Imagine the added risks to the hotdroppers if they bring in capital ships outside of dock range... It could escalate quite nicely!!!

*shoots self in logistics foot*

Please enlighten us, I really don't see how a competent carrier pilot loses their carrier when cynoing from one station to another station.

Gizz, what does the Agony logistical chain have to say about this incredibly bad idea? Should JF pilots have to jump through even more hoops to play this ******* game that already turns even the simplest things into gigantic pains in the ass? I don't see your lazy ass leaving the rats behind to perform overwatch every time something needs to get brought to the station. For the professional couriers, this would be the end of their corp, as it is impossible to recruit escort pilots on the scale necessary to protect 30+ jump freighter pilots in every corner of EVE. Did you even give that some thought? These corps are opening up losec and nosec to players who would never have the ability to do it themselves. Nosec/losec gets more targets overall than your foolish desire to add more JFs to your killboard.

I'd like to see you or other Agony pilots, in the interest of fairness and sportsmanship and whatever the ****, intentionally light cynos 10k+ off station. I know you're not doing it now. In fact, I triple dog dare your corp to begin doing it. Perhaps I should give this list of Agony JF pilots (incorp and out) and cynos (incorp and out) to someone who can put it to good use.

I don't want to remove hotdropping idiot carrier pilots that agress on the undock.... I would just prevent the hotdropped ships from landing at zero on the station.... I know dock ranges for capitals are now HUGE, and I would hope, in practice, a cyno alteration would result in the hotdrop landing ~5km's from the station docking perimeter, which hopefully is no farther than 20-30 km's from the idiotic carrier pilot.... In short, I certainly don't want to remove the risks to people agressing on station (nor prevent it)....

Gizz, what does the Agony logistical chain have to say about this incredibly bad idea? Should JF pilots have to jump through even more hoops to play this ******* game that already turns even the simplest things into gigantic pains in the ass? I don't see your lazy ass leaving the rats behind to perform overwatch every time something needs to get brought to the station. For the professional couriers, this would be the end of their corp, as it is impossible to recruit escort pilots on the scale necessary to protect 30+ jump freighter pilots in every corner of EVE. Did you even give that some thought? These corps are opening up losec and nosec to players who would never have the ability to do it themselves. Nosec/losec gets more targets overall than your foolish desire to add more JFs to your killboard.

I'd like to see you or other Agony pilots, in the interest of fairness and sportsmanship and whatever the ****, intentionally light cynos 10k+ off station. I know you're not doing it now. In fact, I triple dog dare your corp to begin doing it. Perhaps I should give this list of Agony JF pilots (incorp and out) and cynos (incorp and out) to someone who can put it to good use.

Every time you jump a capital you take a risk. Assuming you aren't using your own alt, you trust that the cyno pilot knows what they are doing (always questonable) and aren't too close or too far from the station ( caldari stations are easy mode in that regard). If jumping with other capitals you do occasionally have problems with them landing on top of eachother and bumping off station. So yeah I guess if you play by yourself you can be reasonably sure of safeish travel but I would venture most people play with others in which case jumping does have risks.

Question is, how much fun it is to jump 50 gates with ZZzzzzzzZZZZzzzzzz freighters and escort?

A carrier km hardly means cyno travel is risky....

Ratting in a carrier... Risky
Cynoing a carrier to a POS.... Risky....
Cynoing a carrier onto a station.... Not Risky....

I can fly thru low-sec risk free in a pod, or cloaky.

Would you seriously use a jump freighter if it didn't offer any advantage for the cost? The thing about cyno-capable ships is that they're expensive. The parts are expensive, they're unusable in high-sec (so you're not avoiding war decs), and you pay a ton for fuel. Their only advantage is safety.

Eve may be a 100% PVP environment, but it's also an economic simulator. Risk vs. rewards, and risk vs. cost come into play heavily with any sort of transportation. While nothing can be 100% safe, anything can be 99.9% safe if you're willing to pay for it.

Edit:

If you're asking for balance, cynos should be made more expensive, not more risky.

Actually you're really only upset that you can't freely gank these ships like you can other haulers. You're not content with the number of helpless targets you kill already.

Your opinion is wrong.

Also, increasing the cost of a cyno, thereby increasing the cost of jumping might be a more acceptable alternative. Right now, cyno modules on disposable noobships costs less than 3m to replace. This is fairly insignifcant in today's EvE economy. However, if the actual cyno module itself were a 25m isk (IMO not enough) or 50m isk (a decent price) or heaven forbid a 100m isk (over the top, but probably good for the game), then I'd concede that the risk in cyno travel manifests as a risk to the cyno ship, which is no longer trivial.

It's really a balance I seek.... Currently the price for traveling from station to station via cyno is a negligilbe 3m isk + fuel per trip (in additon to the x billion for the cyno capable ship).

I'm not convinced increasing the cost of a cyno is ideal, but, depending on the cost of the cyno, it's definitely an option. Something tells me that this may undermine Blackfrog moreso than my recommendation, but perhaps not...

I agree with this as a feasible compromise. After all, unlike the ship using the cyno, the ship lighting it is vulnerable for 5-10 minutes. If the cyno is more valuable, it encourages carriers to stick around and help defend the cyno (giving them an aggression timer), making both the cyno ship and the cap ship more vulnerable.

For most things folks argue that cost isn't a factor for balancing. This case isn't really different. The idea of a spool up timer for jumping that people keep talking about would solve this supposed issue.

Last time I lit a cyno for a new corp member, I waited about 40Minutes in hostile lowsec while he got himself ready, despite being told he was ready to go. lit the cyno & then when the carrier was docked was called a loser for having the cyno slightly outside docking range.
Not even a hint of a thank you.

Needless to say, apart from very close friends, of which I have none, I wont be helping out any capital pilots again.

Your opinion is wrong.

its sort of bullshit that jump-capable ships are essentially invulnerable but it's not really fixable without changing a ton of mechanics.