continue to do after x amount of time. Sounds illogical, but in the world of Sci-fi excuses can be easily written:
ôSince the events leading to the destruction of Seyllin I, there have been bizarre accidents with Titan-class supercapitals. Leading scientist are now theorizing that the radiation emitted by the Titan-Class unique reactor technologies( or Doomsday Devices) somehow provoke the appearance of strange wormhole like phenomena which have already caused the destruction of several titans. Early data analysis concludes that the phenomenon occurs with increasing frequency when there is heavy concentration of titans/heavy use of Doomsday Devices in a certain area of spaceö
The mechanic itself would be something like so:
After X amount of titans present (or DDÆs have been fired) in a system, Titan Class vessels will be randomly destroyed( or sucked into wormholes) with a frequency proportional to the amount of Titans until the amount of vessels goes bellow the limit. (Or Y time passed since the last DD).
Titan ûbe-gone timer= (Z seconds)/(Number of titans in system)
or/and:
Titan ûbe-gone timer= (Z seconds)/(Number DDÆs fired in the last W hours)
Example:
Say the limit is 4 titans and group A has them all in system. Group B cynos in 4 more. Instantly a random titan explodes/gets sucked into a wormhole. 30 seconds afterward the next titan does. Then 45 seconds, then 60 seconds. And now youÆve reached the 4 titan limit. All is fuzzy.
TL:DR. -DDÆs are Fine as they are. -Too many titans are an issue. -Solution: If there are too many titans in a system start randomly blowing them up or sucking them into wormholes until there arenÆt so many anymore. -Profit.
ON
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Special Projects Executive
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Posted - 2009.10.02 19:05:00 -
[2]
tl;dr: You're on space crack.
Actually I think that about covers it. No need for a longer version. --Vel
In the world of emoticons, I was colon capital d. |
Drake Draconis
Minmatar Shadow Cadre REIGN Alliance
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Posted - 2009.10.02 19:09:00 -
[3]
Originally by: De'Veldrin tl;dr: You're on space crack.
Actually I think that about covers it. No need for a longer version.
yup.
Dominion isn't even out yet and your[op] already crying the sky is falling.
Here's an idea... how about you wait for it to come out before you start making assumptions eh? ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com ========================= |
De'Veldrin
Minmatar Special Projects Executive
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Posted - 2009.10.02 20:46:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Drake Draconis
Originally by: De'Veldrin tl;dr: You're on space crack.
Actually I think that about covers it. No need for a longer version.
yup.
Dominion isn't even out yet and your[op] already crying the sky is falling.
Here's an idea... how about you wait for it to come out before you start making assumptions eh?
Hi Drake!! --Vel
In the world of emoticons, I was colon capital d. |
Stil Harkonnen
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Posted - 2009.10.02 20:48:00 -
[5]
what a surprise, the 2 forum *****s are the first to respond, and they don't even offer any critiquing, they just shut down the OP without giving any reasons.
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Drake Draconis
Minmatar Shadow Cadre REIGN Alliance
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Posted - 2009.10.02 21:28:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Stil Harkonnen what a surprise, the 2 forum *****s are the first to respond, and they don't even offer any critiquing, they just shut down the OP without giving any reasons.
You would be wise to go read the Dev Blogs/Patch Notes to see the method/reasoning to our madness. ========================= CEO of Shadow Cadre http://www.shadowcadre.com ========================= |
Foolish Bob
Caldari FireTech In Tea We Trust
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Posted - 2009.10.02 21:51:00 -
[7]
Here's the why:
With the awesomeness that is the stealth bomber, the job of the DD for interdicting large sub-capital blobs is slowly starting to be replaced. Note that CCP never said that large fleets of sub capitals were Bad(tm) just that having them in one concentrated ball of death was boring. There might have been a technical reason too, but once you hit boring it's time to do something.
The problem then becomes the increasing use of capital blobs - 100's of dreads / carriers on each side basically pounding at each other. Basically the RR BS fights of old writ large and with 8 year lock times. Again boring. Area effect weapons are not the way to go here though, because a) you want to limit the calculations required to see whether or not each damagable object on grid is in range (one of - but not the only - the reasons that torps are direct weapons now) and b) any area effect that can be effectively deployed on a scale large enough to bother a cap fleet will render any gang of any number of BS utterly boned, hosed and generally in a bad way - no matter how many plates you have.
The solution therefore is a super-powerful directed weapon, and of course the requirement that every titan pilot put in local before he fires "Now witness the firepower of this fully armed and operational battlestation!"
Hence no support. ----------- I am me. I am not the corp I've joined nor the alliance I fly in.
I'm also not a unique and special snowflake.
Everything I say should be taken in that context. |
Argonis Valentio
Senex Legio
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Posted - 2009.10.03 07:48:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Foolish Bob Here's the why:
With the awesomeness that is the stealth bomber, the job of the DD for interdicting large sub-capital blobs is slowly starting to be replaced. Note that CCP never said that large fleets of sub capitals were Bad(tm) just that having them in one concentrated ball of death was boring. There might have been a technical reason too, but once you hit boring it's time to do something.
The problem then becomes the increasing use of capital blobs - 100's of dreads / carriers on each side basically pounding at each other. Basically the RR BS fights of old writ large and with 8 year lock times. Again boring. Area effect weapons are not the way to go here though, because a) you want to limit the calculations required to see whether or not each damagable object on grid is in range (one of - but not the only - the reasons that torps are direct weapons now) and b) any area effect that can be effectively deployed on a scale large enough to bother a cap fleet will render any gang of any number of BS utterly boned, hosed and generally in a bad way - no matter how many plates you have.
The solution therefore is a super-powerful directed weapon, and of course the requirement that every titan pilot put in local before he fires "Now witness the firepower of this fully armed and operational battlestation!"
Hence no support.
I got bored after reading your first paragraph but the reasons are probably in there. I don't support nerfing titans.
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2009.10.03 08:24:00 -
[9]
And a high-value system, like say a Titan nursery, would have the maximum number of Titans in system at all times making any attack practically impossible.
End result: 100% fool-proof defence with zero chance of defeat. Yay for static sovereignty maps!
Solution is to find a way to make people WANT to bring Titans forward into the fray while at the same time minimizing the utter devastation that multiple Titans can cause when used together. This is the focus of a rather lively debate in the test forum but it is at an impasse I am afraid, almost impossible to give any ability worth having without it scaling horribly.
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Foolish Bob
Caldari FireTech In Tea We Trust
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Posted - 2009.10.03 10:31:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Argonis Valentio
I got bored after reading your first paragraph but the reasons are probably in there. I don't support nerfing titans.
The last paragraph is all that's needed as a reason. The rest just seal the deal. ----------- I am me. I am not the corp I've joined nor the alliance I fly in.
I'm also not a unique and special snowflake.
Everything I say should be taken in that context. |
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Neu Bastian
Valklear Guard
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Posted - 2009.10.05 23:00:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Neu Bastian on 05/10/2009 23:02:27
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida And a high-value system, like say a Titan nursery, would have the maximum number of Titans in system at all times making any attack practically impossible.
If you had read through the wall of text, you'd know the op did not propose there be a cap of allowed titans, just that something terrible happens to titans after a certain number has reached.
Lets say the limit is 4, and defending alliance has 4 titans in system. When attacking alliance B cynoes in a titan, alliance A has 4/5 chance of something terrible happening to their titans, while alliance B has 1/5.
Area of effect weapons are terrible on the server, yes, but I can't think of better ways of dealing with blobs.
Quote:
Neu Bastian Valklear Guard - CEO
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